Passing

[Eric the Half a Bee]

Following on from a few threads about this subject, I've been having a look at our stats according to whoscored.com (there's my disclaimer straight away). Stats on passing on there only go back to our last season in the Premier League, there's no Championship information prior to that. I'm presuming this season's stats are up to date.

Pass accuracy:

This current City side is, in terms of percentage, the worst passing side of the last 5 seasons. This doesn't tell the whole story as we've seen discussed - pass type has an effect on these statistics as the data below clearly shows - the lower the percentage of short passes, the less accurate the overall stat becomes.

2017/18: 61.6% accurate, 75.1% short passes
2016/17: 66.1% accurate, 75.5% short passes
2015/16: 71.8% accurate, 80.3% short passes
2014/15: 69.3% accurate, 77.5% short passes
2013/14: 75.4% accurate, 83.5% short passes

However, when you analyse successful short and long passes, there is still proof that our passing this season has been the worst in the last 5 seasons.

2017/18: long accurate 30.7%, short accurate 71.8%, total passes per game average 279.5
2016/17: long accurate 36.6%, short accurate 75.7%, total passes per game average 319.9
2015/16: long accurate 40.4%, short accurate 79.4%, total passes per game average 408.7
2014/15: long accurate 38.4%, short accurate 78.3%, total passes per game average 349.2
2013/14: long accurate 45.4%, short accurate 81.3%, total passes per game average 379

One accusation often labelled against Neil Warnock is that he likes playing long ball. Do the stats bear this out? Well, only his Rotherham team and Millwall (this season) have attempted more long passes than us in 4 seasons of Championship stats, so there might be some truth in this! It probably comes as little surprise that our overall pass inaccuracy stats (and therefore accuracy too) are currently the worst in 4 seasons of Championship football. His Rotherham side are 2nd worst in that list. Does it matter? Well, we're currently joint top of the division. Rotherham were doomed until Warnock took over and they stayed up quite comfortably, so the issue of pass success/long ball-short passing is largely irrelevant.

Do better passing sides win promotion/worse passing sides get relegated?

In 2016/17, the top 6 sides were in the top 7 accurate passers list. Brighton were the least accurate of the top 6 in terms of short passing and were only very marginally more accurate than Wigan and Blackburn, who were both relegated. Nearly half of Brighton's long balls were accurate, a very decent figure.

In 2015/16, while Hull and Middlesbrough were amongst the most accurate passers in the division, Burnley had a worse accuracy percentage than the three teams relegated. Burnley played quite a high percentage of long balls (in comparative terms) which affected that figure, yet they won the title.

In 2014/15, the three promoted teams had better passing statistics across the board than the three teams relegated.

So, to answer the question, teams can get promoted and even win the division without being the best passers.

Finally, a stat that might be of some interest. In 4 seasons of Championship stats, only in the last two seasons have teams recorded a pass success rate of over 80% - 2 last season and 5 so far this season. Fulham (this season and last) and Norwich (this season) are the first teams to get close to 90% short passes attempted. Maybe the Championship is becoming a bit more cultured in terms of football.

As for our carrot crunching friend trying to gain some moral high ground, Bristol City have, in each season since their promotion, been in the top 10 teams in the Championship for attempting long balls. So much for their slick pass and move game...

In essence, passing stats probably don't matter all that much. As one poster put it, ball --> onion bag. I've just presented some stats for those who are interested. I haven't read anything particularly into it.

[Tandy]

So basically the 2015/16 team was a better passing team than our current team.

[WJ99mobile]

So basically the 2015/16 team was a better passing team than our current team.

A more defensively minded team.

[Tandy]

A more defensively minded team.

Try and keep up the thread is about passing.

[The Bob Banker Spanker]

So basically the 2015/16 team was a better passing team than our current team.

According to the stats, yes.
But then again we've probably had more shots on target already this season than we did during the entire 15/16 season.

[WJ99mobile]

Try and keep up the thread is about passing.

Stat: In 2012 Leon Britton had the best passing stats in Europe.

Opinion: Would I have had him in my team? No

Stat: the 2015/2016 team was better at passing

Opinion: I wouldn't like to watch that team play ever again

[TH63]

So basically the 2015/16 team was a better passing team than our current team.

And how many of those passes were from the half way line back to the keeper?

[Tandy]

Stat: In 2012 Leon Britton had the best passing stats in Europe.

Opinion: Would I have had him in my team? No

Stat: the 2015/2016 team was better at passing

Opinion: I wouldn't like to watch that team play ever again

Eric told you that the top teams are the best passers. What part of being a good passing side don't you understand?

[The Bob Banker Spanker]

Eric told you that the top teams are the best passers. What part of being a good passing side don't you understand?

Would you say we were a top team in 15/16?

[Tandy]

And how many of those passes were from the half way line back to the keeper?

