http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-42633502
Some good news , this will be creating and keeping jobs safe
Printable View
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-42633502
Some good news , this will be creating and keeping jobs safe
Good news, but it is on the back of a long term decline in manufacturing.
Yeah, even the optimist would admit we are talking about a small proportion of our exports increasing a small amount based on a weak currency. Good for the people who work in the industries affected and hopefully growth continues so that we become slightly less reliant on volatile financial services.Quote:
Originally Posted by the other bob wilson
It is a commonly perceived myth that manufacturing in the U.K. is in decline. After falling back in 2008-9, manufacturing output has grown since then as shown by this graph at the link in the OPQuote:
Originally Posted by the other bob wilson
Attachment 2046
What’s more, since 1945 industrial production in the U.K. has increased by around 250%. Automation has led to the loss of millions of jobs but we are producing nearly three times as much now as we were at the end of WW2. This is explained in this article:
https://www.theregister.co.uk/2010/0...uring_figures/
Which contains this graph:
Attachment 2047
The article is 8 years old and, as can be seen from the first graph, UK manufacturing has grown significantly since it was published. The same is true of all other advanced countries. Britain is still the 9th biggest manufacturer of any country.
Here is a House of Commons report on the matter published last year:
http://researchbriefings.files.parli...09/SN05809.pdf
I would imagine he means relative to the rest of economy/other sectors.Quote:
Originally Posted by severncity
Fair enough, and our ranking has declined as other countries have focused on manufacturing rather than finance, law and higher education.Quote:
Originally Posted by Eric Cartman
The "productivity gap" between the UK and most other G7 countries has been worrying the UK government for years.But as this report shows, manufacturing productivity in terms of GVA per worker has been improving in recent years relative to the performances of Germany, Italy and France.
(This is a PDF from the ONS which will download automatically):
https://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&so...ZFme1c5wUs01tB
Manufacturing in the UK is becoming much more highly automated and highly skilled.
There we go let's do positive , the country isn't becoming poverty stricken were fighting back ,well done Warnock I say .
Interesting argument that Germany prospers because of its position in the eurozone and access to a ready supply of labour via the single market.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mambo
I'm surprised you believe all that rubbish. When I was a kid there was someone making something on every street. How can it be possible that we are producing three times as much as at the end of WW2 when you hardly ever meet anyone nowadays who makes anything? These stats come from surveys sent out to a sample of businesses. I imagine the surveyees just reply with any old crap that comes into their heads. This crap is then converted into whatever the government wants you to believe by impenetrable models. Our supposed wealth is all smoke and mirrors.Quote:
Originally Posted by severncity
We consume and produce much more today than we did 70, 50 or 30 years ago. I was born in the 60s and as a child in the 70s i had one coat, one pair of shoes and very few toys. Nowadays even the poorest consumers in the developed world can afford many items of clothing and toys for their kids. In the U.K. we manufacture machinery, vehicles, pharmaceutical products, medical instruments, aircraft, beverages and plastics. These processes are highly automated do fewer people are involved.Quote:
Originally Posted by David Vincent
The whole of humanity is consuming manufactured goods at an unprecedented rate and we have our niche markets - specialised products for the most part - that we produce for. Most of our goods are exported and we, in turn, import clothes, toys, consumer electronics and most of our vehicles.
You might have had one coat, one shoe and one toy but that was very unusual. Perhaps your parents were Monists. If you compared an average UK home in the 1950s with an average home today then you would find that the 1950s house contained much more stuff, i.e. manufactured goods. The 1950s home would have had more books, more pictures on the wall, just as many toys (better made and longer lasting), a biscuit barrel, old newspapers under the setee seats, more cupboards and thousands of knick-knacks all over the place. Most of this stuff had been manufactured in the UK. Today you'd struggle to find something made in the UK in a UK house. Even many of the people have been manufactured elsewhere.Quote:
Originally Posted by severncity
I would only believe that we are manufacturing more today in the UK if someone showed me the figures for cars, carrots, machines, coal, steel, etc. rather than some notional money value based on a dodgy survey.
Who should we thank for this resurgence, as it can' t be Tory , shall we plump for Farage ?
