Giggs on the brink of Wales appointment

[ccfc_is_my_life]

I'm not disputing that, they weren't even suspect - it was even more blatant than that. But he was exactly the kind of player susceptible to hamstring issues.

Agreed. People would have had more sympathy if genuine.

As John Hallworth showed, there are certain other ways to get groin/hamstring injuries too ( allegedly ).

[StraightOuttaCanton]

I dont think players who win 9 leagues in 11 years, and 13 in 20 do so by being in a "comfort zone".

Theres a difference between someone having a winning metality and actually winning things, and someone who gives 100% and is desperate to win but never wins anything. .

Comparing Ryan Giggs and Craig Bellamys winning mentality is like comparing Phil Taylor to Mervyn King.

Bellamy was a football nomad because he had no respect for his peers and chased the pound note. He was either bombed out because the hassle of managing him outweighed what he produced on the pitch, or he forced a move for money.

He couldnt even respect the great Sir Bobby Robson and even took a golf club to a team mates legs ffs.

Was it Giggs or Ferguson that had the winning mentality?

Did OGS have it? did Gary Neville? Beckham? Keane?

Well of course, at least visually, Keane did but none of those Man Utd players have gone on to be great leaders of others - the best is Steve Bruce who manages in The Championship and no top Premier League club has even had a pint on him

It’s a complete lottery with the choices the FAW has/had with Osian the only one with any coaching pedigree at all (unless you count Joke City).

To me what got Coleman there (apart from Bale) was his passion about being Welsh - he is of course a Jack just like Hartson so did have a battle with Is bluebirds (one in particular 😀).

I can’t imagine Giggs using Bale’s quote at the euros about all he needed was the dragon on his chest as motivation, whereas I can pictures Bellamy doing and saying exactly the same thing

[J R Hartley]

Surely it doesn't matter who the better or more successful player was?

This piece

http://www.walesonline.co.uk/sport/f...spite-14154068

gives the definite impression that Bellamy came over really well at his interview and that the decision to appoint Giggs was based on his achievements as a player. I appreciate that it is hard for any young managerial wannabe to build a reputation for themselves when they have had very little chance to do so (I disregard those four matches Giggs took charge of in 13/14 at Man United because they prove nothing either way), but the members of the Class of 92 and the players Ferguson signed around that time (e.g. Paul Ince) have not enjoyed much managerial success between them when they have had a go at the job, so all that playing success did little to make them managerial successes. Off the top of my head, I can think of Mark Hughes and Steve Bruce who have made decent managerial careers from Man United sides managed by Alex Ferguson, but they were of an older generation to Giggs - he might turn out to be a good manager of Wales, but I must say that when I hear Bellamy and Giggs talk about the game, I know which one I would be more inclined to choose if I were hiring a manager.

It does matter when some people are arguing that Bellars has more of a winning mentality than Giggs and that Giggs only won what he did because he was surrounded by better players than Bellamy, completely ignoring the fact Giggs was a far, far better player than Bellamy.

I think too much credance is being given to this WOL story by people who usually pour scorn on WOL stories. Just because Bellamy interviewed well it doesnt mean Giggs interviewed badly. Obviously not as he got the job?!?! It could be the FAWs way of praising Bellamy so not to burn bridges with him as no doubt he can be of use to Welsh football if not now, then in the future.

I wouldnt have had either of them as manager. I would rather Roberts out of those interviewed and I dont know why we are restricting ourselves to a Welsh manager. Rob Phillips suggested Michael Laudrup and I think that is a good shout.

As has already been suggested I would rather Bellamy carry on with our youngsters with the view to taking over from Warnock. Much the same as Gerrard is doing at Liverpool.

[Badly Ironed Shirt]

Surely it doesn't matter who the better or more successful player was?

This piece

http://www.walesonline.co.uk/sport/f...spite-14154068

gives the definite impression that Bellamy came over really well at his interview and that the decision to appoint Giggs was based on his achievements as a player. I appreciate that it is hard for any young managerial wannabe to build a reputation for themselves when they have had very little chance to do so (I disregard those four matches Giggs took charge of in 13/14 at Man United because they prove nothing either way), but the members of the Class of 92 and the players Ferguson signed around that time (e.g. Paul Ince) have not enjoyed much managerial success between them when they have had a go at the job, so all that playing success did little to make them managerial successes. Off the top of my head, I can think of Mark Hughes and Steve Bruce who have made decent managerial careers from Man United sides managed by Alex Ferguson, but they were of an older generation to Giggs - he might turn out to be a good manager of Wales, but I must say that when I hear Bellamy and Giggs talk about the game, I know which one I would be more inclined to choose if I were hiring a manager.

