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Thread: Since the Tories came in , rough sleepers on the streets has doubled

  1. #126

    Re: Since the Tories came in , rough sleepers on the streets has doubled

    Quote Originally Posted by SLUDGE FACTORY View Post
    Was it any good ?
    Sadly, it was.
    But hey ho.
    We digress.

  2. #127

    Re: Since the Tories came in , rough sleepers on the streets has doubled

    [QU okOTE=dembethewarrior;4806661]You come across like a politician who's never seen any issues like this face to face..

    (Apologies if wrong, but the way that's written...)

    Edit..didnt get to the part about the friend as the bit before kind of had me screaming "politician"

    I do apologise.[/QU

  3. #128

    Re: Since the Tories came in , rough sleepers on the streets has doubled

    Quote Originally Posted by Jordi Culé View Post
    i have been banging on about container living for 24 years, since i came back from Australia, i was involved in a Scuba diving club ( i was a PADI dive instructor ) , the club had just lost its rental house and was looking at other places, they owned 4 shipping containers on some land, i said they should look at converting them to " bunk rooms " ( i had seen a guy living in one up the coast )

    My brothers company almost built a development for " temp housing " in Kent, it was only going to be 30 of them in total, in 3 blocks of 5, 2 units high, with a communal courtyard / garden, the council appeared keen, but when push came to shove, it was never going to happen

  4. #129
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    Re: Since the Tories came in , rough sleepers on the streets has doubled

    Hasn't the government just taken on £70bn of housing association debt so that they can borrow this amount to build new stock?

  5. #130

    Re: Since the Tories came in , rough sleepers on the streets has doubled

    Well if they have that's good news but won't make much of a dent into the millions of council homes lost due to the right to buy .......which the Tories are still pushing in England ! The Tories said to the voters we are extending the right to buy to those living in housing association properties and we will replace every property sold by building a new one .....has it happened ?........has it feck

  6. #131

    Re: Since the Tories came in , rough sleepers on the streets has doubled

    Walking home from work lastnight, seen a bloke I know that sleeps rough in the park. He's got to be pushing 60. Park gates either side of town get closed in the evening so this fella has to climb over when he's ready to go in.
    Not that anyone deserves to be on the streets, but I'd rather be a youngster than get to that age and be out on the streets.

    There are places in town, but they breathalyse them going in. I do get it to a point, but an old harmless bloke has a drink can't get in, some kid who's probably smacked up...i don't think they do a piss teat to gain entry...

  7. #132
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    Re: Since the Tories came in , rough sleepers on the streets has doubled

    Quote Originally Posted by jon1959 View Post
    If the UK was 'almost bankrupt' in 2010 (defined as the government being unable to pay all its debts immediately if they were all called in?) then that was true for most western governments - certainly the USA. But that technical definition is not useful or very illuminating. The official UK debt to GDP ratio in 2010 was under 70% - lower than many other western countries, and much lower than in earlier decades. If you add in the so-called 'hidden' debts or liabilities then that % rises steeply, but so it does for most other countries too. Most of the debate about unofficial debt and liabilities is so politicised that it is hard to find any figures to trust - but in any case it is not a new phenomenon.
    The issue was the deficit was running at >10% of GDP, which is a course for bankruptcy in the long run.

    Quote Originally Posted by jon1959 View Post
    As this piece describes, if the UK was broke in 2010 it had been broke for centuries! In other words it's a scare-mongering headline with no value.

    https://www.theguardian.com/commenti...tain-not-broke
    typically when the deficit is less than inflation adjusted growth the rising payments on debt is more than offset by the rising tax base to cover it.

    Quote Originally Posted by jon1959 View Post
    Your solution to defecit and low growth seems to be cuts. The alternative strategy of investing to promote growth and greater national income through government capital projects (funded by low interest borrowing) is a century old and has worked all around the world.
    it is one school of thought. not every school of thought advocates it.

    Quote Originally Posted by jon1959 View Post
    It may not fit with the Thatcherite 'corner shop' model of economics, but then the Chancellor of the Exchequer doesn't keep the assets and revenues of the UK in a shoe box under his bed either. Labour has been consistent in advocating a version of Keynsian economics to invest and build our way out of trouble - and has a lot of popular and academic support for its plans.
    it is hard to suggest what could happened if a Keynesian model had been adopted. It may have worked, ut may not. it is all supposition.

    Quote Originally Posted by jon1959 View Post
    Yes, many working people voted Tory in 2010 - and 2015 - and every other election where they had a vote. They always have. A lot of people in elections vote against their own interests for a lot of complicated reasons. In my opinion it has historically been down to The Sun, The Mail and an unhealthy deference. Just maybe a few crunched the numbers and read the manifestos and thought Thatcher or Cameron were the answer. My 'out-laws' are an example.
    it really is crass to suggest working people voting Tory are voting against their own best interests. you have no idea what is in the best interests of the 13.7m or so who voted Tory in this years election. People vote for a myriad of reasons and not everyone is obsessed with money in the way those on the left are.

