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Thread: Fighting terrorism not supporting it

  1. #26

    Re: Fighting terrorism not supporting it

    Quote Originally Posted by Organ Morgan. View Post
    Nick = Croesy.
    You learn something new every day

  2. #27
    Blue in the Face
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    Re: Fighting terrorism not supporting it

    mutha theresa is a fookin commie

  3. #28

    Re: Fighting terrorism not supporting it

    Quote Originally Posted by Alfonso Perez View Post
    Which terrorist groups are you on about & where have I even come close to suggesting that they 'want the terrorists to kill us all'?
    Well you haven't but I am just not sure what you are so afraid of. What are Corbyn, McDonnell and Abbott going to do (putting aside that she is already being sidelined) that will endanger us?

    You began the thread by saying that Corbyn 'doesn't have our best interests at heart', whose then??

    Politicians go on the news and say 'the terrorists hate our way of life', well guess what so do our allies. In Saudi Arabia you couldn't find a country whose beliefs and values are are more polar opposite to our own. Successive governments have clung to them no matter what they did to people yet you act like Corbyn talking to some people from Sinn Fein is the crime of the century.

    I think the world is probably a more complicated place than you are accepting it to be.

  4. #29

    Re: Fighting terrorism not supporting it

    Quote Originally Posted by Eric Cartman View Post
    Well you haven't but I am just not sure what you are so afraid of. What are Corbyn, McDonnell and Abbott going to do (putting aside that she is already being sidelined) that will endanger us?

    You began the thread by saying that Corbyn 'doesn't have our best interests at heart', whose then??

    Politicians go on the news and say 'the terrorists hate our way of life', well guess what so do our allies. In Saudi Arabia you couldn't find a country whose beliefs and values are are more polar opposite to our own. Successive governments have clung to them no matter what they did to people yet you act like Corbyn talking to some people from Sinn Fein is the crime of the century.

    I think the world is probably a more complicated place than you are accepting it to be.
    It would be less complicated if there wasn't so much propaganda about.

  5. #30

    Re: Fighting terrorism not supporting it

    Quote Originally Posted by Alfonso Perez View Post
    refuse to condemn the IRA despite being asked on numerous occasions
    Really? Last I heard Corbyn roundly condemned all terrorism.

  6. #31
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    Re: Fighting terrorism not supporting it

    Quote Originally Posted by Wales-Bales View Post
    You learn something new every day
    Shame you don't empty your inbox every day.

  7. #32

    Re: Fighting terrorism not supporting it

    Quote Originally Posted by Nick View Post
    You either support terrorism or you fight it. It's utterly clear.
    And in today's edition of policy by cliche.................

  8. #33

    Re: Fighting terrorism not supporting it

    Quote Originally Posted by Eric Cartman View Post
    Well you haven't but I am just not sure what you are so afraid of. What are Corbyn, McDonnell and Abbott going to do (putting aside that she is already being sidelined) that will endanger us?

    A primary role of any government is to keep it's citizens as safe as possible & Corbyn's track record of continually opposing terrorist legislation since 1983 (his words not mine) are a cause for concern. Also having credibility on the world stage is vital so his links to terrorist organisations do absolutely nothing to support this. In addition he has stated that the only spending cut he would not reverse relates to the armed forces so he immediately places himself on an dangerous collision course with NATO who are key allies of ours.

    Where has Corbyn said that Abbott will not be Home Secretary if he is elected as my understanding is that he has suggested that his top team will stay in place?

    You began the thread by saying that Corbyn 'doesn't have our best interests at heart', whose then??

    Corbyn's track record of continually voting against his own party suggests that all he cares about is what he believes in & sod the rest.


    Politicians go on the news and say 'the terrorists hate our way of life', well guess what so do our allies. In Saudi Arabia you couldn't find a country whose beliefs and values are are more polar opposite to our own. Successive governments have clung to them no matter what they did to people yet you act like Corbyn talking to some people from Sinn Fein is the crime of the century.


    I don't know what the relevance of this is as we are talking about direct actions & quotes from Jeremy Corbyn, John McDonnell & Diane Abbott highlighting their support for terrorist organisations. If anyone said 20/30 years ago that people harbouring such views could be running our country one day, they would have been the subject of ridicule.

    Corbyn was talking to the IRA so why try to dress it up any differently? Inviting them into parliament 5 days after the Brighton bombing sums up his beliefs & lack of judgement very succinctly.


    I think the world is probably a more complicated place than you are accepting it to be.

    That comes across as more than a little patronising although in fairness you do seem to be describing yourself there. Your inability to consider this logically & objectively is blindingly obvious to me.

