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^^^^nearlyOriginally Posted by Wales-Bales
The plans for Merthyr synagogue which was bought by a Jewish heritage and cultural society is to turn it into a historical Jewish centre. I can see the population of Galon Uchaf queuing up to get in on opening night.
A bit like Canton thenThere was an area of Merthyr given the name 'China' because it was such a disease ridden shithole, where many of the residents were better off in prison because they had food and could wash. As for the word 'Polak' i wouldn't call them that, they don't like itMerthyr is one of the whitest places on the planet.
Sludge has a very long history on this board of being perpetually offended on behalf of others..
Odd that after all of your criticism of Sludge that you post something which states that the number of blacks who die in police custody in England and Wales is "disproportionately high" - presumably, he's won you around to his way of thinking.
I said nothing of the sort , you dont have to talk to someone who runs a bus from merthyr who isnt ukranian to be aware that there is a history of ukranian immigration into the south wales coal valleys and merthyr in particular
I have never talked about ukranian immigration with a bloke who isnt ukranian about ukranian immigration into merthyr
I saw an article in the western mail about the south wales ukranian community many years ago . If your grandfather came over to work in merthyr from the Ukraine then you are part of the ukranian community .
Cardiff used to have four synagogues, now it's got two , it's still got a jewish community , many families with the name gold , goldberg , fine etc in cardiff
And there is plenty in merthyr
No , her name is not catherine
There is a very long history on this board and amongst cardiff city supporters of closet racism
I am having nothing more to do with this thread , some of the comments are staggering considering we support a club with one of the oldest multi cultural communities in the uk on its doorstep
There is a history of white cardiff city fans telling everyone that they are not racist and there is and never has been racism in cardiff
Denying racism in cardiff is part of the city's history
Reading this and other threads will clearly show this to be true
There is a very good book out there called leviathan by Beatrice Campbell
Well worth a read
I am leaving this thread , it's a complete waste of time
Sludge in throwing his toys out of his pram shocker.
Is it a waste of time because not many posters are agreeing with you?
Im 56. Born and bred in Cardiff. I spent the 1st 23yrs of my life in Ely, and the rest in Canton.
Ive followed the City home and away (mostly home) since the mid 70’s.
I absolutely refute what you say. I can count on one hand, the amount of racist incidents I've seen at City games in all those yrs.
I can also count on one hand how many racist incidents I've witnessed in Cardiff as a city as well.
Ive grown from a child to an adult in this City and have mixed with all creeds, colours and religions, and never once given it a 2nd thought. Ive gone drinking in pubs from the docks up to Thornhill,, and never witnessed racial tension.
You keep harping on about the Cardiff 3. That was disgusting behaviour from Sth Wales police, and every single person I've ever spoken to it about it has the same opinion, but to use that as a yard stick, is both laughable and degrading to our wonderful City. Im not saying Cardiff is perfect, not by a long chalk But I've always been proud of its acceptance of multi cultures.
Why don't you **** off to a different part of the UK and peddle your nonsense?
I'm just going to post one more message on this thread and then I'm finished with it because it's depressing.
I've lived my life thinking that Cardiff was, relative to other parts of the UK, a racially tolerant place. I still feel that, but my faith in my city has been shaken a bit in the past decade as I heard more and more "send em back" type comments from people I like of my age or older in the city. Nevertheless, I'd say Cardiff, and the supporters of its football club, could teach other cities and other club's supporters a lot about racial tolerance.
The trouble is, I have a white person's view of racism - my view on it is based on the presumption that racist behaviour is always pretty easy to spot because it's so obvious. One of the things that it emerging in the days since George Floyd's death is that my perception of racism is a lot different from those who spend their lives having to deal with it.
Adrian Chiles told a story on his radio show last week about the former Home Secretary David Blunkett. I cannot remember the exact words used, but the point of the story is that Blunkett said one of the best things about being blind is that the colour of someone's skin became irrelevant to him because, more often than not, he had to be told about it to learn that someone was a different colour to him. In other words, he didn't have to go through the process that so many others do whereby they have to tailor their response to the skin colour of the individual/group involved - strikes me there are plenty in this thread for whom that process is a matter of course. Are they racists? I'd say no in most cases, but then my definition of the term comes from a white perspective.
One point JR raises that’s spot on us if that was a pro Brexit March yesterday we’d be calling them ****ing idiots.
Just because we agree with the reason for this doesn’t mean we have to praise it.
There we go denying racism again , you are white , you are not giving a black persons view of racism
There have been plenty of racist incidents at cardiff city games over the years
Bananas being thrown at alex William's the black city keeper
Monkey chants at cambridge uniteds captain from block A of the grandstand
You are just a town full of pakis chanted by the grange end at oldham athletic and bradford city fans
Swasticas sprayed on the exterior grandstand wall which the club had to remove
Nazi salutes at bradford city fans from the bob bank
You black **** being shouted at a stoke city forward who was wasting time from the Bob bank
I would rather wear a turban than a rose from the grange end
Plenty of incidents , just because you were not witness to them doesnt mean they didnt happen
A few years ago the cardiff city supporters trust organised an open day to invite members of the local community to the football club . We had a good response but many people said that cardiff city was not a welcoming place for them and that on their visits to the club they saw very few faces of colour . And they were of course , right .
Later on someone from the docks asked a club representative what jobs at the club would be available to the local community and what's steps were the club taking to integrate with people from grangetown and the docks . He suggested they could work serving burgers .
