Gwent records the biggest increase in religious and racial hate crimes since Referendum

[Croesy Blue]

Also to reply to bob I can't think of one white rapper who uses the n word. You may get it said on an album by a white rapper but only in collaborations with a black rapper, the white rapper would never say it.

[Feedback]

Don't agree with your first paragraph at all because when it comes to the colour of someone's skin, I cannot think of one descriptive or made up word off the top of my head that is definitely used in a complimentary way - it seems the best we can hope for is just to call them by that colour, so white, black and redskin are seen as fairly neutral terms (at least I think they are, but I may be wrong) and I suppose something like Caucasian falls into the same category.

why can't we use terms that easily identify people, their doesn't always have to be a sinister undertone.

Many other words would be viewed as an insult though by the group the word described and it seems to me that the large majority are names given to dark skinned people by those with paler skins. The n word is unusual in that it is a word that some blacks have no problem with using in certain contexts, It's true that there are very many blacks who disagree with this, but, undoubtedly, we're talking about a word that involves nuances depending on the colour of the skin of the person using it - the reaction by the person the word is directed at can differ greatly depending on those nuances, so we are talking about a word that can be interpreted differently no matter what you claim.

i'm not claiming anything other than as long as we treat different people differently for a given situation, we will always have racism. I have said elsewhere it is a complex issue. It would be nice if we could all use n****r and no one get offended, but given its historical connotations, it is going to take a long time (if ever) for its meaning to change sufficiently for its use to be deemed acceptable.

Apparently there are white rap artists who use it, but, from my perspective, any white person using the n word is either using it as an insult (or worse) or is so stupid as not to understand the implications of what they are saying - either way, there can be no legitimate excuse I can think of for a white middle aged or old politician to use it in this day and age.

there was a basketball coach from Chicago (possibly Illinois) who asked his players if he could join in with them when they referred to each other in that way. They all agreed it was perfectly acceptable. They knew him, they knew he respected them and they respected him. In that context there was no racist connotations no matter what word was used.

[Feedback]

https://www.google.co.uk/imgres?imgu...act=mrc&uact=8

we have a new one

[Feedback]

It's a very complex issue I agree. I just think it's not too complicated to see why in most situations white people should never say that word because it has negative connotations whilst there are situations for black people where saying it does not have the same negative connotations.

as long as we have that differentiation we will have racism. to beat racism means its either offensive to all or offensive to none.

[TH63]

OK, once again, I do not require an explanation as to why the word is deemed offensive.

I know it is offensive, I know why.

Again, what I am asking, and this is as simple as I can word the question, How is it not racist for my specific race to have its vocabulary limited?

And no, this isn't about the time I used the word in my stand up set. Croesy Blue nailed it earlier in this thread when he said the offensiveness of the word depends on the context.

Here's a bit of wisdom for you, we should decide if the word ****** is offensive depending on the intent of the person using it.

But nobody's asking your specific race to not use it. It is suggested that all non-black races refrain from using it.

Ok, I will concede that it's a little bit racist, but on the scale of racism you go past Australians calling us POMS and keep going to the end.

[jon1959]

Croesy Blue nailed it earlier in this thread when he said the offensiveness of the word depends on the context.

Here's a bit of wisdom for you, we should decide if the word ****** is offensive depending on the intent of the person using it.

I agree with that up to a point. The point is that it is often impossible to know the intent, and all we are left with is the words and how they are understood by people who hear them. When it comes to a black or gay person 'owning' an offensive word (******, queer etc) and subverting it, the context may be clear. But that usage is not accepted by many black or gay people. When it comes to white or straight people using those words or descriptions - even with the intent of stripping the historical meaning away - it is much harder to establish that different context.

The anguish 4 years ago when Reginald D Hunter did his set (with his usual use of '******' as a provocation and challenge to his audience) at the PFA awards ceremony still captures all the complexity and discomfort about the way language is used. In my opinion then (and still now) Reg uses the word in the right way, but was never going to be acceptable in that environment. The PFA and other football authorities are and were in a panic about how to deal effectively with racism and homophobia. They cannot cope with context or intent and have adopted a binary, rules based response. It gives me little confidence that those authorities understand the issues they are reacting to, but I do have confidence they know how to apply rules.

https://www.theguardian.com/football...r-race-remarks

[the other bob wilson]

Do you care to explain why? The MP who used the word is bang out of order. It's a horrible word, and one that I've never used in my life, so why do black people find it acceptable in rapping lyrics. I don't buy into ToBW's explanation about the sheepshagging chants. As a Welshman, I don't get offended at all if someone calls me a sheepshagger. I see the humour in it.
There is no humour or justification in the modern world for anybody to be using the "N" word.

