Lets Have a Sensible Debate -Part 1

[Tuerto]

I would suggest a good manager can make a team out of the players at his disposal and try and get the best out of them. For me Bulut has his tactic and shoehorns players into what he wants.

Agree, but that will not stop good players showing us what they can do, even if it's sporadic. i've said enough on Bulut, His tactics are disgraceful, But it's not down to Bulut when a player decides to hold on to the ball that half a second to long which can be the difference in an attacking sense. It's not down to Bulut when players make the most basic of errors, and that happens regularly. The players have to take some responibility or improve. And all of this guff about coaching, well, a Touch can't be coached, awareness can't be coached, vision can't be coached, intelligence can't be coached, and those are the things we desperately need.

Just to add, when players are out there, then they have license to perform, the manager is a spectator, he has the power to hook plaayers, but he can't dictate individual freedoms and decisions on the ball, and if he could, then **** him. Maybe the players should stop being so soft and maybe the upporters should demand much more from them (and the manager) and stop making excuses.

[Undercoverinwurzelland]

So, in short, and going by this thread. For Rubin to fulfill his potential, we need a new manager, different players and different tactics. I propose changing the angle of the stadium.

You could swap "Rubin" with "Cardiff City" in that sentence.

[LeningradCowboy]

I've watched all of the Wales U21 games when they have been on Youtube for this qualifying, Colwill is the outstanding player of that group, if he'd played for another club I think we as Wales fans would be very excited about him.

Not sure that I'd be too excited about a player who is almost 22 but still appearing for the U21s.

[life on mars]

Regarding of Manager next season

what do we do with Rubin Colwill ?

His best position ?
Do we build a team around him ?
Is he good enough for top level championship / prem football ?

Had more minutes this season than last and I,m still 50/50 his best position for starters .

What do you lot think ?

Stay with Mgr, but back him.

Use his contacts abroad he has a few Greeks and Turks especially disciplined types.

Less loans more contract signings.

Under 27 signings only

Sign players who are comfortable on the ball with , vision and play with thier heads up.

Send Rubin on loan to Germany.

( we only rate Rubin as he is Welsh, yes he is good , build a team around him?? is not a viable thought In my humble opinion )

Forget about Kieffer .

Cancel Rambos contract its sucking valuable wages away from the club with very little payback.

[MOZZER2]

Stay with Mgr, but back him.

Use his contacts abroad he has a few Greeks and Turks especially disciplined types.

Less loans more contract signings.

Under 27 signings only

Sign players who are comfortable on the ball with , vision and play with thier heads up.

Send Rubin on loan to Germany.

( we only rate Rubin as he is Welsh, yes he is good , build a team around him?? is not a viable thought In my humble opinion )

Forget about Kieffer .

Cancel Rambos contract its sucking valuable wages away from the club with very little payback.

I will add a part 3 to my sensible debate post as sludge as nicked part 2 - lol - which I am going to address the signing and type of players required and the dreadful situation Bulut faced during the January window

will do that after the Coventry game but you have hit the nail on the head regarding type of players required to take us up to the next level

But nice to see some well thought out and constructed replys in general regarding the Colwill situation

[PontBlue]

Regarding of Manager next season

what do we do with Rubin Colwill ?

His best position ?
Do we build a team around him ?
Is he good enough for top level championship / prem football ?

Had more minutes this season than last and I,m still 50/50 his best position for starters .

What do you lot think ?

You've got to play him as a 10 but you've got to have mobile attack minded players around him who want to play forward.

[The Lone Gunman]

Stay with Mgr, but back him...

He’s been backed. None of the three most expensive signings he’s made started on Saturday. Two of them didn’t end up playing a single minute despite the appalling performances of those who were on the field.

That speaks volumes.

[life on mars]

He’s been backed. None of the three most expensive signings he’s made started on Saturday. Two of them didn’t end up playing a single minute despite the appalling performances of those who were on the field.