Fergie players who became decent managers - I'd like to add Gordon Strachan to the list. Mark Robins is also doing a decent enough job in the lower leagues.

[J R Hartley]

Was it Giggs or Ferguson that had the winning mentality?

Did OGS have it? did Gary Neville? Beckham? Keane?

Well of course, at least visually, Keane did but none of those Man Utd players have gone on to be great leaders of others - the best is Steve Bruce who manages in The Championship and no top Premier League club has even had a pint on him

It’s a complete lottery with the choices the FAW has/had with Osian the only one with any coaching pedigree at all (unless you count Joke City).

To me what got Coleman there (apart from Bale) was his passion about being Welsh - he is of course a Jack just like Hartson so did have a battle with Is bluebirds (one in particular ��).

I can’t imagine Giggs using Bale’s quote at the euros about all he needed was the dragon on his chest as motivation, whereas I can pictures Bellamy doing and saying exactly the same thing

They all had it. They were all winners. With the amount of trophies they won thats not just down the manager, the players have to have the same mentality. With all that they won, I dont see how anyone can argue any different.

Wether they go on to have a good management careers is another matter, complete seperate entity to wether they had the winning mentality. It all depends on the environment in which they are allowed to manage.

Since the Premier League and the money involved its fashionable to employ foreign coaches, especially in the top jobs. The premier league and Sky Sports have made players, British players in particular, very, very wealthy and they dont need to have the stress of a managers job. Look at the money Neville, Carragher and Henry are earning at Sky. Why swap that for grey hair and ageing in dog years? Jose Mourinho was the picture of health when he first arrived in this country, very handsome man (not in a gay way). 15 years later he looks half dead.

I applaud the likes of Giggs, Bellamy, Gerrard.etc for looking to go into management when they dont have to. Theyve all got TV work and it would be far easier for them to go down that route.

[Badly Ironed Shirt]

It does matter when some people are arguing that Bellars has more of a winning mentality than Giggs and that Giggs only won what he did because he was surrounded by better players than Bellamy, completely ignoring the fact Giggs was a far, far better player than Bellamy.

I think too much credance is being given to this WOL story by people who usually pour scorn on WOL stories. Just because Bellamy interviewed well it doesnt mean Giggs interviewed badly. Obviously not as he got the job?!?! It could be the FAWs way of praising Bellamy so not to burn bridges with him as no doubt he can be of use to Welsh football if not now, then in the future.

I wouldnt have had either of them as manager. I would rather Roberts out of those interviewed and I dont know why we are restricting ourselves to a Welsh manager. Rob Phillips suggested Michael Laudrup and I think that is a good shout.

As has already been suggested I would rather Bellamy carry on with our youngsters with the view to taking over from Warnock. Much the same as Gerrard is doing at Liverpool.

Laudrup would have been a great choice - fair play to Rob Phillips on that one. There is no doubt Giggs has a winning mentality, I just find him a cold person who has a high level of self-interest. I'll be interested to hear what he says in the press conference, will he talk about the youth teams for example, and whether he is happy with the prospects coming through (apart from the obvious ones like Woodburn)? How about his backroom staff? Even little things like - does he talk about Wales in an abstract way rather than a "We/Us" language.

[Wales-Bales]

Ryan Giggs - an absolutely phenomenal football player, but also one of the most uninspiring people I have ever heard talking about football.

[Badly Ironed Shirt]

They all had it. They were all winners. With the amount of trophies they won thats not just down the manager, the players have to have the same mentality. With all that they won, I dont see how anyone can argue any different.

Wether they go on to have a good management careers is another matter, complete seperate entity to wether they had the winning mentality. It all depends on the environment in which they are allowed to manage.

Since the Premier League and the money involved its fashionable to employ foreign coaches, especially in the top jobs. The premier league and Sky Sports have made players, British players in particular, very, very wealthy and they dont need to have the stress of a managers job. Look at the money Neville, Carragher and Henry are earning at Sky. Why swap that for grey hair and ageing in dog years? Jose Mourinho was the picture of health when he first arrived in this country, very handsome man (not in a gay way). 15 years later he looks half dead.

I applaud the likes of Giggs, Bellamy, Gerrard.etc for looking to go into management when they dont have to. Theyve all got TV work and it would be far easier for them to go down that route.

Players from the PL era are probably wealthy enough to not have to work ever again once they stop playing. I always thought that managers would start coming from lower-league playing careers as the PL millionaires would retire to an island somewhere. It is impressive that football is such an important part of their lives that they simply can't give it up.

