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While the author of this piece seems to see Neil Warnock as an exception to the rule, I think he has a point - my own view is that we were a club with a "focus on clean sheets and set-pieces" long before our current manager showed up.
https://www.fourfourtwo.com/features...lish-old-guard
I'd like to see foreign managers work on the same budget British ones do.If we get to the prem again and the gaffer retires then that may be a good time to reassess our style and act accordingly.
Good article, thanks for that. He sees Warnock as an exception because he's still being successful (he obviously considers Dyche too young to be another exception) and while he's still in credit here we're going to escape excessive criticism for the way we set up, which is fair enough I guess. What happens after Warnock is the big issue though, as Sneggy says. The direction we take and the way the fans respond to it is going to be very interesting.Quote:
Originally Posted by the other bob wilson
Decent article, but it's not rocket science that the older you get, the more younger people there are around you. That's just life.
Our fanbase isn't patient enough for a project. Granted, our "project" was Trollope, who lived up to his name. I think Warnock picking his successor (or helping to) will see us pick a steady pair of hands that won't set the world alight but I could be wrong.Quote:
Originally Posted by Loramski
about sums it up :thumbup:Quote:
Originally Posted by sneggyblubird
This is hardly new or groundbreaking. I remember plenty of talk among City fans during the last couple of years of Dave Jones' failed attempts to reach the promised land that we needed a younger manager who was more in tune with modern thinking - a stubborn 4-4-2 man who was inflexible wasn't going to work. By and large Malky was welcomed like a breath of fresh air and there's no doubts he was a step up both in terms of tactics and motivation, though our Premier League performance were exactly that of trying to keep clean sheets and hope for set pieces. Slade did the same but had no tactical clue. Not sure Warnock is much of a tactician but a manager who gets everything out of his players and has created a fantastic spirit at the club.
I'd like to think the same but I can't see how that would work unless Warnock was prepared to aid the transition by moving towards a style of play that his successor would favour and making deals in the transfer windows to reflect that. How would that happen? Having kept Warnock for another season it would be pretty pointless to encourage him to mimic someone else and if we're involved in the promotion race in January you could hardly expect him to go out and buy players the new manager would like for next season.Quote:
Originally Posted by Pedro de la Rosa
Whatever long term planning is going on behind the scenes, Tan will be happy to see us go up by any means, however ugly it is, and worry about the future come May. And who can blame him for that?
The issue isn't the manager it is the structure around him DJ, had a cobbled together team around him of PR, and a couple of coaches. DJ did well to wheel and deal around that structure, but ultimately it wasnt good enough to ultimately get promoted.Quote:
Originally Posted by Eric the Half a Bee
MM had an established team around him with a better structure of coaches, and scouting and recruitment. That lead to promotion. However because that team was all MM men it lead to possibly taking advantage of the situation. It definitely lead to distrust.
After that we have gone down the road of having little or no structure under Slade and Trollope.
Then Warnock who pretty much runs the show with Blackwell and Jepson, and the remains of the 'committee' that worked under the other managers.
It doesnt matter if we replace Warnock with a young hungry manager or an experienced old head. If the club doesnt improve its scouting and coaching systems then it will ultimately doom to fail. An experienced manager suits Cardiff at the moment, because he is more than likely to know the coaching team that he wants, and will bring it with him.
Provided Warnock signs players like Reid, Murphy, Holtby or whatever, then we've got somewhere to go. We'll have issues if we sign a load of cloggers, as our team won't be able to do anything else, so we'll either have to stick or go through a massive period of change.Quote:
Originally Posted by Loramski
He got a side nobody fancied for promotion to the Premier League with 90 points, and wasn't a million miles away from keeping them upQuote:
Originally Posted by Eric the Half a Bee
The day we start playing tippy tappy along the back four, is the day I stay home
It's very hard to give fair criticism of these old school managers in such a short article as, if we take Mark Hughes as an example, then you only have to go back to the end of the 2017 season for his reputation to be good again and only back to the end of the 2016 season for his reputation to be very good. Arguably, it's when Hughes attempted to try a more "modern day formation" that his weaknesses were highlighted and his team slid towards relegation, but then how much can you blame the manager if his best striker is also his best full-back and the supporters have given up shouting against the big club bias of the premier league?
