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It feels like 2 points dropped against a team as lowly as Wigan or, and this has been my concern after the optimism created off the back of the last two games, were the results against poor Luton and Huddersfield sides more a reflection of their weaknesses rather than us improving significantly?
:-/
Probably a bit of both, but it also highlights the inconsistency that has been a factor all season.
yeah it feels like 2 points dropped, sloppy defending for their 1st , Fast break out from our set piece lead to their penalty but we should have had at least 1 penalty in the first half...Morrison getting pulled just before our equaliser then Adomah pulled back in the box both ignored by the referee and once again sub standard officiating!
we didn’t really test them enough to really say we should have won but I thought there was nothing wrong with our “winner” however I am at opposite end of ground
We played some decent stuff at times, but draw was probably a fair result. We should have done better. We lacked a real cutting edge. Maybe they were tired. Harris should probably have freshened up the starting 11.
I thought we played ok for the 1st 30 minutes or so, despite sleeping for their goal, then the game seemed to have too many pauses for anyone to get anything going. We didn’t kick on after equalising for the 2nd time and were seemingly happy to let them have the ball at the back. Should have 2 penalties and the disallowed goal was never a foul just a poor punch from Marshall which he scrambled to recover. The ref was dreadful pretty much all game although he did get the penalty decision right.Quote:
Originally Posted by NYCBlue
But 7 points from 9 is a decent return.
How we played is academic really. The raw fact is that if we can't win games like this we can't realistically think about promotion.
When we abandoned Warnockball I warned that it would entail starting again, and it has. Same thing as when Malky went, we lost an impetus which took a long time to build and once again it'll take a while to get a new one going.
My fear is that if Tomlin goes off form of gets injured we haven't got a plan B. As it is , he's got the manager out of trouble time and again with a flash of genius, but the lack of any clear team wide strategy or system has been there to see.
It's okay, but no more than that. I don't think it's going anywhere other than getting away with it and ending up in the middle third of the table, which is a pity. The great adventure is over and we must wait for the next one
Is that like the 2 defeats the 2012/13 champions lost against Peterborough? Closer to home, is that like Barnsley winning at Fulham, even though we managed to beat Barnsley?Quote:
Originally Posted by RonnieBird
As for us losing an impetus that took a long time to build being destroyed, we've won more points under Harris than we did under Warnock and we've become more difficult to beat.
Basically, you don't have a clue what you're talking about. Again.
Rubbish. We are only three points off the play offs. The conditions were poor today but everyone worked hard. The ref was abysmal - apart from the third ‘goal’ and missing two pens for us, he should have sent off their player in the first minute for the tackle on Vaulks. He actually gave a free kick to them (against Adomah) in the second half when the ‘fouled’ player was behind Adomah who was running with the ball and threw himself to the ground. The ref was out of his depth.Quote:
Originally Posted by RonnieBird
We fell asleep for their first goal and almost did the same thing again later in the first half. I thought we were never completely convincing in defence and both of our starting fullbacks struggled against their wide players.
We created a few chances from open play, but we only really threatened to score from corners and long throws. Although for long periods of the second half we looked more likely to get a third goal, I was never confident that Wigan wouldn't go down the other end and score one themselves.
A win would have flattered either team.
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Originally Posted by Eric the Half a Bee
I wish you didn't need to be so childish and personal.
Unfortunately , I think my view of the current situation is about right. It's not a question of one dissapointing result, but rather that there's a lack of clear strategy which everyone is plugged into.
It's also arguable that it's necessary because the previous theme wasn't going any further than it had, but the fact remains that we are in a state of flux which won't be resolved overnight.
Is Mr Harris the answer ? I wouldn't dismiss it, but despite his excellent personal progress he's got quite a lot to learn compared to the likes of Malky or Sir Neil, the most important of which is that you can't sacrifice match by match results as part of your progress toward how you'd eventually like the team to shape up.
I think he's a gamble and that if he ever gets things right that'll take at least another year to start yielding results.
Does that mean that I want to blame ,attack or undermine him ? Certainly not because he didn't make the decision to change course and in any case, once that decision was taken it was taken and there's nothing constructive to be gained from bemoaning it. I merely point out the realities of the matter.
