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Thread: Only 23 years???

  1. #76

    Re: Only 23 years???

    Quote Originally Posted by chris View Post
    they are locked away for their own safety and protection, i do not believe they are mentally ill, they are just genuinely evil people. the general public want proper justice , locking them away in relative comfort for the rest of their lives, does not see the punishment fit the crime in many peoples eyes, .. lets put it this way if myra hindley had ever been let out onto the streets before she died she would not have lasted five minutes
    I agree with you. But do you really want to live in a society ruled by mob justice?

    It'd be like going back to the dark ages.

  2. #77

    Re: Only 23 years???

    Quote Originally Posted by chris View Post
    i think if you were to find that if these people were thrown out into the streets , the general public would give you your answer, especially the friends or families of the victims they mercilessly destroyed .
    Are you pushing for mob rule? Public stoning?

  3. #78

    Re: Only 23 years???

    Quote Originally Posted by lardy View Post
    Are you pushing for mob rule? Public stoning?
    its not mob rule: hehe: , what do you want to do?, lock somebody away after going on a kiillng spree and slap them on their hands and say dont be a naughty boy and dont do it again eh

  4. #79

    Re: Only 23 years???

    Quote Originally Posted by blue matt View Post
    as time goes by, the county leans more and more to the left
    No it isn't this county is leaning more and more right every year ffs.

    I agree with Chris that these people should never see the light of day again. But I disagree with the death penalty for a few reasons:

    1. Plenty of cases of miscarriage of justice have happened
    2. I wouldn't want or trust our government to have the power to murder citizens
    3. It's more expensive to kill someone than to keep them locked up their whole life
    4. Isn't being killed the easy way out? Rather that than be locked in a tiny cell for 70 years.

  5. #80

    Re: Only 23 years???

    ian brady as been wanting to die for years, he went on hunger strike and was force fed ffs..

    the prisons are full to bursting as it is now, the penal system is very much like the nhs is now, it is on its knees and needs totally reforming .

    the death penalty argument will rear its head once again no doubt , but i believe many people in this country would support it for certain crimes especially premeditated murder.

  6. #81

    Re: Only 23 years???

    Watch the film The Life of David Gail, it's a really good argument against miscarriages of justice relating to the death penalty.

    I'd rather premeditated murders carried on rotting in prison than execute 1 innocent person.

    The justice system isn't infallible, just look at the Ched Evans case.

  7. #82

    Re: Only 23 years???

    Quote Originally Posted by chris View Post
    ian brady as been wanting to die for years, he went on hunger strike and was force fed ffs..

    the prisons are full to bursting as it is now, the penal system is very much like the nhs is now, it is on its knees and needs totally reforming .

    the death penalty argument will rear its head once again no doubt , but i believe many people in this country would support it for certain crimes especially premeditated murder.
    I think you're right.

    Which is exactly why it shouldn't be put to a public vote.

    If you have the time or interest, do a search on Derek Bentley and come back and let me know if you're still in favour of the death penalty.

  8. #83

    Re: Only 23 years???

    Quote Originally Posted by Croesy Blue View Post
    Watch the film The Life of David Gail, it's a really good argument against miscarriages of justice relating to the death penalty.

    I'd rather premeditated murders carried on rotting in prison than execute 1 innocent person.

    The justice system isn't infallible, just look at the Ched Evans case.
    ian brady is not innocent or sutcliffe and many others that are locked away , we are talking about irrefutable doubt that they commited those crimes and were convicted for them, these are the ones we are talking about facing.the death penalty

    if they is reasonable doubt then fair enough

  9. #84

    Re: Only 23 years???

    Quote Originally Posted by chris View Post
    ian brady is not innocent or sutcliffe and many others that are locked away , we are talking about irrefutable doubt that they commited those crimes and were convicted for them, these are the ones we are talking about facing.the death penalty

    if they is reasonable doubt then fair enough
    You've raised another issue there though.

    Where do we draw the line?

    Mass Murder?
    Child Killers?
    Pre-meditated?
    Manslaughter?

    Who gets to decide? You? Theresa May? Judges?

  10. #85

    Re: Only 23 years???

    Quote Originally Posted by chris View Post
    ian brady as been wanting to die for years, he went on hunger strike and was force fed ffs..

    the prisons are full to bursting as it is now, the penal system is very much like the nhs is now, it is on its knees and needs totally reforming .

    the death penalty argument will rear its head once again no doubt , but i believe many people in this country would support it for certain crimes especially premeditated murder.
    A murderer who wants to die - why give him his wish?
    Full prisons - because we have so many murderers in there?

    These are both dreadful reasons for the death penalty.

    From your other post, if there's reasonable doubt then they wouldn't be convicted to begin with.

  11. #86

    Re: Only 23 years???

    Quote Originally Posted by chris View Post
    ian brady is not innocent or sutcliffe and many others that are locked away , we are talking about irrefutable doubt that they commited those crimes and were convicted for them, these are the ones we are talking about facing.the death penalty

    if they is reasonable doubt then fair enough
    But plenty of people have been locked away for years as it was thought to be beyond reasonable doubt and then released after wasting 10 years of their lives. How much worse would that be if they'd been killed?

    Is something only beyond reasonable doubt if someone pleads guilty?

  12. #87

    Re: Only 23 years???

    Quote Originally Posted by TH63 View Post
    You've raised another issue there though.