    A few basic questions:

    Do you think that it is acceptable for a potential UK PM to describe terrorist organisations as his friends?

    Do you think that it is acceptable for a potential UK PM to observe a minutes silence for dead IRA terrorists?

    Do you think that it is acceptable that a potential Chancellor wants to honour dead IRA terrorists?

    Do you think that it is acceptable for a potential Home Secretary to want to see the British State defeated in any conflict?

  9. #34

    Re: Fighting terrorism not supporting it

    Quote Originally Posted by Wales-Bales View Post
    It would be less complicated if there wasn't so much propaganda about.

    Please feel free to highlight anything I have said which isn't factual?

  10. #35

    Re: Fighting terrorism not supporting it

    Quote Originally Posted by Eric the Half a Bee View Post
    Really? Last I heard Corbyn roundly condemned all terrorism.

    If Corbyn was asked about all terrorist organisations then I can understand that answer. However, he has been asked repeatedly if he specifically condemns the IRA & he continually refuses to provide a direct answer. Why is it so difficult for him to answer such a simple question?

  11. #36

    Re: Fighting terrorism not supporting it

    "In addition he has stated that the only spending cut he would not reverse relates to the armed forces so he immediately places himself on an dangerous collision course with NATO who are key allies of ours."

    Wouldn't that mean that the party and PM who introduced those cuts is also on a dangerous collision course with NATO?

  12. #37

    Re: Fighting terrorism not supporting it

    Quote Originally Posted by lardy View Post
    "In addition he has stated that the only spending cut he would not reverse relates to the armed forces so he immediately places himself on an dangerous collision course with NATO who are key allies of ours."

    Wouldn't that mean that the party and PM who introduced those cuts is also on a dangerous collision course with NATO?

    In 2016 we spent 2.21% of GDP on defence which is above the 2% NATO target so we are far from being on a collision course. Only last month the NATO Secretary General was incredibly complimentary about our contribution to the organisation from many perspectives. I do wonder if such a positive endorsement will continue if Jeremy Corbyn gets the opportunity to carry out his wish to cut armed forces spending?

  13. #38

    Re: Fighting terrorism not supporting it

    Quote Originally Posted by Alfonso Perez View Post
    In 2016 we spent 2.21% of GDP on defence which is above the 2% NATO target so we are far from being on a collision course. Only last month the NATO Secretary General was incredibly complimentary about our contribution to the organisation from many perspectives. I do wonder if such a positive endorsement will continue if Jeremy Corbyn gets the opportunity to carry out his wish to cut armed forces spending?
    You said 'reverse' cuts? Doesn't that mean the cuts are already being made?

  14. #39

    Re: Fighting terrorism not supporting it

    Quote Originally Posted by lardy View Post
    You said 'reverse' cuts? Doesn't that mean the cuts are already being made?
    Like most government departments cuts have been made although as I have pointed out we are more than meeting our commitments to NATO. That said the cuts are clearly not deep enough for Jeremy Corbyn who said: 'Fight all the cuts. Except those in the Armed Forces. Where we want to see a few more cuts taking place.'

  15. #40

    Re: Fighting terrorism not supporting it

    Quote Originally Posted by Alfonso Perez View Post
    Like most government departments cuts have been made although as I have pointed out we are more than meeting our commitments to NATO. That said the cuts are clearly not deep enough for Jeremy Corbyn who said: 'Fight all the cuts. Except those in the Armed Forces. Where we want to see a few more cuts taking place.'
    So we could make more cuts and still meet the 2% target.

  16. #41

    Re: Fighting terrorism not supporting it

    Quote Originally Posted by lardy View Post
    So we could make more cuts and still meet the 2% target.
    The 2% is a commitment to NATO & should not override what we need to spend to keep our country safe. Personally I would like to see us investing more in certain areas - for example I am pleased that we have a new fleet of warships in production.

  17. #42

    Re: Fighting terrorism not supporting it

    Quote Originally Posted by Alfonso Perez View Post
    That comes across as more than a little patronising although in fairness you do seem to be describing yourself there. Your inability to consider this logically & objectively is blindingly obvious to me.

    A few basic questions:

    Do you think that it is acceptable for a potential UK PM to describe terrorist organisations as his friends?

    Do you think that it is acceptable for a potential UK PM to observe a minutes silence for dead IRA terrorists?

    Do you think that it is acceptable that a potential Chancellor wants to honour dead IRA terrorists?

    Do you think that it is acceptable for a potential Home Secretary to want to see the British State defeated in any conflict?
    I am on my phone so not so easy to reply to all of that.