The bloke representing his community was staggered and the room fell silent
The trust received loads of complaints that by organising the event we were pandering to the ethnic minorities and that we should be concentrating on the price of tickets etc . The racism flying about at that time by some of our fans was dreadful . It wasnt just a handful .
Now you can give your views as a white person as to how cardiff is an integrated city and how we have never had a problem with racism in cardiff or at cardiff city . But I am afraid that's been the response for many years and its incorrect
The docklands area of cardiff has always been a shining light of a true , welcoming , multi racial community but there is a book in the butetown historical centre called below the bridge which is a term many docks people were familiar with . They were often told to .....get back below the bridge ....to butetown
That may not fit in with your white experience of cardiff not having problems with racism or cardiff city not having racists among its support but you must walk around with your eyes closed and your hands over your ears
A cardiff city fan who posts on here and is mixed race has been on the receiving end of racist abuse at cardiff games and has also has observed it at close quarters
If that upsets you then that's a shame but it's true
Indeed most of us are white on here and we are saying oh cardiff is very racially tolerant and there isnt a racist problem in cardiff . How the feck would we know ?
Lots of examples of racist behaviour from cardiff city fans and plenty of racist incidents reported to south wales police about racist behaviour in cardiff society
Just because cardiff is cosmopolitan city doesnt mean we can deny it's a problem
Considering how multi racial cardiff is how many ethnic minority faces do you see at cardiff city games ?
Very very few
Ive seen loads of racism while backpacking around Europe, loads of it while travelling away with football around england, i always went to city games with my best mate at the time who was Asian, the northern teams supporters would occasionally shout a little abuse at him while we travelled to the ground, i must admit, it didnt bother him in the slightest, when we were in Ostend ( travelling to Liege ) we attempted to get in a bar and the doorman said " you lot can come in, he has to wait outside ", we payed them a visit on our last night in ostend , nice of them to put a skip of building materials just down the end of the road
not really seen much racism from city fans, but at the time i classed a few of the edgy chants as " football banter chants " and thats all they were, i am sure people on here would say they were full on racist chants though and hang there heads in shame
Isn’t it easier to say something is banter if you’re white though? Not a pop it’s just probably harder for us to judge if something is banter if it’s in no way directed at us.
I honestly havent seen too much racism from city fans but I wouldn’t say it’s non existent.
I’ve definitely heard you’re just a town full of pakis a few times. Wouldn’t call that banter.
i could also see it from my Asian mates point of view though, as he would join in, he took chants as just " football banter " , we would occasionally chat about it, he saw it in the same sense as the " oh England is full of " chant, no-one really believes it is
But the chances of a white person dying in custody is higher, which is my point. If black people dying in police custody is an issue then so it’s the same for white people so why is it a racial issue rather than a general one?
The numbers are far too small to draw any conclusions, if only 163 people have died in police custody in the past 10 years despite the millions of arrests police make does that imply there’s a deep problem? You also have to consider how these deaths occur, they are usually heart attacks from drug and alcohol abuse.
Like I’ve said, there is racism issues in this country but trying to angle it as police are killing black people is factually wrong, sludge can’t comprehend this
They should ban protests while the virus is still so prevalent
Obviously support them in a few weeks when it’s a bit safer for all
We're in danger of blurring the lines between racism and prejudice. I'm guessing 90% of Asian parents would prefer their son/daughter to marry another Asian. Probably the same with Jewish parents to a degree - and so on. I wouldn't consider such views as racist though as usual there's no stopping the over-reaction that treats the tiniest, most insignificant comment as racist, and the perpetrator a racist..
That isn't what the BBC article said that Llandaff Blue linked. It said the opposite. That black people are twice as likely to die in police custody as white people. There may be other factors involved (or maybe not), and the sample may be small (certainly compared to the USA) but your point is wrong if this is right:
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/52890363
That is the BBC article I have posted about 4 times now which clearly says white people have a 25% higher chance of dying in police custody. It appears both you and Bob didn't bother reading past the first graph, because the BBC article adjusts for arrests which show that white people die at a higher rate.
Just quoting the part of the article that you are referring to:
This is the only relevant measure when looking at the specific issue of deaths in custody.Of those arrested, 79% were white and 85% of those who died in custody were white.
Meanwhile, 9% of people arrested were black (which is disproportionally high) and 8% of those who died in custody were black.
So, over the last 10 years, a white individual who has been arrested was about 25% more likely to die in custody than a black individual who had been arrested.
No - I read the whole article. The para Eric quoted above is one of three interlinked comments on deaths:
Black people are twice as likely as white to die in police custody - that is based on population not arrests!
Of people arrested white people are 25% more likely to die in police custody than black people.
Black people are twice as likely as white to die in police custody after the use of (police) force.
None of those statements are contradictory - and as I agreed above there may be a number of other factors that play into them other than simple ethnicity. I agree that once arrested black people are not more likely to die in the hands of the police (unlike in the USA) but they are much more likely to be arrested, stopped and searched, and given harsher sentences (at least that was what I took from the data quoted in the Secret Barrister's book). It may be that economic factors, health problems, substance dependency, postcode and other factors also influence the outcomes - but none of those are independent of race and ethnicity either.
Are posters conflating Cardiff dwellers with Bluebird fans ?, are people from Cardiff the same as people from the valleys ?
Are things different now to what they were in the past ?
Fair, I misunderstood your comment.
The situation regarding arrests, stop and search etc is one I agree with, and it's a wider conversation that needs to be had rather than people like Sludge trying to take the US policing issue and apply it here despite zero data supporting his claims.
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