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Thread: Another poor attendance yesterday.

  1. #26

    Re: Another poor attendance yesterday.

    Quote Originally Posted by life on mars View Post
    Thing have changed,my mate bought a ticket cost 25 bucks is not easy ,for everyone to do that at that price ,with the add on's that turns into a 40 pound day, if your lucky
    Spot on! We'd have many more 'walk ups' on the day of a game, if the cost wasn't so damn prohibitive. Something the club has to look at

  2. #27

    Re: Another poor attendance yesterday.

    Quote Originally Posted by William Treseder View Post
    To be fair NYCBlue, the title of the thread kinda gave it away. It seems plenty of posters were interested enough to give an opinion. If your fed up of this topic, then there are plenty of other threads to look at. Why even bother looking at this one?
    It did. But it didn't make it any less played out.

  3. #28

    Re: Another poor attendance yesterday.

    Oh look a thread title on a topic I don't like, let me just open that there and put in a comment...

  4. #29

    Re: Another poor attendance yesterday.

    Quote Originally Posted by dembethewarrior View Post
    Oh look a thread title on a topic I don't like, let me just open that there and put in a comment...
    Yawn.

  5. #30

    Re: Another poor attendance yesterday.

    Quote Originally Posted by NYCBlue View Post
    Yawn.
    Should I have put /s so you knew it was sarcasm?

  6. #31

    Re: Another poor attendance yesterday.

    Quote Originally Posted by Badly Ironed Shirt View Post
    To be honest, I was expecting around 15k. Early kick-off, plus Cardiff are not playing very well at the moment.

    This is how the average crowd has been going since the start of the season.

    1 23,899
    2 20,872
    3 20,088
    4 19,850
    5 21,312
    6 20,900
    7 20,557
    8 19,981
    9 19,576
    10 19,322
    11 19,205
    12 19,411
    13 19,283
    14 19,170

    The average attendance after home match 13 is the lowest it has been all season. The club are currently 3rd, a position they have been higher than for the majority of the season. To average 20,000 crowds, the club must average 21,291 over the next 9 games.

    These are the average crowds in 2011-12. The last season before the you-know-what. Cardiff were 3rd after home game 14, having spent the first half of the season in 8th/9th spot.

    1. 22,639 (5.3% lower than this season)
    2. 22,826 (9.4% higher)
    3. 22,505 (12% higher)
    4. 22,167 (11.7% higher)
    5. 22,234 (4.3% higher)
    6. 22,163 (6% higher)
    7. 21,949 (6.8% higher)
    8. 21,960 (9.9% higher)
    9. 22,025 (12.5% higher)
    10. 22,024 (14% higher)
    11. 22,147 (16.4% higher)
    12. 22,273 (14.7% higher)
    13. 22,266 (15.5% higher)
    14. 22,289 (16.3% higher)

    The average crowd in 2011-12 season is 3,119 higher than this season. The ticket prices are unchanged. The team are performing as well as, if not better. In real terms it is less expensive to watch Cardiff City now than it was in 2011/12. On Home match day 3 of 2011/12 Cardiff played the glamorous Doncaster Rovers with 8 points from 5 games, and being 6th in the league. The crowd was 21,863. Cardiff City, this season, played QPR having won all of their previous games. The crowd, 18,520. A difference of 3,343.

    In the course of 6 years, the club have lost an average of 3,119 fans a game - despite being better placed on the pitch. I doubt if Newport County are averaging 3,119 fans.

    I've heard that there are too many games, too few games, silly kick-off times, and all sorts of other reasons for the drop in crowds. Not one person seems willing to point the finger at Vincent Tan. They prefer to point at a fickle fan base, but here are figures from a season that pales in comparison to this current season - 2011/12 provided ample opportunities for the fickleness of fans to shine through.
    http://www.cardiffcityforum.co.uk/vi...c.php?t=191995

  7. #32

    Re: Another poor attendance yesterday.

    Quote Originally Posted by Badly Ironed Shirt View Post
    "Averages have increased every season" - isn't this just the second post Slade season?

    Ticket prices are good, the team are good, the stadium is good. Why have the club lost the equivalent of a Newport County off their attendances since 2011/12?

    I know a fair few people who give Vincent Tan as their reason. I'm interested to hear other reasons, it's far more productive than yet another "crap crowd yesterday" thread. I usually jump on such threads with evidence (albeit some is anecdotal) that Tan deserves a portion of blame (not all of it) but usually this doesn't sit well with those who still go and hope he opens his cheqye book.

