Coronavirus update - NO MORE RESTRICTIONS

[Organ Morgan.]

Farage was an MP once. He "spoke his mind" a lot too. I wouldn't have given him any credence had he still been an MP and came up with something like this as... How the f**k would he know what percentage of people dying actually died of Covid-19 or other causes? He wouldn't. Neither does this guy.

The End.

How would he know? He wouldn't. But the Italian government may; it's why he quoted the Italian official stats.

[tell it like it is]

As far as I can see, you've spent several messages saying why you don't think they're worth listening to without responding to the quote that came out of the meeting, in fact you'd rather find a tweet from 2012 to share. If they do ever "praise the government" I think it's unlikely that you'll be listening to find out.

That's something I recognise those too settled on one side of the political debate would do, be that side left or right.

We know that PPE guidance has changed in England at the same time as stories coming out regarding issues of supply. "The science" won't have changed for that finite period of time but government response to it will while still saying "at all times we've followed the science". We don't know what the science has said previously or is saying now so cannot say how much other actions have simply been because we didn't have capacity/weren't prepared enough to do what science was saying so had to come up with a different interpretation.

They are worth listening to, as long as you recognise the inherent bias contained within them. If you listened to their output, Michie was referring to the "society we have after this is over" - which is hardly science based, is it?

Guidance is going to change, as is everything being the situations changes day to day. There's criticism so far people treated at the Nightingale hospital, well, that's a good thing - shows NHS coped. For every "we don't have PPE" there have been staff saying they've had no problems - which indicates PPE *is* available - yet NHS procurement managers seem to be immune to criticism.

[Organ Morgan.]

Farage was an MP once. He "spoke his mind" a lot too. I wouldn't have given him any credence had he still been an MP and came up with something like this as... How the f**k would he know what percentage of people dying actually died of Covid-19 or other causes? He wouldn't. Neither does this guy.

The End.

This article is from before the MP spoke: 99% of Those Who Died From Virus Had Other Illness, Italy Says https://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...ess-italy-says

The MP was stating that over 96% of Italy's COVID dead died with it and not of it, I.e. they tested positive for COVID-19 but it was incidental to what killed them.

[The Lone Gunman]

This is an Italian MP.....

He looks and sounds like a lunatic.

[Organ Morgan.]

He looks and sounds like a lunatic.

Apparently, he's reputed to be Italy's most respected art critic.

So is probably gaga as you say.

[tell it like it is]

This article is from before the MP spoke: 99% of Those Who Died From Virus Had Other Illness, Italy Says https://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...ess-italy-says

The MP was stating that over 96% of Italy's COVID dead died with it and not of it, I.e. they tested positive for COVID-19 but it was incidental to what killed them.

Which isn't necessarily wrong, just highlights how difficult it is to attribute covid-19 as cause of death.

With covid-19, with underlying symptoms then the immune system is weakened. You may have an issue of the underlying symptoms triggered by covid-19, which your body cannot recover from as it normally would due to covid-19.

It's entirely similar to HIV/AIDS - you don't die of those. You die because of the effects on the immune system meaning you then die of other things such as pneumonia.

Implying covid-19 is thus harmless in itself is stupid. Equally, it's entirely possible to have covid-19, have no symptoms and die regardless.

[jon1959]

John Crace getting 'the tone' right!

https://www.theguardian.com/politics...his-conscience

[Veg1960]

John Crace getting 'the tone' right!

https://www.theguardian.com/politics...his-conscience

Thanks Jon,

Fast becoming my favourite sketch writer.

[trampie09]

Why is England's excess death rate off the scale ?, it's a real worry considering we border them.
What are they doing wrong/not doing right it's a national disaster and a national disgrace for them.

[the other bob wilson]

Why is England's excess death rate off the scale ?, it's a real worry considering we border them.
What are they doing wrong/not doing right it's a national disaster and a national disgrace for them.

What is Wales' excess death rate? We were combined with England on the graph they showed on Newsnight yesterday.

[Rjk]

This article is from before the MP spoke: 99% of Those Who Died From Virus Had Other Illness, Italy Says https://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...ess-italy-says

The MP was stating that over 96% of Italy's COVID dead died with it and not of it, I.e. they tested positive for COVID-19 but it was incidental to what killed them.

I don't think you've really understood what they mean.

The cause of death often isn't the virus, i.e. many people die from pneumonia which is caused by different bacteria present in the lungs. however the chances are if they hadn't actually had the virus they would probably have fought off the bacteria before it took hold.

if it was incidental in 96% of cases then there wouldn't be such a large increase in people dying.

[Croesy Blue]

How can anyone say Covid is just flu still? We have had 30,000 excess deaths compared to any other year, what's causing these if not covid? Have we coincidently just had an extra 20,000 heart attacks and 10,000 car crashed without realising?

Anyone who is too stupid to look at excess deaths and come to any other conclusion must be a ****ing idiot. Stupid enough to think covid was planned in 2015 because of a file name levels of stupid.

