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Thread: Theresa May

  1. #51
    International jon1959's Avatar
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    Re: Theresa May

    Quote Originally Posted by Elwood Blues View Post
    Why is anti Corbyn necessarily anti Labour???
    Because those so-called left leaning papers/magazines have often claimed that Corbyn, Corbynistas, Momentum (except when they like Momentum for challenging what they think Corbyn believes) have taken over or hijacked the Labour Party - and as a result they have called for voters to support the Lib Dems, Greens, Change UK etc.

    The leader and the party don't have to be the same - although in the case of Labour the vast majority of the expanded membership support the leader, even if it is still a minority of MPs - but my point was that the liberal press have equated the leader with the party when trying to influence electoral outcomes.

  2. #52

    Re: Theresa May

    Quote Originally Posted by xsnaggle View Post
    I think you would actually find that most of the BBC are left wingers.
    In their national news output? Kuenssberg - Tory. Norman Smith - Tory. Head of BBC News - Tory. For starters....

  3. #53

    Re: Theresa May

    Quote Originally Posted by life on mars View Post
    It's an interesting one as left leaning folk buy right wing papers ,if they didn't , the Daily Mirror would sell so many more copies,than the Sun.

    Talking to a newsagents recently about selling out of certain papers , he informs me that the shelf supply is driven by the demand .

    I'm sure if a billionaire though could sell 10 million papers a year to a left audience ,I'm sure he would, bugger his politics ,as it's about the money .
    You've taken out of the equation completely the possibility that papers have an agenda to get people to think the way they want.

    I would agree that many don't consider political leanings when they buy a paper. The media will know this. Their job is to peddle what they're told to, or set the agenda their bosses want.

  4. #54
    International jon1959's Avatar
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    Re: Theresa May

    Quote Originally Posted by the other bob wilson View Post
    The notion of a "proper" Labour party after the New Labour phase was an attractive one, but the leadership has shown itself to be weak and too easy a target for the right wing media. There are posters on here whose political views I have plenty of time for who are adamant that antisemitism is not an issue in the Labour party, but my own view is that if there was a genuine will at the top of the party to tackle the issue head on, it would not be the festering sore to the party that it is today. Similarly, the way Labour has tied itself up in knots (mainly because of its leaders views on Europe being at odds with those of the majority of its members and MPs) has seen their "all things to all men" approach bring about a situation, which will, almost certainly, lead to confirmation tomorrow that they are almost an irrelevance as men, and women, desert them in droves - all at a time when it is predicted that the governing party are going to finish fifth in the poll.
    I think the Labour anti-semitism 'crisis' is partly manufactured, although there are clearly some real examples of appalling racism.

    I think the position of Labour as the main opposition with mainly Remain members and MPs, but with a large minority of its (mainly historic) supporters backing Leave was always going to put it in a difficult position - unlike smaller parties who could ignore half the country and adopt a clean position.

    However, I agree that the Labour Party leadership has at times been weak and indecisive. They are very inexperienced, and the leader never wanted the role - although he has since grown into it a bit in that he has stopped offering up as many easy targets for hostile media and internal opponents to shoot at.

    Despite the risk of splitting the Labour Party, the leadership has been fence sitting and watching the Tories implode for too long. A stronger and more experienced opposition would probably have been more effective in 2018. However, that doesn't magic away the parliamentary arithmetic or Theresa May's personality and style.

    Maybe Labour could have damaged her more and brought her to a compromise offer without her own party dumping her? But that could only have been around a 'soft' Brexit (customs union etc.), and would also have risked splitting the Labour Party (even though that may have been in line with conference policy).

  5. #55

    Re: Theresa May

    Quote Originally Posted by xsnaggle View Post
    I think you would actually find that most of the BBC are left wingers.
    How can you know who’s in charge of bbc news and watch bbc news and then think this mate?

  6. #56

    Re: Theresa May

    Quote Originally Posted by Elwood Blues View Post
    Independant? Guardian? Observer? New Statesman
    Centrist paper, the same paper and a weekly magazine ffs

  7. #57

    Re: Theresa May

    Quote Originally Posted by xsnaggle View Post
    Maybe he is seen as dangerous because he is.
    But he is one of them. He has been a politician almost all his life. He was renowned for refusing to toe the leadership line so often, and voted against what the party wanted on more occasions than you could count. He now heads up a leadership cabal that attempts to oust anyone who speaks up against his leadership. witness momentum trying to deselect MPs who oppose his/their ideas.

    He is very dangerous, I just pray that the country never has the opportunity to find out how dangerous.
    Yeah the Labour manifesto in 2017 was really dangerous. Yeah Corbyn was really dangerous to oppose the Iraq War, Syria, Libya etc because they went really well.
    The dangerous ones are the Tories who will shaft the weakest in our society.
    Anyway I look forward to all the names of the lefties in the corridors of power at the BBC.

