Tomlin

[Jimmy the Jock]

How did he play today? For anyone who watched the game..

Everything good came through him . Blackburn’s defence was cut open time and time again by his passes .
After he went off we never made another chance of note , we just huffed and puffed.Blackburn actually came into the game and made a few chances of their own .
Ok so some of us are giving marks for the ability to run around energetically for 90 minutes “ hard working “ ..... we seem to have quite a few of that sort , not sure you can win football matches without players who can actually play football with a degree of skill .
Tomlin can play football , I will take his 60 minutes every game .

[J R Hartley]

Everything good came through him . Blackburn’s defence was cut open time and time again by his passes .
After he went off we never made another chance of note , we just huffed and puffed.Blackburn actually came into the game and made a few chances of their own .
Ok so some of us are giving marks for the ability to run around energetically for 90 minutes “ hard working “ ..... we seem to have quite a few of that sort , not sure you can win football matches without players who can actually play football with a degree of skill .
Tomlin can play football , I will take his 60 minutes every game .

This. Every time.

[Lawnmower]

He is match fit, for 60 minutes.

It’s more about match sharp.
The instinctive stuff is great from him on the ball, but he’s having to work harder off it because he’s just slightly behind in his thinking.

Fitness is a funny thing, I dragged a 20 year old gym monkey ‘semi-pro’ rugby player to 5s a few months back and he was blowing through his arse.

Similar in my early 20s I had a season of playing rugby . I could run forever on a football pitch , but was throwing my guts up at the end of rugby training.


Tomlin’s ‘gastric illness’ wouldn’t have helped, but also a lot of it may also be mental


Finally, at 30 he’s probably just past his peak, so from now on he may never be a consistent 90 minute player in the role he’s playing.

[sneggyblubird]

Losing weight and core fitness are entirely different things.For whatever reason he hasn't trained or played properly for a long time.Given an extended run in the side and a proper training regime suited to his situation will eventually see him last the 90.This is what the gaffer was on about when he said "its up to him".As someone else said I'd have him for an hour any day at the moment but to use a boxing parlance if he smashes it too much in training he runs the risk of "leaving it all in the gym" on matchday.

[The Lone Gunman]

Losing weight and core fitness are entirely different things.For whatever reason he hasn't trained or played properly for a long time.

Tomlin made more appearances for Peterborough during the second half of last season than a number of the current squad made for City. I thought he'd also been playing games for the under-23's pre-season and he played in the friendly against Nice.

I hope I'm wrong as Tomlin's an entertaining player to watch (something most of the present team sadly aren't), but I just don't think he has it in him to play regular full games at this level. I don't think Warnock trusts him at all either, so I wouldn't be banking on seeing too much of him in the coming months.

[thehumblegringo]

I'm with those who believe he's just a bit behind on his match fitness and that he's never been gifted with athletic qualities.

The fact is though, what choice do we have? He's the only player in the squad with the speed of thought and understanding of the game to do something different.

[dembethewarrior]

I'm not an expert on Lee Tomlin either. However, the evidence of his statistics during the last three seasons do suggest that he rarely lasts a full game. During his first spell in City's team in 2017 he completed a full ninety minutes on just three occasions, and they were all cup matches against sides from lower divisions. Meanwhile, at Peterborough this year he started sixteen games but finished just two.

He wasn’t fit then.

He is fit now.

Just not match fit.

Can’t keep going round in circles.

[The Lone Gunman]

He wasn’t fit then.

He is fit now.

Just not match fit.

Can’t keep going round in circles.

I bow to your considerably greater knowledge.

[MacAdder]

Tomlin had a great chance from a free kick late in the game where, not only did he not even test the wall never mind the keeper with his tired effort, he clumsily fouled the defender straight after the block and got booked.
That summed Tomlin up for me.

Yes, everybody knows he has ability that many pro footballers only dream of, but the glimpses of his talents are very few and far between.

