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Its a sad state of affairs, but the Labour party, at present, is like a ship foundering on the rocks, but the crew are not abandoning ship, they're jettisoning their principles. No matter what they say or do, some will still vote for them because they've "always been Labour".
And yet - Jeremy Corbyn turning out to be front runner. I dont think he will be jettisoning any princilples if he wins.Originally Posted by ZZ Jack wrote on Mon, 13 July 2015 23:13
Its a sad state of affairs, but the Labour party, at present, is like a ship foundering on the rocks, but the crew are not abandoning ship, they're jettisoning their principles. No matter what they say or do, some will still vote for them because they've "always been Labour".
If he wins I suspect a lot of Labour MP's will be jettisoned by the electorate next time around!!Its a sad state of affairs, but the Labour party, at present, is like a ship foundering on the rocks, but the crew are not abandoning ship, they're jettisoning their principles. No matter what they say or do, some will still vote for them because they've "always been Labour".
Good luck for the futureIts a sad state of affairs, but the Labour party, at present, is like a ship foundering on the rocks, but the crew are not abandoning ship, they're jettisoning their principles. No matter what they say or do, some will still vote for them because they've "always been Labour".
Personally I vote for the name on the ballot paper rather than the leader.Its a sad state of affairs, but the Labour party, at present, is like a ship foundering on the rocks, but the crew are not abandoning ship, they're jettisoning their principles. No matter what they say or do, some will still vote for them because they've "always been Labour".And yet - Jeremy Corbyn turning out to be front runner. I dont think he will be jettisoning any princilples if he wins.
Would you rather have an unelectable left wing party or an electable centre left party?Its a sad state of affairs, but the Labour party, at present, is like a ship foundering on the rocks, but the crew are not abandoning ship, they're jettisoning their principles. No matter what they say or do, some will still vote for them because they've "always been Labour".And yet - Jeremy Corbyn turning out to be front runner. I dont think he will be jettisoning any princilples if he wins.If he wins I suspect a lot of Labour MP's will be jettisoned by the electorate next time around!!
But to come back to your point I font think there us any point what so ever in the Labour party existing if it is just going to be Tory lite. So I say stick to the principles the party was founded on or shut up shop.Its a sad state of affairs, but the Labour party, at present, is like a ship foundering on the rocks, but the crew are not abandoning ship, they're jettisoning their principles. No matter what they say or do, some will still vote for them because they've "always been Labour".And yet - Jeremy Corbyn turning out to be front runner. I dont think he will be jettisoning any princilples if he wins.If he wins I suspect a lot of Labour MP's will be jettisoned by the electorate next time around!!Maybe. But at least they will be jettisoned because their leader is old skool Labour rather than cos their Leader is a wishy washy populist that has compromised their principles for the sake of power.
Archie
If you want to believe that the Scottish people voted for the SNP in the numbers they did because they were left wing and that they were anti austerity then you carry on believing that, it is not for me to tell you what to think. That doesn't make it so though.
I agree about the labour party sticking to its principles, however you must consider that the needs of the working man are very much different today than they were when Labour was set up all those years ago.
Being a 'working man' myself I can see that we need a left wing party to protect us from the Tories, just like we did 100 years ago.
You want a strong left wing party because you are hard left and not because a left wing party are best to serve the working man. Times have changed and hard left politics aren't popular any more. Syriza have shown us that when push comes to shove, people will follow what is economically sound rather than politically motivated.Archie
As for Greece . I am not really sure where you are coming from. The people voted overwhelmingly against austeriy and from what I can see this is far from a done deal with many Greeks pissed off with being sold out.ArchieIf you want to believe that the Scottish people voted for the SNP in the numbers they did because they were left wing and that they were anti austerity then you carry on believing that, it is not for me to tell you what to think. That doesn't make it so though.
The Greek people may 'want' an end to austerity, but that is only possible if the people of Europe wish to allow them to borrow ad infinitum. It is clear that the people of Europe no longer want to give the people of Greece an open cheque book - democracy in action. As the Greek government know this, they know they have the two choices outlined above. So rather than stick to their principles and see their own people become poor for at least a generation, they have discarded their beliefs when faces with the economic reality of the situation.Thank you for trying to explain to me why I hold the opinions I do. I think i am best placed to know why I hold those opinions though and have to advise you that you are wrong.
I hope Corbyn wins - seems a decent enough chap - and better than the other contenders, all of whom are pretty hopeless.
At least he is a man of principal - unfortunately for him though that wont make his sums add up - but at least it gives a clear argument both on political and economic terms.
Whoever wins though will be the sacrificial lamb before Chukka decides to stand.
Would be good to see a Corbyn and Watson double act
and Archovic vs Feederer is off again.
New balls please.
Hopefully Boris gets the job after fat dave, he will make a right hash of things, although will provide entertainment as a small plus.
Unless you have a crystal ball, you have no idea what so ever how Greece will fair if it opts to go it alone. As I have said previously, telling the banks to **** off has done Iceland the world of good. It won't be so easy for Greece, as they have a gang of thugs on their case determined to **** them over. This is not the beginning of the end, this is the end of the beginning. The days of the Eurozone are numbered, its credibility is shattered and it will all start to unravel now. It was supposed to be a supportive club of nations working together, not a gang of bullies ****ing each other over.everyone knows you are hard left, this isn't news. the reason you want a strongly supported hard left party is because you are hard left. it really is as simple as that.Everyone knows? Fair play, declaring that you and everyone else knows how my thought process work better than I do is a new level of arrogance, even for you
you mention democracy but fail to appreciate that the Germans, all 80m of them, are the ones financing the Greeks and as such their democratic mandate is austerity. yet you seem to think the will of 80m people is somehow less important than the will of 11m people.
Perhaps you can answer this. If the Greeks reject austerity and want to carry on spending as they have, who do you think should lend them the money as the Greeks themselves don't have it? Now once you have answered that, perhaps you can then answer whether those people who you want to lend the money should have a democratic say in whether the money is being lent or not? Because in this case democracy is on both sides of the equation
as for your claim the euro is numbered, the markets are up today, quite considerably so. I'd say that was testament to the strength of the euro and the fact it is seen as a safe haven currency once again.
The Eurozone was supposed to be some sort of capitalist utopia, a club of countries that mutually supported each other. It has grown out of the the ashes of the second world war where this sort of bollocks with one country dictating to another was supposed to be put to bed. That dream is very clearly dead this week.
of course, you are free to ignore this inconvenient truth, as you usually do.
She is an snp politician. Not everyone who votes snp believe what she has to say. I voted plaid because I wanted a strong welsh voice, I believe many scots voted the same way.
Fair play, you do seem keen on making incredible assumptions about the way huge numbers of other people think.
No different than you.She is an snp politician. Not everyone who votes snp believe what she has to say. I voted plaid because I wanted a strong welsh voice, I believe many scots voted the same way.
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