Canada EU trade agreement

[Bluebird since 1948]

Tommy thinks that each part of the UK's needs should be considered in the brexit negotiations. I have no faith whatsoever that they will be met by such an English/London-centric party leading the negotiations.

Out it this way, when have we ever been listened to? Continuously discarded as if we're worthless. I hope one day we stand up for ourselves, although I'm not too optimistic

Carwyn Jones and the other devolved leaders had a meeting with Mrs May this week, like I asked you earlier, what do you think they were talking about other than Brexit? It's hard to keep everyone happy, the electorate in Wales and the rest of England want something completely different to Scotland, NI and London. Oh and by the way, the Tories have 11 Westminster seats in Wales, the second most behind Labour.

What would you like to see happen Tommy? What should Carwyn be seeking for Wales in our Brexit negotiations?

[tommy31]

Carwyn Jones and the other devolved leaders had a meeting with Mrs May this week, like I asked you earlier, what do you think they were talking about other than Brexit? It's hard to keep everyone happy, the electorate in Wales and the rest of England want something completely different to Scotland, NI and London. Oh and by the way, the Tories have 11 Westminster seats in Wales, the second most behind Labour.

Labour have the most. Doesn't mean the party isn't England/London-centric.

What would you like to see happen Tommy? What should Carwyn be seeking for Wales in our Brexit negotiations?

I'd like to see him protect welsh trade. Wales runs a £1.5bn trade surplus with the EU, trading £5.1bn last year. Too important to lose. Have you thought of a reason Wales shouldn't get a say yet?

[Bluebird since 1948]

I'd like to see him protect welsh trade. Wales runs a £1.5bn trade surplus with the EU, trading £5.1bn last year. Too important to lose. Have you thought of a reason Wales shouldn't get a say yet?

LOL - Twpsyn Tommy at it again.

Where have I said Wales should be ignored? Please show me? Wales have had a massive say in the decision to leave the EU, we all had a vote and the will of the majority of the people is to leave. Wales needs a say as does every other area of the UK but fundamentally there are certain things that are going to piss people off in different areas. Just leaving the EU itself goes against what the people of Scotland, London and NI want.

Our FM met our PM this week, they discussed Brexit. I'm not sure what Carwyn wants out of Brexit but I am sure he will be seeking to keep our trade surplus. The problem he has is that the people he governs voted to leave the EU and it was made clear by the leave campaign that this would mean leaving the single market. Is demands for Wales must be realistic.

[tommy31]

What did Jones do for Welsh Trade when Port Talbot announced all those job losses - he did feck all and achieved feck all , as there was nothing he could do to be fair to him, about as useful as a chocolate fireguard when it comes to getting the EU to stop cheap chinese steel - and what made it worse for him - the new road between the Bay and the link road was using steel rods not from the steel plant 50 meters away but from Germany instead.

If that is Jones's idea of helping local Welsh industry - I'd hate to know what the opposite is.

I mean, I haven't said anything about Jones' calibre as a politician, just what I'd like him to do...

[tommy31]

LOL - Twpsyn Tommy at it again.

Where have I said Wales should be ignored? Please show me? Wales have had a massive say in the decision to leave the EU, we all had a vote and the will of the majority of the people is to leave. Wales needs a say as does every other area of the UK but fundamentally there are certain things that are going to piss people off in different areas. Just leaving the EU itself goes against what the people of Scotland, London and NI want.

Our FM met our PM this week, they discussed Brexit. I'm not sure what Carwyn wants out of Brexit but I am sure he will be seeking to keep our trade surplus. The problem he has is that the people he governs voted to leave the EU and it was made clear by the leave campaign that this would mean leaving the single market. Is demands for Wales must be realistic.

It's almost as if you only read what you want to read, isn't it.

I realise the problems carwyn faces. But saying his demands need to be 'realistic' shows a lack of ambition to me. Before you've even started negotiations, you've already gone down a notch from the ideal. That's not the way to do it.
You're right, some things that Wales wants will piss others off. But why should I care about that? I want what's best for Wales, not what's best for London or Belfast. When did anyone else decide to give in to what Wales wanted rather than what they wanted?

[Bluebird since 1948]

It's almost as if you only read what you want to read, isn't it.

I realise the problems carwyn faces. But saying his demands need to be 'realistic' shows a lack of ambition to me. Before you've even started negotiations, you've already gone down a notch from the ideal. That's not the way to do it.
You're right, some things that Wales wants will piss others off. But why should I care about that? I want what's best for Wales, not what's best for London or Belfast. When did anyone else decide to give in to what Wales wanted rather than what they wanted?

So no quotes from me about not wanting Wales to have a say in Brexit negotiations? Great. Also I notice you haven't listed Edinburgh among the places you don't care about? Any reason why? I care deeply about the people of London, Belfast and Edinburgh who are being dragged out of the EU against their will and would be raging if it was the other way round but that's democracy and they have to make best of it.

Carwyns got a very difficult position because he hates the fact that the good people of Wales voted to leave. You still haven't outlined what he's done wrong thus far or given examples as to how Wales have been ignored. When Wales voted to leave we were under no illusions that that meant leaving the single market, Carwyn needs to get his head around that one.

Let's talk ambition for a second though because I believe our leaders in Wales are missing a trick. Ambition for me would be to embrace Brexit. So we have a 1.5bn trade surplus with Europe at the moment? Let's double it. Brexit to me is a new chapter in Wales' story and every knew chapter represents a fantastic opportunity to reinvent ourselves and turn our fortunes around.

Stop talking Brexit down and make the most of it.

[tommy31]

So no quotes from me about not wanting Wales to have a say in Brexit negotiations? Great. Also I notice you haven't listed Edinburgh among the places you don't care about? Any reason why? I care deeply about the people of London, Belfast and Edinburgh who are being dragged out of the EU against their will and would be raging if it was the other way round but that's democracy and they have to make best of it.

There was no reason. Thought it best not to list every city in the UK. Also, me asking for a reason why Wales shouldn't get a say in brexit negs doesn't mean you've said it. Otherwise, why would I ask?

Carwyns got a very difficult position because he hates the fact that the good people of Wales voted to leave. You still haven't outlined what he's done wrong thus far or given examples as to how Wales have been ignored. When Wales voted to leave we were under no illusions that that meant leaving the single market, Carwyn needs to get his head around that one.

Examples of Wales being ignored? How long have you got? I can't remember a time where our needs were met. Eg every single devolution bill since 1999, the current Wales bill ignoring nearly everything the silk commission recommended, Wales getting 0% Barnett consequentials from HS2...... I could go on, but I feel you get the point.

Let's talk ambition for a second though because I believe our leaders in Wales are missing a trick. Ambition for me would be to embrace Brexit. So we have a 1.5bn trade surplus with Europe at the moment? Let's double it. Brexit to me is a new chapter in Wales' story and every knew chapter represents a fantastic opportunity to reinvent ourselves and turn our fortunes around.

Well yeah, that's obviously great to say. But what's the plan? Out of single market means we'll probably lose a high percentage of that due to loss of trade. It's all well and good saying let's double it, but in reality, you're going to lose a lot (at least in the short term) for little potential gain.

Stop talking Brexit down and make the most of it.

I'm looking forward to brexit, but I doubt it's for the same reasons as the majority on here.