More than 300,000 tonnes of “radioactive” mud to be dumped a mile from cardiff

[LordKenwyne]

How convenient for the government. They've got that shit hole attached to england where no one will complain to dump their rubbish.

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/...severn-estuary

More than 300,000 tonnes of “radioactive” mud, some of it the toxic byproduct of Britain’s atomic weapons programme, will be dredged to make way for England’s newest nuclear power station and dumped in the Severn estuary just over a mile from Cardiff.

Politicians in Wales have denounced the move, with one accusing the Welsh government of selling out to London and the nuclear lobby. They have called on ministers to commit to further radiological tests before giving consent for the process, which is crucial for the construction of Hinkley Point C across the estuary in Somerset.

In 2013, an assessment by the Centre for Environment Fisheries and Aquaculture Sciences found that tests on the mud, carried out under International Atomic Energy Agency procedures, revealed only minimal levels of radioactivity, well within safety guidelines. “From radiological considerations, there is no objection to this material being dredged and dumped,” the assessment concluded.

But John Thomas, leader of the Vale of Glamorgan Council, said concerns had been raised about the adequacy of the assessment. He has called for an urgent meeting with Natural Resources Wales, which approved the dredging licence, and the Welsh government.

An independent marine pollution researcher, Tim Deere-Jones, who is also a prominent nuclear power critic, has warned that the dumped sediment could re-concentrate into more powerful radioactive material and be washed ashore in storm surges. “We know sediment in mudflats can dry out and blow ashore and that fine sediment with radioactivity attached can transfer to the land in marine aerosols and sea spray,” Deere-Jones said. Studies of north Wales tidal surges, he added, had revealed that the deposited mud and sand were heavily contaminated with radioactivity from Sellafield.

The mud to be dredged contains 50-year-old deposits from Hinkley Point A, where radioactive material for Britain’s atomic weapons was produced. Nuclear historian Dr David Lowry said some of the plutonium produced at the plant was sent to the US in a controversial and confidential exchange. “That deal is coming back to haunt today’s nuclear industry as plans for the third generation of nuclear plants at Hinkley are literally running into the sparkling radioactive mud,” Lowry said.

The dredging licence was granted to EDF, the company building the new plant, in 2013. It gives the French energy giant the right to discharge materials at Cardiff Grounds, a sandbank in the Bristol Channel. EDF needs to clear the sediment to allow barges to bring in construction materials.

Neil McEvoy, Plaid Cymru Welsh Assembly member, who has received a briefing from Deere-Jones, said dredging should be suspended until a full environmental impact assessment had been carried out. A petition has gained enough signatures to force the assembly to debate the issue. “The problem lies with the unknown,” McEvoy said. “No dose of non-naturally occurring radiation is safe. What we have here is big business trampling over Wales, with a Welsh government doffing its cap to London and the nuclear industry,” he said. “The Welsh national interest is not being served here. The public is outraged that this material will be dumped in Cardiff’s waters, and washed around the Welsh coast, with transfer of radioactivity from sea to land.”

An EDF spokesman said: “We have undertaken a number of assessments as part of this application which concluded the activities pose no threat to human health or the environment. All activities on our sites are strictly controlled and regulated by a number of statutory bodies to ensure the environment and public are protected.”

John Wheadon, of Natural Resources Wales, said: “There are strict conditions in the licence to test the sediment, including a radiological assessment, before it can be deposited. We will only allow the work to start if we’re confident the activity will not harm people and the environment.”

[joecity]

Why can't they just put it in Bristol Docks then if it must go somewhere, They wouldn't notice three eyed fish swimming around. They don't notice a 6 fingered chap rowing from Henley On Thames to visit in laws. Makes sense.

[Ainsley Harriott]

*“No dose of non-naturally occurring radiation is safe." - incorrect.

20 millisieverts a year is considered safe.

It's not unsafe for me to live near Aberthaw power station, to get an X-ray, to get on a plane or to eat a banana. They all expose me to radiation.

[blue matt]

*“No dose of non-naturally occurring radiation is safe." - incorrect.

20 millisieverts a year is considered safe.

It's not unsafe for me to live near Aberthaw power station, to get an X-ray, to get on a plane or to eat a banana. They all expose me to radiation.

I think you are missing the point

" The Evil empire ( England ) is dumping waste ( doesn't matter what ) on the oppressed Little guy ( But with a big heart, Wales ) so Little guy has the opportunity to feel hard done by "

[Taunton Blue Genie]

Surely the plan is for the dredged material to be dumped in the channel so that is scoured on the ebb tide and transported downstream rather than have it sitting on sandbanks.

[LordKenwyne]

Surely the plan is for the dredged material to be dumped in the channel so that is scoured on the ebb tide and transported downstream rather than have it sitting on sandbanks.

I am unsure on the process if I am honest.