    I'm not portraying the crowds as a disaster, but they are significantly lower than you'd realistically expect. It's important stuff, it determines how much money the club has to spend on new players.

    21,000 on Boxing Day whilst second in the league? That is pitiful and shows there is a significant loss of interest and appetite to watch Cardiff City.
    Yes it is the second post Slade season but that makes no difference, they have still increased considerably both years since (16500 to 19144).

    It is obvious from the information you have been given by various posters that Tan and the rebrand are very little, if anything, to do with why our attendances dropped since 2013/2014, the main reasons are the quality of football, lack of success and hopeless managers who couldnt connect with the fans but you still are chosing to disregard this. As pointed out to you, we have actually added the equivalent of a Newport County crowd to our attendances in the last two years but you also ignore this. By the end of the season, if we keep towards the top end of the table, our average attendance will be considerably higher than last season and most likely at or around the figures you have quoted for 2011/12. This doesnt indicate a crisis or loss of interest in City at all and certainly isnt 'pitiful' as you suggest.

  8. #33

    Re: Another poor attendance yesterday.

    Quote Originally Posted by dembethewarrior View Post
    Cost me 30 quid for food and train fare for me and my daughter. I didn't need to buy tickets, but if I did I'd be looking at 50 quid.
    Can see how many couldn't do that too often.
    Something has greatly changed in terms of entrance fees , I can recall going to games in the early 70 's and we were very poor, but managed it somehow ,we did have the benefit of free bus travel, by jumping on and off moving buses with those back end open access ?

  9. #34

    Re: Another poor attendance yesterday.

    Quote Originally Posted by Superdad View Post
    Crowds of course are important , but I dont think they influence the playing budget as much as they may have 20 years ago. Take Norwich as an example. They have to sell and sell quickly as they simply do not have the finances presently to carry on as they are. They have crowds in excess of 26,000 most games, but what they don’t have is a rich benefactor to subsidise them.

    Our average crowds you have listed do not take into account 4,000 free children’s tickets which were purchased for the family stand.

    If this deal was still in place , then the attendance figures for last season would be 20,000 and 23,000 for this season.
    If you look at the areas in the ground compared to prior to our promotion season then I'd say the Canton is actually fuller, Ninian the same, Grandstand slightly emptier but the biggest difference is the Family Stand which was so full it extended into the corner block of the Grandstand.

    People bough cheap or free tickets on the back of Wembley and a promotion push which went on for 4 seasons of fantastic football.

    It's a pity we floundered over Xmas as I think we might have sold another 1-2000 more season tickets if we'd won just 2 of those 4 games.

    I honestly don't think many of the outsiders to the current club believe we will go up and those results just helped reinforce that theory.

    Let's face it as well the perception in general is that the football is still not that attractive so football purists aren't going to bother either.

    A lot of damage has been done in many ways and it will clearly take more than half a season near the top to repair .

    I don't think however there are that many that still don't attend exclusively due to Tan.

    Maybe 500 at most and on the other side of it there are many others that now come due to us having a decent side which we wouldn't have without him.

  10. #35

    Re: Another poor attendance yesterday.

    Quote Originally Posted by dml1954 View Post
    Yes it is the second post Slade season but that makes no difference, they have still increased considerably both years since (16500 to 19144).

    It is obvious from the information you have been given by various posters that Tan and the rebrand are very little, if anything, to do with why our attendances dropped since 2013/2014, the main reasons are the quality of football, lack of success and hopeless managers who couldnt connect with the fans but you still are chosing to disregard this. As pointed out to you, we have actually added the equivalent of a Newport County crowd to our attendances in the last two years but you also ignore this. By the end of the season, if we keep towards the top end of the table, our average attendance will be considerably higher than last season and most likely at or around the figures you have quoted for 2011/12. This doesnt indicate a crisis or loss of interest in City at all and certainly isnt 'pitiful' as you suggest.
    What information is this then? It's all quite subjective and there are maybe 3,119 reasons why 3,119 fewer people now attend on average than in 2011/12. I can offer anecdotal evidence for 5 of those 3,119 (family members who watched every home game in the 23 draws in one season season), and I can chip in with long time fans like TLG, Alfie Sherwood, TVB from this board. I can also tell you that a few fans that sat close to me at Ninian Park and then at the new ground all stopped going citing Tan as their reason.

    But, of course, we should ignore this and blame it all on 2 seasons of Slade.