There is so much wealth in the premier league and so many inflated budgets (or teams willing to risk it all to stay in the league) that a manager compared to Klopp has joined Southampton when they were threatened with relegation. That wealth is coming now into the Championship but it only takes that extra season of failure and Aston Villa could easily become the next Bolton Wanders could easily become the next Darlington F.C. I know Warnock wants to go back up but our season could still be very successful without promotion if we get it right off the field.
Everyone seems to copy whats being most successful at the time which isn't a bad thing but when everyone is trying the same thing ultimately the team with the best players wins.
English teams seem to do things a bit slower in the past and copying when it's too late. Swansea credit to them did this very well and probably were innovative for their league statue at the time.
We can't keep.being successful the way we do it but at the moment I think it's best we can do. Whenever we change it's going to be a transition so it's whether it's worth risking that if were in pl but I think when it does happen will set us back years.
Given the way we've played our football for most of this decade and the way Neil Warnock sides play, we're going to have to be successful this coming season for the support to stay onside with the team. There's going to be a level of expectation on City come August that hasn't been there for about five years and if they are failing playing a brand of football that I'll charitably call old fashioned, then things might turn ugly pretty quickly - the atmosphere was dreadful in 13/14 even after we started playing in blue again.
He did indeed. I don't think that's as a result of Warnock being a great tactician. We play a primitive type of football. Win our own individual battles, drop off and make it difficult for teams to play through us when not in possession, nothing fancy in defence and clear the ball as far away as possible, preferably out of play. Attacks formed if a forward player holds onto a long ball from defence or a swift ball forward, little to no midfield build up. Wingers must track back. Good game management.Quote:
Originally Posted by City123
I agree with TOBW that there's going to be an expectancy of the team this season. That carries a lot of pressure.
I think that's a very unfair view of Warnock that has been cultivated by his media image. If his entire tactical view of football was just Sunday league phrases like "win your battles" and "get it in row Z" he'd have been kicked out of football long ago, to still be as successful as he is at the age of 70 shows an ability to adapt as the game changes, just because a side don't play a possession based game doesn't make them tactically naive or make the manager a poor tactician, Warnock makes the most out of what he has and took a hugely unfancied side to the Premier League, he didn't do that with just telling players to win their battles.Quote:
Originally Posted by Eric the Half a Bee
Osian Roberts waxed lyrical on Warnock's tactical nous on Radio Wales throughout our promotion season, we played Wolves (managed by flavour of the month Nuno) off the park at their place in our promotion campaign, destroyed Aston Villa and humiliated Leeds. "Primitive" is an incredibly harsh way to describe our play, we played some brilliant football in the first half of our promotion campaign, were we more conservative in the second half of the campaign? Yes, but injuries played a large role in that (We ended up having to play Lee Peltier in midfield)
This is the article with Osian's commentsQuote:
Originally Posted by City123
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/43948672
Excellent, so we see a system where Warnock puts man to man markers on two Boro players. He regularly does that, it's about winning your own personal battles.Quote:
Originally Posted by Pedro de la Rosa
The article seems to be suggesting roughly the same as I am - motivation and building a team spirit are essential factors for Warnock. A great tactician? If he was he'd have had a long and successful Premier League career as a manager. I'm not knocking him by the way. The fact that he's not had a long top flight career says something is missing to have stopped him from getting that. In the blood and thunder of the Championship, excellent organisation and getting players to die for the cause can take you a long way.
Being a good tactician and being good at the mental side of the game are not mutually exclusive, in fact you need to be good at both in order to be successful, as Warnock has been throughout his almost 40 years in managementQuote:
Originally Posted by Eric the Half a Bee
I'd argue his top flight career has been hampered by the media image of him and the type of clubs he's managed in the top flight. Its us, Crystal Palace, QPR, Notts County and Sheffield United, hardly mega-clubs
Cardiff city is out of touch with thinking.
Reminds me of that story from Hangeland at when they where at Palace. The boys was waiting for half time talk and what to do tactical. Warnock had them do kne jerks... Motivation my arse.. For monkeys maybe..Quote:
Originally Posted by City123
not just cardiff city but wish the game in the UK would get in the real world and go with the flow from our european and south american counter parts especially at grass route level
the english fa DNA for future football players is the way forward but to me sadly too late but at least it's a start . noticed Burnley fc taking this model seriously this week
http://www.thefa.com/learning/coachi...academy-futsal