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Re: Operation Yellowhammer
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Originally Posted by
NYCBlue
He literally has no idea what he's talking about. He doesn't even know the meaning of the terms he uses. (Why the ****ing **** would a large, capitalist country want to steer the world away from globalization - it makes no sense and it can't be done) He obviously gets his opinions spoon-fed to him from whacko, right-wing websites. Invoking Wilbur Ross FFS! (you should spend a few minutes looking him up if you don't know who he is) It's a joke. Do yourself a favour and put him on ignore. Serenity now!
WB thinks Trump is an anti-globalist. He's obviously missed the last three decades where Trump's business model has been to build a tower with his name on in as many countries as possible.
If more people put him on ignore, the board would be much better.
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Re: Operation Yellowhammer
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Originally Posted by
Dorcus
What's the problem with that?
Really?
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Re: Operation Yellowhammer
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Originally Posted by
lardy
WB thinks Trump is an anti-globalist. He's obviously missed the last three decades where Trump's business model has been to build a tower with his name on in as many countries as possible.
If more people put him on ignore, the board would be much better.
And the part where Trump and his entire family had all the dry goods they were peddling in the US and elsewhere manufactured in China and Mexico.
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Re: Operation Yellowhammer
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Originally Posted by
NYCBlue
And the part where Trump and his entire family had all the dry goods they were peddling in the US and elsewhere manufactured in China and Mexico.
I can see you are a Rachael Madcow arse licker type of person :biggrin:
BTW I have bookmarked your comments where you state categorically that current US economic policy is ineffective and will not produce any positive results. We can revisit this topic at some point in the future, when we have more data that either backs up or disproves your statement of fact.
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Re: Operation Yellowhammer
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Originally Posted by
delmbox
Over the past few months and even weeks various Ministers have denied that there would be fuel shortages, Food shortages and there was even the matter of Mogg rubbishing a respected doctor for saying there would be medicine shortages, all whilst the document formerly named Base Scenario and published as Worst Case scenario existed.
This is another example of deceit.
So it now says it’s the worst case scenario. Does anybody really trust these guys to know that. They have got most else wrong.
Who in their right minds would have voted for this scenario. Even now when Johnson is pushing even harder for Brexit did it take a law change to get this document published.
For all of you who continually revert to arguments about Democracy I suggest you focus on questions of Truth and Integrity which to me now seem much more important.
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Re: Operation Yellowhammer
It’s mad people keep reverting to the democracy argument while our PM who was elected by 0.1% of the country shuts down parliament by lying to the queen so our elected officials can’t do what’s best for the population.
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Re: Operation Yellowhammer
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Originally Posted by
rudy gestede
It’s mad people keep reverting to the democracy argument while our PM who was elected by 0.1% of the country shuts down parliament by lying to the queen so our elected officials can’t do what’s best for the population.
They’ve had 3 yrs to do something that’s best for the population..
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Re: Operation Yellowhammer
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Originally Posted by
William Treseder
They’ve had 3 yrs to do something that’s best for the population..
And unfortunately May’s red lines have made it impossible for them to do that.
That’s why nothing has happened our elected officials have been fighting to stop the country being crippled and people literally dying due to a bad deal.
Glad to see you’re ok with our whole democracy being thrown out the window though.
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Re: Operation Yellowhammer
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Originally Posted by
rudy gestede
And unfortunately May’s red lines have made it impossible for them to do that.
That’s why nothing has happened our elected officials have been fighting to stop the country being crippled and people literally dying due to a bad deal.
Glad to see you’re ok with our whole democracy being thrown out the window though.
So that goes back to my earlier post. Why are we getting a bad deal from the EU, when all we want is to opt out? The member countries appear to have let an all consuming monster grow, in front of their very eyes, without designing or preparing a plausible and fair way for a member country to give up membership if they so desire.
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Re: Operation Yellowhammer
The bad deal isn’t from the EU the bad deal is from us because we have imposed our own red lines.
The EU are happy for us to have a good deal they just have to protect their current member states like Ireland. Our current red lines would break the GFA and who knows what that could cause.
The EU also have to protect their citizens who currently live in the U.K. which the red lines don’t protect.
The bad deal is nothing to do with the EU, the bad deal is because of the U.K..
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Re: Operation Yellowhammer
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Originally Posted by
rudy gestede
The bad deal isn’t from the EU the bad deal is from us because we have imposed our own red lines.
The EU are happy for us to have a good deal they just have to protect their current member states like Ireland. Our current red lines would break the GFA and who knows what that could cause.
The EU also have to protect their citizens who currently live in the U.K. which the red lines don’t protect.
The bad deal is nothing to do with the EU, the bad deal is because of the U.K..
The red lies are a bit of a mish mash on both sides.
At the end of the day, The crux of the problem is, the EU has allowed itself to grow and grow, without putting in place, a plausible leave plan, for any member that wants to leave.
