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So, what you're saying is that what he is telling us nearly a year before the Referendum is that once a Leave win had been announced, there would be negotiation with the EU whatsoever - right, I see.Originally Posted by Wales-Bales
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Nah. Only if you read the hard right rags like The Express, Mail and Torygraph,
So, what you're saying is that what he is telling us nearly a year before the Referendum is that once a Leave win had been announced, there would be negotiation with the EU whatsoever - right, I see.
Twitter can be awful but plenty of good people doing in-depth research on there. My apologies if I missed your link to the BBC article but you called JennyWren's assertion that less than 100 laws have been forced on us by the EU as 'crap' so I offered the link to suggest this was not the case.
Dennis Skinner doesn't call him dodgy Dave for nothing, but the relevent bit is when he said he was currently negotiating the final deal!
Apologies if I misunderstood the thrust of your reply. I thought you were merely trying to disagree with my figures. If there were only 100 EU laws that affected the UK, it would certainly make me wonder what the hell they had been doing for the last forty odd years.
What laws have the EU forced on us that people don’t agree with then?
So the EU has lots of regulations? That's hardly a surprise. I would argue that these are not examples of meddling in UK affairs, more that they are the framework for EU membership, for frictionless trade deals and so on. Most clubs have rules and regulations.
It's very much different from supposedly inflicting new laws on the UK.
Do people not realise the UK is in the room when these terrible laws are being discussed?
It’s now page 27 of this thread, which seems to have been going on longer than the Brexit negotiations itself. The leavers and the remainers are still hard at it, with little progress being made. Both sides entrenched with their views and beliefs. Can you not just call it a draw Mike. 🤔
It’s been an interesting thread hasn’t it? No one’s forcing anyone to read it.
It’s not been that interesting. I’ve not learnt anything I didn’t already know.
And that goes out to everyone. Why not tell us if you haven't enjoyed reading a long thread? We'd all love to hear about it.
Why don’t you enlighten us with some of your knowledge then rather than moaning?
The 12000 are regulations and laws imposed upon the UK with us having little or no say in it, so yes they are examples of how the EU interferes in our affairs adversely.
Name three examples out of those 12,000 where we had little or no say and they adversely affected us.
Which ones did we have little or no say in? We are an equal member and had equal input.
Because this appears to be the latest fact on that
That’s ignoring the fact that the voting stage isn’t the only input we get. The U.K. also negotiates all laws with the other 27 countries before they’re put to vote.The British government has voted against EU laws 2% of the time since 1999
Official EU voting records* show that the British government has voted ‘No’ to laws passed at EU level on 56 occasions, abstained 70 times, and voted ‘Yes’ 2,466 times since 1999.
In other words, UK ministers were on the “winning side” 95% of the time, abstained 3% of the time, and were on the losing side 2%.
And ignoring the fact that our MEPs have voted differently to our MPs. Which part of this is undemocratic? Which part is a disadvantage to us?
Why do you think those regulations are interfering adversely?
Those are making sure we have less harmful.chemicals in products, food that is a better standard of quality, medical devices, pharmaceuticals etc etc. Which area of life would you be happy to accept a lower standard in than the rest of Europe?
Do you know the difference between regulations and laws ? Regulations are imposed upon us and we have to comply whether we like it or not. They are decided by back room committees and unknown bureaucrats and we have to comply, as we are part of the 'club', whether we like it or not. We have absolutely no vote or say on these before they are imposed. There are thousands of them. Silly examples include :- They introduced a rule to dictate what size and shape bananas we should eat, also banned the use of high powered hair dryers, vacuums and toasters, banned people from eating their own pet horses but eating other types of horse is perfectly fine, banned traditional British light bulbs, tried to ban the Cornish Pasty etc etc etc. All sound silly but costing UK taxpayers and companies millions of pounds to implement and examples of how they have nothing better to do than interfere in our daily life. Ask British fishermen what they think of EU fishing regulations. Ask British farmers what they think of EU farming directives.
I'm looking forward to going back to buying a pint of beer instead of half a litre, having a speed limit in mph instead of km, and spending £ again instead of the bloody Euro.
Oh hang on a minute- we can opt out anyway.
Referendums are not legally binding, so legally the Government can ignore the results; for example, even if the result of a pre-legislative referendum were a majority of "No" for a proposed law, Parliament could pass it anyway, because parliament is sovereign.
Nothing new at all? How about some ideas to resolve things? I offer three:
1. Parliament has a secret ballot to determine what MPs really want without worrying about how they need to posture.
2. Partition the UK into a leave area and a remain area. Leavers are barred from visiting the remain area (part of the new EU) forever and no trade takes place between leave land and the EU but leave can reap the benefits of their free trade agreements with ROTW.
3. Give everyone who wants to remain an EU passport before some agreed date and allow them the rights of EU citizenry they currently have. Leavers can self identify and continue to enjoy their subject status.
If we make our own laws and regulations, why cant we have better standards than the rest of Europe ?
Thing is, even if they were imposed in the manner you suggest (btw they weren't), they also seem eminently reasonable to me.
I have friends who are farmers, all of whom are ardent remainers. They know that if we leave without a deal, the UK can be swamped with cheaper meat from around the world, where animal welfare is less stringent than here. They all fear for their businesses if we have a no-deal Brexit. Sound good to you?
Who says we can't do that currently?
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