These Electric car things are great, in they. NOT !!!!

[Sunnysideup]

My mate makes a compelling argument as to Hydrogen in the future
It won’t happen in our lifetimes but with the advancement of technology and the abundance of water I’m sure he’s right. 🤔

[Maurice Swan]

A sobering thought: https://www.dailymail.co.uk/home/index.htmlght.....

[Enoch Mort]

Some interesting info and thoughts in this thread. Also very informative. My nephew charges up his electric car from electricity generated from his solar panels and stored in his powerwall. He has not paid directly for charging up the car since he has had it. He appears to be quite happy.

[BLUETIT]

https://twitter.com/Tanni_GT/status/...7Ctwgr%5Etweet

[BLUETIT]

https://www.manchestereveningnews.co...t-26345174.amp

[Sunnysideup]

I did see that online
Wasn’t on the mainstream news?
Bad publicity for the manufacturers 🫣

[TWGL1]

Apparently in the UK the majority of the electricity entering the national grid from a single energy source is natural gas. Natural gas is a largely imported fossil fuel and can emit harmful GHGs such as carbon dioxide (CO2) when burned to generate electricity.

[BLUETIT]

And there’s more

https://apple.news/AB1bmRjz2Tu6g_m-QGXbJ5A

[Sunnysideup]

That’s just a minor issue Titty 🫣

[dembethewarrior]

I'm sure people moaned when they changed from horse and cart too.

Miserable old bastards.

[splott parker]

I'm sure people moaned when they changed from horse and cart too.

Miserable old bastards.

Put a lot of horses out of a job and severely hit the rhubarb crop!!!!!!!

[dembethewarrior]

Put a lot of horses out of a job and severely hit the rhubarb crop!!!!!!!

Rhubarb pie and custard.

[Tito Fuente]

Apparently in the UK the majority of the electricity entering the national grid from a single energy source is natural gas. Natural gas is a largely imported fossil fuel and can emit harmful GHGs such as carbon dioxide (CO2) when burned to generate electricity.

You know what else emits harmful GHGs such as carbon dioxide (CO2) when burned?

Petrol & diesel.

I wonder which emits more GHGs from running a personal vehicle - the electricity that has been absorbed from the national grid that's required to charge an EV for each use or burning petrol/diesel throughout the use of a gas guzzler?

Answers on postcard.

[TWGL1]

You know what else emits harmful GHGs such as carbon dioxide (CO2) when burned?

Petrol & diesel.

I wonder which emits more GHGs from running a personal vehicle - the electricity that has been absorbed from the national grid that's required to charge an EV for each use or burning petrol/diesel throughout the use of a gas guzzler?

Answers on postcard.

I wonder how they are going to dispose of all these electric batteries , I know the car I was looking at had a battery weight of 500kg, which put me off, also the extra environment impact of increased tyre wear ( ignoring brake pads etc ) and the increased mileage ( and indirect charging costs ) detouring to charging areas when motorway driving.

Let’s also not forgetting the slave labour and black market that’s emerging from the Cobalt industry. Each to their own thought as you say.

[Sunnysideup]

Yes I was watching a documentary on the Children being used to mine Lithium in Angola
It didn’t make happy viewing 🙁🙁

[dembethewarrior]

Yes I was watching a documentary on the Children being used to mine Lithium in Angola
It didn’t make happy viewing 🙁🙁

Kids should be at school 🤬

[JamesWales]

Never had one and am a long way off being able to afford one, but it's clearly the future someday. But cold weather knocks a third off the range? That's pretty useless isn't it?

[ToTaL ITK]

Listen! we all know that most of you petrol pervs will never give up your Ford Capri Gtx. But its the future so get used to it.

[Tito Fuente]

I wonder how they are going to dispose of all these electric batteries , I know the car I was looking at had a battery weight of 500kg, which put me off, also the extra environment impact of increased tyre wear ( ignoring brake pads etc ) and the increased mileage ( and indirect charging costs ) detouring to charging areas when motorway driving.

Let’s also not forgetting the slave labour and black market that’s emerging from the Cobalt industry. Each to their own thought as you say.

I can't pretend that I know much about this subject at all so you'll have to help me out.

Is "extra environment impact of increased tyre wear ( ignoring brake pads etc ) and the increased mileage ( and indirect charging costs ) detouring to charging areas when motorway driving " more or less of an environmental impact than burning fossil fuels at source when using a petrol diesel vehicle?

[Optimistic Nick]

I can't pretend that I know much about this subject at all so you'll have to help me out.

Is "extra environment impact of increased tyre wear ( ignoring brake pads etc ) and the increased mileage ( and indirect charging costs ) detouring to charging areas when motorway driving " more or less of an environmental impact than burning fossil fuels at source when using a petrol diesel vehicle?

Worth noting that ev brakes a) regenerate energy and b) need replacing less regularly. Tyres: yeah I suspect they do wear more quickly than ICE due to the extra weight so that is probably fair. EVs do have specific tyres (or at least mine does) which might be designed to mitigate this (dunno) but I suspect that yes they wear out a bit more quickly than tyres on an ICE. but as you say: how does it stack against the other environmental factors?

