Just stop oil

[Robin Friday's Ghost]

Were Covid vaccines declared 100% safe.?

Im not saying you are wrong but I dont recall this as most medications dont declare this. Always a chance of a reaction.

They were definitely not declared 100% safe. However, people who were under very little danger of any serious effects of Covid were persuaded - aggressively - to accept it to prevent passing it onto the the more vulnerable. Except that Pfizer has admitted their vaccine was never tested on whether it prevented transmission. I had 2 vaccines and a booster. I wouldn't have had any of them if I'd known this as I don't believe it posed much of a danger to me a healthy person with none of the vulnerable conditions. I won't have any more whatever I'm told because I don't like being lied to.

[North Cardiff Blue]

They were definitely not declared 100% safe. However, people who were under very little danger of any serious effects of Covid were persuaded - aggressively - to accept it to prevent passing it onto the the more vulnerable. Except that Pfizer has admitted their vaccine was never tested on whether it prevented transmission. I had 2 vaccines and a booster. I wouldn't have had any of them if I'd known this as I don't believe it posed much of a danger to me a healthy person with none of the vulnerable conditions. I won't have any more whatever I'm told because I don't like being lied to.

I think you are looking at it now with hindsight, at the time most people were worried. I was in good health on no meds no issues, so not worried in the slightest. I did have an elderly mother though, so on the advice that I was slightly less likely to get it and pass it on to her I had two and the booster too. The other reason I had it was to allow everything to reopen quicker and damage the economy slightly less.

Overall they are as safe as getting covid, so it was no harm in having the injections for me, and the saved the lives of lots of elderly and ill weak people.

[cyril evans awaydays]

This is how madness infects. Vaccines were introduced at "warp speed" to try and introduce normalcy. The developers never claimed they tested for evasion of transmission but after they had done their job the gifted gang bellowed this out as proof of some kind of plot.

In reality they both significantly stopped transmission, regardless of whether they were tested for it and mitigated the effects if there was transmission.

I am not sure who lied to you that they were tested for transmission but if you ever get confronted with similar circumstances again I guess you have to go with your instincts.

[Robin Friday's Ghost]

This is how madness infects. Vaccines were introduced at "warp speed" to try and introduce normalcy. The developers never claimed they tested for evasion of transmission but after they had done their job the gifted gang bellowed this out as proof of some kind of plot.

In reality they both significantly stopped transmission, regardless of whether they were tested for it and mitigated the effects if there was transmission.

I am not sure who lied to you that they were tested for transmission but if you ever get confronted with similar circumstances again I guess you have to go with your instincts.

If you didn't experience the "selfish bastard" pressure then lucky you. The argument that we should accept the vaccine to protect our elderly parents etc was a major theme. And it was not based on science at all.

[lardy]

If you didn't experience the "selfish bastard" pressure then lucky you. The argument that we should accept the vaccine to protect our elderly parents etc was a major theme. And it was not based on science at all.

If it wasn't based on science at all, what do you think it was based on?

Without the vaccine, life would have continued like late 2020, which I recall as being pretty unpleasant.

[cityhammer]

If it wasn't based on science at all, what do you think it was based on?

Without the vaccine, life would have continued like late 2020, which I recall as being pretty unpleasant.

Didnt Born Guessing recently admit in questioning into the covid pandemic that he NEVER read the scientific reports? So guess the vaccination programme in Wales was not based on science.

[JamesWales]

I had the vaccine earlier than most and was proud to have it etc and encouraged everyone to have it. But I also knew it was a risk.

We all knew it hadn't been tested as well as other drugs. I glossed over that in the knowledge that it may get us out of covid rules and also that the risk would be shared by 95% of the population, so at least we would all be fkd.

But I also found the politics surrounding the vaccine abhorent and very contradictory from people who normally preach autonomy over one's own body. Stuff like vaccine passports was outrageous really, particularly as we knew it didn't prevent us passing the disease on.

My Dad, who has numerous underlying health conditions, had the vaccine and got Ill and chose not to have his boosters. That was his choice in my opinion and I don't think he should have faced any consequence for it..as it happens he didnt as he does very little anyway, but some did.

[az city]

I had the vaccine earlier than most and was proud to have it etc and encouraged everyone to have it. But I also knew it was a risk.

We all knew it hadn't been tested as well as other drugs. I glossed over that in the knowledge that it may get us out of covid rules and also that the risk would be shared by 95% of the population, so at least we would all be fkd.

But I also found the politics surrounding the vaccine abhorent and very contradictory from people who normally preach autonomy over one's own body. Stuff like vaccine passports was outrageous really, particularly as we knew it didn't prevent us passing the disease on.

My Dad, who has numerous underlying health conditions, had the vaccine and got Ill and chose not to have his boosters. That was his choice in my opinion and I don't think he should have faced any consequence for it..as it happens he didnt as he does very little anyway, but some did.

If your father had passed it on to one of your children (partially through not being fully vaccinated) and that child suffered consequences (not that I wish that on a little Jimbolina) that would have been ok with you then? I think we both know it would not.

[Wales-Bales]

If your father had passed it on to one of your children (partially through not being fully vaccinated) and that child suffered consequences (not that I wish that on a little Jimbolina) that would have been ok with you then? I think we both know it would not.

"If" is not science

[TWGL1]

If your father had passed it on to one of your children (partially through not being fully vaccinated) and that child suffered consequences (not that I wish that on a little Jimbolina) that would have been ok with you then? I think we both know it would not.

