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Re: Is it now harder to come to the UK than it is to become a UK citizen?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
dml1954
In the interests of balance I would like to point out that Brexit is not the biggest mistake the UK has ever made, I did vote for it, as did 52% of us. If only the other 48% would accept the result of a democratic vote, stop moaning and get on with it, the country would be a much happier place.
You're right there dml. Brexit is definitely not the biggest mistake the UK has ever made.
It will be the biggest mistake the UK has ever made.
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Re: Is it now harder to come to the UK than it is to become a UK citizen?
Why the **** would a 21st Century immigrant to the UK know who Torvil and Dean are? Does anyone under 40 know who they are?
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Re: Is it now harder to come to the UK than it is to become a UK citizen?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
dml1954
In the interests of balance I would like to point out that Brexit is not the biggest mistake the UK has ever made, I did vote for it, as did 52% of us. If only the other 48% would accept the result of a democratic vote, stop moaning and get on with it, the country would be a much happier place.
There's a difference between accepting the result and accepting the problems that are widely predicted to arise. A friend of mine publicly admitted on social media that he'd be happy to accept Brexit even if it meant everyone in his constituency losing their jobs. I accept he wants to leave and he's got his way. I will never accept that attitude of f*ck everyone else, I don't care how badly people are affected.
This isn't voting in a new captain of the golf club or a new chairman of a choir. It's something that has far reaching complications, some we don't even know about yet, and will affect all of our lives, many in a negative way. Yet we're told to shut up and put up with it because some people don't want black people here.
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Re: Is it now harder to come to the UK than it is to become a UK citizen?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
dml1954
In the interests of balance I would like to point out that Brexit is not the biggest mistake the UK has ever made, I did vote for it, as did 52% of us. If only the other 48% would accept the result of a democratic vote, stop moaning and get on with it, the country would be a much happier place.
Should the people of Scotland blindly accept the will of a bunch of ****ing idiots in England and Wales who were too stupid to see they were being lied to? Wales receives almost £700M a year from the EU. Do you think Boris and his chums are going to be as generous?
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Re: Is it now harder to come to the UK than it is to become a UK citizen?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
NYCBlue
Should the people of Scotland blindly accept the will of a bunch of ****ing idiots in England and Wales who were too stupid to see they were being lied to? Wales receives almost £700M a year from the EU. Do you think Boris and his chums are going to be as generous?
Calling people thick, remember Hillary’s deplorables ?, isn’t the way to engage voters, I would suggest it has the opposite effect and just like in Merica produced a kick back from a big sector of the electorate . You have made the valid point of the level of subsidy from the EU to Wales, but, and importantly IMO, many people in Wales never saw the benefits of this EU subsidy, we have generations of youngsters in areas of Wales not used to the concept of work because there wasn’t anything suitable to replace the traditional industries when they were removed (and all whilst the UK was in the EU), instead of competing with the leave fairy tale stories on the side of busses etc. the remain camp should have went on the offensive with the positives, ramming home achievements, this should have been the easiest vote ever for the remain side to have won but they allowed themselves to get sucked into a dirty campaign and basically ended up just calling people thick and racist and never once considering why people felt left out during the prosperity of the EU, just perhaps it was the only way the left out of Wales and areas of the North could have any effect on changing destiny even if it wasn’t going to be for the better, they made the country hear them. And did they just!!!!. It was the people of Wales who decided, the people didn’t not want to be in the club %age, but the Welsh government’s during the period of EU legislation/rule etc. should be taking a long hard look at itself at how they managed to let the people of Wales to think that they would be better off outside, they made the decisions and allocated the money.
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Re: Is it now harder to come to the UK than it is to become a UK citizen?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Nelsonca61
Calling people thick, remember Hillary’s deplorables ?, isn’t the way to engage voters, I would suggest it has the opposite effect and just like in Merica produced a kick back from a big sector of the electorate . You have made the valid point of the level of subsidy from the EU to Wales, but, and importantly IMO, many people in Wales never saw the benefits of this EU subsidy, we have generations of youngsters in areas of Wales not used to the concept of work because there wasn’t anything suitable to replace the traditional industries when they were removed (and all whilst the UK was in the EU), instead of competing with the leave fairy tale stories on the side of busses etc. the remain camp should have went on the offensive with the positives, ramming home achievements, this should have been the easiest vote ever for the remain side to have won but they allowed themselves to get sucked into a dirty campaign and basically ended up just calling people thick and racist and never once considering why people felt left out during the prosperity of the EU, just perhaps it was the only way the left out of Wales and areas of the North could have any effect on changing destiny even if it wasn’t going to be for the better, they made the country hear them. And did they just!!!!. It was the people of Wales who decided, the people didn’t not want to be in the club %age, but the Welsh government’s during the period of EU legislation/rule etc. should be taking a long hard look at itself at how they managed to let the people of Wales to think that they would be better off outside, they made the decisions and allocated the money.
