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Thread: Arm our officers

  1. #76

    Re: Arm our officers

    Quote Originally Posted by Tandy View Post
    You should have said you don't trust 50% of the ones you encountered. You came across as some sort of paranoid tart.
    That is what I said. I suppose I just didn't account for people with such poor reading comprehension to be lurking around.

    And at least have the originality to come up with a different insult than the one I used for you.

  2. #77

    Re: Arm our officers

    Quote Originally Posted by SOXY BOY View Post
    I think the Police officer who was killed was actually armed.
    Quote Originally Posted by Packerman View Post
    i was thinking the same, if he was inside the parliamentary secure area then surely he was armed??
    Errr...
    No, he wasn't.
    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-39359158

  3. #78
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    Re: Arm our officers

    Quote Originally Posted by Colonel Cærdiffi View Post
    That is what I said. I suppose I just didn't account for people with such poor reading comprehension to be lurking around.

    And at least have the originality to come up with a different insult than the one I used for you.
    So let's get this right how many of the 125000 police officers don't you trust?

  4. #79

    Re: Arm our officers

    Quote Originally Posted by Tandy View Post
    So let's get this right how many of the 125000 police officers don't you trust?
    I'll let you know once I've encountered them all.

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    Re: Arm our officers

    It might have been useful to question this (supposed lone-wolf) apparent 'terrorist'. It might not have been that useful. Or it might just have been possible to glean something that saves other lives in other potential incidents further down the line.
    TBH, I'm not convinced on this occasion - but we will never know now.

    Some Police need to be armed, in some locations / situations.

    More generally, perhaps some investment / research / training in way more efficient instant stun weapons might be better than creating a mini USA (no thanks).

  6. #81
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    Re: Arm our officers

    Quote Originally Posted by Colonel Cærdiffi View Post
    I'll let you know once I've encountered them all.
    How many have you encoutered?

  7. #82

    Re: Arm our officers

    Quote Originally Posted by Tandy View Post
    How many have you encoutered?
    I don't have an exact figure for you Tandy, why don't you just save us some bother and tell us where you're going with this line of questioning, assuming there is a point to it.

  8. #83
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    Re: Arm our officers

    Quote Originally Posted by Colonel Cærdiffi View Post
    I don't have an exact figure for you Tandy, why don't you just save us some bother and tell us where you're going with this line of questioning, assuming there is a point to it.
    Well I'm sure we would all like to know why you wouldn't trust our police officers to have "spud guns" based on your experience.

  9. #84

    Re: Arm our officers

    Quote Originally Posted by lardy View Post
    Jean de Menzies has been forgotten already then.
    was he shot by " BAD Lowly paid civil servant meathead bobby's with superiority-complex who chose a career in policing in order to assert their authority over others " ( in C.C words )

    or

    shot by Officers who made mistakes at a time of heightened security worries after the July London bombings and being mistaken for one of the Failed bombers from the day before


    I am of the belief it was the 2nd statement

  10. #85

    Re: Arm our officers

    Quote Originally Posted by blue matt View Post
    was he shot by " BAD Lowly paid civil servant meathead bobby's with superiority-complex who chose a career in policing in order to assert their authority over others " ( in C.C words )

    or

    shot by Officers who made mistakes at a time of heightened security worries after the July London bombings and being mistaken for one of the Failed bombers from the day before


    I am of the belief it was the 2nd statement
    Which of those two scenarios do you think is better?

  11. #86

    Re: Arm our officers

    Quote Originally Posted by blue matt View Post
    was he shot by " BAD Lowly paid civil servant meathead bobby's with superiority-complex who chose a career in policing in order to assert their authority over others " ( in C.C words )

    or

    shot by Officers who made mistakes at a time of heightened security worries after the July London bombings and being mistaken for one of the Failed bombers from the day before


    I am of the belief it was the 2nd statement
    I think the point is Matt, that had they mistakenly whacked him over the head with a truncheon, he'd have woken up with a headache.

    In his case though, it wasnt a mistake that could be rectified by an apology and a couple of aspirin,

  12. #87

    Re: Arm our officers

    Quote Originally Posted by Tandy View Post
    Well I'm sure we would all like to know why you wouldn't trust our police officers to have "spud guns" based on your experience.
    I can't be arsed to be honest. Let's just say whatever point you were trying to make is totally right and leave it there.