    Where do we draw the line?

    Mass Murder?
    Child Killers?
    Pre-meditated?
    Manslaughter?

    Who gets to decide? You? Theresa May? Judges?
    mass murder - sutcliffe,, child killers - brady , allitt , premeditated murder - countless locked away inside - death penalty without a doubt .

    manslaughter - mitigating circumstances would not be a capital offence and would not warrant the death penalty

  13. #88

    Re: Only 23 years???

    Quote Originally Posted by chris View Post
    mass murder - sutcliffe,, child killers - brady , allitt , premeditated murder - countless locked away inside - death penalty without a doubt .

    manslaughter - mitigating circumstances would not be a capital offence and would not warrant the death penalty
    You're missing my point. Who gets to play God here? Chris from Merthyr? Or some bloke who thinks you should have your head chopped off if he covets thy neighbours ox?

  14. #89

    Re: Only 23 years???

    I feel you're avoiding the important questions people are asking you Chris.

    What about The Birmingham 6 would you have put them to death?

  15. #90

    Re: Only 23 years???

    Quote Originally Posted by TH63 View Post
    You're missing my point. Who gets to play God here? Chris from Merthyr? Or some bloke who thinks you should have your head chopped off if he covets thy neighbours ox?
    i have obviously opened a can of worms up here and do not want to go on posting all day :

    i have basically explained that i would be in favour of the death penalty been reintroduced, for convicted and PROVEN killers that are currently residing in hm prisons across the country and i feel that many millions in this country feel exactly the same way
    Last edited by chris; 08-03-17 at 15:03.

  16. #91

    Re: Only 23 years???

    Quote Originally Posted by Croesy Blue View Post
    I feel you're avoiding the important questions people are asking you Chris.

    What about The Birmingham 6 would you have put them to death?
    Would have saved a fair bit on compo.

  17. #92

    Re: Only 23 years???

    The Birmingham 6 spent over 20 years in prison as convicted murderers, would you have executed them too?

  18. #93

    Re: Only 23 years???

    Quote Originally Posted by chris View Post
    i have obviously opened a can of worms up here and do not want to go on posting all day :

    i have basically explained that i would be in favour of the death penalty been reintroduced, for convicted and PROVEN killers that are currently residing in hm prisons across the country and i feel that many millions in this country feel exactly the same way
    Many millions in this country think we should kick out everyone who isn't white so I don't think that's a just reason for bringing something in.

  19. #94

    Re: Only 23 years???

    Quote Originally Posted by Jimmy the Jock View Post
    Would have saved a fair bit on compo.
    The cost of executing someone isn't that different to that compo

  20. #95

    Re: Only 23 years???

    Quote Originally Posted by Croesy Blue View Post
    The Birmingham 6 spent over 20 years in prison as convicted murderers, would you have executed them too?
    which do think is the bigger deterrent croesy ?

    capital punishment or life imprisonment at the taxpayers expense ?

  21. #96

    Re: Only 23 years???

    Quote Originally Posted by chris View Post
    which do think is the bigger deterrent croesy ?

    capital punishment or life imprisonment at the taxpayers expense ?
    I'm quite sure that the length of a sentence is quite low on the thoughts of someone considering committing murder.

  22. #97

    Re: Only 23 years???

    Quote Originally Posted by Croesy Blue View Post
    The cost of executing someone isn't that different to that compo
    would have saved a fair bit on board and lodge as well.

  23. #98

    Re: Only 23 years???

    Quote Originally Posted by chris View Post
    which do think is the bigger deterrent croesy ?

    capital punishment or life imprisonment at the taxpayers expense ?
    1. Someone who is intent on premeditated murder isn't put off by either, it's proven that the death penalty is no more of a deterrant than life in prison.
    2. Capital punishment costs the tax payers a lot more than life in prison
    3. The extra cost is ignoring all the extra appeals that happen during an execution and the fact no one will ever plead guilty again

    So there's those 2 reasons dealt with

    Secondly you're ignoring the fact that people have spent 10 or 20 years + in prison for murdering people only to be found not guilty, what's the time frame on executing these people?

    Are you happy to give the government and a jury of your peers the power to sentence you to death?

  24. #99

    Re: Only 23 years???

    Quote Originally Posted by itkman View Post
    I'm quite sure that the length of a sentence is quite low on the thoughts of someone considering committing murder.
    I agree, the reason we dont all go around killing each other is we think about the consequences , those that do kill, couldn't,generally, give a monkies about consequences.

  25. #100

    Re: Only 23 years???

    Quote Originally Posted by Croesy Blue View Post
    1. Someone who is intent on premeditated murder isn't put off by either, it's proven that the death penalty is no more of a deterrant than life in prison.
    2. Capital punishment costs the tax payers a lot more than life in prison
    3. The extra cost is ignoring all the extra appeals that happen during an execution and the fact no one will ever plead guilty again

    So there's those 2 reasons dealt with

    Secondly you're ignoring the fact that people have spent 10 or 20 years + in prison for murdering people only to be found not guilty, what's the time frame on executing these people?

    Are you happy to give the government and a jury of your peers the power to sentence you to death?
    so if capital punishment is no deterrent to convicted killers, then life imprisonment is basically a holiday camp and somewhere to go to live for the rest of their lives.

    you try telling that to the victims families and i think you would get a very different answer

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