There's something else that comes out of this which i find deeply worrying. It seems that more and more people don't care whether they're factually correct or not. It is a great mystery to me why, and I've experienced this a lot, someone will have an opinion on something, you prove beyond any doubt that their opinion is based on horseshit, yet despite this they still believe their opinion, or won't change their mind even if they're wrong. I'm not talking about where opinions aren't black or white, where both can argue they are right, but things where there is absolutely no doubt that one person is 100% most definitely wrong.
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Re: Is it now harder to come to the UK than it is to become a UK citizen?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Nelsonca61
Calling people thick, remember Hillary’s deplorables ?, isn’t the way to engage voters, I would suggest it has the opposite effect and just like in Merica produced a kick back from a big sector of the electorate . You have made the valid point of the level of subsidy from the EU to Wales, but, and importantly IMO, many people in Wales never saw the benefits of this EU subsidy, we have generations of youngsters in areas of Wales not used to the concept of work because there wasn’t anything suitable to replace the traditional industries when they were removed (and all whilst the UK was in the EU), instead of competing with the leave fairy tale stories on the side of busses etc. the remain camp should have went on the offensive with the positives, ramming home achievements, this should have been the easiest vote ever for the remain side to have won but they allowed themselves to get sucked into a dirty campaign and basically ended up just calling people thick and racist and never once considering why people felt left out during the prosperity of the EU, just perhaps it was the only way the left out of Wales and areas of the North could have any effect on changing destiny even if it wasn’t going to be for the better, they made the country hear them. And did they just!!!!. It was the people of Wales who decided, the people didn’t not want to be in the club %age, but the Welsh government’s during the period of EU legislation/rule etc. should be taking a long hard look at itself at how they managed to let the people of Wales to think that they would be better off outside, they made the decisions and allocated the money.
Anyone (especially someone living in Wales) that believed Boris and Farage and allowed themselves to get riled up into a 19th century worldview is stupid. That's not my fault.
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Re: Is it now harder to come to the UK than it is to become a UK citizen?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Nelsonca61
Calling people thick, remember Hillary’s deplorables ?, isn’t the way to engage voters, I would suggest it has the opposite effect and just like in Merica produced a kick back from a big sector of the electorate . You have made the valid point of the level of subsidy from the EU to Wales, but, and importantly IMO, many people in Wales never saw the benefits of this EU subsidy, we have generations of youngsters in areas of Wales not used to the concept of work because there wasn’t anything suitable to replace the traditional industries when they were removed (and all whilst the UK was in the EU), instead of competing with the leave fairy tale stories on the side of busses etc. the remain camp should have went on the offensive with the positives, ramming home achievements, this should have been the easiest vote ever for the remain side to have won but they allowed themselves to get sucked into a dirty campaign and basically ended up just calling people thick and racist and never once considering why people felt left out during the prosperity of the EU, just perhaps it was the only way the left out of Wales and areas of the North could have any effect on changing destiny even if it wasn’t going to be for the better, they made the country hear them. And did they just!!!!. It was the people of Wales who decided, the people didn’t not want to be in the club %age, but the Welsh government’s during the period of EU legislation/rule etc. should be taking a long hard look at itself at how they managed to let the people of Wales to think that they would be better off outside, they made the decisions and allocated the money.
Do you really think the EU has a bigger say in how we replace traditional industry than Westminster?
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Re: Is it now harder to come to the UK than it is to become a UK citizen?
Interesting quotes:
Yuval Noah Harari (author of Sapiens and other tomes):
You might object that people were asked ‘What do you think?’ rather than ‘What do you feel?’, but this is a common misperception. Referendums and elections are always about human feelings, not about human rationality. If democracy were a matter of rational decision-making, there would be absolutely no reason to give all people equal voting rights – or perhaps any voting rights. There is ample evidence that some people are far more knowledgeable and rational than others, certainly when it comes to specific economic and political questions.”
