Confused - watching Scotland at moment

[Baloo]

That brings up an interesting point.

If results against the bottom side aren't counted, why do they still count when calculating 2nd place in the group? It is possible for a team to have a better record against the other teams, lose to the bottom side twice, but have a better record against teams finishing 1st, 2nd, etc than the actual runner up.

Presumably because within the group everybody plays the same teams.

[Dr Lecter]

So basically this is the stupidest qualifying campaign ever

Yep.

Surely a simpler solution would be to just put one of the second place teams through automatically (Wales would be a fair pick) and make England drop out to save them next year's humiliation?

[Badly Ironed Shirt]

Yep.

Surely a simpler solution would be to just put one of the second place teams through automatically (Wales would be a fair pick) and make England drop out to save them next year's humiliation?

First time I read this, I thought it was a ridiculous idea. But, before I came along to disagree for the sake of disagreeing, I thought about your plan long and hard and I've come to the conclusion that it is the best idea of the lot.

Pros - Wales light up another tournament with brilliantly good looking and well humoured fans. Cons, England fans won't be getting their heads kicked in in Tashkent or wherever UEFA have to put them to avoid crowd trouble.

Pros - Chris Coleman can deliver yet more tactical masterclasses to the overrated bums like Joachim Low and Sir Bobby Charlton (I assume he still manages Ireland?).
Cons - We won't witness Alan Green and Clive Tyldesley in emotional melt down as England draw 0-0 with a nine man team from Zaire.

The pros outweigh the cons for me, so I am swayed and your idea is the best of the lot. They say there is a thin line between lunacy and genius, and you walk that line with more dexterity that that bloke what walked between the twin towers before they were blown up.