    BTW - I am not blaming it 100% on Tan. But, to hear people defend him when he has plainly had a negative effect (as witnessed on this board alone) and claim he has had no impact on the viewing habits of entire families, especially in the face of the comparison with 2011/12 is laughable.

    I also point you in the direction of Nick's link - I don't use that board, but a few people seem to have an opinion that matches mine - and that Tan is also the reason why they have stopped going.

    But, let's not let facts, figures and testimonies get in the way of blindly defending Cheque Book Tan.

  11. #36

    Re: Another poor attendance yesterday.

    Quote Originally Posted by Badly Ironed Shirt View Post
    What information is this then? It's all quite subjective and there are maybe 3,119 reasons why 3,119 fewer people now attend on average than in 2011/12. I can offer anecdotal evidence for 5 of those 3,119 (family members who watched every home game in the 23 draws in one season season), and I can chip in with long time fans like TLG, Alfie Sherwood, TVB from this board. I can also tell you that a few fans that sat close to me at Ninian Park and then at the new ground all stopped going citing Tan as their reason.

    But, of course, we should ignore this and blame it all on 2 seasons of Slade.

    BTW - I am not blaming it 100% on Tan. But, to hear people defend him when he has plainly had a negative effect (as witnessed on this board alone) and claim he has had no impact on the viewing habits of entire families, especially in the face of the comparison with 2011/12 is laughable.

    I also point you in the direction of Nick's link - I don't use that board, but a few people seem to have an opinion that matches mine - and that Tan is also the reason why they have stopped going.

    But, let's not let facts, figures and testimonies get in the way of blindly defending Cheque Book Tan.
    You said earlier that Tan deserves a portion of blame (not all of it). What other reasons do you think given that you have poo-pooed any alternative offered that isn't Tan?

  12. #37

    Re: Another poor attendance yesterday.

    Given the standards set throughout the season, I thought Saturday's attendance was pretty good for a lunchtime kick off televised game - there wasn't an announcement about Sunderland stubs that I missed was there?.

  13. #38

    Re: Another poor attendance yesterday.

    If people don't want to go and watch City playing then that's their problem.

    I couldn't give a rats ar5e how many people are in the stadium, I go because I've always gone (over 40 odd years, 30 of them travelling from London every week). I enjoy the good games and enjoy moaning about the bad games. I meet my family and friends and have a few beers, laughing when we're 5hit and fawning over the players when they do something brilliant.

    Tan is not a supporter, likewise many other owners/ chairmen of our club and plenty of others. He's here temporarily, unlike many of us who will be there whatever happens.

    So, if you want to come and watch City play, however bad/ good their brand of football (and let's face it, there's been some 5hit football in the last 40 odd years), then come. If you don't want to come, then don't, go and do something else instead.

  14. #39

    Re: Another poor attendance yesterday.

    Quote Originally Posted by Harry Monk View Post
    If people don't want to go and watch City playing then that's their problem.

    I couldn't give a rats ar5e how many people are in the stadium, I go because I've always gone (over 40 odd years, 30 of them travelling from London every week). I enjoy the good games and enjoy moaning about the bad games. I meet my family and friends and have a few beers, laughing when we're 5hit and fawning over the players when they do something brilliant.

    Tan is not a supporter, likewise many other owners/ chairmen of our club and plenty of others. He's here temporarily, unlike many of us who will be there whatever happens.

    So, if you want to come and watch City play, however bad/ good their brand of football (and let's face it, there's been some 5hit football in the last 40 odd years), then come. If you don't want to come, then don't, go and do something else instead.
    With you all the way Harry.

  15. #40

    Re: Another poor attendance yesterday.

    Quote Originally Posted by Superdad View Post
    Crowds of course are important , but I dont think they influence the playing budget as much as they may have 20 years ago. Take Norwich as an example. They have to sell and sell quickly as they simply do not have the finances presently to carry on as they are. They have crowds in excess of 26,000 most games, but what they don’t have is a rich benefactor to subsidise them.

    Our average crowds you have listed do not take into account 4,000 free children’s tickets which were purchased for the family stand.

    If this deal was still in place , then the attendance figures for last season would be 20,000 and 23,000 for this season.
    Minus season ticket holders who don't attend any particular game. People who don't attend can hardly be included in attendance figures.

  16. #41

    Re: Another poor attendance yesterday.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lawnmower View Post
    If you look at the areas in the ground compared to prior to our promotion season then I'd say the Canton is actually fuller, Ninian the same, Grandstand slightly emptier but the biggest difference is the Family Stand which was so full it extended into the corner block of the Grandstand.

