Reply With QuoteOr the Reading play off semiOriginally Posted by Hilts
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We were shyte, as usual. Just as well M'boro were useless.
Or the Reading play off semi
Or even Reading away a few weeks ago
Yes, I enjoyed today's game and thought we played some of the best football we have managed this season.
I know it's not good and we need to learn how to score goals but it really wasn't that bad compared to many games I have seen
I thought we were better v Huddersfield, but that was more Warnock like today. Looked solid and in control without actually getting anything serious on target !
You obviously weren't at the cup game against Weymouth.
You’re way off the mark, I’ve been there for my team since 1962 and I’ve witnessed some shite but today was nowhere near the worst. I’d have a different opinion had I been a Middlesbrough fan though, they were appalling.
Think the manager can be blamed for that, he’s trying to get his team to play tippy tapper when they clearly can’t - and unless he changes 6 or 7 of them they never will.
Man for man they have a decent ( if ageing) squad, but t appears that Woodgate is another deluded by the ‘there is only one way to play football ‘ nonsense.
By the way - that would be us if we tried to play that way with the squad we’ve got.
He’ll be gone by Christmas
Who are the other people who are deluded into thinking that there is only one way to play football, Must be people you know as nobody on here is asking for 'Tippy Tappy' I've said it hundreds of times. fans just want some balance, and when we do go long, there is some method involved, because at the moment there is none. If people want to watch us aimlessley boot the ball forward and bypass the midfield or watch our wingers recieve the ball without any support and then have to run with the ball like an 11 year old at Pontcanna Fields then good for them. I don't and I'm getting increasingly more frustrated at having to watch the shit that Warnock churns out, It isn't football, it's a refusal to engage the opposition. Can't wait umtil he's gone.
It’s everywhere.
Boro are a great e ample of a team trying to play a bit of it and failing.
Huddersfield also poor
Stoke have tried to change in the last few years and are a shadow of what they were
Luton were a bit better, but created nothing
Fulham also were great in their own half but produced very little from it
I’m not saying we should whack it up every time, in fact at times yesterday and against Huddersfield and Luton we played some good football, particularly on the counter.
I just wish there wasn’t this obsession with passing stats and a perception that that is the only way to play.
What suits our players is to be organised and attack quickly and utilise the pace we have, not 40 passes around a back 4 and keeper where only one player is comfortable on the ball
You say we bypass the midfield, so why is it that Joe Ralls is regularly the top passer in the opposition half ( from both teams) ?
What we don’t do is the vanity project of pointless sideways and back passed around our own box
Why are you citing other teams and how they play, We are not them and i and many others don't want to play like them or have any interest in what they do. It's about what we do. I notice that you don't raise any of our failings and just reference how we could end up by talking about other clubs, that's not progressive in my opinion.
We do bypass the midfield on loads of occasions, Joe Ralls is a pivot and likes to offload the ball, he sits pretty deep and generally gives the ball to the next player who is going to whack the ball down the line. I'd be interested to know what our stats are in the final third. Like i've said a million times, i don't think that anyone wants us to knock the ball about the back for 100 passes or are obsessed with passing stats, the only person to bring that up is you. What some people want is some composure and thought. We can play with wingers and we can be direct at times but there has to be some method instead of the lottery football we have to witness week after week. Our fullbacks don't even support the wide players and they're often isolated. Nothing is rolled into the striker, two fullbacks who have to man mark and zero adventure from our midfield, add to that those stupid long throws.
I’m citing other teams as an example of what could happen to us if we decided to bin off Warnock and bring in a ‘young manager who wants to play football the ‘so called’ right way’
You know that anyway.
In terms of supporting the wingers then today isn’t a great day to be criticising that as Joe Bennett got forward quite a lot today, especially after Hoillet came on - maybe he felt more comfortable doing it with him there. Far more than previous games
Peltier just isn’t the player for that -however defensively he was excellent and in a 1-0 win that is all important.
This side will stick to what they do best and right now after a mediocre start and massive disruption it’s only points that matter.
If very very much doubt that if we starting having 51% possession and passing it around a bit better that the supporters in general would be happy if we lost.
Clearly we can be better, and if you think I’m completely happy then you are wrong. Some variation in our game might actually make it more effective when we do go direct, however it’s interesting to watch the reactions when we do try different things and they don’t come off 😂
At the moment I see our biggest issues as being
- poor decision making around the box and finishing
- a weakness in the middle in defence when teams run at us, this does seem to be improving
- a lack of a settled side ( improving a little)
- quality of ball into the box
Probably the only one of those 4 which would be improved by a change in tactics would be that 4th one. You’d have to temper that then by the fact the game will be played more in our half.
