More players will choose Wales now as little England are a crock of shite
| + Visit Cardiff FC for Latest News, Transfer Gossip, Fixtures and Match Results |
More players will choose Wales now as little England are a crock of shite
And in 20 years time people will be saying "Oh [Insert name here] is a good player, but he's no Gareth Bale"Originally Posted by chris
in the era we play in now , bale is up there with the best in the world
if we are talking about all time greats from previous decades , he is a long way down the list.
That's how the "all time greats" discussions work, the modern greats are dismissed until around 20 years after they've retired
bale is no maradona , cruyff, charles, di stefano, puskas, beckanbauer , etc great players are great players no matter what era you played in, as explained bale is up there with the best in the world in this era , but lets be honest, their is not a lot of competition about . in my opinion messi is the only player people will be talking about twenty years from now as a true great.from this era.
How do you know? Were you around to see him play?if we are talking about just welsh players that have played abroad and of world class ability in their era or time , then fair enough , but there as not been that many as there , other than john charles , ian rush , mark hughes , and gareth bale and thats about it.
charles for me would easily top that list.
ask around pal, he was on another level to the other three that have been mentioned , the fact he went to juventus thirty years before any of the others followed him abroad tells its own story, you had to be very special indeed if a club like juventus wanted you at that time.
Why do people always pick out the big names, as if they were the only ones who had successful careers abroad. !ask around pal, he was on another level to the other three that have been mentioned , the fact he went to juventus thirty years before any of the others followed him abroad tells its own story, you had to be very special indeed if a club like juventus wanted you at that time.
Here is one great player (even though he is Ingurlish
Cardiff City player as well,
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gerry_Hitchens
for once I find myself agreeing with Chris.
john Charles was probably the outstanding player of the proffessional era, and certainly head and shoulders (yes and in height) above his peers.
When a panel of then famous managers were asked to name their best 11 players for a world team, an Italian put John Charles in the same team twice, once at Centre forward and once at Centre Half. When he was told he couldn't do that he said words to the effect of "You asked me to pick the best player in each position, and Charles is the best in the world in both these positions."
No one could argue against that and his selection was allowed to stand.
I cannot recall that ever being said of any other player before or since. (and in case anyone asks - - Yes, I did see him play)
I never saw John Charles play. My father did and I respect his opinion immensely. he said the same. Pick him c/f to go 1-0 up, then move him to c/h to secure the win. Bobby Robson wrote the foreword in Charles autobiography and it is a glowing recommendation. He must have been one hell of a player. By many accounts Wales might have won the 58 tournament is teams hadnt kicked the smoke out of him
I can't see me saying this very often, but I agree with Chris regarding John Charles.
My Dad plays against him when he was at Cardiff and he said he was in a different class to anyone else he played against, including John Toshack just before he moved to Liverpool.
For people such as Bobby Robson and Jimmy Greaves to rate John Charles as the best player they have ever seen, including Pele, that says everything.
I can't comment because I never had the chance to see john Charles play. I'm not saying Bale is better, but I just wonder how some people are so sure. I never knew jimmy greaves and bobby Robson said those things so that's interesting to know.
Pele was undoubtedly the best ever. Longevity, world cups won, career goals/games ratio who else comes close?
Charles, Best, Messi all greats but their records at international level were average.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/foo...overhyped.html
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/foo...overhyped.html
Interesting article. Having watched every world cup since 1966 my own view is that I have still not seen anyone to rival Pele as an individual player or the 1970 Brazil team. Defensively they were average but nothing matches their attack.
Each decade produces a truly great player but no one else has appeared in 4 world cups and won 3. Maradona, Messi and Cruyff do not come close.
Garrincha was supremely talented but like Best lacked discipline and wasted his great talent.
Best attacking team ever
1970 Brazill TEAM was, indeed, the best ever.
But Id put Cruyff above Pele any day as an individual player.
Great thread this. Part of the problem I have with what Chris says is that he is comparing Charles with Bale when the latter is only just halfway through his career. Bale will become our all time leading scorer. He was pivotal in the greatest tournament in our history. He has already been part of two Champions League triumphs. He may well go on to become a Madrid great.
It is a good thread, and I have some sympathy with the view that Charles is, and will be, the best player ever for Wales in the context of his ability vs the players of his age. I can remember seeing him introduced at the Millenium Stadium during the Germany friendly match in 2002 and told my then 9 year old son that he had just seen one of the greatest players of all time.
I think Bale is already a Wales great, but he will have to go some to beat the reputation from his contempories that Charles acquired over his career - and that I think is the only way to compare them.
Thankyou
All opinions I know. However Cruyff did not have Pele's longevity nor anything near his scoring record never mind 3 world cup wins spanning 12 years. One of the best European players undoubtedly.
You really can't compare Pele's scoring record to anyone else's, 500 of the 1,000+ goals came in friendlies and he was playing in the Brazilian state championships where he was essentially playing against farmers
Nowt wrong with playing against farmers.
We get 6 guaranteed points a season playing against them.
Agreed, Bale has already achieved more playing in better teams. Had Charles played for Real Madrid and the mighty Bluebirds whilst at his peak Chris's argument might have been valid.
Look at his international scoring record, were they all tractor boys as well? He was the jewel in the crown of the greatest team ever to play football.
Posting Permissions
Reply With Quote