    Honest answer, I don't really care. I can understand why people who were involved would care but I think elections should be about the future rather than the past. Britain has had too many enemies that have turned to friends and vice versa to judge. Britain have also had enemies and positions that virtually no one in the political classes challenged, Corbyn did and was proved right in the end.

    Is our agenda on terrorism working? I was in London on Saturday night and it feels to me that our interventions abroad and our commitment to trying to beat an ideology with bombs isn't providing the results. I don't think a different approach is such a dangerous idea.

    Theresa May's vision for Britain (and yours) sounds a lot like North Korea, support the government position or else and sacrifice spending on schools, policing and healthcare in order to maintain a huge scary military. We will end up thick, ill and fundamentally unsafe but at least we can keep bombing the Middle East.

  18. #43

    Re: Fighting terrorism not supporting it

    Quote Originally Posted by Alfonso Perez View Post
    The 2% is a commitment to NATO & should not override what we need to spend to keep our country safe. Personally I would like to see us investing more in certain areas - for example I am pleased that we have a new fleet of warships in production.
    Don't take a knife to a warship fight.

  19. #44

    Re: Fighting terrorism not supporting it

    Quote Originally Posted by Eric Cartman View Post

    Honest answer, I don't really care. I can understand why people who were involved would care but I think elections should be about the future rather than the past. Britain has had too many enemies that have turned to friends and vice versa to judge. Britain have also had enemies and positions that virtually no one in the political classes challenged, Corbyn did and was proved right in the end.
    Always amuses me that people dig out old Corbyn quotes when it was only last year that May was campaigning to stay in the EU.

  20. #45

    Re: Fighting terrorism not supporting it

    Quote Originally Posted by lardy View Post
    Always amuses me that people dig out old Corbyn quotes when it was only last year that May was campaigning to stay in the EU.
    Wonder if Theresa May was campaigning for Nelson Mandele to be released thirty years ago when elements within the Conservative party were saying he was a terrorist and I wonder what her attitude was to the situation described here?

    http://www.independent.co.uk/voices/...-10507850.html

    If questions have to be asked about what politicians from the main opposition party were doing and saying decades ago, I don't get why the same isn't true of politicians within the Governing party.

  21. #46

    Re: Fighting terrorism not supporting it

    Quote Originally Posted by Eric Cartman View Post
    I am on my phone so not so easy to reply to all of that.

    Honest answer, I don't really care. I can understand why people who were involved would care but I think elections should be about the future rather than the past. Britain has had too many enemies that have turned to friends and vice versa to judge. Britain have also had enemies and positions that virtually no one in the political classes challenged, Corbyn did and was proved right in the end.

    Is our agenda on terrorism working? I was in London on Saturday night and it feels to me that our interventions abroad and our commitment to trying to beat an ideology with bombs isn't providing the results. I don't think a different approach is such a dangerous idea.

    Theresa May's vision for Britain (and yours) sounds a lot like North Korea, support the government position or else and sacrifice spending on schools, policing and healthcare in order to maintain a huge scary military. We will end up thick, ill and fundamentally unsafe but at least we can keep bombing the Middle East.

    So you don't care as it had no impact on you - that's a pretty selfish viewpoint from someone who try's to portray himself as a caring socialist. I certainly have issues with people who gave support to a terrorist group who murdered many innocent civilians, even if you don't.

    I think that someone's core values are a very important issue when voting for a new prime minister. If Corbyn could simply specifically condemn the IRA that would be a start but for some reason he is unwilling to do so despite numerous opportunities. The truth is that he has not changed his opinions & his warped view of the world remains well & truly intact.

    I agree that bombing is not the answer. One thing we do need are tougher anti-terror laws & if that impinges on my human rights then I really don't care as it is unlikely to have much impact on me as I don't have anything to hide. I wish we could have a cross party approach to this to reach an acceptable compromise but Corbyn's record of continually voting against anti-terror legislation suggests that this will be impossible to achieve if he is elected. Despite what has been happening of late I have far more confidence in Theresa May & Amber Rudd to keep us safe as opposed to the dream team of Jeremy Corbyn & Diane Abbott.

    You know nothing about my vision for the UK so how can you compare it to North Korea - fair play that is an incredibly stupid & pathetic thing to say. I far from support the Government's position on lot's of things but sadly I think that Theresa May is the best of a very bad bunch & I have never been more disappointed & underwhelmed by any other election. Personally I wish that there was an alternative to May but I am firmly of the opinion that those who think that Corbyn is the answer (like you) are deluded - interestingly 172 out of 229 Labour MPs also think that Corbyn is incapable of leading this country. What do you know that 75% of Labour MP's don't?

