What do you understand a FUNDAMENTALIST to be?

[Gofer Blue]

Religious fundamentalism is the practice of either an individual or a group that look for literal interpretations of original religious books or text. They then practice these teaching in all aspects yo their lives. They believe that their beliefs are the only ones that are 'true' and there is no other interpretation. There is no other option or alternatives to beliefs or teachings.

I have a negative opinion as the lack of flexibility or willingness to accept other people's opinions or beliefs I find confrontational and not pragmatic. It also limits to compromise.

I throwing in that individual religious fundamentalism such as your own differs wildly from some group fundamentalism which is much more problematic in some parts of the world and included violence, retribution and tyranny.

Although you have very strong convictions and beliefs about your faith I'd suggest you also have the capacity to compromise.

The fundamentalism I was referring to, in the context of my original post differs greatly to your understanding and another context all together.

Best of luck to you butt.

You probably should not make that assumption about me. Yes, have a strong faith and I am a much more compassionate person since becoming a Christian, (probably deemed a “nice person” in the eyes of the world), but don't forget I am a follower of Jesus.

Now Jesus also had very strong beliefs, was tolerant, but uncompromising. Unlike the “religious” people of his time he was at ease mixing with the “undesirable” folk like prostitutes, beggars, lepers, tax collectors (who were despised as they were collaborators with the hated Roman occupiers) etc. I would argue that if he was intolerant or judgemental of these people he would have stayed well clear of them.

There is the example of the woman who was caught having sex with a man who was not her husband and in accordance with the Jewish law she was about to be stoned to death by a crowd but Jesus intervened. He spoke those now famous words: let anyone of you who is without sin be the first to throw a stone at her, (John 8:7-11) whereby the crowd quietly drifted away, one by one. Jesus had saved the woman from death but then he said to her, go now and leave your life of sin, an uncompromising message if ever there was one i.e. he loved the sinner but hated the sin. He unashamedly did not compromise in any way, but he had compassion on her.

I believe that Jesus was God in human form so in that way he 100% knew what it was like to be human, subject to all the same things that we are: pain, love, moods, temptations, anger etc., yet, unlike me and every person on planet Earth, he was sinless. Other faiths deny this and believe he was just a good human being. I can tolerate the fact that they have this opinion but that's between them and God. I will not compromise my position.

Jesus said "I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me. If you really know me, you will know my Father as well. From now on, you do know him and have seen him.” (John 14:6). At face value this seems to be a very arrogant statement, but there is no escaping it, it is crystal clear and he said it! Now folk can either accept it or reject it as being a typical piece of Christian dogma. Again, folk should be made aware of it (that's my job as a Christian so they have a chance to consider it*) but of course they have the free will to make their own decision. It's between them and God, I've done my bit so please leave me out of it. Rest assured I will not resort to coercion or violence or remove parts of anyone's anatomy to “convince” them!

I go about my daily life trying to live in peace with everyone I come across as Jesus would expect me to, but I am not a saint in the vernacular sense (although in the biblical sense I am). The apostle Paul wrote that these are the attributes of a “real” Christian: love, joy, peace, forbearance, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness and self-control. (Galatians 5: 22-23). I can put my hand up and honestly say that I fail every day in most of these!

*”The Great Commission” - Jesus told his disciples to “go and make disciples of all nations, baptising them in the name of the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit and teaching them to obey everything I have told you. And surely I am with you always, even to the very end of the age”
(Matthew 28:16-20).

[Jordi Culé]

You probably should not make that assumption about me. Yes, have a strong faith and I am a much more compassionate person since becoming a Christian, (probably deemed a “nice person” in the eyes of the world), but don't forget I am a follower of Jesus.

Now Jesus also had very strong beliefs, was tolerant, but uncompromising. Unlike the “religious” people of his time he was at ease mixing with the “undesirable” folk like prostitutes, beggars, lepers, tax collectors (who were despised as they were collaborators with the hated Roman occupiers) etc. I would argue that if he was intolerant or judgemental of these people he would have stayed well clear of them.

There is the example of the woman who was caught having sex with a man who was not her husband and in accordance with the Jewish law she was about to be stoned to death by a crowd but Jesus intervened. He spoke those now famous words: let anyone of you who is without sin be the first to throw a stone at her, (John 8:7-11) whereby the crowd quietly drifted away, one by one. Jesus had saved the woman from death but then he said to her, go now and leave your life of sin, an uncompromising message if ever there was one i.e. he loved the sinner but hated the sin. He unashamedly did not compromise in any way, but he had compassion on her.

