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Thread: "we could still singe the King of Spain’s beard”.

  1. #1

  2. #2
    International Vimana.'s Avatar
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    Re: "we could still singe the King of Spain’s beard”.

    I bet opinions are divided over this vintage style sabre rattling.
    Probably around 52% to 48% .

  3. #3

    Re: "we could still singe the King of Spain’s beard”.

    I just watched the Evening Standard video link. The headline said "Former Tory leader Michael Howard suggests Theresa May 'would go to war' to defend Gilbraltar"

    In the video the words or phrase 'go to war' was never mentioned by him. He may have said it somewhere else in the video but that wasnt in the clip they are showing.

    I get the idea this sort of stuff will continue for the next couple of years. Politician says something, it gets misquoted, then some other politician comments on it and the newspaper prints the response.
    Last edited by ninianclark; 03-04-17 at 08:05.

  4. #4

    Re: "we could still singe the King of Spain’s beard”.

    Quote Originally Posted by ninianclark View Post
    I just watched the Evening Standard video link. The headline said "Former Tory leader Michael Howard suggests Theresa May 'would go to war' to defend Gilbraltar"

    In the video the words or phrase 'go to war' was never mentioned by him. He may have said it somewhere else in the video but that wasnt in the clip they are showing.

    I get the idea this sort of stuff will continue for the next couple of years. Politician says something, it gets misquoted, then some other politician comments on it and the newspaper prints the response.
    The video doesn't work on that page for me, but I assume it's the Channel 4 here (https://twitter.com/sunapology/statu...427683184641):


    Q - The logical end of what you're saying is "We should go to war with Spain if necessary"

    A - No, what I'm saying is the current PM should, and I'm sure will, show the same resolve in looking after the interests of Gibraltar as Margaret Thatcher did looking after the interests of the Falkland Islands.



    It's very clear what he means in that interview. If he didn't say those precise words then they shouldn't be in quotations in the headline - that's true (though they also spell Gibraltar wrongly) - but that's not the issue here.

  5. #5

    Re: "we could still singe the King of Spain’s beard”.

    Quote Originally Posted by lardy View Post
    The video doesn't work on that page for me, but I assume it's the Channel 4 here (https://twitter.com/sunapology/statu...427683184641):


    Q - The logical end of what you're saying is "We should go to war with Spain if necessary"

    A - No, what I'm saying is the current PM should, and I'm sure will, show the same resolve in looking after the interests of Gibraltar as Margaret Thatcher did looking after the interests of the Falkland Islands.



    It's very clear what he means in that interview. If he didn't say those precise words then they shouldn't be in quotations in the headline - that's true (though they also spell Gibraltar wrongly) - but that's not the issue here.

    The link you gave https://twitter.com/sunapology/statu...427683184641):
    no longer exists.

    To me - either he says "we would go to war" or he doesn't say it - he cant say both. What he does say is he thinks the current would PM would show the same 'great resolve' as the former PM. Define 'great resolve'.

    I hate to be a pedant - and I know it's wishful thinking - but if they could put in the headline exactly what he said - then it might help a little. As per every politician who wants to get 5 mins of TV time is now giving their interpretation of his words in order to suit their politics.

    For the record I think the 'Gibraltarians' have been there over 300 years, longer than 'Americans' have been in Native America. It's all a load of bollocks anyway unless Spain should give Ceuta back to Morocco. Ceuta was taken over by Franco I think so guessing around the 1930's.

    I also think Sully Island should be returned to the Sullivans who were the original inhabitants back in the 1800's

  6. #6

    Re: "we could still singe the King of Spain’s beard”.

    Quote Originally Posted by ninianclark View Post
    The link you gave https://twitter.com/sunapology/statu...427683184641):
    no longer exists.

    To me - either he says "we would go to war" or he doesn't say it - he cant say both. What he does say is he thinks the current would PM would show the same 'great resolve' as the former PM. Define 'great resolve'.

    I hate to be a pedant - and I know it's wishful thinking - but if they could put in the headline exactly what he said - then it might help a little. As per every politician who wants to get 5 mins of TV time is now giving their interpretation of his words in order to suit their politics.