Children are not at risk from Covid, the data shows that, hence why the vaccine programme for people under 50 has been withdrawn.

[Robin Friday's Ghost]

If it wasn't based on science at all, what do you think it was based on?

Without the vaccine, life would have continued like late 2020, which I recall as being pretty unpleasant.

I was specifically referring to the campaign to urge us to be vaccinated to protect others. The Pfizer vaccine had not been tested on whether it presented transference to others, although we were not made aware of this. Therefore this campaign, during which people who chose not to have the vaccine were vilified as selfish, was not based on science.

[Undercoverinwurzelland]

Here's a question for the conspiracy theorists - why? Why would the governments, media, scientists etc want to con everyone into believing that man-made climate change is destroying the planet? It's inconvenient for governments. The oil, car, airline, construction etc lobbies exert massive influence on governments all over the world and are generally backed by the likes of Murdoch who control huge swathes of the world's press.
So who is "they" and why would they be lying to us about climate change/silencing the few question it?

[lardy]

Here's a question for the conspiracy theorists - why? Why would the governments, media, scientists etc want to con everyone into believing that man-made climate change is destroying the planet? It's inconvenient for governments. The oil, car, airline, construction etc lobbies exert massive influence on governments all over the world and are generally backed by the likes of Murdoch who control huge swathes of the world's press.
So who is "they" and why would they be lying to us about climate change/silencing the few question it?

This is exactly the question. Oil companies have been the richest in the world for decades, only recently overtaken by technology but still immensely rich and powerful as the world runs on oil. Western governments are always sucking up to OPEC countries because of this reliance.

The idea that some group could buy out basically every publishing scientist in the world without any pushback any response from oil companies or governments is beyond insane. Simply no one is rich enough to do this.

[Wales-Bales]

Here's a question for the conspiracy theorists - why? Why would the governments, media, scientists etc want to con everyone into believing that man-made climate change is destroying the planet? It's inconvenient for governments. The oil, car, airline, construction etc lobbies exert massive influence on governments all over the world and are generally backed by the likes of Murdoch who control huge swathes of the world's press.
So who is "they" and why would they be lying to us about climate change/silencing the few question it?

A new economic system that doesn't rely on people and growth? In which case, what happens to all the people?

[Undercoverinwurzelland]

A new economic system that doesn't rely on people and growth? In which case, what happens to all the people?

But who do you think wants that? And again, why? The richest and most powerful in the world are doing very nicely already from growth based on people.

[Dorcus]

But who do you think wants that? And again, why? The richest and most powerful in the world are doing very nicely already from growth based on people.

Also growth is not infinite. Continuously busting a gut for "growth" will bust the planet. The planet is finite unlike human imagination.

[Robin Friday's Ghost]

I think you are looking at it now with hindsight, at the time most people were worried. I was in good health on no meds no issues, so not worried in the slightest. I did have an elderly mother though, so on the advice that I was slightly less likely to get it and pass it on to her I had two and the booster too. The other reason I had it was to allow everything to reopen quicker and damage the economy slightly less.

Overall they are as safe as getting covid, so it was no harm in having the injections for me, and the saved the lives of lots of elderly and ill weak people.

The advice that you were less likely to get it was correct and based on testing, albeit not as rigorous us usual.

The advice that you were less likely to pass it on to your mother was not based on testing or any other scientific evidence. But we were told it would help stop the spread nevertheless. That's what I object to.

[Dorcus]

Why do you always say the left are loopy?
Better than the rabid right.

A lot more intelligent and human that's for sure!

[SLUDGE FACTORY]

100%

I think it's bollocks better off in the Daily Mail

[JamesWales]

Who are we kidding Jimbo, if you were alive back then you'd have taken the enlightened centrist approach as you always do and would be saying 'I'm for the right for women to vote but I'm against the ruckus they're making'.

I absolutely would have been on the side of women not having to throw themselves under horses to get the vote Ducky.

Remember, it's not me who is ever keen to overule election or referendum results when it doesn't suit me👍

I do take your wider point, I just think they have means to protest and they should do it properly. Thats what we do in democracies. I also happen to have some sympathy for their cause (if not their means) and instead of having any sympathy I just think they are bunch of arrogant, selfish spoilt posh kids. And their behaviour encourages millions to think the same

[Dave Blue]

Meanwhile, referring to the actual title of this thread, The Times states that the PM will go soft on green policies to ‘woo voters’ right next to a photo of burning Greece - and without any trace of irony.

[the other bob wilson]

Meanwhile, referring to the actual title of this thread, The Times states that the PM will go soft on green policies to ‘woo voters’ right next to a photo of burning Greece - and without any trace of irony.

Looks like Sunak is going down the 30p Lee route - fight the next election on culture wars because there's nothing else they can fight it on.

[Dorcus]

Meanwhile, referring to the actual title of this thread, The Times states that the PM will go soft on green policies to ‘woo voters’ right next to a photo of burning Greece - and without any trace of irony.

Bang goes his blue wall.

[North Cardiff Blue]

Bang goes his blue wall.

Labour will win the next election and Starmer won't be able to rush net zero either, the country is in a mess if he wants more than one term in office he will have the same approach, the dates will be pushed back.

How many voters want to give up, their cars, and flights, holidays and take a massive further reduction in lifestyle?

[xsnaggle]

Bang goes his blue wall.

But the latest polls seem to show that Starmer is losing ground in the old Red Wall constituencies. Makes no sense for either lot.