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Thread: Tomlin's goal

  1. #1

    Tomlin's goal

    Did Tomlin kick it out of the keeper's hands? It looked like it had just left his hands so should have been a goal.

  2. #2

    Re: Tomlin's goal

    Possibly, but they never get given.

  3. #3

    Re: Tomlin's goal

    Quote Originally Posted by Toadstool View Post
    Possibly, but they never get given.
    They give it to Samuel Eto against David Marshall at Stamford Bridge a few years back

  4. #4

    Re: Tomlin's goal

    A striker in that situation is not allowed to move. It's the law.
    Look up Georgie Best Gordon Banks.

  5. #5
    First Team Forest Green Bluebird's Avatar
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    Re: Tomlin's goal

    Quote Originally Posted by Robin Friday's Ghost View Post
    Did Tomlin kick it out of the keeper's hands? It looked like it had just left his hands so should have been a goal.
    Law12 FIFA

    Offences committed against goalkeepers

    • It is an offence for a player to prevent a goalkeeper from releasing the ball
    from his hands

    • A player must be penalised for playing in a dangerous manner if he kicks or
    attempts to kick the ball when the goalkeeper is in the process of releasing
    it

    • It is an offence to restrict the movement of the goalkeeper by unfairly
    impeding him

  6. #6

    Re: Tomlin's goal

    Quote Originally Posted by Forest Green Bluebird View Post
    Law12 FIFA

    Offences committed against goalkeepers

    • It is an offence for a player to prevent a goalkeeper from releasing the ball
    from his hands

    • A player must be penalised for playing in a dangerous manner if he kicks or
    attempts to kick the ball when the goalkeeper is in the process of releasing
    it

    • It is an offence to restrict the movement of the goalkeeper by unfairly
    impeding him
    Unless it’s a Cardiff City keeper

  7. #7

    Re: Tomlin's goal

    Quote Originally Posted by MacAdder View Post
    A striker in that situation is not allowed to move. It's the law.
    Look up Georgie Best Gordon Banks.
    Yep I remember that one.

  8. #8

    Re: Tomlin's goal

    Quote Originally Posted by Forest Green Bluebird View Post
    Law12 FIFA

    Offences committed against goalkeepers

    • It is an offence for a player to prevent a goalkeeper from releasing the ball
    from his hands

    • A player must be penalised for playing in a dangerous manner if he kicks or
    attempts to kick the ball when the goalkeeper is in the process of releasing
    it

    • It is an offence to restrict the movement of the goalkeeper by unfairly
    impeding him
    Tomlin carefully stayed at the keeper's side so the 3rd rule is not infringed.

    Tomlin did not prevent the keeper from releasing the ball - in fact he waited for him to do it. So the first rule is not infringed.

    The decision for the ref appears to be whether there was an attempt to kick the ball
    when the keeper was "in the process of releasing it." There must also be a decision that what happened was dangerous. This rule conflates 2 situations.

    That keeper threw the ball into the air, intending to kick it as it fell. Once he had done so, he had released it.

    There was no danger.

    I think there is a perfectly good argument that it was a valid goal,

    Furthermore Tomlin was booked, presumably for dangerous play. So the ref must have thought it was dangerous, perhaps even when the ball had been released and he was entitled to go for it?

    These laws are a bit of a shambles, in particular law 2.


  9. #9

    Re: Tomlin's goal

    Just saw the replay on sky sports, the ball is definitely released, Tomkins boot is not much higher than the keepers and he was never going to hurt him.

    I thought at the time he was stupid trying to do it, but looking at the replay I think it was a fair challenge

  10. #10

    Re: Tomlin's goal

    Quote Originally Posted by rich munn View Post
    Tomlin carefully stayed at the keeper's side so the 3rd rule is not infringed.

    Tomlin did not prevent the keeper from releasing the ball - in fact he waited for him to do it. So the first rule is not infringed.

    The decision for the ref appears to be whether there was an attempt to kick the ball
    when the keeper was "in the process of releasing it." There must also be a decision that what happened was dangerous. This rule conflates 2 situations.

    That keeper threw the ball into the air, intending to kick it as it fell. Once he had done so, he had released it.

    There was no danger.

    I think there is a perfectly good argument that it was a valid goal,

    Furthermore Tomlin was booked, presumably for dangerous play. So the ref must have thought it was dangerous, perhaps even when the ball had been released and he was entitled to go for it?

    These laws are a bit of a shambles, in particular law 2.

    Yes, the way the goalkeeper threw it and released it is key. It was some distance away from his body, he was not in control of it.

  11. #11

    Re: Tomlin's goal

    On the radio wales phone-in, Blakey explained that even though the goalie throws the ball he’s deemed to still be in control of it, if the ball bounced then it wouldve been ok.

  12. #12

    Re: Tomlin's goal

    Quote Originally Posted by TH63 View Post
    On the radio wales phone-in, Blakey explained that even though the goalie throws the ball he’s deemed to still be in control of it, if the ball bounced then it wouldve been ok.
    Agreed that's the normal opinion, but the keeper's throw was hardly one of being in control of it. He threw it some distance away from his body so he could whack it.