Richard Dawklins:
I, and most other people, don’t have the time or the experience to do our due diligence on the highly complex economic and social issues facing our country in, or out of, Europe. That’s why we vote for our Member of Parliament, who is paid a good salary to debate such matters on our behalf, and vote on them. The European Union referendum, like the one on Scottish independence, should never have been called.
My personal opinion was always that I didn't know enough about the complexity and consequences of the vote either way. However, the streets, pubs and social media were full of people expounding on the matter but with nothing other than vacuous slogans support in their vocabulary.
There are great minds out there with opinions that fell on either side of the argument but most of us were, sadly, clueless.
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Re: Is it now harder to come to the UK than it is to become a UK citizen?
Quote:
If democracy were a matter of rational decision-making, there would be absolutely no reason to give all people equal voting rights – or perhaps any voting rights.
Falls down a bit here imo.
Richard Dawkins' quote echos exactly my thoughts when a referendum was called.
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Re: Is it now harder to come to the UK than it is to become a UK citizen?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Croesy Blue
Falls down a bit here imo.
Richard Dawkins' quote echos exactly my thoughts when a referendum was called.
Yep, I always thought that it was a decision to be made by the people who are paid well to make such decisions. I’m sure that there are many other things that certain people feel a lot stronger about than the EU situation yet they don’t expect a referendum to get their way. The whole fiasco was a waste of time & money.
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Re: Is it now harder to come to the UK than it is to become a UK citizen?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
lardy
A few years ago I did an office Christmas quiz with questions from the citizenship test. The most anyone got was 70%.
I remember one question about the Huguenots coming from France in 1671 or something. Why on earth is this kind of shite in there?
Tells us more about the people who set these kind of tests than the people actually taking them.
At a guess the team probably consists mainly OxBridge graduates
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Re: Is it now harder to come to the UK than it is to become a UK citizen?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
NYCBlue
Should the people of Scotland blindly accept the will of a bunch of ****ing idiots in England and Wales who were too stupid to see they were being lied to? Wales receives almost £700M a year from the EU. Do you think Boris and his chums are going to be as generous?
The West Lothian question has been the subject of ongoing debate ever since it was first raised in 1977
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Re: Is it now harder to come to the UK than it is to become a UK citizen?
17/24
Must remember to read the questions more carefully
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Re: Is it now harder to come to the UK than it is to become a UK citizen?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Jeff Mansfield
The UK has always had full control over legal non-EU immigration. It isn't part of the Schengen agreement. It could even have delayed immigration from the EU by 7 years but chose not to do so in 2004 and 2007.
The idea that we have no control is just one of Johnson's Straw Man arguments: what you do is create a problem which doesn't really exist, using fallacious arguments, so you can then claim the credit for solving it.
This is a crowd-pleaser which a lot of people will love until they see that nothing has changed. The Govt will quietly create all kinds of exceptional categories and all will be exactly as it is now. NHS staff, carers, cheap car washes etc will still be done by 'immigrants'. And then the truth will come out.
British workers on low pay will still be low-paid. The unemployment black-spots will not create new jobs because of this. Hard-working people on council house waiting lists will still be waiting, paying through the nose for private rent.
But it looks good doesn't it. And in Brexit Britain, that's what counts.
Nail on the head
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Re: Is it now harder to come to the UK than it is to become a UK citizen?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
jeremy corbyn
Dont decking drag me into this. Brexit is the biggest mistake the UK have ever made. I didn't vote for it. Neither did 48% of us.
Too right
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Re: Is it now harder to come to the UK than it is to become a UK citizen?
Feck me
11/24
I’m packing me bags 💼🙃
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Re: Is it now harder to come to the UK than it is to become a UK citizen?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
NYCBlue
Should the people of Scotland blindly accept the will of a bunch of ****ing idiots in England and Wales who were too stupid to see they were being lied to? Wales receives almost £700M a year from the EU. Do you think Boris and his chums are going to be as generous?
Scotland is part of the UK, so yes they should accept it. Also you are accusing 17.4 million people (including those who voted for it in Scotland) of being stupid which is a typical attitude of remainers in general, who will not accept the result of a binding democratic vote and it also says a lot about your general attitude to life. Wales was receiving money from the EU but the UK as a whole paid over £20 billion a year into EU coffers - there is nothing like giving you your own money back is there and then bragging about it.
