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Thread: Expectations

  1. #31

    Re: Expectations

    As mentioned earlier, Warnock's mantra during our last Championship season was to achieve at least 15 clean sheets. Can our present defense respond to this challenge? Yes, they've done it before - but they are two years older.......

  2. #32

    Re: Expectations

    Quote Originally Posted by the other bob wilson View Post
    Too few replies to come to firm conclusions, but they're certainly suggestive of a higher degree of expectation from the home crowd than there has been at the ground for about five years.
    The Slade years dampened expectations quite dramatically. I think we are back to expectations of Malkys second season.

    Not quite Dave Jones latter years expectations just yet.

  3. #33

    Re: Expectations

    Quote Originally Posted by the other bob wilson View Post
    I want to see what our squad looks like when the window closes before I start thinking about expectation levels, but, as it's always easier to think about these things when it isn't my club involved, I'll say would expect a team with the same sort of profile as us over the past two seasons to finish in the top six.
    I am inclined to think the same way. There are still positions that require strengthening and the current recruitment has only papered some of the cracks.

    Cardiff have signed a GK, CB and 2 CM. Two strikers have returned from loan as well as a CAM who intends to prove himself, with two academy players potentially making the jump to the first team if our American selection is anything to go by.

    When you address what is missing from the first team in comparison to last season's squad, they are weaker in CM with Camarasa, Gunnarsson and Arter gone. And they are also weaker on the wings with Harris gone.

    The recruitment has helped to bolster defence but I think we are all waiting on a breathe of fresh air at right back... Can Coxe provide that?

    Cardiff arguably don't need to recruit another winger with Hoilett, Murphy and NML providing options out wide. But up front the 5 options Zohore, Madine, Bogle, Healey and Ward, hardly inspire confidence. And as far as striker recruitment is concerned I was hoping Cardiff would have secured a new player prior to the trip to US.

    With the window closing prior to the beginning of the season I'm concerned we won't shore up the positions that will help to bolster the squad ahead for a top 6 push.

  4. #34

    Re: Expectations

    Think we will be sniffing around the top six

  5. #35

    Re: Expectations

    Quote Originally Posted by J R Hartley View Post
    He wont have the excuse of "little ol Cardiff" or "Tight budget" excuse that hes enjoyed for much of his tenure here.

    This season is different to the other 2 Championship seasons hes managed us, expectation will be higher and rightly so.

    Weve spent a fortune on the squad by Championship standards.

    Anything less than play-offs will be a failure.
    Don't you just love revisionists. Why let facts get in the way of opinion? I'm not knocking you JRH, just want to state some facts.

    Let's look at the facts.

    Malky Mackay Spending 2012-13 in Champ
    - he inherited just 9 players (3 of those were g/kprs).
    - he spent under £12m in 2 seasons and got promoted
    2011-12: Spent ... £2.84m
    Recouped ... £1.93m
    Debt ... £0.91m debt
    2012-13: Spent ... £13.08m
    Recouped ... £1.54m
    Debt ... £11.54m

    That was a net debt on transfers of £12.45m after inheriting 6 outfield players, gaining promotion in two seasons. Hardly spending badly nor excessive.

    City then won the Championship by EIGHT POINTS and a goal difference of PLUS 27.

    In the 2013-14 PL season Malky spent £45.82m on transfer fees recouping £3.74m during the season; a debt of £42.08m.

    Sunsequently ...
    - Caulker was sold for £10.75m
    - Medel was sold for £8m
    - Mutch was sold for £7.57m
    - Brayford was sold for £2.3m

    I can't see how it was badly spent if we recouped virtually what we paid for the players.

    ... thereby recouping £28.62m and making a spend of £13.46m on players Malky signed for the PL campaign.


    This makes a net outlay of £25.91m for his two and a half seasons. Not bad when inheriting just 6 outfield players.