5

[Dr Lecter]

Eric told you that the top teams are the best passers. What part of being a good passing side don't you understand?

The part where you're trying to pretend that Slade had us playing good football.

Change the record - the football under Slade was awful to watch.

Have you ever wondered why you're the only person on here to pretend otherwise?

I'll give you a clue - it's not because you're more knowledgeable than everyone else.

[Tandy]

Would you say we were a top team in 15/16?

We threatened to be a top team but fell short

[Tandy]

The part where you're trying to pretend that Slade had us playing good football.

Change the record - the football under Slade was awful to watch.

Have you ever wondered why you're the only person on here to pretend otherwise?

I'll give you a clue - it's not because you're more knowledgeable than everyone else.

Eric has provided the stats on passing do you dispute him?

[Dr Lecter]

Eric has provided the stats on passing do you dispute him?

As someone else pointed out, the stats don't take into account ineffective passes.

The Leon Britton analogy is a great example - in terms of simple five yard sideways passing, he's a genius. Shame he doesn't actually provide any creativity.

As I said, the football under Slade was awful to watch - do you dispute this?

[Tandy]

As someone else pointed out, the stats don't take into account ineffective passes.

The Leon Britton analogy is a great example - in terms of simple five yard sideways passing, he's a genius. Shame he doesn't actually provide any creativity.

As I said, the football under Slade was awful to watch - do you dispute this?

So why don't you tell Eric that the stats don't take into account ineffective passes?

Seen worse to be honest

[Eric the Half a Bee]

Eric told you that the top teams are the best passers.

No I didn't. I said that teams can be successful without being the greatest passers, see Leicester City's Premier League winning side. Sides can also be good passing teams and get relegated. Passing stats are just about irrelevant enough to not even be considered a rule of thumb.

[J R Hartley]

No I didn't. I said that teams can be successful without being the greatest passers, see Leicester City's Premier League winning side. Sides can also be good passing teams and get relegated. Passing stats are just about irrelevant enough to not even be considered a rule of thumb.

Yet relevant enough for you to start a thread with a long winded first post about them?!?

Warnock dealt with this question in his presser yesterday

[Eric the Half a Bee]

So basically the 2015/16 team was a better passing team than our current team.

What is interesting is that the side from the season before was a less accurate passing team. Given that Solksjaer was in charge at the beginning and his side tended to keep possession well, this would have skewed the stats and I would say Slade's team's stats that season would have been worse. The 2015/16 stats suggest an influence from a coach known for a passing style of play.

[Tandy]

No I didn't.

Yes you did.
"In 2016/17, the top 6 sides were in the top 7 accurate passers list.

If passing stats are so "irrelevant" why start a thread full of passing stats?

[The Bob Banker Spanker]

We threatened to be a top team but fell short

I wouldn't say we threatened at all.
We finished in the top 10 but other than the first 10 games we were absolutely no threat to the playoffs.
Probably one of the very few seasons in the Championship where you knew who was going to be in the top 6 at the end of the season around Christmas time.
We were dreadful to watch.

[J R Hartley]

http://www.walesonline.co.uk/sport/f...rnock-13658309

I think it's fair to say Warnock would think this thread was a load of bollox.

Just Eric being his usual self picking faults with the team

[Eric the Half a Bee]

Yet relevant enough for you to start a thread with a long winded first post about them?!?

Warnock dealt with this question in his presser yesterday

I ended my post by saying
In essence, passing stats probably don't matter all that much. As one poster put it, ball --> onion bag. I've just presented some stats for those who are interested. I haven't read anything particularly into it.

Given this had already answered your dig, why did you feel the need to be an argumentative knob as usual?

[J R Hartley]

I ended my post by saying
In essence, passing stats probably don't matter all that much. As one poster put it, ball --> onion bag. I've just presented some stats for those who are interested. I haven't read anything particularly into it.

Given this had already answered your dig, why did you feel the need to be an argumentative knob as usual?

Oh please. That little devils advocate comment at the end doesn't disguise this thread for what it really is.

[Tandy]

I wouldn't say we threatened at all.
We finished in the top 10 but other than the first 10 games we were absolutely no threat to the playoffs.
Probably one of the very few seasons in the Championship where you knew who was going to be in the top 6 at the end of the season around Christmas time.
We were dreadful to watch.

We beat Derby who were in 6th spot to move us within 2 points of a play-off place. The last 7 games cost us where we could only manage 1 win. That's why I said we fell short.
Tell me why 28600 people attended if the football was crap, I know they were given freebies out but surely people got better things to do than watch a load of rubbish

[The Bob Banker Spanker]

We beat Derby who were in 6th spot to move us within 2 points of a play-off place. The last 7 games cost us where we could only manage 1 win. That's why I said we fell short.
Tell me why 28600 people attended if the football was crap, I know they were given freebies out but surely people got better things to do than watch a load of rubbish

You answered your own question there.