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Re: Operation Yellowhammer
No they’re not the red lines are completely put in place by the U.K.
The thing only thing the EU won’t compromise is there needs to be a border somewhere between the U.K. and the EU (Ireland) and even would allow the backstop to negate this until a proper solution could be agreed.
There’s a plausible plan to leave you submit articles 50 after planning what you want and then try and negotiate with the EU.
The U.K. submitted article 50 before it had even decided if it wanted access to the single market. Then wasted 2 years doing nothing, asked for an extension and set in place ridiculous red lines. The eu agreed a deal with the U.K. but then we still weren’t happy with it because we’d need a hard border somewhere between us an EU countries.
What red lines do you think the EU have put in place?
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Re: Operation Yellowhammer
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Originally Posted by
rudy gestede
No they’re not the red lines are completely put in place by the U.K.
The thing only thing the EU won’t compromise is there needs to be a border somewhere between the U.K. and the EU (Ireland) and even would allow the backstop to negate this until a proper solution could be agreed.
There’s a plausible plan to leave you submit articles 50 after planning what you want and then try and negotiate with the EU.
The U.K. submitted article 50 before it had even decided if it wanted access to the single market. Then wasted 2 years doing nothing, asked for an extension and set in place ridiculous red lines. The eu agreed a deal with the U.K. but then we still weren’t happy with it because we’d need a hard border somewhere between us an EU countries.
What red lines do you think the EU have put in place?
How about the “4 freedoms” Goods,Capital, services and labour? Tying them all up under one banner is always gonna create problems for a member wanting to opt out.
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Re: Operation Yellowhammer
What in have the EU done with regards to those to make it difficult to leave?
You do realise the U.K. were one of the biggest inputs to how the EU is right? The EU isn’t some huge autonomous being, the U.K. was one of the main players in how the EU is. We weren’t forced or coerced into it.
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Re: Operation Yellowhammer
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Originally Posted by
rudy gestede
What in have the EU done with regards to those to make it difficult to leave?
You do realise the U.K. were one of the biggest inputs to how the EU is right? The EU isn’t some huge autonomous being, the U.K. was one of the main players in how the EU is. We weren’t forced or coerced into it.
We never voted to go into it either.
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Re: Operation Yellowhammer
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Originally Posted by
William Treseder
We never voted to go into it either.
And we should never had a referendum to vote ourselves out. We elect MPs to make crucial decisions like this and thank God we’ve still got a few having a go at sorting out this whole sorry mess. The referendum was a hell of a cop out for parliament, they can always fall back on the line ‘Well you voted for it’. But, talking to a few leavers now they didn’t realise that they were voting for this fiasco, I’m sure some of them thought we’d be out at midnight that night.
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Re: Operation Yellowhammer
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Originally Posted by
William Treseder
We never voted to go into it either.
We voted to join it as a trading bloc and the U.K. were instrumental to making it more than that.
There’s a reason people who fought in the war were More likely to vote remain and that’s because they’ve seen the good it’s done since the Second World War at maintaining peace.
Look at the good it’s done for countries like Poland and Czechia too.
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Re: Operation Yellowhammer
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Originally Posted by
splott parker
And we should never had a referendum to vote ourselves out. We elect MPs to make crucial decisions like this and thank God we’ve still got a few having a go at sorting out this whole sorry mess. The referendum was a hell of a cop out for parliament, they can always fall back on the line ‘Well you voted for it’. But, talking to a few leavers now they didn’t realise that they were voting for this fiasco, I’m sure some of them thought we’d be out at midnight that night.
:thumbup: at the very least the referendum should have been more well defined, 3 years on and still no one knows what leave actually means.
The whole thing was rushed to quieten lunatic Tory back benchers and steal the Ukip vote.
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Re: Operation Yellowhammer
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Originally Posted by
William Treseder
They’ve had 3 yrs to do something that’s best for the population..
It could we'll take several lifetimes. 3 years is nothing given the magnitude of the problem
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Re: Operation Yellowhammer
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Originally Posted by
William Treseder
The red lies are a bit of a mish mash on both sides.
At the end of the day, The crux of the problem is, the EU has allowed itself to grow and grow, without putting in place, a plausible leave plan, for any member that wants to leave.
Why on Earth would anyone in their right mind want to leave?
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Re: Operation Yellowhammer
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Originally Posted by
rudy gestede
:thumbup: at the very least the referendum should have been more well defined, 3 years on and still no one knows what leave actually means.
The whole thing was rushed to quieten lunatic Tory back benchers and steal the Ukip vote.
Nobody knows what leave actually means, because, as I keep saying, there is no protocol or template for any member country to do so.
The public were duped into believing we’d simply just leave, and that would be that.
Personally, I still don’t believe a no deal brexit would be anywhere near as bad as is being made out.
That said, I can understand the panic and worry that this whole shambles is causing.