    My wish is that the conservatives win with a reduced majority, Corbyn resigns (& takes his abhorrent mates with him) & Labour elect a more balanced/capable leader, thus becoming an effective opposition as opposed to a party of protest. Also, if Theresa May doesn't pull her socks up then I hope that she is ousted during the next parliament & a more capable leader is brought in as Prime Minister. My vision is about having a very strong economy & investing more & more in education, health, defence, police, social care, work & pensions, our environment, the poorer parts of the UK etc.etc. so on some things we appear to have an element of agreement.

  22. #47

    Re: Fighting terrorism not supporting it

    Quote Originally Posted by the other bob wilson View Post
    Wonder if Theresa May was campaigning for Nelson Mandele to be released thirty years ago when elements within the Conservative party were saying he was a terrorist and I wonder what her attitude was to the situation described here?

    http://www.independent.co.uk/voices/...-10507850.html

    If questions have to be asked about what politicians from the main opposition party were doing and saying decades ago, I don't get why the same isn't true of politicians within the Governing party.



    How many of those are currently running for PM, Chancellor or Home Secretary Bob? Do you know anything which suggests that Theresa May supported any terrorist organisations? What about Tim Farron, Nicola Sturgeon or Leanne Wood?

  23. #48

    Re: Fighting terrorism not supporting it

    Quote Originally Posted by Eric the Half a Bee View Post
    Really? Last I heard Corbyn roundly condemned all terrorism.
    Took a bloody long time to do it though didn't he.

  24. #49

    Re: Fighting terrorism not supporting it

    Quote Originally Posted by lardy View Post
    Always amuses me that people dig out old Corbyn quotes when it was only last year that May was campaigning to stay in the EU.
    It always amuses me how many apologists are around when it suits their political persuasion.

    Talking of the EU do you honestly believe that Jeremy Corbyn really wanted to remain noting his past comments & half-hearted efforts during the campaign?

  25. #50

    Re: Fighting terrorism not supporting it

    Quote Originally Posted by Alfonso Perez View Post
    So you don't care as it had no impact on you - that's a pretty selfish viewpoint from someone who try's to portray himself as a caring socialist. I certainly have issues with people who gave support to a terrorist group who murdered many innocent civilians, even if you don't.

    I think that someone's core values are a very important issue when voting for a new prime minister. If Corbyn could simply specifically condemn the IRA that would be a start but for some reason he is unwilling to do so despite numerous opportunities. The truth is that he has not changed his opinions & his warped view of the world remains well & truly intact.

    I agree that bombing is not the answer. One thing we do need are tougher anti-terror laws & if that impinges on my human rights then I really don't care as it is unlikely to have much impact on me as I don't have anything to hide. I wish we could have a cross party approach to this to reach an acceptable compromise but Corbyn's record of continually voting against anti-terror legislation suggests that this will be impossible to achieve if he is elected. Despite what has been happening of late I have far more confidence in Theresa May & Amber Rudd to keep us safe as opposed to the dream team of Jeremy Corbyn & Diane Abbott.

    You know nothing about my vision for the UK so how can you compare it to North Korea - fair play that is an incredibly stupid & pathetic thing to say. I far from support the Government's position on lot's of things but sadly I think that Theresa May is the best of a very bad bunch & I have never been more disappointed & underwhelmed by any other election. Personally I wish that there was an alternative to May but I am firmly of the opinion that those who think that Corbyn is the answer (like you) are deluded - interestingly 172 out of 229 Labour MPs also think that Corbyn is incapable of leading this country. What do you know that 75% of Labour MP's don't?

    My wish is that the conservatives win with a reduced majority, Corbyn resigns (& takes his abhorrent mates with him) & Labour elect a more balanced/capable leader, thus becoming an effective opposition as opposed to a party of protest. Also, if Theresa May doesn't pull her socks up then I hope that she is ousted during the next parliament & a more capable leader is brought in as Prime Minister. My vision is about having a very strong economy & investing more & more in education, health, defence, police, social care, work & pensions, our environment, the poorer parts of the UK etc.etc. so on some things we appear to have an element of agreement.
    He has condemned the violence of the IRA. Are you saying this isn't enough and he must condemn their underlying objectives also?

    What does keep us safe mean? More warships?

    This government has clearly risked it's citizens lives in order to pursue austerity. This isn't I told you so, the police specifically warned them, they did it anyway.

    The smear of Corbyn hasn't worked. Originally when he was elected I had a bit of hope but then firmly became an 'anyone but corbyn' mainly because of the actions of the organisation which backs him. This election campaign has pushed me towards him. Constant irrelevant smear, mistakes by his team being headlines and mistakes by key cabinet members ignored, attack after attack and he stays polite.

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