That speaks volumes.

What signings are you refering too??

[The Lone Gunman]

What signings are you refering too??

Ramsey, Siopis and Turnbull, obviously. Who did you think I was referring to?

[llan bluebird]

I watched Fernandez yesterday and Odengard today for both wear 8 (maybe coincidence) but have such free roles. Both come deep to get the ball, travel forward, pass and keep moving towards the goal.

When I look at Rubins skillset, obviously nowhere near that level but a Poundland version of those two, but where would Bulut play them in Bulut ball?

[LA Bluebird]

To be fair, Arteta may have been on the blower to Erol for his tactics in the second half here

[Eric the Half a Bee]

To be fair, Arteta may have been on the blower to Erol for his tactics in the second half here

Don't think so. Arsenal created a couple of chances on the break from open play.

[life on mars]

Ramsey, Siopis and Turnbull, obviously. Who did you think I was referring to?

I was interested in what you deemed as backing ??

Ramsey busted flush waste of money probably not Managers choice .

Siopis dogged midfielder which we have plenty off ..


Turnbill?? Busted flush Celtic squad player .

Sorry if thats not backing , its lacking and cheap options.

Every manager since Harris has cried out for a real forward after Kieffer left , real backing is getting a forward in plus a creative midfielder and speedy winger, buying Kipree..

What you suggest are cheap fill in's ......

[life on mars]

You've got to play him as a 10 but you've got to have mobile attack minded players around him who want to play forward.

He's not good enough , if he was that good Wales would play him at number 10 and we would be in the Euros due to his emphatic number 10 talent ??

You.have to wonder since coming onto the scene why he's not had a team built around him at number10 , there's been a few managers that had not applied that tactic, question is why ??

[SLUDGE FACTORY]

Don't think so. Arsenal created a couple of chances on the break from open play.

Bring back warnock

[The Lone Gunman]

What you suggest are cheap fill in's ......

I haven’t suggested anything other than I believe Bulut has been backed. After all, he’s been allowed to bring in fourteen new players and I’m confident the club’s wage bill is bigger this season than it was last.

Of course, he’s not been allowed to throw multi-millions around in terms of transfer fees and wages, but that’s down to a combination of economic realities and the rules. He’s no different in that respect to most Championship managers, is he?

[North Cardiff Blue]

I haven’t suggested anything other than I believe Bulut has been backed. After all, he’s been allowed to bring in fourteen new players and I’m confident the club’s wage bill is bigger this season than it was last.

Of course, he’s not been allowed to throw multi-millions around in terms of transfer fees and wages, but that’s down to a combination of economic realities and the rules. He’s no different in that respect to most Championship managers, is he?

He had a limited choice of players, we were placed under an EFL transfer embargo, so only partly backed and the players he did want in January were out of reach.

[Eric the Half a Bee]

He had a limited choice of players, we were placed under an EFL transfer embargo, so only partly backed and the players he did want in January were out of reach.

The thing is that Tan takes FFP very seriously (as he needs to), so spending millions on players is unlikely in the summer. Before the embargo we had to get rid of players before we could bring any in, mostly frees or low cost transfers and I see this summer being no different.

Anyone thinking that Bulut will have a war chest to spend this summer to bring in lots of good players is living in cloud cuckoo land. Our wage bill can't afford to rise much, either.

[North Cardiff Blue]

The thing is that Tan takes FFP very seriously (as he needs to), so spending millions on players is unlikely in the summer. Before the embargo we had to get rid of players before we could bring any in, mostly frees or low cost transfers and I see this summer being no different.

Anyone thinking that Bulut will have a war chest to spend this summer to bring in lots of good players is living in cloud cuckoo land. Our wage bill can't afford to rise much, either.

Agreed but at least he will have the whole of the market option as we won't be under an embargo, the players he signed improved us dramatically, he can do the same again, build on that and take another step forward, we need to prioritise a left back and Striker and he will know that.