For all the improvement under Harris, I still can't see us going on an extended promotion threatening run, but I would be very happy if the manager proved me wrong :thumbup:
I didn’t think we were too bad. It was an enjoyable game, and the winner should have stood in my opinion. Ward missed a sitter just before that as well. Been a great week in my opinion, and we’ve moved closer to the playoffs despite not winning.
Look how Barnsley battered Fulham. There are no easy games in this league. On to Stoke..
You are right that there is no need for personal abuse, but you are wrong to talk about losing momentum. We didn't have any under Warnock. While we might not look like a team that will challenge for promotion we are much better than we were.Quote:
Originally Posted by RonnieBird
Why isn't there a like button?Quote:
Originally Posted by BlueArmy 86
You said we can't think about winning promotion if we don't win games like today. That's nonsense.Quote:
Originally Posted by RonnieBird
You also claim we've lost impetus since Warnock left. That's also nonsense. Results have been better and confidence appears to be growing having been almost non-existant since relegation under Warnock.
'Twas a veritable curate's egg.
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Originally Posted by RichardM
Thank you for that, and I certainly hope I am wrong. Of course we all have different opinions and read things differently but we all have the interests of the club at heart I hope and, as you demonstrate, we can disagree without being disagreeable.
Recent results have been a slight improvement, but I still think that's been at the expense of a general togetherness which might have turned the corner. As I said though, that doesn't matter now because done is done and we certainly mustn't undermine the current manager with hypotheticals about past decisions.
Really, that's all I was saying - that were not looking like a team which will challenge or promotion , and that I think it's realistic for us to aspire to that given recent history , money spent on players , parachute incomes and support levels.
I was just studying the table and in practical terms it's almost impossible now for us to be challenging this year because it would rely on several teams having a complete meltdown together with us winning lots and lots of games against good opponents.
Never mind, as you say we can in the mean time enjoy the more attractive style of football, but we can't and mustn't just cruise along, but formulate an efficient and reliable "usp" which can be expected to achieve the target next season. This may well be the current project coming good, but we can't afford to wait years to find out.
I'd say the acid test would be whether there's some consistency and improved direction towards the end of this season, and if that's not happening then maybe it needs to be re assessed.
I don't post here much because I get frustrated by moronic name calling if someone takes a different view, and the loud mouths get to shout everyone else down, so I appreciate your civil reply.
You do realise we're three points off the playoffs?Quote:
Originally Posted by RonnieBird
We're three points off the playoffs.Quote:
Originally Posted by RonnieBird
We still have to put a decent run together against some good teams. Can we?Quote:
Originally Posted by City123
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Originally Posted by Wales-Bales
It’s ne of the reasons we are glued to the City year n year out. You just never know
We've lost 2 since Harris came in and have shown definite signs of improvement, I think we can. To say its "almost impossible" for us to challenge is nonsenseQuote:
Originally Posted by Wales-Bales
Sorry, but this is priceless. I've lost count of the number of posters you've been condescending towards, accused of not having your intellect etc. Everytime you post nonsense, you need to be pulled up on it. Such has been your style in the past.Quote:
Originally Posted by RonnieBird
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Originally Posted by Eric the Half a Bee
If you say so Eric. I'm here to discuss football rather than my intellect or your manners though, so perhaps we could leave that part of the conversation there ?
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Originally Posted by City123
Yea we are, and I applaud your positive view. I also sincerely hope I'm wrong in my reading of the situation.
The trouble is that in order to exploit that position we need to be consistent and focussed to a very high degree and I don't think we are.
It'd rely on one or two teams having a very bad run indeed whilst we were winning away games against leading teams on a regular basis. Stranger things have happened but it seems unlikely now because there's little or no margin for error.
That's my objective opinion, but I was confident that we'd avoid relegation last year and I was wrong about that so let's hope I'm wrong about this too. I'm usually right more than I'm wrong about football, but no one can foresee the future and I admire your positive view, which is one thing we must retain in the future whatever happens.
So given your objective opinion, how do you work out that there is little margin for error? Something mathematical will help here. Facts, points averages etc. A reasonable analysis of what is required will suffice.Quote:
Originally Posted by RonnieBird
Also, do you accept that we're in a better position with Harris in "transition" than we would have been with Warnock?
Don’t feel the need to apologise, he isn’t a bluebird. From the stylometry is obviousQuote:
Originally Posted by Eric the Half a Bee