  13. #13

    Re: Tomlin's goal

    Quote Originally Posted by Eric the Half a Bee View Post
    Agreed that's the normal opinion, but the keeper's throw was hardly one of being in control of it. He threw it some distance away from his body so he could whack it.
    Come on

    no chance it's a goal although maybe worth a try with that ref

  14. #14

    Re: Tomlin's goal

    Quote Originally Posted by rich munn View Post
    Tomlin carefully stayed at the keeper's side so the 3rd rule is not infringed.

    Tomlin did not prevent the keeper from releasing the ball - in fact he waited for him to do it. So the first rule is not infringed.

    The decision for the ref appears to be whether there was an attempt to kick the ball
    when the keeper was "in the process of releasing it." There must also be a decision that what happened was dangerous. This rule conflates 2 situations.

    That keeper threw the ball into the air, intending to kick it as it fell. Once he had done so, he had released it.

    There was no danger.

    I think there is a perfectly good argument that it was a valid goal,

    Furthermore Tomlin was booked, presumably for dangerous play. So the ref must have thought it was dangerous, perhaps even when the ball had been released and he was entitled to go for it?

    These laws are a bit of a shambles, in particular law 2.

    My thoughts exactly. Absolute shambles of a decision.

  15. #15

    Re: Tomlin's goal

    Quote Originally Posted by SunderlandBluebird View Post
    Come on

    no chance it's a goal although maybe worth a try with that ref
    No chance with that ref. He gave us bugger all.

    Yes, I know they're never given.

    I stand by my argument that he wasn't in control of the ball. He threw it up in the air. Surely then it should be fair game for anyone?

  16. #16

    Re: Tomlin's goal

    Quote Originally Posted by Eric the Half a Bee View Post
    No chance with that ref. He gave us bugger all.

    Yes, I know they're never given.

    I stand by my argument that he wasn't in control of the ball. He threw it up in the air. Surely then it should be fair game for anyone?
    Just think, if they allowed this it would happen with every time the keeper kicked the ball out and we'd go back to those ridiculous days of strikers chasing keepers around the box.
    The keeper is regarded as in control of the ball until he's kicked it. It wasn't a goal, you should be more aggrieved about the failure to give a pen for pulling Morrison to the ground minutes later.

  17. #17

    Re: Tomlin's goal

    Quote Originally Posted by tomm View Post
    Just think, if they allowed this it would happen with every time the keeper kicked the ball out and we'd go back to those ridiculous days of strikers chasing keepers around the box.
    The keeper is regarded as in control of the ball until he's kicked it. It wasn't a goal, you should be more aggrieved about the failure to give a pen for pulling Morrison to the ground minutes later.
    Or utterly relieved that he was still on the field after the mixup at the start of the second half.

  18. #18

    Re: Tomlin's goal

    Quote Originally Posted by tomm View Post
    Just think, if they allowed this it would happen with every time the keeper kicked the ball out and we'd go back to those ridiculous days of strikers chasing keepers around the box.
    The keeper is regarded as in control of the ball until he's kicked it. It wasn't a goal, you should be more aggrieved about the failure to give a pen for pulling Morrison to the ground minutes later.
    The ref was crap for both teams,they could have had a penalty

  19. #19
    International jon1959's Avatar
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    Re: Tomlin's goal

    Quote Originally Posted by Whisperer View Post
    They give it to Samuel Eto against David Marshall at Stamford Bridge a few years back
    That's what I thought of as soon as the incident happened. But I was looking from the Grandstand and Tomlin blocked my view of what the Millwall keeper did with the ball, so not sure if the situations were close enough for comparison. Anyway, this was Eto'o stealing the ball from Marshall:


  20. #20

    Re: Tomlin's goal

    I don't really see how the keeper can kick the ball without letting go of it. Worth a try but even Tomlins celebration was half-hearted.

  21. #21
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    Re: Tomlin's goal

    Everyone in the ground knew it wasn't a goal. The only people who would have given were not present.
    Can't believe so many people don't know the rules.

  22. #22
    First Team Forest Green Bluebird's Avatar
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    Re: Tomlin's goal

    Quote Originally Posted by jon1959 View Post
    That's what I thought of as soon as the incident happened. But I was looking from the Grandstand and Tomlin blocked my view of what the Millwall keeper did with the ball, so not sure if the situations were close enough for comparison. Anyway, this was Eto'o stealing the ball from Marshall:

    Marshall bounced the ball therefore released it from his possession. Correct decision.

    Millwall keeper still in possession of ball - until after he makes contact. Tomlin cannot pinch ball off him whilst in air.

  23. #23

  24. #24

    Re: Tomlin's goal

    A few more



  25. #25

    Re: Tomlin's goal

    Quote Originally Posted by Forest Green Bluebird View Post
    Law12 FIFA

    Offences committed against goalkeepers

    • It is an offence for a player to prevent a goalkeeper from releasing the ball
    from his hands

    • A player must be penalised for playing in a dangerous manner if he kicks or
    attempts to kick the ball when the goalkeeper is in the process of releasing
    it

    • It is an offence to restrict the movement of the goalkeeper by unfairly
    impeding him
    The law is an ass then - the Millwall keeper was obviously not in possession of the ball when Tomlin committed the "foul" and the challenge he put in would have been deemed a fair one if it had been between two outfield players contesting a loose ball. However, the powers that be, perhaps understandably, do not want to see the consequences of what would follow if goals like that were allowed to stand.

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