    Much is written about the Cornelius fiasco despite being injured for 5 of his 6 months at City. The signing of Madine has been far worse considering he's been fit yet hasn't look like scoring a goal for the first team or reserves. Yes, we lost £5m on Cornelius yet no-one says a word about Mutch. Malky signed for him £1.25m yet was sold for 4 times that.

    ****
    Fees as per: https://www.transfermarkt.com/cardif...ers/verein/603

    StT.
    <><

  6. #36

    Re: Expectations

    Quote Originally Posted by Steve the Tea View Post
    Don't you just love revisionists. Why let facts get in the way of opinion? I'm not knocking you JRH, just want to state some facts.

    Let's look at the facts.

    Malky Mackay Spending 2012-13 in Champ
    - he inherited just 9 players (3 of those were g/kprs).
    - he spent under £12m in 2 seasons and got promoted
    2011-12: Spent ... £2.84m
    Recouped ... £1.93m
    Debt ... £0.91m debt
    2012-13: Spent ... £13.08m
    Recouped ... £1.54m
    Debt ... £11.54m

    That was a net debt on transfers of £12.45m after inheriting 6 outfield players, gaining promotion in two seasons. Hardly spending badly nor excessive.

    City then won the Championship by EIGHT POINTS and a goal difference of PLUS 27.

    In the 2013-14 PL season Malky spent £45.82m on transfer fees recouping £3.74m during the season; a debt of £42.08m.

    Sunsequently ...
    - Caulker was sold for £10.75m
    - Medel was sold for £8m
    - Mutch was sold for £7.57m
    - Brayford was sold for £2.3m

    I can't see how it was badly spent if we recouped virtually what we paid for the players.

    ... thereby recouping £28.62m and making a spend of £13.46m on players Malky signed for the PL campaign.


    This makes a net outlay of £25.91m for his two and a half seasons. Not bad when inheriting just 6 outfield players.

    Much is written about the Cornelius fiasco despite being injured for 5 of his 6 months at City. The signing of Madine has been far worse considering he's been fit yet hasn't look like scoring a goal for the first team or reserves. Yes, we lost £5m on Cornelius yet no-one says a word about Mutch. Malky signed for him £1.25m yet was sold for 4 times that.

    ****
    Fees as per: https://www.transfermarkt.com/cardif...ers/verein/603

    StT.
    <><
    Sorry, but what the hell has all that got to do with my post that you’ve quoted?

    What have I revised exactly?

    I’m talking about Warnock not Malky???

  7. #37

    Re: Expectations

    I'll answer this by saying what were Stoke's expectations this time last year

  8. #38

    Re: Expectations

    I expect us to make long term improvements to the club. This is the final year of the Warnock project and starting everything over (as we did when we went from DJ to Malky, or Malky to Ole, or.....anyone before Warnock arrived really) will not be good enough. For me that means that we can have a slightly disappointing season on the pitch as long as things take a big step forward in other ways, but realistically I would be calling finishing in the top half only as slightly disappointing whereas anything below that would be very disappointing.

  9. #39

    Re: Expectations

    Quote Originally Posted by Chris Pontprennau Blues View Post
    I'll answer this by saying what were Stoke's expectations this time last year
    Stoke had just spent 10 years in the EPL. Almost all of our squad were playing in the Championship two years ago. Plus we have a Championship specialist at the helm.

  10. #40

    Re: Expectations

    Quote Originally Posted by Pedro de la Rosa View Post
    That's not what you said though.

    Yes it is.
    In short I suggested that we must have an intent rather than some vague and general hope of scraping in.
    Well you quite rightly implied that it might not quite turn out like that and I agreed with you that an intent isn't the same as a guarantee, but my point remains that we must be grimly determined to come first.

  11. #41

    Re: Expectations

    We need another 2 center midfielders and possibly another striker and I would hope top two. Playoffs minim , but definitely those midfielders

  12. #42

    Re: Expectations

    Purely because we expect to do ok and this is the Championship I confidently predict we'll come 16th.