I believe that Jesus was God in human form so in that way he 100% knew what it was like to be human, subject to all the same things that we are: pain, love, moods, temptations, anger etc., yet, unlike me and every person on planet Earth, he was sinless. Other faiths deny this and believe he was just a good human being. I can tolerate the fact that they have this opinion but that's between them and God. I will not compromise my position.

Jesus said "I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me. If you really know me, you will know my Father as well. From now on, you do know him and have seen him.” (John 14:6). At face value this seems to be a very arrogant statement, but there is no escaping it, it is crystal clear and he said it! Now folk can either accept it or reject it as being a typical piece of Christian dogma. Again, folk should be made aware of it (that's my job as a Christian so they have a chance to consider it*) but of course they have the free will to make their own decision. It's between them and God, I've done my bit so please leave me out of it. Rest assured I will not resort to coercion or violence or remove parts of anyone's anatomy to “convince” them!

I go about my daily life trying to live in peace with everyone I come across as Jesus would expect me to, but I am not a saint in the vernacular sense (although in the biblical sense I am). The apostle Paul wrote that these are the attributes of a “real” Christian: love, joy, peace, forbearance, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness and self-control. (Galatians 5: 22-23). I can put my hand up and honestly say that I fail every day in most of these!

*”The Great Commission” - Jesus told his disciples to “go and make disciples of all nations, baptising them in the name of the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit and teaching them to obey everything I have told you. And surely I am with you always, even to the very end of the age”
(Matthew 28:16-20).

Thanks Gofer.

An interesting read on your personal thoughts, reflections and how you practice and live by your beliefs.

The tolerance and compassion you practice towards others is only due to your beliefs, you didn't hold these qualities prior to becoming a committed follower of Jesus?

The contrast between your understanding of God is a massive contrast to the Christian Nationalism of some groups in the USA who advocate living and practicing religious values from the Old Testament and this includes stoning individuals for adultery.

https://www.rollingstone.com/politic...sm-1234797127/

Different interpretations of God and how he would act I suppose?

[truthpaste]

Thanks Gofer.

An interesting read on your personal thoughts, reflections and how you practice and live by your beliefs.

The tolerance and compassion you practice towards others is only due to your beliefs, you didn't hold these qualities prior to becoming a committed follower of Jesus?

The contrast between your understanding of God is a massive contrast to the Christian Nationalism of some groups in the USA who advocate living and practicing religious values from the Old Testament and this includes stoning individuals for adultery.

https://www.rollingstone.com/politic...sm-1234797127/

Different interpretations of God and how he would act I suppose?

I'm sure Gofer will give you another helpful reply, however just on your final point of 'interpreting' God and His Word, the Bible:-

1. Like any book, we should never dive in and out to extract information without knowing the surrounding context. So many people do, and end up misrepresenting that book, whatever it may be.
2. While Christians still read and learn from the Old Testament, it now mainly provides a platform and deeper interpretaion for what we discover in the New Testament (NT); and in the NT we read about the origin of the Church (see Acts chapter 2) and therefore the instructions (New Covenant) that God has for today, which does NOT include stoning people! There is a lot more to this than what I have said, this is just an overview of the contrast between the Old and New Testaments and God's dealings with mankind.
If you have further questions then please don't hold back.

[Gofer Blue]

Thanks Gofer.

An interesting read on your personal thoughts, reflections and how you practice and live by your beliefs.

The tolerance and compassion you practice towards others is only due to your beliefs, you didn't hold these qualities prior to becoming a committed follower of Jesus?

The contrast between your understanding of God is a massive contrast to the Christian Nationalism of some groups in the USA who advocate living and practicing religious values from the Old Testament and this includes stoning individuals for adultery.

https://www.rollingstone.com/politic...sm-1234797127/

Different interpretations of God and how he would act I suppose?

Jordi – in answer to your first question, no, I did not hold those qualities before I became a Christian. I was intolerant, judgemental and very lacking in compassion! I am ashamed to admit it but on occasions these traits can occasionally still creep into my mind when I observe what is going on in the world. My main negative reaction these days is anger, anger at all the injustices in the world. I can even get angry with God which is stupid really as the things I get angry about are man-made, but I guess he is big enough to take it.