Farage is a good shout.Quote:
Originally Posted by life on mars
Two of the three links I posted were from the House of Commons and then ONS. Consumer goods were built to last in the past; today’s are more disposable with built-in obsolescence. There are nearly 40 million vehicles on the roads compared to under 3 million in 1945. I had a quite comfortable upbringing in a nice area and no one at that time had as many clothes and trainers as kids have today. I’m not well off but I’ve still got about 10 pairs of shoes and trainers; it is quite common for young men and women to have dozens of pairs of footwear nowadays.Quote:
Originally Posted by David Vincent
It seems axiomatic to me that people consume and dispose of far more manufactured goods than in the past so if you have any statistics to counter my certainty I would be very interested to see them.
10 pairs of shoes! You have gone from one extreme to the other. I can only assume you are some sort of shoe fetishist. Nevermind, we get all sorts on here. At least you are an intelligent poster. Some of them only know they are alive because they can hear air rushing through their nostrils.Quote:
Originally Posted by severncity
I've just looked through my Whitaker's Almanack for 1962. It's several decades since the book was last opened. Here are some UK production figures comparing 1960 and today :
Potatoes 2016 5.2 million Tonnes v 1960 7.2 million tons
Oats 2015 .8 million Tonnes v 1960 2 million tons
Vehicles 2016 1817 1960 1811k
This is just a very small sample but you can see that we were producing just as much if not more in 1960 than we are today. You will say that the vehicle totals shows that we are much more efficient today - i.e. fewer car workers. But if you look at the economy as a whole you would probably find that we were producing just as much with far fewer workers so they were more efficient then. Here are the employment totals :
Employed 2015 33 million 1960 24 million 1960
Unemployed 2017 1.4 million .3 million 1960
It could be that my samples are skewed and I am completely wrong. But all this talk about how rich we are today does not make sense to me. How is it possible that we can import millions of people from third world countries and pay them like kings according to their own standards for doing nothing when in the 1950s and 1960s you had to work like a dog just to keep your head above water? Either we were all deceived into thinking we were poor then or this new richness is an illusion. I personally think our current situation is a mixture of The Matrix and 1984.
Here are some other interesting comparisons :
UK prison population 2014 86k 1960 30k
UK murders 2016 571 1960 144
Potatoes aren’t counted in the manufacturing total. In 1960, according to https://www.gov.uk/government/upload...es-summary.pdfQuote:
Originally Posted by David Vincent
there were 8 million vehicles on the U.K. roads, so if your production figures are correct then the U.K. must have exported the vast majority of its manufactured vehicles - which is also true today. People have multiple televisions in their homes and the proliferation of charity shops, which often have to throw away many of the donated goods, shows that consumer fetishism is rampant.
As for my shoe collection, I tend to spend £100 a year buying trainers and shoes in one purchase from Sports Direct, which I have delivered. Three or four new pairs a year (I do a lot of walking) means that I’ve always got some smart footwear. Shoes cost about £20 in the 1970s/1980s - roughly what I pay now.
As for your prison figures, it is true that serious criminality is a big problem nowadays. The breakdown of the family unit, the decline of the church, the mobility of the population (and subsequent undermining of community spirit) and immigration (as a result of which criminal gangs are more likely to form) all play their part in increased crime. But having a myriad of consumer products to envy, covet and steal has also been a cause of the rise in crime, with mobile phones and car stereos being obvious examples of such products that just weren’t around prior to the 1980s.
How did we get to shoes and prisons from the original post I made
""UK manufacturing output at its highest for 10 years"
Gotta luv this board and not take it to heart .
:facepalm::hehe:
Persuasive stuff, maybe I was wrong - you've set out one of the best arguments I've seen in favour of our continued membership of the EU there.Quote:
Originally Posted by severncity
There is a chart in the link below which shows that in 2016 UK industry used a third of the energy industry used in 1970. If we are making twice as much stuff today as we did then you would expect us to be using more energy not less. It could be that we are using energy more efficiently and of course there is less heavy industry nowadays but I don't think that explains how we could be producing twice as much with a third of the energy.
They are just lying to us for the fun of it.
https://www.carbonbrief.org/five-cha...ergy-last-year
Doesn't answer the output side of your question but this extract of the attached study analyses the question on the reduction of energy input.Quote:
Originally Posted by David Vincent
Character of the Industrial Sector
The current situation in regard to energy use in UK industry and its recent historic development can obviously in
fluence the potential for future improvements. Thus, since the 1973 oil price hike, industry has been the only sector of the UK economy to have experienced a dramatic decline in final energy demand of roughly 50% in the period 1973
–2007 (prior to the global economic slump of 2008). This was in spite of a rise of some 15% in the real gross value added (GVA) of industry over the same period. The consequent drop in aggregate energy intensity (defined as energy use per unit of economic output) is driven by different effects:
Energy efficiency:
A large part of the decline in industrial energy intensity can be attributed to energy efficiency improvements; an estimated 80% of the fall in industrial energy demand between 1970 and 1995 resulted from this.