This level of environmental concern might be genuine of course, but if it is it is then it's hard to reconcile worrying about EV break pads with any form of car ownership, and certainly with using a car to travel the long distances at which recharging on motorways would require.

But to put his mind at ease on some other points:

EV batteries are recycled and reused in things like domestic storage batteries. They are bloody expensive, I think they look to squeeze every minute of useful life out of them.

EV chargers are located at motorway service stations so the extra fraction of a mile to detour when on the motorway is a non issue

Yes EV chargers at service stations are expensive, just as petrol is. You use it if you have to, which - given modern EV ranges - wouldnt be that often for many people. Overall assuming you can charge at home, the price per mile for EV should be a lot lower than ICE. I have a large, heavy, inefficient EV. My average price per mile is a little under 4p which is more than the 2.5p when I first got it and electricity prices were lower, but still way cheaper than any ICE I've ever had.

Obviously you have extreme cases of people driving from Cardiff to Newcastle and back on a daily basis or whatever but EV isnt really viable for them yet and even if it was, anyone worried about the environmental damage of extra mileage to the on-route charger wouldnt be driving that journey anyway and would be taking public transport.

There are genuine barriers to mass adoption of EVs, the main one being that unless you have access to a home or office charger on a frequent basis, it's not going to be viable. And a lot of people will fall into that category. But his environmental concerns are a bit... odd.

[Tito Fuente]

Worth noting that ev brakes a) regenerate energy and b) need replacing less regularly. Tyres: yeah I suspect they do wear more quickly than ICE due to the extra weight so that is probably fair. EVs do have specific tyres (or at least mine does) which might be designed to mitigate this (dunno) but I suspect that yes they wear out a bit more quickly than tyres on an ICE. but as you say: how does it stack against the other environmental factors?

This level of environmental concern might be genuine of course, but if it is it is then it's hard to reconcile worrying about EV break pads with any form of car ownership, and certainly with using a car to travel the long distances at which recharging on motorways would require.

But to put his mind at ease on some other points:

EV batteries are recycled and reused in things like domestic storage batteries. They are bloody expensive, I think they look to squeeze every minute of useful life out of them.

EV chargers are located at motorway service stations so the extra fraction of a mile to detour when on the motorway is a non issue

Yes EV chargers at service stations are expensive, just as petrol is. You use it if you have to, which - given modern EV ranges - wouldnt be that often for many people. Overall assuming you can charge at home, the price per mile for EV should be a lot lower than ICE. I have a large, heavy, inefficient EV. My average price per mile is a little under 4p which is more than the 2.5p when I first got it and electricity prices were lower, but still way cheaper than any ICE I've ever had.

Obviously you have extreme cases of people driving from Cardiff to Newcastle and back on a daily basis or whatever but EV isnt really viable for them yet and even if it was, anyone worried about the environmental damage of extra mileage to the on-route charger wouldnt be driving that journey anyway and would be taking public transport.

There are genuine barriers to mass adoption of EVs, the main one being that unless you have access to a home or office charger on a frequent basis, it's not going to be viable. And a lot of people will fall into that category. But his environmental concerns are a bit... odd.

Thanks for your well thought-out reply, Nick.

I think you've covered all bases with that.

Thoughts TWGL?

[life on mars]

Got a plug in Hybrid , its averaging with petrol /electric charge at 111 mpg .

Plugged in I get silly MPG

Cost at home to charge its £7

Thankfully, fortunately its a business car so I get to charge it at work as a freebie ..

Best drive ever .

Don't understand why the green lobby haven't attacked me yet as its carbon creation footprint is mad .

I do feel that the future has to change , if we go to no fossil fuel how will the poorer in society get to buy one these crazy prices machines .

As the boss of one of the big fuel companies pointed out to mad Greta , he has done more in the last 20 years than anyone to redcue pollution , banning fossil fuels too early wont fix this it will just hurt the economy and poor in society

[BLUETIT]

Bullshit
EV chargers are located at motorway service stations so the extra fraction of a mile to detour when on the motorway is a non issue

There are instances where people have had to queue for hours (even getting overstay fines) at motorway services

[Tito Fuente]

Got a plug in Hybrid , its averaging with petrol /electric charge at 111 mpg .

Plugged in I get silly MPG

Cost at home to charge its £7

Thankfully, fortunately its a business car so I get to charge it at work as a freebie ..

Best drive ever .

Don't understand why the green lobby haven't attacked me yet as its carbon creation footprint is mad .

I do feel that the future has to change , if we go to no fossil fuel how will the poorer in society get to buy one these crazy prices machines .

As the boss of one of the big fuel companies pointed out to mad Greta , he has done more in the last 20 years than anyone to redcue pollution , banning fossil fuels too early wont fix this it will just hurt the economy and poor in society

"As the boss of one of the big fuel companies pointed out to mad Greta , he has done more in the last 20 years than anyone to redcue pollution"

Nice to see that satire is alive and well

[Sunnysideup]

On EV ownership the negatives far outweigh the positives
From initial cost to second hand value
Then there’s the “What about the children of the future brigade”
Please go over to Angola and stop the exploitation of these young children digging the Lithium out of the ground for EV batteries
We can argue this thread for a week and never agree
As I’ve said earlier in the thread I borrowed my sister’s EV for a weekend and couldn’t wait to give it back