The guy is living on past glories and though he may occasionally show something a bit different, we see these people all the time at various levels.
IMHO he is playing above his level. A level where stamina is key.

Impact player when we need something different who can still play a big part this season but I concur with a previous post, the messiah he certainly is not.

[Jimmy the Jock]

Tomlin had a great chance from a free kick late in the game where, not only did he not even test the wall never mind the keeper with his tired effort, he clumsily fouled the defender straight after the block and got booked.
That summed Tomlin up for me.

Yes, everybody knows he has ability that many pro footballers only dream of, but the glimpses of his talents are very few and far between.

The guy is living on past glories and though he may occasionally show something a bit different, we see these people all the time at various levels.
IMHO he is playing above his level. A level where stamina is key.

Impact player when we need something different who can still play a big part this season but I concur with a previous post, the messiah he certainly is not.

It was a free kick just outside the box , hardly a great chance.....
He did indeed fluff his lines though and shortly after he was hauled off. He was knackered , I cant argue with others who state he doesn't last the pace , what I see though is a game changer when he is on , no matter the level, he is a game changer , a unique footballer that every side needs .
Perhaps running around the pitch like a headless chicken to impress Warnocks draconian style is a waste of his talents, its certainly a waste of his limited energy.

[J R Hartley]

Tomlin had a great chance from a free kick late in the game where, not only did he not even test the wall never mind the keeper with his tired effort, he clumsily fouled the defender straight after the block and got booked.
That summed Tomlin up for me.

Yes, everybody knows he has ability that many pro footballers only dream of, but the glimpses of his talents are very few and far between.

The guy is living on past glories and though he may occasionally show something a bit different, we see these people all the time at various levels.
IMHO he is playing above his level. A level where stamina is key.

Impact player when we need something different who can still play a big part this season but I concur with a previous post, the messiah he certainly is not.

Players hits the wall from a free kick. Sell him. Hes useless. Its not like Messi or Ronaldo have ever hit a wall from a free kick now is it?

[Tuerto]

He wasn’t fit then.

He is fit now.

Just not match fit.

Can’t keep going round in circles.

The thing is we don't really know whether this is as fit as he gets or whether he does suffer with his stamina. I suppose time will tell if he's given a run of games. I've noticed that Tomlin does buzz about alot, making runs and supporting the player with the ball, in fact he's quite unique in our team in that he passes and moves, i suspect that takes alot out of him. You can see that he goes hard for the first 30 minutes, maybe that's an instruction from the manager due to his stamina issues, mybe Tomlin is aware of it and decides to give everything while he can. I'd be surprised if we saw Tomlin play consistently for a full 90 minutes, he'd have to make up alot of fitness to sustain his style of play for another 30 minutes. Here's hopling though.

[dembethewarrior]

I bow to your considerably greater knowledge.

Opinion.

Thanks.

[The Lone Gunman]

Opinion.

Thanks.

Ah, an opinion, although stated in the style of a fact.

Thanks.

[William Treseder]

Reading this thread, reminds me of how lucky we were to have a player of Whittinghams ability and durability for so many seasons.
I tend to agree with TLG. As good as Tomlin can be at times, I don’t think we’ll ever see a full 90 mins in a City shirt.

[dembethewarrior]

Ah, an opinion, although stated in the style of a fact.

Thanks.

If you insist.

Noticed you can’t be wrong.

[dembethewarrior]

what I see though is a game changer when he is on , no matter the level, he is a game changer , a unique footballer that every side needs .
Perhaps running around the pitch like a headless chicken to impress Warnocks draconian style is a waste of his talents, its certainly a waste of his limited energy.

What he said

[William Treseder]

It was a free kick just outside the box , hardly a great chance.....
He did indeed fluff his lines though and shortly after he was hauled off. He was knackered , I cant argue with others who state he doesn't last the pace , what I see though is a game changer when he is on , no matter the level, he is a game changer , a unique footballer that every side needs .
Perhaps running around the pitch like a headless chicken to impress Warnocks draconian style is a waste of his talents, its certainly a waste of his limited energy.