Structural change:
The relative size of industrial subsectors has changed with a transition away from EI industries.
Fuel switching:
Coal and oil use has steadily declined in favor of cleaner fuels, such as electricity and gas. These cleaner fuels can be
used with a higher degree of control and so are more efficient than alternatives. Additionally, when examining primary energy demand, the increase in the efficiency of electricity generation (largely caused by fuel switching in favor of nat-
ural gas) will have the effect of lowering primary energy use.
http://ciemap.leeds.ac.uk/wp-content...-reduction.pdf
A good argument for being in a customs union and a free trading zone, but not an endorsement of being a part of the undemocratic, unaccountable, wannabe-superstate EU.Quote:
Originally Posted by the other bob wilson
yes life on mars great news but lets look at why
on the face of it manufacturing is booming right now and has been for the last 5 years . the 2 major industries that has seen massive growth is aerospace and the automotive industries . can't speak for the aerospace industry but i can for the automotive industry . been working in the industry for the last 4 years and all the main players in this area are concentrated in the midlands . every single car manufacturer in that area is now full with workers from eastern european countries . the last place i worked 90 per cent were eastern european and you could only get a job through an agency
sounds great doesen't when you say manufacturing is booming in the uk with record output but the majority of people that actually that assemble cars and parts are non british . perhaps this is the reason the uk voted out with brexit ?
to me the only way to keep manufacturing in good shape all the supply chains that the automotive industry rely on from abroad is to move them to the uk then we will see a real manufacturing base in our country than just an assembly manufacturing country . the devalue of the pound makes this a real possibilty then we can see a real uk manufacturing base in the uk then we can invest in young people to take on real engineering apprenticeships giving youngsters a life long free of debt
as for engineers the uk lost 15 years where the uk didn't invest at all so now all the major players are crying they don't have enough qualified engineers in this country . i blame all the government parties for this when all manufacturing was shipped out to low cost countries now we have an upsurge in this country . as this is my area i could go on forever what's wrong with manufacturing in this country but i don't want to bore you to death !
no doubt electric cars will now have a massive effect in jobs by losing and creating thousands of jobs in the car industry . nobody knows what's going to happen in reality . i,m not too concerned with robots in manufacturing as they have been used for the last 30 years but i can see people working in general office work and retail a massive change
Thanks for the link. The paper is mainly waffle but the key claim is that 80% of the reduction of energy use is due to improved energy efficiency. There is no evidence given for this claim and it goes against the Jevons Paradox : improved efficiency means more fuel use not less.Quote:
Originally Posted by cyril evans awaydays
"Economists have observed that consumers tend to travel more when their cars are more fuel efficient, causing a 'rebound' in the demand for fuel."
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jevons_paradox
I thought this quote from the paper about energy efficiency in the concrete industry was telling :
"However, now that there are no wet kiln types left in the UK, further potential for reducing energy demand in this manner is limited".
To me it is obvious that industry is using less energy because we are making less stuff. It is only when you start questioning official stats that you can move on to the big lies they are telling us about immigration, Islam, Syria and the supposed Russian threat.
The government officially gave up on the British workers many decades ago. They weren't breeding fast enough so they imported millions of fast breeders. They weren't working hard enough so they imported millions of harder workers.Quote:
Originally Posted by MOZZER2
Why is it that employers and the government can say that East Europeans are better educated, more flexible and are harder workers than British workers? This is almost certainly a true claim but any claims that the British are superior in any way are now thought crimes which can lead to a prison sentence.
If this were true you would be in prison for about 100 consecutive life sentences. I know people like you don't like to acknowledge it, but the reality is that you can and do say whatever you want to.Quote:
Originally Posted by David Vincent
Stop playing the victim, it is boring to have to constantly stumble across it in threads.
Eric get your head out of the sand and take the red pill. If we weren't posting anonymously then many of the sensible posters on here would have been arrested. If what we say in private was said in the presence of a policeman we would be arrested. The police in the UK are more interested in political thought crimes than they are in crimes against property and people. The UK police just function as private security guards and spies for our elite class.Quote:
Originally Posted by Eric Cartman