Re your second question: I am very wary of far right American Christians, not that I know any personally but from what I observe on TV and also from some of the YouTube videos that are out there. One sickening image I remember was of Donald Trump waving a Bible about in front of a church in the USA somewhere. The verse that comes to mind is: By their deeds you will know them. Does a man gather grapes from thorns or figs from briars?” (Matthew 7:16).

The story in the link you provided is quite shocking. As I’ve said before, Jesus came with a new covenant which supercedes the OT covenant. It was quite common in OT days for folk to sacrifice animals as burnt offerings to God as atonement for their sins but Jesus himself was ultimately the supreme sacrifice so this practice is no longer necessary.

The OT takes sin very seriously, as a contamination that can disrupt the good order God places in creation and that can potentially cause chaos in the world. To cleanse sin from the community, life was required. I think Moses who gave the laws to the people was overzealous in his understanding of what God wanted. It was very important to keep order especially when the Jews were involved in the exodus. Of course, it’s very difficult for us 21st century folk to get our head around these ancient customs. Maybe this is where these American Christian Nationalists are getting their ideas from i.e. remove offenders from society (permanently) in order to maintain social order!

[Jordi Culé]

Jordi – in answer to your first question, no, I did not hold those qualities before I became a Christian. I was intolerant, judgemental and very lacking in compassion! I am ashamed to admit it but on occasions these traits can occasionally still creep into my mind when I observe what is going on in the world. My main negative reaction these days is anger, anger at all the injustices in the world. I can even get angry with God which is stupid really as the things I get angry about are man-made, but I guess he is big enough to take it.

Re your second question: I am very wary of far right American Christians, not that I know any personally but from what I observe on TV and also from some of the YouTube videos that are out there. One sickening image I remember was of Donald Trump waving a Bible about in front of a church in the USA somewhere. The verse that comes to mind is: By their deeds you will know them. Does a man gather grapes from thorns or figs from briars?” (Matthew 7:16).

The story in the link you provided is quite shocking. As I’ve said before, Jesus came with a new covenant which supercedes the OT covenant. It was quite common in OT days for folk to sacrifice animals as burnt offerings to God as atonement for their sins but Jesus himself was ultimately the supreme sacrifice so this practice is no longer necessary.

The OT takes sin very seriously, as a contamination that can disrupt the good order God places in creation and that can potentially cause chaos in the world. To cleanse sin from the community, life was required. I think Moses who gave the laws to the people was overzealous in his understanding of what God wanted. It was very important to keep order especially when the Jews were involved in the exodus. Of course, it’s very difficult for us 21st century folk to get our head around these ancient customs. Maybe this is where these American Christian Nationalists are getting their ideas from i.e. remove offenders from society (permanently) in order to maintain social order!

Cheers for your very personal contribution. Takes something to do that on an open forum but I guess you're happy answering any questions.

If religion/Christianity works for you then great. I've no problem with people's personal beliefs, it's a bit colloquial and probably simplistic but "whatever floats your boat..."

I obviously 'don't believe' but do recognise religion can make some people better personalities for whatever reasons that maybe.

I'm an atheist but there again so was Han Solo.

I live with a church goer and alhough we have had theological discussions it's never descended into argument and they've never felt the need to suggest my lifestyle or beliefs are wrong.

I do take issue with any religious groups/parties who try to set an agenda or pass down doctrines on others where my use of the term 'fundamentalist' was used, with a negative view. You've taken your time to clear that up and we've agreed the term can be construed and interpreted in different ways with a number of meanings.

[Gofer Blue]

Cheers for your very personal contribution. Takes something to do that on an open forum but I guess you're happy answering any questions.

If religion/Christianity works for you then great. I've no problem with people's personal beliefs, it's a bit colloquial and probably simplistic but "whatever floats your boat..."

I obviously 'don't believe' but do recognise religion can make some people better personalities for whatever reasons that maybe.

I'm an atheist but there again so was Han Solo.

I live with a church goer and alhough we have had theological discussions it's never descended into argument and they've never felt the need to suggest my lifestyle or beliefs are wrong.

I do take issue with any religious groups/parties who try to set an agenda or pass down doctrines on others where my use of the term 'fundamentalist' was used, with a negative view. You've taken your time to clear that up and we've agreed the term can be construed and interpreted in different ways with a number of meanings.

No problem, always happy to share my views with others and never afraid of having my faith challenged. However as I always say, judge me by my actions not my words - somewhat difficult on an Internet forum of course! There must now be many people on this forum who have been exposed to Christian thinking (1650 views of this thread to date but only 44 replies, mostly from the same dozen or so people). In a sense that's all I can do then, I have shared the gospel as Jesus requires of his followers but the rest is up to them.