[ccfc_is_my_life]

I am unsure on the process if I am honest.

The key parts from that article are McEvoy's involvement ( and he's a piece of work ) and the fact McEvoy was briefed by someone who has been a long term nuclear power critic, who can hardly be called independent in any sense of the word.

To get what they want, politicians do tend to scaremonger to attract emotional rather than logical responses.

[LordKenwyne]

I think you are missing the point

" The Evil empire ( England ) is dumping waste ( doesn't matter what ) on the oppressed Little guy ( But with a big heart, Wales ) so Little guy has the opportunity to feel hard done by "

The government have broken multiple promises in recent weeks/months for wales yet still you look to defend them.

You're dismissing my attempt to even comment on the subject. That tells you the welsh mentality from some.

The people saying the waste is fine are people involved in the move.

I'll wait for more articles to surface before blindly cheerleaders the tories.

[LordKenwyne]

That is before you go into the fact no ordinary person even wants it other than the tories flogging it for a quick buck:

https://www.theguardian.com/commenti...heresa-may-hs2

[blue matt]

The government have broken multiple promises in recent weeks/months for wales yet still you look to defend them.



I'll wait for more articles to surface before blindly cheerleaders the tories.

I hate the Tory Government, always have, i expect I always will

[headlight]

A report I read about this stated that the testing had only been carried out on the surface of the silt, up to 5cm down iirc.
It said that although the amount of radioactivity found at this surface level was within acceptable limits that past experience from testing deeper in radioactive silt, at other locations around the world, had often shown much higher levels of radioactivity.
The report urged EDF to have tests carried out deeper in the silt (it is several feet deep) but their (EDF"s) response was that the testing they had had carried out met with UK government criteria

[headlight]

Here is the article
http://www.walesonline.co.uk/news/wa...e-mud-13673203

[Taunton Blue Genie]

I am unsure on the process if I am honest.

I hate to intrude on the usual Welsh paranoia but the material will probably be deposited so that it moves downstream passing Somerset, Devon and Cornwall too.

[joecity]

I hate to intrude on the usual Welsh paranoia but the material will probably be deposited so that it moves downstream passing Somerset, Devon and Cornwall too.

Phew that's o.k then cause all I care about is Cardiff and absolutely nothing else. At all.

[joecity]

Phew that's o.k then cause all I care about is Cardiff and absolutely nothing else. At all.

Except for the people watching me of course.

[ccfc_is_my_life]

Phew that's o.k then cause all I care about is Cardiff and absolutely nothing else. At all.

Not at all. It's a point of questioning scaremongering, something McEvoy has a history of doing.

Any decision needs to be made upon facts, not emotion.

[ccfc_is_my_life]

I hate to intrude on the usual Welsh paranoia but the material will probably be deposited so that it moves downstream passing Somerset, Devon and Cornwall too.

That's a smart move. Any radioactivity could well help resolve the defective genes in prevalent those areas.

[Heathblue]

I hate to intrude on the usual Welsh paranoia but the material will probably be deposited so that it moves downstream passing Somerset, Devon and Cornwall too.

PROBABLY!!!!! IMO The Hinckley project is a massive mistake although it will sustain 1,000's of well paid jobs, far too much risk with Nuclear Power, going down the path that the government has, at the very least it should not have involved the Chinese and French. I note other countries are returning to coal fired power stations, The UK has plenty of the stuff and a workforce capable of mining it, I would like to see the UK free of Nuclear anything and leading the world with energy solutions based on the natural resources that we have, Water & Wind a lot of it, energy policy is being shaped by short term business (profit for the few) and not for future generations, 3 mile island, chenobyl, fukushima, how long before we get the real biggy ?

[Croesy Blue]

PROBABLY!!!!! IMO The Hinckley project is a massive mistake although it will sustain 1,000's of well paid jobs, far too much risk with Nuclear Power, going down the path that the government has, at the very least it should not have involved the Chinese and French. I note other countries are returning to coal fired power stations, The UK has plenty of the stuff and a workforce capable of mining it, I would like to see the UK free of Nuclear anything and leading the world with energy solutions based on the natural resources that we have, Water & Wind a lot of it, energy policy is being shaped by short term business (profit for the few) and not for future generations, 3 mile island, chenobyl, fukushima, how long before we get the real biggy ?

I work in Nuclear power and people's reactions like this always seem a bit bizzare to me. The Uk currently has 15 working nuclear power reactors, one right next to where HPC is being built. The safety standards in this country are unbelievabley tight and there is no way they would be allowed to operate if they were unsafe.

Chernobyl was a completely different reactor and they turned off all the safety functions and the positive coefficient of reactivity meant it didn't just shut itself down like ours would.

Fukishima other than the the operators who were killed by the wave on site there hasn't been one nuclear related death due to the crisis management being so good. It should be noted as well that the sea wall being too short and the generators being in the basement was pointed out as an issue multiple times but due to the how Japanese Hierachies are they never followed up on it.