  13. #88

    Re: Arm our officers

    Quote Originally Posted by blue matt View Post
    was he shot by " BAD Lowly paid civil servant meathead bobby's with superiority-complex who chose a career in policing in order to assert their authority over others " ( in C.C words )

    or

    shot by Officers who made mistakes at a time of heightened security worries after the July London bombings and being mistaken for one of the Failed bombers from the day before


    I am of the belief it was the 2nd statement
    The second, but I'm not sure how it helps your argument. If officers who were, presumably, selected to be armed because of their strong abilities can make fatal errors in stressful and difficult situations - doesn't it seem logical that weaker officers would make similar mistakes more often?

  14. #89

    Re: Arm our officers

    Quote Originally Posted by lardy View Post
    The second, but I'm not sure how it helps your argument. If officers who were, presumably, selected to be armed because of their strong abilities can make fatal errors in stressful and difficult situations - doesn't it seem logical that weaker officers would make similar mistakes more often?
    He's basically arguing against himself at this point.

    He's advocating the training of police officers in the use of firearms by using an example of a time when officers trained in the use of firearms shot an innocent man.

  15. #90
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    Re: Arm our officers

    Quote Originally Posted by Colonel Cærdiffi View Post
    I can't be arsed to be honest. Let's just say whatever point you were trying to make is totally right and leave it there.
    So you haven't got the exact figure of officers who you have encountered and you can't tell us any experience of encountering any.
    You need to get out more you paranoiac tart.

  16. #91

    Re: Arm our officers

    Quote Originally Posted by Tandy View Post
    So you haven't got the exact figure of officers who you have encountered and you can't tell us any experience of encountering any.
    You need to get out more you paranoiac tart.
    I can't tell you the exact figure because I haven't been counting and I can't be arsed explaining the bad encounters to some boob on the internet who has trouble reading complete sentences and gets the hump when you point out how he's an idiot.

    So you're welcome to carry on believing that everybody trusts the police 100%, there are no bad apples in the force and nobody has ever had a bad experience with them, including me.

  17. #92
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    Re: Arm our officers

    Quote Originally Posted by Colonel Cærdiffi View Post
    I can't tell you the exact figure because I haven't been counting and I can't be arsed explaining the bad encounters to some boob on the internet who has trouble reading complete sentences and gets the hump when you point out how he's an idiot.

    So you're welcome to carry on believing that everybody trusts the police 100%, there are no bad apples in the force and nobody has ever had a bad experience with them, including me.
    You have slagged the police off in this thread and when asked for your reasons for slagging them off you become abusive. If you were mistreated by the police it may have something to do with you abusing them.

  18. #93

    Re: Arm our officers

    Quote Originally Posted by Tandy View Post
    You have slagged the police off in this thread and when asked for your reasons for slagging them off you become abusive. If you were mistreated by the police it may have something to do with you abusing them.
    OK.

  19. #94

    Re: Arm our officers

    This may not be the thread for humour, but there is no way this cop doesnt shoot himself in the foot at least twice a day if he was armed..
    Hot Fuzz 2.


  20. #95

    Re: Arm our officers

    Quote Originally Posted by lardy View Post
    The second, but I'm not sure how it helps your argument. If officers who were, presumably, selected to be armed because of their strong abilities can make fatal errors in stressful and difficult situations - doesn't it seem logical that weaker officers would make similar mistakes more often?
    the mistakes were made from the top down, not just the guys who took the shots, i am sure you must have read the report

    since that fatal day the procedure's for taking the shot have changed ( surprised you have read about it )

    you mention weaker officers, the rules of combat could be set fairly easy, a guy is coming towards you with a knife, take the shot, a guy with a knife is stabbing someone, give the warning and then if they do not stop, take the shot

    the more technical stuff, as in the case of Jean de Menzies would still be carried out by specialist teams, you appear ( i guess on purpose ) be confusing the two, a specialist FA officers and a armed Police Officer just using his gun for protection and to stop terrorist activities, once again, body cams will tell us the story and the police will learn from that

  21. #96

    Re: Arm our officers

    Quote Originally Posted by Colonel Cærdiffi View Post
    I don't know what the solution to an arsehole with a knife is, but I know giving every superiority-complex meathead bobby a hand-cannon is going to cause more problems than it solves.
    I am in agreement with you as in I wouldn't want all our police to be armed, but your barbed comments toward them seem to be a bit ott. You've obviously had a bad/some bad experiences with plod, which is your business, but they do a thankless job.
    Can you imagine what it's like to be a copper involved in social riots, or having to control hundreds of Neanderthals at football grounds up and down the country, or finding dead bodies, dead babies, smashed up teenagers in RTA's, etc.?
    We all know that corruption and bullying takes place in all walks of life, but no amount of cash would persuade me to join the fuzz in this day and age. Just be thankful that there are youngsters out there who still want to join.