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Re: Is it now harder to come to the UK than it is to become a UK citizen?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Eric the Half a Bee
There's a difference between accepting the result and accepting the problems that are widely predicted to arise. A friend of mine publicly admitted on social media that he'd be happy to accept Brexit even if it meant everyone in his constituency losing their jobs. I accept he wants to leave and he's got his way. I will never accept that attitude of f*ck everyone else, I don't care how badly people are affected.
This isn't voting in a new captain of the golf club or a new chairman of a choir. It's something that has far reaching complications, some we don't even know about yet, and will affect all of our lives, many in a negative way. Yet we're told to shut up and put up with it because some people don't want black people here.
So now people who voted leave are racist as well as stupid eh. I rest my case.
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Re: Is it now harder to come to the UK than it is to become a UK citizen?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
NYCBlue
Anyone (especially someone living in Wales) that believed Boris and Farage and allowed themselves to get riled up into a 19th century worldview is stupid. That's not my fault.
Give someone a long enough piece of rope and they will eventually hang themselves. Thanks.
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Re: Is it now harder to come to the UK than it is to become a UK citizen?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
dml1954
Scotland is part of the UK, so yes they should accept it. Also you are accusing 17.4 million people (including those who voted for it in Scotland) of being stupid which is a typical attitude of remainers in general, who will not accept the result of a binding democratic vote and it also says a lot about your general attitude to life. Wales was receiving money from the EU but the UK as a whole paid over £20 billion a year into EU coffers - there is nothing like giving you your own money back is there and then bragging about it.
I don't usually get involved in this type of debate but cannot let you get away with such a misleading post.
The amount the UK paid to the EU varied from year to year but was mostly less than £20bn. In 2018 we were due to pay £17.4bn but with our discount or rebate, which was negotiated by Thatcher, this reduced to £13.2bn.This rebate applies every year. The EU paid £4bn back to the UK in various sponsored projects reducing it further to just over £9bn. There were also various research grants paid to UK universities and other organisations which further reduces the net amount to just over £7bn which I believe amounts to just over 1% of our GDP.
These figures are readily available from the UK Office of National Statistics whose head once stated that Boris Johnson's continual statement of £350m per week was 'a clear misuse of National Statistics'. I suggest that your post is that also.
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Re: Is it now harder to come to the UK than it is to become a UK citizen?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
dml1954
So now people who voted leave are racist as well as stupid eh. I rest my case.
The people I know who voted leave ...not friends I hasten to add ....were indeed both stupid and racist
In some cases out and out xenophobic , thick racist idiots
It's fair to say that many people in the uk who voted leave were thick and racist
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Re: Is it now harder to come to the UK than it is to become a UK citizen?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
BlueToujours
I don't usually get involved in this type of debate but cannot let you get away with such a misleading post.
The amount the UK paid to the EU varied from year to year but was mostly less than £20bn. In 2018 we were due to pay £17.4bn but with our discount or rebate, which was negotiated by Thatcher, this reduced to £13.2bn.This rebate applies every year. The EU paid £4bn back to the UK in various sponsored projects reducing it further to just over £9bn. There were also various research grants paid to UK universities and other organisations which further reduces the net amount to just over £7bn which I believe amounts to just over 1% of our GDP.
These figures are readily available from the UK Office of National Statistics whose head once stated that Boris Johnson's continual statement of £350m per week was 'a clear misuse of National Statistics'. I suggest that your post is that also.
Did I just witness a murder?
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Re: Is it now harder to come to the UK than it is to become a UK citizen?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
BlueToujours
I don't usually get involved in this type of debate but cannot let you get away with such a misleading post.
The amount the UK paid to the EU varied from year to year but was mostly less than £20bn. In 2018 we were due to pay £17.4bn but with our discount or rebate, which was negotiated by Thatcher, this reduced to £13.2bn.This rebate applies every year. The EU paid £4bn back to the UK in various sponsored projects reducing it further to just over £9bn. There were also various research grants paid to UK universities and other organisations which further reduces the net amount to just over £7bn which I believe amounts to just over 1% of our GDP.
These figures are readily available from the UK Office of National Statistics whose head once stated that Boris Johnson's continual statement of £350m per week was 'a clear misuse of National Statistics'. I suggest that your post is that also.
So the stuff on the side of the bus was nonsense ? Well I never
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Re: Is it now harder to come to the UK than it is to become a UK citizen?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Heisenberg
Did I just witness a murder?
If it's not murder it's a serious case of assault