I just don’t think it’s that simple to change how you play - it has to be a long term plan which is embedded from top to bottom in your club and you have to be ready to accept several seasons on failure before you get the rewards. We just aren’t ready for that- best chance was missed 5-6 years ago when we had 4 seasons of parachute money available.
Now, I’m afraid the pragmatic reality is if we want to compete we need success in the next 2 seasons.
and I’m certainly not making it up about an obsession with playing the game one way. It’s everywhere - and it does my head in to be honest. I’ve always loved the variety in football from Barca to Wimbledon and I loved how Wimbledon were able to match the best by mixing it up. It means football is there for all - not just the ‘fancy Dan’s’ ( no pun intended), but the workhorses and lanky awkward Centre half’s who needed 3 touches to control the ball but could slide tackle a player from 10 yards and rise at a corner to score a late winner.
Fast losing my love for the game ( if it wasn’t for City I doubt I’d be interested apart from playing) so much so that I watched my first 10 minutes of prem footy yesterday with Newcastle v Brighton - and that was worse than our game !! Highlight was seeing Andy Carroll back 😂
Hear hear, what we play is anti-football.
Its ugly and at times embarrassing.
I can't wait for the day that we play two up front to give the poor sod who's playing there some help.
I don't think that things will change under Warnock, infact they wont change, it's what he's done for the best part of his career. I don't think that we can rely on the type of football we are seeing, it's short term and has no longevity. I'm not intersted in passing the ball about for the sake of it either, i want to be entertained as well. I find it hugely frustrating when after the second pass there is no option or outlet, a lack of movement, everything through the wingers which is as basic as it comes. Any good fullback can adjust or isolate a wide player, if they're struggling then they can call a central defender over or stop the source of supply.That's why our wingers look decent for 25 minutes then fade into obscurity because pace isn't enough.
I agree about how we play in the final third. There's no composure, no willing runners as Warnock is all about shape. I don't know if Glatzel can play or not because he hasn't had a ball rolled into him, he gets no support from midfield and moreoften than not he's the only player in the box when the ball is delivered. If we are going to play in the way that e do then we must support the man on the ball although that would mean that Warnock loses his 'shape' and i don't think that he trusts us against teams who can break quickly, especially with Bamba out and Manga gone.
The worst thing for me is our willingness to concede possession, bung the ball up and make it 50 50, it's an admission that we can't play or are unwilling to do so.
I agree with you about movement and that is frustrating, often it seemed recently that Ralls was the only one actually offering himself for the short ball and when he got it all he could see was the backs of 4 players in a line 20 yards out - all marked.
Then he’d get criticised for not keeping possession.
That got better when Grujic came in and latterly when Pack arrived, was a little better yesterday with Bacuna, although I don’t see that as his game.
Hopefully when Pack is back we will see the midfield settle as him Ralls and one other.
Who that is I don’t know.
I guess lots would like it to be Tomlin, but I don’t know. I still can’t see him being more than an impact player.
Bacuna is the man in form, but how would the 3 line up then ?
Paterson is probably the favourite, but he’s not playing well and besides, I don’t see him as a midfielder ( or no 10) If he’s going to play I’d rather sacrifice a winger and if you are going to knock it long have him jumping against a full back and heading it across rather than flicking on which favours the defenders and keeper. He will also stop the full back getting forward . On the other hand I think Whyte deserves to keep his place and all 3 other wingers have a claim to start. So not an easy decision.
He’ll probably end up as our striker 😂
At the moment we just need to accumulate some more points and if we do then I think performances will improve as players settle in and the side becomes more consistent. Probably never to the levels you’d like and unlikely to be playing the football you want, but more effective.
Tomlin is finished in my opinion. I don't even think that he's that good anyway. He likes to take a touch and he does follow his pass in support but i can't see anything else that gets me enthused about his game.
are you thinking of the game that ended 2-7
It was so bad that it was actually funny.
I wasn’t at the game yesterday but I think that some perspective may be in order here.
Noticed Huddersfield have now adopted a model very close to ours with more emphasis on shape and formation than passing prettily back and forth until someone takes it off them and scores. Campbell is pretty isolated - one midfielder (O'Brien) in support of 2 wide players - very often when WBA have the ball there are 9 players in the box.
Strangely enough their fans are a lot more appreciative of their new approach on 'Down at the Mac' as its a results based business funnily enough Fulham fans are getting peeved off with their possession at all costs approach too
Maybe we'll be back in fashion soon.......
I think they made us look better than we were. Their no. 11 Fletcher must have had a bet on us winning 1-0. After he scored he seemed to lose interest in the game, the number of errors they made speaks volumes for how bad they were. Better teams would have ripped us apart.
Were you at the Vs Boro game in 2011(0-3) Now that WAS feckin dire.
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