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Unfortunately Watford were completely on another level to us.
The way the played through the lines with Pereyra, Quina, Delofeu and particularly Doucoure was was very impressive was on another level compared to us.
I know we set up differently but we have nobody at all playing in between the lines. Gunnarsson body shape is all wrong and never scans the play. Manga can't even control the ball and is nowhere near good enough to play full back at this level.
Etheridge was unbelievable.
I disagree. They had something a bit extra but I wouldn't say they're on another level.
In fact, I thought both teams looked scruffy and were battling pretty awful conditions. Heavy rain is hard enough to play in, but the gusts make it hard the judge the ball. It might have been a different contest on a dry, calm day in September.
The boy Delefeou (check spelling) was great.
They destroyed us. If we approached the game the same way and played them another 10 times we’d lose every one (and by more than 1 goal) - I’d say they were on a different planet never mind level to us yesterday . We played like a league 1 team might away from home to a PL team in the 3rd round of the cupQuote:
Originally Posted by B. Oddie
Our biggest mistake was letting them play.
No closing down, no hassling, no pressing. Nothing. In some games we do this for 90 minutes, in others we don't do it at all.
You can't make a tackle if you're just ball watching. Watch Man City, when they lose the ball they hunt you down until they get it back. Granted we don't have the ability Man City players have, but we should at least be trying to win the ball back.
That is what I saw too. Their final third play was a completely different class to us. The idea that we could just try a bit harder or play a bit more attacking (which is all over this forum at the moment) and that would eradicate that gap in class is fantasy.Quote:
Originally Posted by thehumblegringo
We are a patchwork and Warnock is doing a good job with what he has got. As long as we don't lose our marbles in the January window we should be in a good financial position next year either in this division or the Championship (at the moment the bookies have us about 60% to go down and 40% to stay up.
Not what I saw. We gave them their half, let their defenders play but you don't get beat by a CB. We tried to close down when they crossed the half way line, sometimes it worked and other times they pulled us out of our shape and tore us to shredsQuote:
Originally Posted by Spooky Tree
This is difficult when we leave so much space between positions we may as well play 10 defenders, I was hoping that the penny would drop after yesterday and warnock would scrap the way we approach away games but after pulling 2 goals back I don’t think this will be happening nowQuote:
Originally Posted by Spooky Tree
It would be interest8ng to know how much each player in their team cost? Partic midfield and up front, I don’t think they spent ridiculous amounts to get to that level, so nor do we need to?
It can’t be easy for Neil when our midfield who have been so good at home let us down a bit away? And Murphy? They need to step up away aswellQuote:
Originally Posted by jamieccfc
There was no closing down at all.Quote:
Originally Posted by Eric Cartman
Only Peltier closed down and challenged when he came on, and in the space of about a minute he had won the ball back twice.
If a player as limited as Peltier can win the ball back, there's no reason the rest of our team can't.
I agree the players need to take more responsibility but Warnock needs to approach these games a bit different from just trying to keep it 0-0 for 60/70 mins I think he could go 3 at the backQuote:
Originally Posted by goats
The person to blame for yesterdays defeat was Warnock, he was out thought completely and failed to respond to Watford style of play. We allowed Watford to play a 2.6.2 system which overloaded our midfield which just retreated backwards. Their 2 wingers both came into midfield while their full backs overlapped. We should have gone 5.3.2 and then having 2 upfront would have meant their full backs wouldnt have come forward so much and allowed our midfield to be more compact.
Manga was so far infield and Hoillet so far back it looked like he was centre back anyway.Quote:
Originally Posted by jamieccfc
We looked so disorganised, it was hard to see WHAT the plan was
Oh okay so closing down is only closing down when it works.Quote:
Originally Posted by Spooky Tree
Are we fit enough to do the chase down ?Quote:
Originally Posted by Spooky Tree
Can't agree Eric. Have a look how we set up. We're flat in midfield, we sit off. Warnock has this idea that we can just defend, gain possession and then give it to the wingers who can run at three defenders and hopefully get a throw in, free kick or corner. We didn't even give ourselves a chance yesterday. Most teams at this level can play if you let them or invite them to. Watford aren't great as was shown when we were forced to press them. I'm not saying that we would have got the result yesterday if we had played differently, but to not even try is wrong-sitting off and crowding the18 yard line doesn't work. Watford looked good yesterday because Warnock decided to employ an attack versus defence approach, it's the stuff of training sessions.Quote:
Originally Posted by Eric Cartman
It's hard to be critical cos we are where we are and in some ways we are championship team who manages to squeeze every last ounce of potential out of themselves on a consistent basis.Quote:
Originally Posted by Eric Cartman
The fact is we have some defenders who are very uncomfortable on the ball and a midfield who relies on hard work rather than on any guile.
Even Camarasa who has been excellent for us this season would probably struggle to get in the Watford team. (Though it could be argued he'd be better in a team that pass the ball)
The defensive midfielder is not just there to defend these days but he's usually the pivot of the team and controls the pace and tempo of the game. Gunnarsson is incapable of doing this and can only play as a bit of a plug in midfield.
Like someone else said in this thread, we never play in between the lines but get the ball wide and hope we can get a set piece. We have so much we need to invest in to catch teams like Watford, Bournemouth and Leicester but some more creativity in the middle of the park has got to be up there behind a full back and striker.
Watford were good yesterday, bit I think we had an off day. And we still could’ve snatched a draw. Wouldn’t say they’re another level to us.
I was there yesterday and had a very good viewpoint. We looked a shambles in midfield for most of the match and there seemed to be no cohesion. I also felt sorry for Paterson who was up front with on occasions absolutely nobody around him. Whilst he's a top bloke, great character and good for a laugh NW was culpable again for a failed game plan which gave Watford far too much time to play. Our ball retention was woeful and our inability to build from the back meant hoof ball and lost possession. I don't buy this crap about we went up a season too early. Ok we're there so let's make a fist of it. Also think Reid should start against Manure and Gunnarsson should have a rest.
Couldn't agree more with all of the above. Reid to start and Josh Murphy....please can someone find the legs to keep up with him? He always tries to run the ball down the wing on his own. Watford had two or three players on him and not suprisingly he didn't get through with no other City players in support. 433 Neil...let's have a go on Saturday.Quote:
Originally Posted by Taffy Blue in Berkshire
We don’t seem to have played many games with Murphy, Reid, Patterson/ Zohore and Hoillet/ NML as a 4.Quote:
Originally Posted by IanD
Centre forward, no 10 and 2 wingers.
I’d like to see us try.
I think Reid has the legs to help out midfield and he can also spot a through ball and creates and takes chances.
They would create problems and maybe take a bit of pressure off the back 4.
Arter and Camerasa playing centre mid, with Gunner and Ralls as cover/ competition.
Big Cal won most flick ons yesterday...sometimes no one was running on to them and when they were they couldn't control the ball.
Just about every 2nd ball was picked up by Watford players..with no one anywhere near them