[BlueWales]

Ryan Giggs - an absolutely phenomenal football player, but also one of the most uninspiring people I have ever heard talking about football.

This.

Being a great player has nothing to do with becoming a great manager.

Bobby Charlton and Bobby Moore were both rubbish.

Giggs might prove to be the same.

[Wales-Bales]

Paul Scholes to replace Osian Roberts as assistant manager?

[Badly Ironed Shirt]

Was it Giggs or Ferguson that had the winning mentality?

Did OGS have it? did Gary Neville? Beckham? Keane?

Well of course, at least visually, Keane did but none of those Man Utd players have gone on to be great leaders of others - the best is Steve Bruce who manages in The Championship and no top Premier League club has even had a pint on him

It’s a complete lottery with the choices the FAW has/had with Osian the only one with any coaching pedigree at all (unless you count Joke City).

To me what got Coleman there (apart from Bale) was his passion about being Welsh - he is of course a Jack just like Hartson so did have a battle with Is bluebirds (one in particular ��).

I can’t imagine Giggs using Bale’s quote at the euros about all he needed was the dragon on his chest as motivation, whereas I can pictures Bellamy doing and saying exactly the same thing

During the years in the doldrums, I always thought Wales should be run more as a club side. It was difficult, though, when so many players (including Giggs) withdrew from training camps. Can you remember that tournament involving Malta, Tunisia and some other country? Wales had to call up Karl Ready ffs - there was no hint of togetherness.

Now, we get fewer players pulling out, largely due to the lack of friendlies, and using training camps instead. I hope that continues, but the FAW know they can make some decent money through friendlies and maybe Giggs is happy to have friendlies instead of training camps. If Wales go back down the friendlies route, I'm concerned that there will be less appetite for players travelling to places and risking injuries, and there goes the club spirit that Wales currently enjoys.

[J R Hartley]

Youth level? Look how many came from that group.
Senior level? Man Yoo best club in Europe for most of his career there.
International level? Performances nowhere near as good as at Man Yoo - because he couldn't elevate players.

Bellamy got on at people due to wanting perfection. Giggs motivating people? Hmm.

And of those that come through Giggs broke in to the team first, and stayed longer than anyonelse.

He cant be blamed for some of the awful rubbish he had to play with. Bellamy didnt exactly inspire Wales to do well as a player either.

[Wales-Bales]

I can’t imagine Giggs using Bale’s quote at the euros about all he needed was the dragon on his chest as motivation, whereas I can pictures Bellamy doing and saying exactly the same thing

Bellamy is the natural heir to Gary Speed's legacy, and with Osian Roberts as No.2 there would have been minimal disruption.

[Eric the Half a Bee]

I dont think players who win 9 leagues in 11 years, and 13 in 20 do so by being in a "comfort zone".

Theres a difference between someone having a winning metality and actually winning things, and someone who gives 100% and is desperate to win but never wins anything. .

Comparing Ryan Giggs and Craig Bellamys winning mentality is like comparing Phil Taylor to Mervyn King.

Bellamy was a football nomad because he had no respect for his peers and chased the pound note. He was either bombed out because the hassle of managing him outweighed what he produced on the pitch, or he forced a move for money.

He couldnt even respect the great Sir Bobby Robson and even took a golf club to a team mates legs ffs.

I don't understand how you can dismiss Craig Bellamy's winning mentality. Sure he hasn't been at the best club in the country for 2 decades. Was that down to a lack of winning mentality or not having the same talent as a youngster? Bellamy worked up through the ranks during his career and was arguably at the peak of his powers during the second half of his career. He's not had the fortune to have had Giggs' talent, where he was always going to be a regular at Old Trafford.

I would suggest that Giggs' success came down to him being an unbelievably gifted footballer. He was doing things on the pitch as a teenager that Bellamy wasn't capable of, that's a certainty. I disagreed with the comfort zone comment and agree with you that Giggs still needed to work hard at Old Trafford to keep his place. However, I reckon to suggest Giggs has more of a winning mentality than a guy who probably had to work harder in his career to climb the ladder (then got close to the top in the latter stages of his career) is nonsense.

Give me someone who strives to make themselves better and will push themselves any day of the week. Given a darting analogy, take Peter Wright. Someone who, until he made his only world final, you'd never have considered for a major tournament. He hasn't the natural talent of someone like MVG or Taylor but has been absolutely focused on what he wants from the sport and how much work he needs to put into it to get where he wants to be. He still won't make world number 1 or world champion (in my view), but it won't be for his will to win.