  8. #58

    Re: Theresa May

    Quote Originally Posted by xsnaggle View Post
    Maybe he is seen as dangerous because he is.
    But he is one of them. He has been a politician almost all his life. He was renowned for refusing to toe the leadership line so often, and voted against what the party wanted on more occasions than you could count. He now heads up a leadership cabal that attempts to oust anyone who speaks up against his leadership. witness momentum trying to deselect MPs who oppose his/their ideas.

    He is very dangerous, I just pray that the country never has the opportunity to find out how dangerous.
    Well said.

  9. #59

    Re: Theresa May

    Corbyn would have to go some to match the chaos caused by the last two incumbents at number 10.

  10. #60
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    Re: Theresa May

    A couple of quotes from people who have worked inside it. But I'm sure people with all the internet skills will be able to find something to argue against it.

    One thing I would say, I never said individuals were biased but that the BBC as an institution is. It is that way by virtue of the people who work there, some of whom think they are more intelligent than the 'masses' who need to be 'guided' and 'educated'.

    https://biasedbbc.org/quotes-of-shame/

  11. #61

    Re: Theresa May

    Quote Originally Posted by xsnaggle View Post
    Maybe he is seen as dangerous because he is.
    But he is one of them. He has been a politician almost all his life. He was renowned for refusing to toe the leadership line so often, and voted against what the party wanted on more occasions than you could count. He now heads up a leadership cabal that attempts to oust anyone who speaks up against his leadership. witness momentum trying to deselect MPs who oppose his/their ideas.

    He is very dangerous, I just pray that the country never has the opportunity to find out how dangerous.
    People have been saying this for years, we have had a general election since Corbyn took over and nobody has been deselected for speaking out against the leadership. What would it take for you to start to doubt your own position?

  12. #62

    Re: Theresa May

    Quote Originally Posted by xsnaggle View Post
    A couple of quotes from people who have worked inside it. But I'm sure people with all the internet skills will be able to find something to argue against it.

    One thing I would say, I never said individuals were biased but that the BBC as an institution is. It is that way by virtue of the people who work there, some of whom think they are more intelligent than the 'masses' who need to be 'guided' and 'educated'.

    https://biasedbbc.org/quotes-of-shame/
    I'm sure anyone could create a list of biased quotes depending on their political colours; there are plenty of people on the left who are exasperated at the BBC's stance at times. Maybe it depends on what you're listening to at the time - The News Quiz or the Today show.

    What's wrong with being 'educated'? Sometimes I watch telly to learn stuff.

  13. #63

    Re: Theresa May

    Quote Originally Posted by xsnaggle View Post
    A couple of quotes from people who have worked inside it. But I'm sure people with all the internet skills will be able to find something to argue against it.

    One thing I would say, I never said individuals were biased but that the BBC as an institution is. It is that way by virtue of the people who work there, some of whom think they are more intelligent than the 'masses' who need to be 'guided' and 'educated'.

    https://biasedbbc.org/quotes-of-shame/
    Don't you think people need to be educated? Seems like quite a sensible approach to me.

  14. #64

    Re: Theresa May

    Quote Originally Posted by Bluebirdman Of Alcathays View Post
    I'm sure anyone could create a list of biased quotes depending on their political colours; there are plenty of people on the left who are exasperated at the BBC's stance at times. Maybe it depends on what you're listening to at the time - The News Quiz or the Today show.

    What's wrong with being 'educated'? Sometimes I watch telly to learn stuff.
    I think this rather proves the point about the BBC's alleged bias

    https://inews.co.uk/culture/televisi...ght-wing-bias/

    It seems that, surprise, surprise the bias is nearly always seen as being in favour of the side that is opposite your own politics - something which may well suggest that the BBC is, broadly, neutral.

  15. #65

    Re: Theresa May

    Quote Originally Posted by jon1959 View Post
    I think the Labour anti-semitism 'crisis' is partly manufactured, although there are clearly some real examples of appalling racism.

    I think the position of Labour as the main opposition with mainly Remain members and MPs, but with a large minority of its (mainly historic) supporters backing Leave was always going to put it in a difficult position - unlike smaller parties who could ignore half the country and adopt a clean position.

    However, I agree that the Labour Party leadership has at times been weak and indecisive. They are very inexperienced, and the leader never wanted the role - although he has since grown into it a bit in that he has stopped offering up as many easy targets for hostile media and internal opponents to shoot at.

    Despite the risk of splitting the Labour Party, the leadership has been fence sitting and watching the Tories implode for too long. A stronger and more experienced opposition would probably have been more effective in 2018. However, that doesn't magic away the parliamentary arithmetic or Theresa May's personality and style.

    Maybe Labour could have damaged her more and brought her to a compromise offer without her own party dumping her? But that could only have been around a 'soft' Brexit (customs union etc.), and would also have risked splitting the Labour Party (even though that may have been in line with conference policy).
    I think that's a fair analysis Jon, but with regard to your last paragraph, I did quite a long post on the politics forum outlining why I believe that Europe is/has been a much bigger problem for the Conservatives than for Labour. While I accept that it would mean losing votes and probably members from the Leave side of the argument, my instinct (admittedly, I'm far from infallible in that department!) is that Labour would handle a change of approach to favour becoming a "remain" party far better than the Tories would and so feel that they are missing a trick so to speak - again, I'm talking instinct here, but it seems to me that the current leader is the biggest obstruction to such a thing happening.