    For the record I think the 'Gibraltarians' have been there over 300 years, longer than 'Americans' have been in Native America. It's all a load of bollocks anyway unless Spain should give Ceuta back to Morocco. Ceuta was taken over by Franco I think so guessing around the 1930's.

    I also think Sully Island should be returned to the Sullivans who were the original inhabitants back in the 1800's
    It's still there, just the close bracket attached to it:

    https://twitter.com/sunapology/statu...40427683184641

    He says 'same resolve', and as he specifically refers to the Falklands conflict he can only mean war. Skirt around it if you wish, but this is clearly what he's talking about.

  7. #7

    Re: "we could still singe the King of Spain’s beard”.

    With the way Cameron and his pals have cocked up funding and procurement for the armed forces plus personnel
    cuts we couldn't singe the eyebrows of the Queen of Spain. Unless May went nuclear of course.

  8. #8

    Re: "we could still singe the King of Spain’s beard”.

    Quote Originally Posted by lardy View Post
    It's still there, just the close bracket attached to it:

    https://twitter.com/sunapology/statu...40427683184641

    He says 'same resolve', and as he specifically refers to the Falklands conflict he can only mean war. Skirt around it if you wish, but this is clearly what he's talking about.
    Interviewer "Are you suggesting we should go to war with Spain"
    Answer "No of course not"

    That then gets turned into "Former Tory leader Michael Howard suggests Theresa May 'would go to war' to defend Gilbraltar"

    Never once did he say "go to war", I'd love to see you defend that in a court of law, rather than a court of opinions

    Im merely suggesting people are taking the quote and making the reverse headline up to suit themselves - I guess nothing new there then....

    You then get the Sun countering the counter claim with this rhetorical rubbish "Britain could ‘cripple’ Spain if war broke out over Gibraltar and is ‘three times as powerful’ claims ex-Royal Navy commander"

  9. #9

    Re: "we could still singe the King of Spain’s beard”.

    Let's take your inference as fact then - If Spain 'invades' Gibraltar how would the UK react ? - probably the same way as the Falklands - eventually (like any country would) . If Spain vetoes a Brexit deal on the basis of Gibraltar - then that is a political matter. There is a big difference. No panic though - Spain wont be invading Gibraltar so we can all sleep safe, keep calm and carry on.

  10. #10

    Re: "we could still singe the King of Spain’s beard”.

    He says 'no' and then says it could be like that time when we went to war and that he wants to remind the EU 'what sort of people we are'. It's clear what he is insinuating, the British are the sort of people who will use military might to hold on to their territory.

  11. #11
    International TH63's Avatar
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    Re: "we could still singe the King of Spain’s beard”.

    And see Gareth Bale locked up as a POW?????

  12. #12

    Re: "we could still singe the King of Spain’s beard”.

    Sarah Palin (remember her) was quoted that she could see Russia from her house in Alaska (more of that in a minute), lets presume Russia invaded Alsaka, as they wanted their old territory that they sold to the USA way back about 150 years or so ago etc.

    If Russia had invaded Alaska - what do you the USA would do ?

    Here is Howard being interviwed Andrew Neil on bbc daily politics (he still never says the word 'war' as you quoted, or even 'go to war')

    Starts at 5mins 50 seconds

    Last edited by ninianclark; 03-04-17 at 11:49.

  13. #13

    Re: "we could still singe the King of Spain’s beard”.

    Quote Originally Posted by ninianclark View Post
    Sarah Palin (remember her) was quoted that she could see Russia from her house in Alaska (more of that in a minute), lets presume Russia invaded Alsaka, as they wanted their old territory that they sold to the USA way back about 150 years or so ago etc.

    If there Russia had invaded Alaska - what do you the USA would do ?

    Here is Howard being interviwed Andrew Neil on bbc daily politics (he still never says the word 'war' as you quoted, or even 'go to war')
    I haven't quoted him as saying the word 'war' (I was paraphrasing because he was referring very directly to a war) and I don't think Spain are going to invade Gibraltar so no point addressing this.