Agree to a certain extent, but a decent midfielder in the mould of Tomlin, who can spray about defence splitting passes, and hold on to the ball when needed, expends less energy than any of his team mates except the keeper.
Surely it’s not too much to ask, to get one that can see out a whole game?

[J R Hartley]

Agree to a certain extent, but a decent midfielder in the mould of Tomlin, who can spray about defence splitting passes, and hold on to the ball when needed, expends less energy than any of his team mates except the keeper.
Surely it’s not too much to ask, to get one that can see out a whole game?

How do they expand less energy? A player in his position has to be constantly on the move looking to receive the ball and join the attack.

Pack, when fit, is the player who should be picking the ball up off the defence and spraying it like you described. Not the attacking midfielder who has to link with the midfield and the forwards do constantly on the move.

[J R Hartley]

If Lee Tomlin could charge around a football field like a headless chicken for 90 minutes with his undoubted technical ability he wouldn’t be playing for Cardiff City.

As someone had already said losing weight and being match sharp / fit are completely different.

He hasn’t had a proper pre season either, not featured as much as the others, and then struck down with illness.

Hopefully the more games he gets under his belt his stamina will pick up.

Look at Paterson, he hasn’t had a proper pre season and it’s showed. He’s been awful in every game he’s played so far and unlike Tomlin he doesn’t have the technical ability to fall back on when he can’t put in a full shift.

Give me a 60 minute Tomlin over a trier like Paterson any day.

[The Lone Gunman]

If Lee Tomlin could charge around a football field like a headless chicken for 90 minutes with his undoubted technical ability he wouldn’t be playing for Cardiff City.

I don't think anyone has suggested Tomlin should charge around the field like a headless chicken for ninety minutes. Based on the evidence of recent seasons, his ability to last ninety minutes under any circumstances is questionable, but I guess we'll see if he can during the coming weeks provided Warnock gives him a run in the side.

[J R Hartley]

I don't think anyone has suggested Tomlin should charge around the field like a headless chicken for ninety minutes. Based on the evidence of recent seasons, his ability to last ninety minutes under any circumstances is questionable, but I guess we'll see if he can during the coming weeks provided Warnock gives him a run in the side.

Well its hardly a secret that hes had his problems, most of them his own doing, and by his own admission he has not lived the life of a professional athlete. Six months without playing competetive football when he went on loan to Peterborough so its not really a surprise he was lacking fitness and wasnt playing 90 minutes week in, week out for them,.

The penny has finally dropped with him it seems but is it too late at 30? Probably, but id prefer he was given one last chance to prove himself because hes one of the few players weve got playing for us who can excite the fans.

Weve got more than enough water carriers in the team to accommodate him in my opinion.

Only at Cardiff City it seems the fans prefer players who can compete and run about than someone with skill. I dont know if its from spending so many years in the dungeon its made our fans that way but for as long as I can remember the triers get more plaudits than the players who can turn a game.

Here are some examples over the years ive been supporting Cardiff.

Gareth Stoker > Jason Fowler
Gareth Ainsworth > Jason Bowen
Gavin Rae > Stephen Mcphail
Aron Gunnarson / Don Cowie > Peter Whittingham
Callum Paterson > Lee Tomlin / Bobby Reid

And my personal favourite Alex Revell > Kenwynne Jones

Jay Bothroyd is the best all round striker ive seen play for City but he used to get dogs abuse from our own fans for being lazy and not running about like a headless chicken. If he he had the stamina to do that added to the other qualities in his game he wouldnt have been anywhere near the Championship.

Sometimes youve just got to admit that players at this level have their flaws, and unfortunately stamina is one of the flaws of Tomlins game.

[surge]

Well its hardly a secret that hes had his problems, most of them his own doing, and by his own admission he has not lived the life of a professional athlete. Six months without playing competetive football when he went on loan to Peterborough so its not really a surprise he was lacking fitness and wasnt playing 90 minutes week in, week out for them,.