    People bough cheap or free tickets on the back of Wembley and a promotion push which went on for 4 seasons of fantastic football.

    It's a pity we floundered over Xmas as I think we might have sold another 1-2000 more season tickets if we'd won just 2 of those 4 games.

    I honestly don't think many of the outsiders to the current club believe we will go up and those results just helped reinforce that theory.

    Let's face it as well the perception in general is that the football is still not that attractive so football purists aren't going to bother either.

    A lot of damage has been done in many ways and it will clearly take more than half a season near the top to repair .

    I don't think however there are that many that still don't attend exclusively due to Tan.

    Maybe 500 at most and on the other side of it there are many others that now come due to us having a decent side which we wouldn't have without him.
    Totally agree on the Tan thing , that a smoke screen ,though it was an excellent crowd considering the time and the TV coverage ,even our friends were 50% down and they are usually very loyal :

    Huge percentage of the crowd are the baby boomers era who have the cash to do this with ease.
    25 to 30 somethings rather be in the Wine bar or cycling in lycra .
    Young families find it tough with mortgages and kid commitments so they select the offer games .
    Folk who have spare money would rather go to a concert ,rugger or a nice meal out .
    Its too guttural an environment for the snowflake Millennials and their children
    I look around me ,its over 50's, when we have gone what will be left , lower attendances ,unless they get promotion and stay there.
    When we growing up there was very little choice of affordable entertainment other than sport ,now they are spoilt for choice.

    We have to accept we are dinosaurs, almost Jurassic in nature and the choices out there is so different as is the cost, it has lost its working class affordability ( I mean real work-class ie hard manual workers ,not the over stressed office type roles )

  17. #42

    Re: Another poor attendance yesterday.

    Quote Originally Posted by Badly Ironed Shirt View Post
    What information is this then? It's all quite subjective and there are maybe 3,119 reasons why 3,119 fewer people now attend on average than in 2011/12. I can offer anecdotal evidence for 5 of those 3,119 (family members who watched every home game in the 23 draws in one season season), and I can chip in with long time fans like TLG, Alfie Sherwood, TVB from this board. I can also tell you that a few fans that sat close to me at Ninian Park and then at the new ground all stopped going citing Tan as their reason.

    But, of course, we should ignore this and blame it all on 2 seasons of Slade.

    BTW - I am not blaming it 100% on Tan. But, to hear people defend him when he has plainly had a negative effect (as witnessed on this board alone) and claim he has had no impact on the viewing habits of entire families, especially in the face of the comparison with 2011/12 is laughable.

    I also point you in the direction of Nick's link - I don't use that board, but a few people seem to have an opinion that matches mine - and that Tan is also the reason why they have stopped going.

    But, let's not let facts, figures and testimonies get in the way of blindly defending Cheque Book Tan.
    No - lets not let facts and figures get in the way of you blindly criticising Tan is what you mean. Also I wouldnt brag about your original post getting coverage on the other board if I were you. Perhaps you could also enlighten me as to exactly what Tan is doing wrong currently. He certainly isnt waving his cheque book around, although what that has to do with anything I dont know. I am prepared to bet that when he came in originally, you and the other people you mention were happy as Larry that someone with money was prepared to invest in a club that had been run on thin air for many years. You call our attendances currently pitiful but they are obviously not. You have such a big downer on City that I seriously wonder why you bother following them.

  18. #43

    Re: Another poor attendance yesterday.

    Quote Originally Posted by dml1954 View Post
    No - lets not let facts and figures get in the way of you blindly criticising Tan is what you mean. Also I wouldnt brag about your original post getting coverage on the other board if I were you. Perhaps you could also enlighten me as to exactly what Tan is doing wrong currently. He certainly isnt waving his cheque book around, although what that has to do with anything I dont know. I am prepared to bet that when he came in originally, you and the other people you mention were happy as Larry that someone with money was prepared to invest in a club that had been run on thin air for many years. You call our attendances currently pitiful but they are obviously not. You have such a big downer on City that I seriously wonder why you bother following them.
    Hes not a Cardiff fan.
    Anyway - decent crowd I thought.
    Agree from the drop in attendances a large proportion does seem to be from the Family Stand. Got to be a worry that.
    However cup final incentives to buy ST.s / fans attracted to come by big name signings and the cash being splashed for a real go at promotion inflated attendances for a period not to mention the novelty of a new stadium.
    Fans who have quit because of Tan in my opinion are minimal and irrelevant anyway as they are never coming back same as those who bore you with the Toshack tale.
    The Leeds gate shows the support is there.

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