  13. #43

    Re: Expectations

    I expect a 3rd to 6th place finish and an appearance at the Championship Play-Off Final on May 25 next year. It's why I took odds of 6-4 for a top 6 spot and have booked a 4-night stay at a Londonistan hotel which encompasses that date. 90%+ of this faith is centred on our Neil's stewardship.

  14. #44

    Re: Expectations

    Where do you think the bookies will have us? 4th or 5th favourite?

  15. #45

    Re: Expectations

    Quote Originally Posted by Steve the Tea View Post
    Don't you just love revisionists. Why let facts get in the way of opinion? I'm not knocking you JRH, just want to state some facts.

    Let's look at the facts.

    Malky Mackay Spending 2012-13 in Champ
    - he inherited just 9 players (3 of those were g/kprs).
    - he spent under £12m in 2 seasons and got promoted
    2011-12: Spent ... £2.84m
    Recouped ... £1.93m
    Debt ... £0.91m debt
    2012-13: Spent ... £13.08m
    Recouped ... £1.54m
    Debt ... £11.54m

    That was a net debt on transfers of £12.45m after inheriting 6 outfield players, gaining promotion in two seasons. Hardly spending badly nor excessive.

    City then won the Championship by EIGHT POINTS and a goal difference of PLUS 27.

    In the 2013-14 PL season Malky spent £45.82m on transfer fees recouping £3.74m during the season; a debt of £42.08m.

    Sunsequently ...
    - Caulker was sold for £10.75m
    - Medel was sold for £8m
    - Mutch was sold for £7.57m
    - Brayford was sold for £2.3m

    I can't see how it was badly spent if we recouped virtually what we paid for the players.

    ... thereby recouping £28.62m and making a spend of £13.46m on players Malky signed for the PL campaign.


    This makes a net outlay of £25.91m for his two and a half seasons. Not bad when inheriting just 6 outfield players.

    Much is written about the Cornelius fiasco despite being injured for 5 of his 6 months at City. The signing of Madine has been far worse considering he's been fit yet hasn't look like scoring a goal for the first team or reserves. Yes, we lost £5m on Cornelius yet no-one says a word about Mutch. Malky signed for him £1.25m yet was sold for 4 times that.

    ****
    Fees as per: https://www.transfermarkt.com/cardif...ers/verein/603

    StT.
    <><
    I think under malky we had a very high wages to turnover ratio, so we were very much gambling at the time

  16. #46

    Re: Expectations

    Quote Originally Posted by Rjk View Post
    Where do you think the bookies will have us? 4th or 5th favourite?
    3rd fave behind Leeds and Fulham. I recommended in a post here to take City at 6-4 the other day at Skybet as the odds were mispriced. Best available anywhere now for top 6 is 11-10.

  17. #47

    Re: Expectations

    I've read plenty of comments on here bizarrely suggesting that players who won automatic promotion 2 years ago are good enough for a promotion bid, especially if we strengthen. If only football was that simple. Every season some players do better than you expect. Every season some do worse. We have no idea what relegation will do to each individual. We were a bit of an unknown quantity 2 years ago, now our tactics and formations will be expected by opposition teams. There's also added pressure of being expected to have a good season and us being a scalp

  18. #48

    Re: Expectations

    Quote Originally Posted by Rjk View Post
    Where do you think the bookies will have us? 4th or 5th favourite?
    They have us joint third behind Fulham and Leeds.

  19. #49

    Re: Expectations

    Quote Originally Posted by Eric the Half a Bee View Post
    I've read plenty of comments on here bizarrely suggesting that players who won automatic promotion 2 years ago are good enough for a promotion bid, especially if we strengthen. If only football was that simple. Every season some players do better than you expect. Every season some do worse. We have no idea what relegation will do to each individual. We were a bit of an unknown quantity 2 years ago, now our tactics and formations will be expected by opposition teams. There's also added pressure of being expected to have a good season and us being a scalp
    I wouldn’t call it bizarre considering the bookies have us as 3rd favourites.

    I agree though I think we’ll find it tougher next season and I reckon we might come up a bit short.