The penny has finally dropped with him it seems but is it too late at 30? Probably, but id prefer he was given one last chance to prove himself because hes one of the few players weve got playing for us who can excite the fans.

Weve got more than enough water carriers in the team to accommodate him in my opinion.

Only at Cardiff City it seems the fans prefer players who can compete and run about than someone with skill. I dont know if its from spending so many years in the dungeon its made our fans that way but for as long as I can remember the triers get more plaudits than the players who can turn a game.

Here are some examples over the years ive been supporting Cardiff.

Gareth Stoker > Jason Fowler
Gareth Ainsworth > Jason Bowen
Gavin Rae > Stephen Mcphail
Aron Gunnarson / Don Cowie > Peter Whittingham
Callum Paterson > Lee Tomlin / Bobby Reid

And my personal favourite Alex Revell > Kenwynne Jones

Jay Bothroyd is the best all round striker ive seen play for City but he used to get dogs abuse from our own fans for being lazy and not running about like a headless chicken. If he he had the stamina to do that added to the other qualities in his game he wouldnt have been anywhere near the Championship.

Sometimes youve just got to admit that players at this level have their flaws, and unfortunately stamina is one of the flaws of Tomlins game.

I think you've crammed in examples to make your point whether they are accurate or not. McPhail may have been judged far too harshly before news of his health condition broke but cannot remember Gavin Rae being supported that keenly, Peter Whittingham was definitely favoured over Don Cowie, and Alex Revell was never a fan favourite but Kenwynne Jones got his name sung much more than most at the time. Arguably, we should favour Paterson over Tomlin (hasn't done anything yet) and Reid (just a bad fit for this team and made it known when trying to engineer a move away) based on their contributions to the side alone.

Considering how fans took to Camarasa and have taken to Tomlin this year I'm not sure it's accurate to say we totally favour effort over skill. I think what gets these players support is that they look like they care whereas a player like Bacuna sometimes looks far too relaxed and is judged too harshly for this reason, although Gavin Whyte clearly cares and is the other player getting criticised far too harshly also.

It's far too simple to say it's activity over skills for City fans. I think it's seeing players care that gets support and it's just easier to see that with those maximising their limited talents over those who aren't or whose talents are harder to see by the average football fan - at least the average football fan before technology and better punditry made us more aware of what skill and tactics are.

[Tuerto]

I think you've crammed in examples to make your point whether they are accurate or not. McPhail may have been judged far too harshly before news of his health condition broke but cannot remember Gavin Rae being supported that keenly, Peter Whittingham was definitely favoured over Don Cowie, and Alex Revell was never a fan favourite but Kenwynne Jones got his name sung much more than most at the time. Arguably, we should favour Paterson over Tomlin (hasn't done anything yet) and Reid (just a bad fit for this team and made it known when trying to engineer a move away) based on their contributions to the side alone.

Considering how fans took to Camarasa and have taken to Tomlin this year I'm not sure it's accurate to say we totally favour effort over skill. I think what gets these players support is that they look like they care whereas a player like Bacuna sometimes looks far too relaxed and is judged too harshly for this reason, although Gavin Whyte clearly cares and is the other player getting criticised far too harshly also.

It's far too simple to say it's activity over skills for City fans. I think it's seeing players care that gets support and it's just easier to see that with those maximising their limited talents over those who aren't or whose talents are harder to see by the average football fan - at least the average football fan before technology and better punditry made us more aware of what skill and tactics are.

Good post. I think that alot of City fans see a plyer or a manager in their own mold or make the comparison on what they would give out on the pitch because none of us are very good at football. One of the best bits of individual skill i've ever seen from a City player was Bellamy's check back for his goal against Swansea away, fooling the fullback into thinking that he was continuing his run but giving himself enough time and space to get the shot in. For me it was better than the goal.

[Ribeye]

listened to game yesterday but not watched it. Would Tomlin be better used as a 65 70 minute sub when defenders are getting mentally and physically tired?