I’d say the best way forward now, would be for another delay, and an exit strategy drawn up, not by the UK, but by the EU, that is clear, precise, and transparent.
It should then be put to the UK public to either vote for that, or vote for a no deal brexit.
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Re: Operation Yellowhammer
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Originally Posted by
splott parker
And we should never had a referendum to vote ourselves out. We elect MPs to make crucial decisions like this and thank God we’ve still got a few having a go at sorting out this whole sorry mess. The referendum was a hell of a cop out for parliament, they can always fall back on the line ‘Well you voted for it’. But, talking to a few leavers now they didn’t realise that they were voting for this fiasco, I’m sure some of them thought we’d be out at midnight that night.
Spot on!
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Re: Operation Yellowhammer
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Originally Posted by
Dorcus
Why on Earth would anyone in their right mind want to leave?
I suggest you ask the 17.4m people who voted to do so.
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Re: Operation Yellowhammer
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Originally Posted by
William Treseder
I suggest you ask the 17.4m people who voted to do so.
A figure which had now probably fallen to well below 16million and dropping like a stone as we speak.
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Re: Operation Yellowhammer
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Originally Posted by
William Treseder
Nobody knows what leave actually means, because, as I keep saying, there is no protocol or template for any member country to do so.
The public were duped into believing we’d simply just leave, and that would be that.
Personally, I still don’t believe a no deal brexit would be anywhere near as bad as is being made out.
That said, I can understand the panic and worry that this whole shambles is causing.
I’d say the best way forward now, would be for another delay, and an exit strategy drawn up, not by the UK, but by the EU, that is clear, precise, and transparent.
It should then be put to the UK public to either vote for that, or vote for a no deal brexit.
Well, you've got it there. People were duped into believing it would be easy. Farage said we'd get a deal easy (Norway, Canada, our choice), Johnson said we'd save money and could spend it on the NHS, and he also said the Irish border would be unaffected by Brexit. We now know that these two, and many others involved in the campaign, stand to individually gain massive sums of money from Brexit (not to mention that Johnson got the premiership from it).
As you say, people were duped, and that actually makes it pretty hard from a democratic point of view to argue that the result from 2016 should stand without a followup. Democracy is all about the people making choices from information they have.
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Re: Operation Yellowhammer
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Originally Posted by
lardy
Well, you've got it there. People were duped into believing it would be easy. Farage said we'd get a deal easy (Norway, Canada, our choice), Johnson said we'd save money and could spend it on the NHS, and he also said the Irish border would be unaffected by Brexit. We now know that these two, and many others involved in the campaign, stand to individually gain massive sums of money from Brexit (not to mention that Johnson got the premiership from it).
As you say, people were duped, and that actually makes it pretty hard from a democratic point of view to argue that the result from 2016 should stand without a followup. Democracy is all about the people making choices from information they have.
This was always the case. A super rich elite pulling the strings in the background planning for a bonanza by stripping the UK of any protective regulation. The tragedy is that so many of the hapless hordes who voted to Leave did not understand they would suffer badly in the event and were manipulated by a class of immoral speculators.
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Re: Operation Yellowhammer
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Originally Posted by
Dorcus
This was always the case. A super rich elite pulling the strings in the background planning for a bonanza by stripping the UK of any protective regulation. The tragedy is that so many of the hapless hordes who voted to Leave did not understand they would suffer badly in the event and were manipulated by a class of immoral speculators.
You’re not endearing yourself to me, by using terms like “hapless hordes”.
Going by your logic, if the oh so clever remain voters, with their wonderful gift of hindsight, had got off their arses and voted, we wouldn’t be in this mess.
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Re: Operation Yellowhammer
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Originally Posted by
William Treseder
You’re not endearing yourself to me, by using terms like “hapless hordes”.
Going by your logic, if the oh so clever remain voters, with their wonderful gift of hindsight, had got off their arses and voted, we wouldn’t be in this mess.
A fair point you make there, many were too complacent, hopefully they won't be when the third referendum comes along. However, I'm sure you'll agree with me that it was a huge con not allowing the 16-17 year olds to vote when they are going to be most affected by the issue. Hopefully that will be rectified in time for the next poll.
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Re: Operation Yellowhammer
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Originally Posted by
lardy
People were duped into believing it would be easy.
Ho, ho, ho, it's always everybody else who gets duped and never you, Mr Trump Russia Collusion man :hehe:
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Re: Operation Yellowhammer
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Originally Posted by
Wales-Bales
Ho, ho, ho, it's always everybody else who gets duped and never you, Mr Trump Russia Collusion man :hehe:
I haven't really followed all the black ops and alt right propaganda on Mueller and Russia - certainly not made any claims on it - but is it your view (independently formed of course from the most reliable of objective sources) that Trump is innocent of not only collusion but also of obstruction of justice? I think I know the answer, but you know...... ho ho ho!