  20. #50

    Re: Expectations

    Quote Originally Posted by Baloo View Post
    I wouldn’t call it bizarre considering the bookies have us as 3rd favourites.

    I agree though I think we’ll find it tougher next season and I reckon we might come up a bit short.
    Bookies often get this division quite wrong, so I'll stick with bizarre. I'm sure it will be a lot tougher than 2 years ago.

  21. #51

    Re: Expectations

    Quote Originally Posted by Eric the Half a Bee View Post
    Bookies often get this division quite wrong, so I'll stick with bizarre. I'm sure it will be a lot tougher than 2 years ago.
    I know they do. But I think there is still a basis for people to think we’ll do well that can hardly be described as strange. Anyway, I think we’re agreeing it will be tougher this time around.

  22. #52

    Re: Expectations

    Quote Originally Posted by Baloo View Post
    I know they do. But I think there is still a basis for people to think we’ll do well that can hardly be described as strange. Anyway, I think we’re agreeing it will be tougher this time around.

  23. #53

    Re: Expectations

    Quote Originally Posted by NYCBlue View Post
    They have us joint third behind Fulham and Leeds.
    Don't write off WBA

    Since 2001 they have not finished outside the top six of the Championship, either automaticaly promoted, in the play offs or in the Premier League.

  24. #54

    Re: Expectations

    Quote Originally Posted by Michael Morris View Post
    Don't write off WBA

    Since 2001 they have not finished outside the top six of the Championship, either automaticaly promoted, in the play offs or in the Premier League.
    STAT!

  25. #55

    Re: Expectations

    Quote Originally Posted by Michael Morris View Post
    Don't write off WBA

    Since 2001 they have not finished outside the top six of the Championship, either automaticaly promoted, in the play offs or in the Premier League.
    That's who were joint third with.

  26. #56

    Re: Expectations

    Where are Fulham in the odds? I think with a striker like Mitrovic they are always going to be there or there abouts in this league.

  27. #57

    Re: Expectations

    Quote Originally Posted by Eric the Half a Bee View Post
    Bookies often get this division quite wrong, so I'll stick with bizarre. I'm sure it will be a lot tougher than 2 years ago.
    People always say this though, it's either the weakest division in a while, or the strongest (as it appears now). Personally, it's always a crazy division but the quality is about the same. It's going to be really tough but we've got a side we know can get promoted. That's not saying they will but with smart additions we should be in a position to challenge and I think that's the expectation.

  28. #58

    Re: Expectations

    Quote Originally Posted by RonnieBird View Post
    Yes it is.
    In short I suggested that we must have an intent rather than some vague and general hope of scraping in.
    Well you quite rightly implied that it might not quite turn out like that and I agreed with you that an intent isn't the same as a guarantee, but my point remains that we must be grimly determined to come first.
    Quote Originally Posted by RonnieBird View Post
    My expectation therefore is that we can and must win this league outright and anything less is unacceptable.
    That reads as saying finishing in 2nd place is unacceptable, which is why I got a few cheap laughs.

  29. #59

    Re: Expectations

    Quote Originally Posted by Croesy Blue View Post
    Where are Fulham in the odds? I think with a striker like Mitrovic they are always going to be there or there abouts in this league.
    2nd favourites behind Leeds, who are selling a lot of key players. Something isn't right at Elland Road if you ask me! Cue massive promotion push and a 100+ points tally. Although, I did call they'd burn out last season and I think a similar story will happen this year.

  30. #60

    Re: Expectations

    Quote Originally Posted by Pedro de la Rosa View Post
    2nd favourites behind Leeds, who are selling a lot of key players. Something isn't right at Elland Road if you ask me! Cue massive promotion push and a 100+ points tally. Although, I did call they'd burn out last season and I think a similar story will happen this year.
    https://www.football365.com/news/lee...ely-by-default

    This is a very good article on it, only bit I didn't like was

    while Cardiff City will surely not overachieve so emphatically again

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