[Croesy Blue]

This article is from before the MP spoke: 99% of Those Who Died From Virus Had Other Illness, Italy Says https://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...ess-italy-says

The MP was stating that over 96% of Italy's COVID dead died with it and not of it, I.e. they tested positive for COVID-19 but it was incidental to what killed them.

This has all been going on for ****ing ages now, how can you still not grasp what's going on?

[trampie09]

What is Wales' excess death rate? We were combined with England on the graph they showed on Newsnight yesterday.

Wales score is high, England off the scale, I think NI, Scot, Wal 'z' score is between 10 and 20, England is over 40, I think England's has been over 40 for 3 weeks now which is a diabolically bad score they are basically about the worst in the entire World.

[trampie09]

England should not be coming out of lockdown anytime soon with a z score like they have got, the problem for the UK Celtic countries is what if we are ready to come out of lockdown and they are not ? or England comes out of lockdown when we in Wales know they shouldn't ?
Why England's z score should be so much worse than NI, Scot and Wal is odd, what are they doing differently or not doing at all ?, it seems unlikely to be the roll of the dice because the home nation's are so interlinked, but perhaps it has something to do with population density or something.
Unfortunately for England it's a national disaster and although facts aren't fully known and probably won't be for some years it seems like a national disgrace when compared to the rest of Europe and at this stage the rest of the World.

[tell it like it is]

Out of interest, what's the "z score" ans what does it represent?

[the other bob wilson]

Wales score is high, England off the scale, I think NI, Scot, Wal 'z' score is between 10 and 20, England is over 40, I think England's has been over 40 for 3 weeks now which is a diabolically bad score they are basically about the worst in the entire World.

Thanks, I take it the z score you talk about relates to excess deaths? it's going off that subject, but I was surprised, and a little alarmed, to learn that the number of deaths in RCT is higher than in Cardiff and the Vale apparently, yet I hear it said so often that the virus has not really found it's way to the valleys. It's true that there are, apparently, not many cases around here at the top of the Rhondda valley (and the majority of the ones I'm aware of were picked up in hospital), but, self evidently, that's not true elsewhere in the county.

[trampie09]

Thanks, I take it the z score you talk about relates to excess deaths? it's going off that subject, but I was surprised, and a little alarmed, to learn that the number of deaths in RCT is higher than in Cardiff and the Vale apparently, yet I hear it said so often that the virus has not really found it's way to the valleys. It's true that there are, apparently, not many cases around here at the top of the Rhondda valley (and the majority of the ones I'm aware of were picked up in hospital), but, self evidently, that's not true elsewhere in the county.

Try and stay safe Bob, where is the top of the Rhondda valley - Treherbert ?

[Packerman]

Try and stay safe Bob, where is the top of the Rhondda valley - Treherbert ?

depends which valley Maerdy is top of Rhondda Fach

[trampie09]

depends which valley Maerdy is top of Rhondda Fach

Indeed, I'm wondering where Bob's neck of the woods is ?

[Heisenberg]

This article is from before the MP spoke: 99% of Those Who Died From Virus Had Other Illness, Italy Says https://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...ess-italy-says

The MP was stating that over 96% of Italy's COVID dead died with it and not of it, I.e. they tested positive for COVID-19 but it was incidental to what killed them.

Why are you raising this now as if it's a new development? The story has always been that people with pre-existing illnesses are more likely to die when having Covid-19.

Say, for instance, that I have skin cancer... I contract Covid-19 but my immune system cannot fight it as well as a 'healthier' person who hasn't had their immune system compromised by bouts of radio and chemotherapy... I then develop pneumonia as I cannot fight the infection and that is what ends up killing me.

I would have still been alive had it not been for Covid-19 causing my immune system to be compromised. The death certificate would say cause of death as pneumonia but the mitigating factor is Covid-19 which lead to the infection.

It's really not that hard to figure out. I know you're bright, so it's not that you don't know all of this already... you're just throwing shit and hoping some of it will stick someday as you've been ridiculously and hilariously wrong on everything related to Covid-19 since you first posted about it back in January.

There isn't a conspiracy, Organ. I know you'll never accept that fact on here, but, hopefully, deep down you can at least admit it to yourself.

[the other bob wilson]

Indeed, I'm wondering where Bob's neck of the woods is ?

I'm in a village called Tynewydd which is the next one up from Treherbert. If I was to head north from here, I'd reach Blaencwn if I veered to the left and Blaennrhondda if i went straight on. They are both about a five minute walk away and they are at the top of the valley - there's nothing after them.

[trampie09]

I'm in a village called Tynewydd which is the next one up from Treherbert. If I was to head north from here, I'd reach Blaencwn if I veered to the left and Blaennrhondda if i went straight on. They are both about a five minute walk away and they are at the top of the valley - there's nothing after them.

I'm originally from the other side of Craig y Llyn.

[tell it like it is]

https://www.jpost.com/health-science...16j__DhLNFU0no

[the other bob wilson]

https://www.jpost.com/health-science...16j__DhLNFU0no

That sounds like great news.