    Quote Originally Posted by jon1959 View Post
    Corbyn and McDonnell are not communists. They are left social democrats. They are also - obviously - amongst that small group of MPs who have consistently not lined their own pockets (see expenses). You are entitled to disagree with them and detest their politics, but the personal attack on them and their motives is pathetic.
    They are not social democrats - Blair was a social democrat, so was Brown and Milliband. Corbyn and McDonnell are very much further left. McDonnell is on R4 quite a lot and you only have to listen to him to see he is not an advocate of social democracy.

  8. #133
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    Re: Since the Tories came in , rough sleepers on the streets has doubled

    Quote Originally Posted by SLUDGE FACTORY View Post
    Well if they have that's good news but won't make much of a dent into the millions of council homes lost due to the right to buy .......which the Tories are still pushing in England ! The Tories said to the voters we are extending the right to buy to those living in housing association properties and we will replace every property sold by building a new one .....has it happened ?........has it feck
    how does RTB affect the total number of homes available for the people living in the UK? As far as I can see the only difference is the ownership of the home and not the actual numbers of housing stock available in the UK. The requirement for social housing is the same pre and post RTB.

  9. #134

    Re: Since the Tories came in , rough sleepers on the streets has doubled

    Quote Originally Posted by TISS View Post
    The issue was the deficit was running at >10% of GDP, which is a course for bankruptcy in the long run.


    typically when the deficit is less than inflation adjusted growth the rising payments on debt is more than offset by the rising tax base to cover it.


    it is one school of thought. not every school of thought advocates it.


    it is hard to suggest what could happened if a Keynesian model had been adopted. It may have worked, ut may not. it is all supposition.

    it really is crass to suggest working people voting Tory are voting against their own best interests. you have no idea what is in the best interests of the 13.7m or so who voted Tory in this years election. People vote for a myriad of reasons and not everyone is obsessed with money in the way those on the left are.

    They are not social democrats - Blair was a social democrat, so was Brown and Milliband. Corbyn and McDonnell are very much further left. McDonnell is on R4 quite a lot and you only have to listen to him to see he is not an advocate of social democracy.

  10. #135
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    Re: Since the Tories came in , rough sleepers on the streets has doubled

    Quote Originally Posted by the other bob wilson View Post
    why is it the left are always those who go on about money then?

  11. #136

    Re: Since the Tories came in , rough sleepers on the streets has doubled

    Quote Originally Posted by TISS View Post
    why is it the left are always those who go on about money then?
    My sides are splitting here.

    I can't get into any sort of political debate here as I'm useless...but aren't many of these Tory rich types "leaning right" ?

  12. #137
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    Re: Since the Tories came in , rough sleepers on the streets has doubled

    Quote Originally Posted by dembethewarrior View Post
    My sides are splitting here.

    I can't get into any sort of political debate here as I'm useless...but aren't many of these Tory rich types "leaning right" ?
    being rich doesn't mean you bang on about wanting more money by doing nothing. The left are always going on about wanting more money and the way they get is is by changing the law, not by working harder, longer or smarter.

    its not about being rich, there are plenty of no so rich who vote Tory, just like there are plenty of rich people who vote Labour it is all part of life's rich tapestry

  13. #138

    Re: Since the Tories came in , rough sleepers on the streets has doubled

    Goon news - The UK built more than 200,000 new homes for the first time since the financial crisis, with an increase in numbers every year since 2012.

    http://www.cityam.com/275871/uk-buil...rst-time-since

  14. #139

    Re: Since the Tories came in , rough sleepers on the streets has doubled

    Quote Originally Posted by TISS View Post
    being rich doesn't mean you bang on about wanting more money by doing nothing. The left are always going on about wanting more money and the way they get is is by changing the law, not by working harder, longer or smarter.

    its not about being rich, there are plenty of no so rich who vote Tory, just like there are plenty of rich people who vote Labour it is all part of life's rich tapestry
    Everything the Tories do (Not on about voters here now) is to make more money.

  15. #140
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    Re: Since the Tories came in , rough sleepers on the streets has doubled

    Quote Originally Posted by dembethewarrior View Post
    Everything the Tories do (Not on about voters here now) is to make more money.
    no it isn't. in fact, this Tory government has taxed more than any other in history, has increased red tape and bureaucracy more than any other and is about as business friendly as McDonnell and Corbyn.

  16. #141
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    Re: Since the Tories came in , rough sleepers on the streets has doubled

    Quote Originally Posted by Nick View Post
    Goon news - The UK built more than 200,000 new homes for the first time since the financial crisis, with an increase in numbers every year since 2012.

    http://www.cityam.com/275871/uk-buil...rst-time-since

  17. #142
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    Re: Since the Tories came in , rough sleepers on the streets has doubled

    Quote Originally Posted by Pearcey3 View Post
    Agreed.
    Also a great post by Jon.