So you think that back in the days before we started singing 1-0 to the sheepshaggers, those who chanted sheepshaggers at us were doing so because they thought we would find it funny? It was meant to insult and annoy us, whereas, for the last twenty years or so, we've been turning the insult on it's back and finding humour in it - the fact still remains though that it is a word which can be viewed differently depending on who is using it.

[the other bob wilson]

Also to reply to bob I can't think of one white rapper who uses the n word. You may get it said on an album by a white rapper but only in collaborations with a black rapper, the white rapper would never say it.

http://www.thedailybeast.com/dear-wh...damn-privilege

[William Treseder]

There are a few of us on this thread doing a good impression of Feedback and Splott Dai. 😂. It's a good topic to discuss though and interesting to see the different opinions and takes on it.
If this had been posted on the politics forum I wouldn't have even seen it, as I don't go on there.
As long winded as it is, it's only one thread, and imo has every right to be on this front page along with anything City and football related. It's what made this board so interesting before.
Ps. Feedy and SD are probably contributing under different names. 😂

[Feedback]

I agree with that up to a point. The point is that it is often impossible to know the intent, and all we are left with is the words and how they are understood by people who hear them. When it comes to a black or gay person 'owning' an offensive word (******, queer etc) and subverting it, the context may be clear. But that usage is not accepted by many black or gay people. When it comes to white or straight people using those words or descriptions - even with the intent of stripping the historical meaning away - it is much harder to establish that different context.

The anguish 4 years ago when Reginald D Hunter did his set (with his usual use of '******' as a provocation and challenge to his audience) at the PFA awards ceremony still captures all the complexity and discomfort about the way language is used. In my opinion then (and still now) Reg uses the word in the right way, but was never going to be acceptable in that environment. The PFA and other football authorities are and were in a panic about how to deal effectively with racism and homophobia. They cannot cope with context or intent and have adopted a binary, rules based response. It gives me little confidence that those authorities understand the issues they are reacting to, but I do have confidence they know how to apply rules.

https://www.theguardian.com/football...r-race-remarks

they'd be positively apoplectic if Chris Rock appeared.

Some people just cannot or will not understand context is everything and that it is the purpose of comedy to break down social taboos

[LordKenwyne]

There are a few of us on this thread doing a good impression of Feedback and Splott Dai. ��. It's a good topic to discuss though and interesting to see the different opinions and takes on it.
If this had been posted on the politics forum I wouldn't have even seen it, as I don't go on there.
As long winded as it is, it's only one thread, and imo has every right to be on this front page along with anything City and football related. It's what made this board so interesting before.
Ps. Feedy and SD are probably contributing under different names. ��

He has been banned from twitter permanently it looks like so he'll need an outlet.

Allowing Splott Dai back would be ok I think though. There'd be arguing but it'd be more active on here.

[Croesy Blue]

they'd be positively apoplectic if Chris Rock appeared.

Some people just cannot or will not understand context is everything and that it is the purpose of comedy to break down social taboos

Chris Rock regrets that difference between black people and n****** sketch now, says he thinks it gave racists an excuse to use the word

[Feedback]

Chris Rock regrets that difference between black people and n****** sketch now, says he thinks it gave racists an excuse to use the word

does he really regret it? I've seen interviews with him and he says he hates the way it was hijacked by the racists, but not that he wishes he hadn't done it. I'm pretty sure Obama used it as a leitmotif too.

[Colonel Cærdiffi]

I agree with that up to a point. The point is that it is often impossible to know the intent, and all we are left with is the words and how they are understood by people who hear them. When it comes to a black or gay person 'owning' an offensive word (******, queer etc) and subverting it, the context may be clear. But that usage is not accepted by many black or gay people. When it comes to white or straight people using those words or descriptions - even with the intent of stripping the historical meaning away - it is much harder to establish that different context.

