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Thread: Government and Labour against Gaza ceasefire

  1. #1

    Government and Labour against Gaza ceasefire

    Both parties are unanimous in their public stance on this issue. Neither will call for a ceasefire.

    The chief reason both give seems to be morally questionable in my opinion. The reason given is that any ceasefire would allow Hamas to regroup and thwart the Israeli aim of ridding themselves of the threat of Hamas altogether.

    The fact that any realistic operation to achieve such an aim will necessitate the eventual slaughter of many more thousands of innocent people surely raises an ethical quandary.

    The question is this: is it morally acceptable to allow the slaughter of thousands of innocent lives in order to eradicate an evil entity whose continued existence would probably endanger far less lives than those lost in the military operation itself.

    Would not a far more humane and morally acceptable stance be to call an immediate ceasefire and allow the Qataris to broker a deal for the return of the Israeli hostages even if that would likely involve the return of Hamas prisoners from Israeli jails?

    One thing for sure is that unless Israel obliterates Gaza then this cycle of violence will continue. Is all this loss of innocent life really morally justifiable?

  2. #2
    International jon1959's Avatar
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    Re: Government and Labour against Gaza ceasefire

    Tory ministerial aide Paul Bristow sacked for calling for a Gaza ceasefire.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-67264814

    Every little helps.

  3. #3

    Re: Government and Labour against Gaza ceasefire

    Quote Originally Posted by jon1959 View Post
    Tory ministerial aide Paul Bristow sacked for calling for a Gaza ceasefire.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-67264814

    Every little helps.
    Bloody racist aye !

  4. #4

    Re: Government and Labour against Gaza ceasefire

    Quote Originally Posted by SLUDGE FACTORY View Post
    Bloody racist aye !
    Why would someone be sacked for calling for peace in the region?

  5. #5

    Re: Government and Labour against Gaza ceasefire

    Quote Originally Posted by jon1959 View Post
    Tory ministerial aide Paul Bristow sacked for calling for a Gaza ceasefire.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-67264814

    Every little helps.
    It’s strange what you can and can’t get sacked for in government

  6. #6

    Re: Government and Labour against Gaza ceasefire

    Both sides have said they dont want a cease fire - so it makes no difference what 'we' say
    We have F all to do with either sides business.
    It's a war, both sides want a war, both 'govts' want to have a scrap.
    Maybe for once we should keep our noses out of other peoples arguments.

  7. #7

    Re: Government and Labour against Gaza ceasefire

    Quote Originally Posted by pipster View Post
    Both sides have said they dont want a cease fire - so it makes no difference what 'we' say
    We have F all to do with either sides business.
    It's a war, both sides want a war, both 'govts' want to have a scrap.
    Maybe for once we should keep our noses out of other peoples arguments.
    That would be obnoxious Pipsqueak and it would be a cowardly failure of moral duty. Our voice carries little weight but we should use all our influence to bear upon the USA to enforce a ceasefire because US defunding of Israel is the only course of action which will halt this tragedy.

  8. #8

    Re: Government and Labour against Gaza ceasefire

    Quote Originally Posted by jon1959 View Post
    Tory ministerial aide Paul Bristow sacked for calling for a Gaza ceasefire.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-67264814

    Every little helps.
    The world's gone mad.

  9. #9

    Re: Government and Labour against Gaza ceasefire

    Seems the UK Government and the main opposition party are out of step with what a large majority of UK nationals think on this matter.

    https://www.ipsos.com/en-uk/israel-g...-on-both-sides

  10. #10
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    Re: Government and Labour against Gaza ceasefire

    Quote Originally Posted by the other bob wilson View Post
    Seems the UK Government and the main opposition party are out of step with what a large majority of UK nationals think on this matter.

    https://www.ipsos.com/en-uk/israel-g...-on-both-sides
    It's causing Labour big problems with a lot of their councilors.

  11. #11

    Re: Government and Labour against Gaza ceasefire

    Quote Originally Posted by North Cardiff Blue View Post
    It's causing Labour big problems with a lot of their councilors.
    What is it with western governments appetite for war when most of their citizens are experiencing financial hardship.

  12. #12

    Re: Government and Labour against Gaza ceasefire

    Quote Originally Posted by TWGL1 View Post
    What is it with western governments appetite for war when most of their citizens are experiencing financial hardship.
    Agree 👍

  13. #13

    Re: Government and Labour against Gaza ceasefire

    Quote Originally Posted by Dorcus View Post
    That would be obnoxious Pipsqueak and it would be a cowardly failure of moral duty. Our voice carries little weight but we should use all our influence to bear upon the USA to enforce a ceasefire because US defunding of Israel is the only course of action which will halt this tragedy.
    Being rather judgemental again Dorky.
    As an international negotiator as you appear to be, how would you go about implementing your ceasefire?
    Who would you speak to in the US in order to get this defunding of Israel?

  14. #14

    Re: Government and Labour against Gaza ceasefire

    Quote Originally Posted by pipster View Post
    Being rather judgemental again Dorky.
    As an international negotiator as you appear to be, how would you go about implementing your ceasefire?
    Who would you speak to in the US in order to get this defunding of Israel?
    Joe Biden Pipsqueak

  15. #15

    Re: Government and Labour against Gaza ceasefire

    Quote Originally Posted by Dorcus View Post
    Joe Biden Pipsqueak
    As an international negotiator, what would you ask Joe Biden, do you think he would listen to you?