    We need to get away from all this talk of austerity. Under the Tories the well off had tax cuts. It was targeted austerity aimed at the weaker in society. Bloody disgusting.
    is this a fact or just left wing rhetoric? i'd be interested to see where the rich have had their taxes cut?

  18. #143

    Re: Since the Tories came in , rough sleepers on the streets has doubled

    Hi demb mate. The guy you see could book into a 'wet houe'. There is a few around. Hostels that allow drink or if not the drink then an intoxicated user. Dont know where you live. Plenty of older guys especialyy those who like a drink tend to make their own way. Hostels have become fuller of young people and its a headache for older types. Changes to housing benefits to under 25s havent helped with this.

  19. #144

    Re: Since the Tories came in , rough sleepers on the streets has doubled

    Quote Originally Posted by joecity View Post
    Hi demb mate. The guy you see could book into a 'wet houe'. There is a few around. Hostels that allow drink or if not the drink then an intoxicated user. Dont know where you live. Plenty of older guys especialyy those who like a drink tend to make their own way. Hostels have become fuller of young people and its a headache for older types. Changes to housing benefits to under 25s havent helped with this.
    Wasn't aware of that. Bloke is harmless enough, not sure how long he's been sleeping rough, he does get spotted in a pub from time to time (I ain't going to judge that) he seems like a quiet enough fella. I'll look into it and pass the info on. It is of course possible that he doesn't want the help, but no harm passing on information.

  20. #145

    Re: Since the Tories came in , rough sleepers on the streets has doubled

    Quote Originally Posted by dembethewarrior View Post
    Wasn't aware of that. Bloke is harmless enough, not sure how long he's been sleeping rough, he does get spotted in a pub from time to time (I ain't going to judge that) he seems like a quiet enough fella. I'll look into it and pass the info on. It is of course possible that he doesn't want the help, but no harm passing on information.
    That's all you can do mate. Good stuff.

  21. #146

    Re: Since the Tories came in , rough sleepers on the streets has doubled

    Quote Originally Posted by joecity View Post
    That's all you can do mate. Good stuff.
    Could be any one of us one day. It's what I always tell my daughter too.

  22. #147

    Re: Since the Tories came in , rough sleepers on the streets has doubled

    Quote Originally Posted by TISS View Post
    how does RTB affect the total number of homes available for the people living in the UK? As far as I can see the only difference is the ownership of the home and not the actual numbers of housing stock available in the UK. The requirement for social housing is the same pre and post RTB.
    Let's say there are 10000 council homes in a town

    5000 of those , in the nice streets are sold off

    The council now only has a stock of 5000 homes to provide for those in housing need , once these are passed onto the council

    If you don't replace council housing that is sold like for like with new social housing , then a housing crisis develops

    It really is very simple to understand , the institute of housing , housing policy experts , shelter and many other groups warned this was going to happen

    What council's have left following right to buy is fewer housing to offer those in need and that which is left is often poor quality as the right to buy has been higher on the nice estates and lower on the rougher ones

    The right to buy has created sink estates with poor quality housing and social problems

    The need for social housing following right to buy is fecking enormous , waiting lists are massive , at an all time high for many councils

    That's why so many have been forced into the badly managed private sector and the housing benefit bill has risen

  23. #148

    Re: Since the Tories came in , rough sleepers on the streets has doubled

    Quote Originally Posted by TISS View Post
    The issue was the deficit was running at >10% of GDP, which is a course for bankruptcy in the long run.


    typically when the deficit is less than inflation adjusted growth the rising payments on debt is more than offset by the rising tax base to cover it.


    it is one school of thought. not every school of thought advocates it.


    it is hard to suggest what could happened if a Keynesian model had been adopted. It may have worked, ut may not. it is all supposition.

    it really is crass to suggest working people voting Tory are voting against their own best interests. you have no idea what is in the best interests of the 13.7m or so who voted Tory in this years election. People vote for a myriad of reasons and not everyone is obsessed with money in the way those on the left are.

    They are not social democrats - Blair was a social democrat, so was Brown and Milliband. Corbyn and McDonnell are very much further left. McDonnell is on R4 quite a lot and you only have to listen to him to see he is not an advocate of social democracy.
    Is this a joke ?

  24. #149

    Re: Since the Tories came in , rough sleepers on the streets has doubled

    Quote Originally Posted by TISS View Post
    Still way short of what's required and mostly private build , we need social housing ff sake

  25. #150

    Re: Since the Tories came in , rough sleepers on the streets has doubled

    Quote Originally Posted by TISS View Post
    is this a fact or just left wing rhetoric? i'd be interested to see where the rich have had their taxes cut?
    Yes it is a fact , Jon works in housing management , he knows what he's talking about

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