The anguish 4 years ago when Reginald D Hunter did his set (with his usual use of '******' as a provocation and challenge to his audience) at the PFA awards ceremony still captures all the complexity and discomfort about the way language is used. In my opinion then (and still now) Reg uses the word in the right way, but was never going to be acceptable in that environment. The PFA and other football authorities are and were in a panic about how to deal effectively with racism and homophobia. They cannot cope with context or intent and have adopted a binary, rules based response. It gives me little confidence that those authorities understand the issues they are reacting to, but I do have confidence they know how to apply rules.

https://www.theguardian.com/football...r-race-remarks

You're spot on about the complexity of it all. I wonder if there are even two people in the world who agree 100% on the topic.

[lardy]

He has been banned from twitter permanently it looks like so he'll need an outlet.

Allowing Splott Dai back would be ok I think though. There'd be arguing but it'd be more active on here.

It's pretty difficult to get banned from Twitter. And more than that, it appears he has recently been arrested for what I will generously call his 'comments'.

https://storify.com/cdaargh/anti-semites-on-twitter

[Croesy Blue]

It's pretty difficult to get banned from Twitter. And more than that, it appears he has recently been arrested for what I will generously call his 'comments'.

https://storify.com/cdaargh/anti-semites-on-twitter

Isn't holocaust denial quite serious? He was always a bit out there but didn't seem this bad, looks like he's gone off the deep end a bit

[lardy]

Isn't holocaust denial quite serious? He was always a bit out there but didn't seem this bad, looks like he's gone off the deep end a bit

Yeah I looked at his timeline a few times, though he made many thousands of tweets so I only saw a very small part of it, but it was a great deal worse than he posted on here.

Last time I took a peek was when I read that he was part of the gang laying into a BBC reporter:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...interview.html

Mail link because it's the first one that came up on Google.

[elytillidie]

You're spot on about the complexity of it all. I wonder if there are even two people in the world who agree 100% on the topic.

All about context for me, two great songs, would only offend those most determined to be offended.
John Lennon... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Woman_...r_of_the_World
Patti Smith... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rock_N_Roll_******

[lardy]

All about context for me, two great songs, would only offend those most determined to be offended.
John Lennon... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Woman_...r_of_the_World
Patti Smith... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rock_N_Roll_******

Also Oliver's Army, talks about one less white ******.

[Feedback]

Also Oliver's Army, talks about one less white ******.

in the context of that particular song I think it was a reference to the Irish nationalist/catholic people. the song itself couldn't be more anti war/anti racism unless it was sung by Billy Bragg

[lardy]

in the context of that particular song I think it was a reference to the Irish nationalist/catholic people. the song itself couldn't be more anti war/anti racism unless it was sung by Billy Bragg

Yep, it was about how it is always the working class who are pushed into doing the dirty jobs on behalf of their government.

[Feedback]

Yep, it was about how it is always the working class who are pushed into doing the dirty jobs on behalf of their government.

plus ça change, plus c'est la même chose

[JDerrida]

But to black people a white person using it always has racist connotations due to the history. I think this is the point we find difficult to understand, I've been to a couple of lectures about it and I always had the same view point as you but I've come to understand I can't understand how a black person feels when a white person uses that word.

The word is very ugly.
If a white person uses it, it has racist connotations due to history.
If a black person uses it, it could have racist connotations due to history.
I'm sure a LOT of black people despise it's use by other black people.
To have a blanket acceptance of black people using it, is naive as there's a number of reasons why it word be used.
However, there is an undertone to it that continues the differentiation of people's based on colour.
How long before it should be deemed unacceptable for anyone to use it?

[I.8.POLITICAL.CORRECTNESS]

nail on the head mate

[William Treseder]

So after a couple of pages later on the use of the n word, where are we?
It appears it's all down to the context of how it's used. What was the context that the 2 black guys in the Colonels video were using it to call the takeaway attendant Bitch ******?
I'm not racist, so could I call someone who's pissed me off Bitch ******?
It appears that a lot of white folk are trying to bend over backwards in apologising to black people for the way some of our ancestors treated their ancestors in yrs gone by.
Absolute nonsense! It's a horrible word, that nobody of any skin colour should be happy to use, what ever context it's meant in.
Are we gonna have a certain word that only white people can use?
As I said earlier, the world is going mad!