  16. #16

    Re: Government and Labour against Gaza ceasefire

    Quote Originally Posted by pipster View Post
    As an international negotiator, what would you ask Joe Biden, do you think he would listen to you?
    Not me Pipsqueak but the international community will hold some sway at government level so obviously the least we can do is demand of our governments that they lobby uncle Joe to demand a ceasefire of Israel

  17. #17

    Re: Government and Labour against Gaza ceasefire

    Quote Originally Posted by Dorcus View Post
    Not me Pipsqueak but the international community will hold some sway at government level so obviously the least we can do is demand of our governments that they lobby uncle Joe to demand a ceasefire of Israel
    Dorky - you shouldn't hide your talents. This may only be a football message board - but I'm sure Joe, Rishy, Benny et al are all watching this place, waiting for your next pronouncement on world peace and how to handle these very complex situations.
    So well done you, for showing the world how it should be done....

  18. #18

    Re: Government and Labour against Gaza ceasefire

    Quote Originally Posted by pipster View Post
    Dorky - you shouldn't hide your talents. This may only be a football message board - but I'm sure Joe, Rishy, Benny et al are all watching this place, waiting for your next pronouncement on world peace and how to handle these very complex situations.
    So well done you, for showing the world how it should be done....
    So clearly you have no concerns about innocent children being slaughtered Pipsqueak and your stance would be "let the tragedy take it's course". Interesting but rather predictable. One wonders what your stance be if it were your children being blown up by a murderous army. Maybe you would sort it out yourself and decline outside help. What a dilemma for you

  19. #19

    Re: Government and Labour against Gaza ceasefire

    Quote Originally Posted by Dorcus View Post
    So clearly you have no concerns about innocent children being slaughtered Pipsqueak and your stance would be "let the tragedy take it's course". Interesting but rather predictable. One wonders what your stance be if it were your children being blown up by a murderous army. Maybe you would sort it out yourself and decline outside help. What a dilemma for you
    I can’t recall you this passionate about the Yemen conflict or the previous conflict in Ukraine ( people were happy for billions to be sent prolonging the crisis ) , although I do agree with you on this one.

  20. #20

    Re: Government and Labour against Gaza ceasefire

    Quote Originally Posted by Dorcus View Post
    So clearly you have no concerns about innocent children being slaughtered Pipsqueak and your stance would be "let the tragedy take it's course". Interesting but rather predictable. One wonders what your stance be if it were your children being blown up by a murderous army. Maybe you would sort it out yourself and decline outside help. What a dilemma for you
    Agree with me or you like innocent children being killed!

    Grow up Dorcus. You've written some sensible things in this thread, but this isn't one of them.

  21. #21

    Re: Government and Labour against Gaza ceasefire

    Quote Originally Posted by TWGL1 View Post
    I can’t recall you this passionate about the Yemen conflict or the previous conflict in Ukraine ( people were happy for billions to be sent prolonging the crisis ) , although I do agree with you on this one.
    I'm passionate about anything and everything.

  22. #22

    Re: Government and Labour against Gaza ceasefire

    Quote Originally Posted by JamesWales View Post
    Agree with me or you like innocent children being killed!

    Grow up Dorcus. You've written some sensible things in this thread, but this isn't one of them.
    And who the hell cares about your infantile opinion?

    I wanted to guage the ethical tone of the board and I expected the responses I got from the usual suspects.

    Do you really think it's morally acceptable to say "let them sort things out for themselves" when we all know thousands of defenseless innocents are being slaughtered without mercy and have no recourse to "sorting things out'?

    And don't bother writing your usual sanctimonious claptrap. I just wanted to guage opinion. A simple yes or no will suffice.

  23. #23

    Re: Government and Labour against Gaza ceasefire

    Quote Originally Posted by Dorcus View Post
    Both parties are unanimous in their public stance on this issue. Neither will call for a ceasefire.

    The chief reason both give seems to be morally questionable in my opinion. The reason given is that any ceasefire would allow Hamas to regroup and thwart the Israeli aim of ridding themselves of the threat of Hamas altogether.

    The fact that any realistic operation to achieve such an aim will necessitate the eventual slaughter of many more thousands of innocent people surely raises an ethical quandary.

    The question is this: is it morally acceptable to allow the slaughter of thousands of innocent lives in order to eradicate an evil entity whose continued existence would probably endanger far less lives than those lost in the military operation itself.

    Would not a far more humane and morally acceptable stance be to call an immediate ceasefire and allow the Qataris to broker a deal for the return of the Israeli hostages even if that would likely involve the return of Hamas prisoners from Israeli jails?

    One thing for sure is that unless Israel obliterates Gaza then this cycle of violence will continue. Is all this loss of innocent life really morally justifiable?
    I can understand Israel’s rage but I cannot understand parties more distant from this mess actually condoning the reaction since.

  24. #24

    Re: Government and Labour against Gaza ceasefire

    Quote Originally Posted by Dorcus View Post
    I'm passionate about anything and everything.
    Apart from kids right

  25. #25

    Re: Government and Labour against Gaza ceasefire

    Quote Originally Posted by TWGL1 View Post
    Apart from kids right
    No apart from obsessive bras, right 😂

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