    What do you think he meant by banging on about the Falklands repeatedly, if not war? I'm interested to how you've interpreted his words. Or maybe he wasn't talking about the Falklands because he didn't directly say the name....

  14. #14

    Re: "we could still singe the King of Spain’s beard”.

    Quote Originally Posted by lardy View Post
    I haven't quoted him as saying the word 'war' (I was paraphrasing because he was referring very directly to a war) and I don't think Spain are going to invade Gibraltar so no point addressing this.

    What do you think he meant by banging on about the Falklands repeatedly, if not war? I'm interested to how you've interpreted his words. Or maybe he wasn't talking about the Falklands because he didn't directly say the name....
    "He says 'no' and then says it could be like that time when we went to war and that he wants to remind the EU 'what sort of people we are'. It's clear what he is insinuating, the British are the sort of people who will use military might to hold on to their territory."

    He never talked about war or going to war - as you said he has many times.

    I dont care about the context, he was asked a question, he gave an answer and is now being quoted for something he didnt say.

    Thatcher had 'great resolve' in defending the Falkland Islanders freedom. Howard thinks may would also show 'great resolve' to defend the rights and freedoms of the Gibraltarians. Never once did he say the PM would do that using military aggression, war etc - as you have eluded to.

    ps - the reason I used Sarah Palin as an example - was because she was "quoted" by many as saying she could see Russia from her house, when she never said anything of the sort. It was said by an actress doing a comedy sketch - and people took that quote instead of what she really said.

  15. #15

    Re: "we could still singe the King of Spain’s beard”.

    Of course he didn't say it directly, he's a politician. He reminds me of that other guy who argued with Paxman, the "did you threaten to overrule" argument, his identity escapes me for the moment.

    In this case, he was asked a question and our conversation is about what he actually said because we have seen the video. Nothing at all like the Sarah Palin thing. It's crystal clear what he was talking about.

  16. #16

    Re: "we could still singe the King of Spain’s beard”.

    Footage emerges of the Admiral who made the above comment"we could still singe the King of Spain’s beard”.
    http://youtu.be/_EfW9znJYjw

  17. #17

    Re: "we could still singe the King of Spain’s beard”.

    Quote Originally Posted by TH63 View Post
    And see Gareth Bale locked up as a POW?????
    Interned as an " enemy alien " would be more correct unless Bale joins the Army in the meantime.

    Just think of all the Costa Crooks who would end up behind the wire too.

  18. #18

    Re: "we could still singe the King of Spain’s beard”.

    Let's stop chattering on and do em

  19. #19

    Re: "we could still singe the King of Spain’s beard”.

    Let's drop a miniaturised nuke on Benidorm. Spain would immediately surrender with the added bonus of culling loads of British chavs.

  20. #20

    Re: "we could still singe the King of Spain’s beard”.

    Here is a very light hearted discussion about why Britain has never lost a war - for any left wing easily offended liberal types - Im sure someone apologises for any offence caused to you or your pet cat etc


  21. #21

    Re: "we could still singe the King of Spain’s beard”.

    Quote Originally Posted by Organ Morgan. View Post
    Let's drop a miniaturised nuke on Benidorm. Spain would immediately surrender with the added bonus of culling loads of British chavs.
    Would we notice the damage ?

    One positive outcome though, we wouldn't have to watch those dreadful teaser adverts ,advising us the latest series of Benidorm was due .

  22. #22

    Re: "we could still singe the King of Spain’s beard”.

    Quote Originally Posted by ninianclark View Post
    Here is a very light hearted discussion about why Britain has never lost a war - for any left wing easily offended liberal types - Im sure someone apologises for any offence caused to you or your pet cat etc

    Ah, I see. Michael Howard's moving into stand up comedy now is he? He's no Al Murray mind based on his offering on Sunday.

  23. #23

    Re: "we could still singe the King of Spain’s beard”.

    I took the week of work to watch the invasion of Spain live on CNN , bugger all has happened ,whats the latest , is it trouble manning the gunboats , I'm sure Dai Hunt would skipper the leading boat .

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