  22. #97

    Re: Arm our officers

    Quote Originally Posted by Colonel Cærdiffi View Post
    He's basically arguing against himself at this point.

    He's advocating the training of police officers in the use of firearms by using an example of a time when officers trained in the use of firearms shot an innocent man.
    I guess when you make a mistake, you post a picture of a lorry getting stuck under a bridge on a haulage companies FB page, yet these Police officers in the case of Jean de Menzies made a mistake the day after a failed bombing attempt and shot the wrong guy, mistakes were made, the whole procedure has been tightened up, yet we know they will make a mistake again, people do

    so thats another bad mark against the " BAD Lowly paid civil servant meathead bobby's with superiority-complex who chose a career in policing in order to assert their authority over others " Eh

  23. #98

    Re: Arm our officers

    Quote Originally Posted by William Treseder View Post
    I am in agreement with you as in I wouldn't want all our police to be armed, but your barbed comments toward them seem to be a bit ott. You've obviously had a bad/some bad experiences with plod, which is your business, but they do a thankless job.
    Can you imagine what it's like to be a copper involved in social riots, or having to control hundreds of Neanderthals at football grounds up and down the country, or finding dead bodies, dead babies, smashed up teenagers in RTA's, etc.?
    We all know that corruption and bullying takes place in all walks of life, but no amount of cash would persuade me to join the fuzz in this day and age. Just be thankful that there are youngsters out there who still want to join.
    what state would we be in if people did not step up and do the job ? ? ??

  24. #99

    Re: Arm our officers

    Quote Originally Posted by blue matt View Post
    the mistakes were made from the top down, not just the guys who took the shots, i am sure you must have read the report

    since that fatal day the procedure's for taking the shot have changed ( surprised you have read about it )

    you mention weaker officers, the rules of combat could be set fairly easy, a guy is coming towards you with a knife, take the shot, a guy with a knife is stabbing someone, give the warning and then if they do not stop, take the shot

    the more technical stuff, as in the case of Jean de Menzies would still be carried out by specialist teams, you appear ( i guess on purpose ) be confusing the two, a specialist FA officers and a armed Police Officer just using his gun for protection and to stop terrorist activities, once again, body cams will tell us the story and the police will learn from that
    I think you're missing the point (perhaps on purpose) that arming all police officers is a turning point, there's no going back once it's done. So the gun is just there for protection and to stop terrorists - how many times will an average officer come across a terrorist? None of the police officers I know have ever been in a situation where they have needed a gun for protection.

    You talk about someone being stabbed with a knife - I'm sure you remember (perhaps you forgot on purpose) the 'you ain't no muslim bruv' incident. The police successfully tasered him. Didn't need a gun. Otherwise, yesterday's terrorist attacked with a car. Arming officers isn't going to stop that exceedingly rare occurence.

    If anything, the fact that the guy resorted to using a car and a knife rather than a bomb and an automatic is a testament to the good work done by our intelligence services. That's our best weapon, prevention, not chasing after them with a gun after the event.

  25. #100

    Re: Arm our officers

    Quote Originally Posted by blue matt View Post
    I guess when you make a mistake, you post a picture of a lorry getting stuck under a bridge on a haulage companies FB page, yet these Police officers in the case of Jean de Menzies made a mistake the day after a failed bombing attempt and shot the wrong guy, mistakes were made, the whole procedure has been tightened up, yet we know they will make a mistake again, people do

    so thats another bad mark against the " BAD Lowly paid civil servant meathead bobby's with superiority-complex who chose a career in policing in order to assert their authority over others " Eh
    The whole Menezes incident was a tragic **** up, the amazing thing is the woman in charge is about to be the commissioner !!

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