  16. #66

    Re: Theresa May

    Quote Originally Posted by xsnaggle View Post
    A couple of quotes from people who have worked inside it. But I'm sure people with all the internet skills will be able to find something to argue against it.

    One thing I would say, I never said individuals were biased but that the BBC as an institution is. It is that way by virtue of the people who work there, some of whom think they are more intelligent than the 'masses' who need to be 'guided' and 'educated'.

    https://biasedbbc.org/quotes-of-shame/
    Seems like a neutral source there.

  17. #67

    Re: Theresa May

    Would anyone expect a compete scum bag who has opinions like this about the suadi
    Embassy murder to think the bbc was left leaning though? This prick would think farage was a lefty.


    Quote Originally Posted by xsnaggle View Post
    While any mrder is unjustifiable remember that this man knew the risk he was taking as shown by his instruction to his woman, and also that if he was murdered then the murder did not happen in Turkey. He may just as easily have been arrested and renditioned to Saudi Arabia.
    We are told there is proof but no one is rushing to reveal it.

  18. #68
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    Re: Theresa May

    Quote Originally Posted by lardy View Post
    Don't you think people need to be educated? Seems like quite a sensible approach to me.
    I think education is a wonderful thing. The comment about needing to be educated with regard to the people we were discussing was in, "We need to educate these people who obviouskly on't think the same as us, the error of their ways" It didin't mean education in the usual school - college- university way.

  19. #69
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    Re: Theresa May

    Quote Originally Posted by rudy gestede View Post
    Would anyone expect a compete scum bag who has opinions like this about the suadi
    Embassy murder to think the bbc was left leaning though? This prick would think farage was a lefty.
    There you go again with your totally unnecessary and offensive language. Who the feck are you to call anyone a prick or a scumbag you keyboard warrior toss pot?

    You must have wasted some time trawling to find that post mind. It was in the Saudi murder thread ages ago. Couldn't you find anything later?
    And what I said was neither left nor right wing, but a simple fact. The man knew the Saudi's didn't like him (to put it mildly) and he knew that when he entered the Embassy he would be on Saudi sovereign territory, so by extension he knew the risk he was taking. you must have a very twisted view of things to turn that into something you are suggesting.
    you're just an insulting arsehole.

  20. #70

    Re: Theresa May

    Quote Originally Posted by lardy View Post
    Don't you think people need to be educated? Seems like quite a sensible approach to me.
    You certainly need reeducating

  21. #71

    Re: Theresa May

    Quote Originally Posted by xsnaggle View Post
    There you go again with your totally unnecessary and offensive language. Who the feck are you to call anyone a prick or a scumbag you keyboard warrior toss pot?

    You must have wasted some time trawling to find that post mind. It was in the Saudi murder thread ages ago. Couldn't you find anything later?
    And what I said was neither left nor right wing, but a simple fact. The man knew the Saudi's didn't like him (to put it mildly) and he knew that when he entered the Embassy he would be on Saudi sovereign territory, so by extension he knew the risk he was taking. you must have a very twisted view of things to turn that into something you are suggesting.
    you're just an insulting arsehole.
    The moral high ground has been conceded a tad with your own invective.

  22. #72
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    Re: Theresa May

    Quote Originally Posted by Taunton Blue Genie View Post
    The moral high ground has been conceded a tad with your own invective.
    Oh bugger, you spotted it!!!

  23. #73

    Re: Theresa May

    Quote Originally Posted by xsnaggle View Post
    Oh bugger, you spotted it!!!
    You are correct though, this board’s Jeremy’s Corbyn resorts to insults at the drop of a hat. I’ve been insulted and sworn at by him. Luckily for us we are not snowflakes and sticks and stones etc etc. Still he does lose the debate each time he swears at and insults other posters.

  24. #74

    Re: Theresa May

    Quote Originally Posted by BlueArmy 86 View Post
    Tara 👋
    So the Tories are having a third election to appoint a leader, after not being happy with the outcome of the last two.

    Meanwhile, voters are denied a confirmatory vote on Brexit.

  25. #75

    Re: Theresa May

    Quote Originally Posted by Eric the Half a Bee View Post
    So the Tories are having a third election to appoint a leader, after not being happy with the outcome of the last two.

    Meanwhile, voters are denied a confirmatory vote on Brexit.
    Second election to elect a Prime Minister.

    The one before Theresa May was Cameron in 2005!!

    They were happy enough with him for over 10 years and he wasn't pushed but went himself.

    I'm not a great fan of a second referendum but if it was just to confirm the way we leave I could accept it.

    I would not support one if remain was one of the choices

    We've done that.

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