It seems bizarre you are worried about nuclear waste but want a return to coal power stations which produce a much more radioactive biproduct which cannot be reprocessed unlike uranium. That's ignoring how damaging to the enviroment burning coal every day it.

There have been 100s of Nuclear power plants operated in the UK, France, Germany and Scandanavia with zero issues ever. The only reason other countries have gone back to coal is it is an easy win for any government due to the scewed public perception of how dangerous nuclear power is. It's viewed in the same way as plane crashes because of how destructive the odd crash every 10s of years can be people only look at the consequences and not how unlikely something going wrong actually is.

[tomm]

I work in Nuclear power and people's reactions like this always seem a bit bizzare to me. The Uk currently has 15 working nuclear power reactors, one right next to where HPC is being built. The safety standards in this country are unbelievabley tight and there is no way they would be allowed to operate if they were unsafe.

Chernobyl was a completely different reactor and they turned off all the safety functions and the positive coefficient of reactivity meant it didn't just shut itself down like ours would.

Fukishima other than the the operators who were killed by the wave on site there hasn't been one nuclear related death due to the crisis management being so good. It should be noted as well that the sea wall being too short and the generators being in the basement was pointed out as an issue multiple times but due to the how Japanese Hierachies are they never followed up on it.

It seems bizarre you are worried about nuclear waste but want a return to coal power stations which produce a much more radioactive biproduct which cannot be reprocessed unlike uranium. That's ignoring how damaging to the enviroment burning coal every day it.

There have been 100s of Nuclear power plants operated in the UK, France, Germany and Scandanavia with zero issues ever. The only reason other countries have gone back to coal is it is an easy win for any government due to the scewed public perception of how dangerous nuclear power is. It's viewed in the same way as plane crashes because of how destructive the odd crash every 10s of years can be people only look at the consequences and not how unlikely something going wrong actually is.

Sod coal, sod nuclear. Both (not so slowly) killing the planet. Wales could be a world leader in renewables. But no, the UK Government wants to stick to their market obsessed ideology to the extent that the Chinese and French are given cast iron contracts to print money if they build new nuclear plants.

[ken smith]

I work in Nuclear power and people's reactions like this always seem a bit bizzare to me. The Uk currently has 15 working nuclear power reactors, one right next to where HPC is being built. The safety standards in this country are unbelievabley tight and there is no way they would be allowed to operate if they were unsafe.

Chernobyl was a completely different reactor and they turned off all the safety functions and the positive coefficient of reactivity meant it didn't just shut itself down like ours would.

Fukishima other than the the operators who were killed by the wave on site there hasn't been one nuclear related death due to the crisis management being so good. It should be noted as well that the sea wall being too short and the generators being in the basement was pointed out as an issue multiple times but due to the how Japanese Hierachies are they never followed up on it.

It seems bizarre you are worried about nuclear waste but want a return to coal power stations which produce a much more radioactive biproduct which cannot be reprocessed unlike uranium. That's ignoring how damaging to the enviroment burning coal every day it.

There have been 100s of Nuclear power plants operated in the UK, France, Germany and Scandanavia with zero issues ever. The only reason other countries have gone back to coal is it is an easy win for any government due to the scewed public perception of how dangerous nuclear power is. It's viewed in the same way as plane crashes because of how destructive the odd crash every 10s of years can be people only look at the consequences and not how unlikely something going wrong actually is.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/u...-a7226991.html

https://www.theguardian.com/environm...clear-accident

[LordKenwyne]

I hate to intrude on the usual Welsh paranoia but the material will probably be deposited so that it moves downstream passing Somerset, Devon and Cornwall too.

Apologies for hoping for more details on this.

I should have known my place as a non entity welshman that should accept whatever the english based goverment do.

As of course, they will always do what is the best interests of wales.

How silly of me to even contemplate querying it.

By the way, I've never voted plaid in my life, so this isn't someone that is a die hard secessionist. Well, I am not even saying it is wrong in the first place really, just some clarity?.

[Steve R]

I hate to intrude on the usual Welsh paranoia but the material will probably be deposited so that it moves downstream passing Somerset, Devon and Cornwall too.

Probably. Should be fine then.

[joecity]

I was being ironic in reply to Genie calling Welsh folk paranoid. Who wouldn't care about this. Never mind.

[ccfc_is_my_life]

I was being ironic in reply to Genie calling Welsh folk paranoid. Who wouldn't care about this. Never mind.

There is a degree of paranoia, though.

We've a situation near us, been ongoing for well over a decade in terms of problems. Made our case logically, evidence based. McEvoy presented a petition for something not even in his ward, like most of the people on that "side" had no idea of any of the evidence, facts just dealt on an emotional level.