[J R Hartley]

I don't understand how you can dismiss Craig Bellamy's winning mentality. Sure he hasn't been at the best club in the country for 2 decades. Was that down to a lack of winning mentality or not having the same talent as a youngster? Bellamy worked up through the ranks during his career and was arguably at the peak of his powers during the second half of his career. He's not had the fortune to have had Giggs' talent, where he was always going to be a regular at Old Trafford.

I would suggest that Giggs' success came down to him being an unbelievably gifted footballer. He was doing things on the pitch as a teenager that Bellamy wasn't capable of, that's a certainty. I disagreed with the comfort zone comment and agree with you that Giggs still needed to work hard at Old Trafford to keep his place. However, I reckon to suggest Giggs has more of a winning mentality than a guy who probably had to work harder in his career to climb the ladder (then got close to the top in the latter stages of his career) is nonsense.

Give me someone who strives to make themselves better and will push themselves any day of the week. Given a darting analogy, take Peter Wright. Someone who, until he made his only world final, you'd never have considered for a major tournament. He hasn't the natural talent of someone like MVG or Taylor but has been absolutely focused on what he wants from the sport and how much work he needs to put into it to get where he wants to be. He still won't make world number 1 or world champion (in my view), but it won't be for his will to win.

Another one mistaking effort and drive for a winning mentality.

Ive stated my opinion, im not repeating myself.

[dembethewarrior]

So you're saying that when he was missing games for us in his teens and early twenties, he was doing it to prolong his club career?

I'm 32. I don't know his whole history for club and country, I'm basing my opi ion on his layer years I guess.

[William Treseder]

So you're saying that when he was missing games for us in his teens and early twenties, he was doing it to prolong his club career?

The WaRrIoR is getting a little confused.

[Sloop_Jon_Bee]

Suppose their wives would be too old for Giggs then. Thank god they don't want Rooney...

[Eric the Half a Bee]

Another one mistaking effort and drive for a winning mentality.

Ive stated my opinion, im not repeating myself.

In which case, how do you assume Giggs has a winning mentality? Couldn't he equally just have been a part of an excellent team that won a staggering amount. If this creates a winning mentality, then how can that be replicated? It can't, unless Wales keep winning. If your argument is that Giggs has a winning mentality from winning, then the only way Wales can have a winning mentality is from winning, not from Giggs. Did Sir Alex Ferguson have that winning mentality as a footballer? Do top footballers who have a winning mentality usually go on to make excellent managers?

I'm not suggesting whether I think you are right or wrong, I don't understand where you are coming from.

[ccfc_is_my_life]

In which case, how do you assume Giggs has a winning mentality? Couldn't he equally just have been a part of an excellent team that won a staggering amount. If this creates a winning mentality, then how can that be replicated? It can't, unless Wales keep winning. If your argument is that Giggs has a winning mentality from winning, then the only way Wales can have a winning mentality is from winning, not from Giggs. Did Sir Alex Ferguson have that winning mentality as a footballer? Do top footballers who have a winning mentality usually go on to make excellent managers?

I'm not suggesting whether I think you are right or wrong, I don't understand where you are coming from.

Phil Neville, Paul Ince and Roy Keane also have that Man Yoo winning mentality.

Shit at football management mind.

[dembethewarrior]

The WaRrIoR is getting a little confused.

Grow up. You've got be be at least 50 with a wife and kids.

[dembethewarrior]

This.

Being a great player has nothing to do with becoming a great manager.

Bobby Charlton and Bobby Moore were both rubbish.

Giggs might prove to be the same.

Neither has shagging your brothers wife or turning up for friendly games, seems to be a factor on his ability among loads on here and the Facebook live stream of his press conference.

[Eric the Half a Bee]

Phil Neville, Paul Ince and Roy Keane also have that Man Yoo winning mentality.

Shit at football management mind.

I've just looked down the current list of Premier league and football league managers. The number of managers who have had playing experience of the Premier League is unbelievably low - the list of very top Premier League footballers who are now managers is shorter than the list of things I enjoy about going shopping with the missus.

There are certainly more ex Premier league footballers who are now pundits. There are probably lots of others with different roles at different clubs. But as managers, I can see Harry Kewell at Crawley, Steve Bruce at Villa, Nigel Clough at Burton and I think that's it.

Arguably, the Premier League's most prized English managers at present are Sean Dyche and Eddie Howe. Neither have graced a Premier League game as a footballer.

[dembethewarrior]

Meanwhile stoke have appointed the great Paul Lambert to keep them in the premier league 😂😂😂

[lardy]

Even if we agree that Giggs has a winning mentality, the important thing is whether he can pass it on to his players or not. I find it difficult to picture him doing that.