[goats]

You probably should not make that assumption about me. Yes, have a strong faith and I am a much more compassionate person since becoming a Christian, (probably deemed a “nice person” in the eyes of the world), but don't forget I am a follower of Jesus.

Now Jesus also had very strong beliefs, was tolerant, but uncompromising. Unlike the “religious” people of his time he was at ease mixing with the “undesirable” folk like prostitutes, beggars, lepers, tax collectors (who were despised as they were collaborators with the hated Roman occupiers) etc. I would argue that if he was intolerant or judgemental of these people he would have stayed well clear of them.

There is the example of the woman who was caught having sex with a man who was not her husband and in accordance with the Jewish law she was about to be stoned to death by a crowd but Jesus intervened. He spoke those now famous words: let anyone of you who is without sin be the first to throw a stone at her, (John 8:7-11) whereby the crowd quietly drifted away, one by one. Jesus had saved the woman from death but then he said to her, go now and leave your life of sin, an uncompromising message if ever there was one i.e. he loved the sinner but hated the sin. He unashamedly did not compromise in any way, but he had compassion on her.

I believe that Jesus was God in human form so in that way he 100% knew what it was like to be human, subject to all the same things that we are: pain, love, moods, temptations, anger etc., yet, unlike me and every person on planet Earth, he was sinless. Other faiths deny this and believe he was just a good human being. I can tolerate the fact that they have this opinion but that's between them and God. I will not compromise my position.

Jesus said "I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me. If you really know me, you will know my Father as well. From now on, you do know him and have seen him.” (John 14:6). At face value this seems to be a very arrogant statement, but there is no escaping it, it is crystal clear and he said it! Now folk can either accept it or reject it as being a typical piece of Christian dogma. Again, folk should be made aware of it (that's my job as a Christian so they have a chance to consider it*) but of course they have the free will to make their own decision. It's between them and God, I've done my bit so please leave me out of it. Rest assured I will not resort to coercion or violence or remove parts of anyone's anatomy to “convince” them!

I go about my daily life trying to live in peace with everyone I come across as Jesus would expect me to, but I am not a saint in the vernacular sense (although in the biblical sense I am). The apostle Paul wrote that these are the attributes of a “real” Christian: love, joy, peace, forbearance, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness and self-control. (Galatians 5: 22-23). I can put my hand up and honestly say that I fail every day in most of these!

*”The Great Commission” - Jesus told his disciples to “go and make disciples of all nations, baptising them in the name of the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit and teaching them to obey everything I have told you. And surely I am with you always, even to the very end of the age”
(Matthew 28:16-20).

It does amaze me somewhat that people actually believe the stuff written about a bloke called Jesus 2000 yrs ago, it’s more than likely all bollocks, like most old stories, which seem to grow in obscureness as the years roll by. Not forgetting that the church used fear to rule so would regularly peddle lies and mis information to control the people. Lastly, stuff that was relevant so long ago, really isn’t now.
Morals and being kind, curtious etc will always be in favour but looking how beliefs of just 20/30 years ago are not tolerated anymore and some that might have you clipped 100 yrs ago, like being gay, are now fine, make stuff written so long ago almost completely irrelevant. You will never see that though….I fully get that…

[Gofer Blue]

It does amaze me somewhat that people actually believe the stuff written about a bloke called Jesus 2000 yrs ago, it’s more than likely all bollocks, like most old stories, which seem to grow in obscureness as the years roll by. Not forgetting that the church used fear to rule so would regularly peddle lies and mis information to control the people. Lastly, stuff that was relevant so long ago, really isn’t now.
Morals and being kind, curtious etc will always be in favour but looking how beliefs of just 20/30 years ago are not tolerated anymore and some that might have you clipped 100 yrs ago, like being gay, are now fine, make stuff written so long ago almost completely irrelevant. You will never see that though….I fully get that…

In pretty short supply in this country these days I find. For example, our politicians aren't setting particularly good standards of morals, kindness or courtesy. Also this forum can sometimes be a microcosm in that regard!

[goats]

In pretty short supply in this country these days I find. For example, our politicians aren't setting particularly good standards of morals, kindness or courtesy. Also this forum can sometimes be a microcosm in that regard!

Don’t ever look at politicians as a benchmark for society surely? Absolute freaks of nature most of them, so out of touch with anything real. We really need a new political system.