[Eric the Half a Bee]

the players he signed improved us dramatically.

Couldn't agree more. Diedhiou, Runarsson, Panzo, Ugbo and Meite were superb signings. Siopis is a 9/10 every game and Turnbull will light up the Championship next season.

[Sparticus_Mills]

Would it be fair to say Wales U21 do build their team around him and with some success, I'd even go far to say he's is the outstanding player in the U21 team. I don't think our manager plays a system that suites our best players, as has been said previously, he tries to shoehorn players into his, and it hasn't worked.

[olderblue]

Would it be fair to say Wales U21 do build their team around him and with some success, I'd even go far to say he's is the outstanding player in the U21 team. I don't think our manager plays a system that suites our best players, as has been said previously, he tries to shoehorn players into his, and it hasn't worked.

You can build a team around a creative player, if you have the balls and imagination to play football in an exciting attacking system.

If you’re shit scared of losing then you set up so defensively that you don’t need creativity in your team, in fact a creative skilful footballer would look out of place as a square peg in a round hole.

If you’re dogmatic and carry on losing, you might just keep repeating the same mistakes over and over again.

Bulut isn’t a good, progressive coach, his football is dire, he won’t take risks and he’s bored the pants off most fans these days

He could have played with one holding midfielder on Friday and gone for it, he didn’t, he won’t and until he’s gone in the summer, any creativity will be parked, hopefully waiting for a decent coach to turn up.

[life on mars]

I haven’t suggested anything other than I believe Bulut has been backed. After all, he’s been allowed to bring in fourteen new players and I’m confident the club’s wage bill is bigger this season than it was last.

Of course, he’s not been allowed to throw multi-millions around in terms of transfer fees and wages, but that’s down to a combination of economic realities and the rules. He’s no different in that respect to most Championship managers, is he?

I would argue he has done well with what he's been given, the Rambo one us where it probably pushes the value up without any return. Bet he'd rather had 2 or 3 fit seasoned players in rather than one who had hardly played.

After the Norwich defeat we had a great run of results. We didn't turn up at the Jacks which for me was an appalling effort by the players.

We beat a decent side today .

For me he has something to offer as a manager a number of players have flourished most notably NG, Grant .Sipos, Ralls, Goutas ,Alnwick, Bowler. Collins .

I do wonder how we'd be if :

O'Dowda & Rambo had stayed fit .

Robinson delivered on his undoubted skills .

Bought back Hugill and Kipree

Tanner & Colwill (built) on thier promise .

And the club really backed him and got in a decent striker instead of washed up journeymen forwards .

[life on mars]

Would it be fair to say Wales U21 do build their team around him and with some success, I'd even go far to say he's is the outstanding player in the U21 team. I don't think our manager plays a system that suites our best players, as has been said previously, he tries to shoehorn players into his, and it hasn't worked.

Were 11th , if we had drawn at the Jacks and won at home to Sunderland, we would be 7th on 60 points, 4 points off 6th placed Norwich.

No Championship side is going to build a team around Colwill he is not at that stage, and may never be .

U21 International games are a world away from the rigours of the Championship , at times they appear to be non committal blown up training sessions when winning against the mighty Lithuanians , Gibraltar, Iceland U21's.

Over the last few years big boy U21's like Belgium , Holland & Switzerland stuck 15 goals on us .

[J R Hartley]

Were 11th , if we had drawn at the Jacks and won at home to Sunderland, we would be 7th on 60 points, 4 points off 6th placed Norwich.

No Championship side is going to build a team around Colwill he is not at that stage, and may never be .

U21 International games are a world away from the rigours of the Championship , at times they appear to be non committal blown up training sessions when winning against the mighty Lithuanians , Gibraltar, Iceland U21's.

Over the last few years big boy U21's like Belgium , Holland & Switzerland stuck 15 goals on us .

If youre auntie had bollocks she would be your uncle.