Reply With QuoteGlaring deficiencies in democracy - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2vqv0IRUzk8
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http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-37238641
In other news, bear shits in the woods.
Glaring deficiencies in democracy - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2vqv0IRUzk8
The older members on here will remember that we were all denied a vote on Europe back in 1975. Ted Heath fobbed the electorate off with the excuse that there was no need, as it was only going to be a trade agreement that Britain would have with the rest of the then considerably smaller Common Market.Originally Posted by Wales-Bales
We were stuffed, set on a course for political union which no one in the country had ever been consulted about, let alone allowed to vote on.
Brexit has rectified that wrong. 11+ million people voted a Tory government in last year, 17+ million voted for Britain to leave the European Union this year.
The message is loud and clear, we don't want political union, a one size fits all European army, or anymore sham marketing campaigns designed to strip away our culture and sovereignty in vain attempts to convince us that we are all one homogeneous European family.
Don't you mean world family? Cos the political union will not stop with Europe.
I agree with you Splott David, but I think you must have been on drugs in 1975 because that year we had a vote on staying in the EU. Most of the mugs voted yes. You are probably thinking of 1973 when we entered the EU.
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Re his beret
"Two pamphlets saying the deal was brilliant were sent to every household at the June 1975 referendum. They also protested that there would be no further sacrifices of sovereignty. Again, such promises were in direct contravention of the Treaty of Rome"
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/columnist...LIED-TO--.html
"Down with this sort of thing"
They also had a 'protest' in Cardiff.
About 50 people turned up and stood around in the rain for a bit.
You can't argue with that sort of political statement.
"Down with this sort of thing"
They also had a 'protest' in Cardiff.
About 50 people turned up and stood around in the rain for a bit.
You can't argue with that sort of political statement.
So, so true - pathetic on all sides.
Who's that patronising snob?
What bollox he speaks - the vote was 52 to 48, not 80 to 20. If it had been the latter, then all of those on the losing side would have to accept the cause was lost and get on with life, but you're talking about 15 million plus people (millions more than the number who voted for the present Government) here. It stands to reason that, while many of them (myself included) are prepared to accept the verdict and get on with post EU life, there are those who see the narrowness of the margin between the two sides as a reason to keep their campaign going.
Farage was on record before the vote as saying that he would be campaigning for another vote if his side lost by 52 to 48 or less and do you think that condescending git in the video would just be getting on with his life now if the remain side had won with a margin of less than 5%?
Some people have spent the last 40 years banging on about wanting to leave what is now called the European Union, do you think those who feel just as passionately from the other side of the argument are just going to keep quiet and accept that the matter is now dead?
One cannot recognise the legitimacy of a result that has been widely seen as based on rubbish and/or untrue arguments made by both sides. It can be recognised as a legitimate political opinion and perhaps an opinion held by the majority, it's just the result didn't necessarily show that.
These are good suggestions that could reduce this feeling being replicated in the future....or we could just reduce the less biased voices being represented further by cutting short money again and charging £3,000 to get a chat with the PM.
How about local and general elections? Should they be rerun until one side gets more than 80%? How far do you want to go? And finally, do you really believe the EU is democratic?
Ignore all of the arguments on all sides for a minute. The fact remains is that people were misled about the Common Market membership being about trade and not about any form of political union, yet alone political diktats and regulations from un-elected unaccountable individuals whose names no one in Britain had a clue about.
Yanis was absolutely right.
He should know, he was there
Even more surprising, the Eurogroup doesn't officially exist, all EU decisions are taken informally.
Last edited by Wales-Bales; 04-09-16 at 20:26.
Maybe saying it less but I really hope I would still be saying it. I've seen Lib Dems question whether they should still be a party that talks about reforming how we do politics when it's so far down most people's priorities list however I hope the majority can still find time for it. Afterall, we live in a time where Corbyn says things like "we have a mandate to" or May (who apparently recently misrepresented immigration statistics) says "Brexit means Brexit" so these democratic decisions best bloody be made by informed public otherwise we risk shooting ourselves in the foot. It's scary to think we could easily have all the arguments in the media made by always the same voices and unscrutinised voices at that.
If this government has a legitimate desire to open up democracy they will do everything to allow for decisions to be as informed as possible, however it wouldn't surprise me to see them in high-vis jackets one moment looking interested in Joe Bloggs and providing misleading soundbites the next.
That reply reads as if you read the first sentence of what I posted and then didn't bother with the rest of it.
Would Farage, his party, and the one issue Tories who have spoke about little else for decades have just accepted a 52/48 remain vote and moved on without another mention about our EU membership? Of course they wouldn't and yet all of those on the losing side are expected to do just that because the vote went the other way - just as it was absurd to label all leave voters as racists, it is equally daft to think that a group of people four times the size of the population of Wales would all react to the outcome in the same way.
As I said, my attitude is we've had the vote and now lets live with it's outcome, but not all of those who voted remain will feel the same way and if some want to lobby for another vote on the subject for the rest of their lives then they're perfectly free to do so. After all, Farage likes telling us that he was a lone voice in the wilderness when he started pressing for a referendum, so there's a successful precedent out there to drive them on in their quest.
"A man was wrestled to the floor by police after snatching Mr Izzard's trademark pink beret when grappling with him in the street.
Mr Izzard pursued the man and retrieved his beret. A man was later arrested."
****'s sake
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