Open letter to Mark Drakeford

[Eric the Half a Bee]

I haven't got formal evidence to back this up, but I've read on many occasions that the R was running at around 3 in the UK in March and early April. Today I heard a presenter say on Radio 5 that figures just released show that the R in Wales was 1.27 - that surprised me as I'd neve heard it measured that precisely before and I wondered whether what she meant to say it was between 1.2. and 1.7. if she did, then 1.7 is as high as I've heard it in months, but, even if it is, it's still some way short of the figure for much of the spring wave.
Also, regarding supermarkets, I do my weekly shop in the local Lidls early on a Monday morning when there's very few people about, but I also do a Tesco's shop once a fortnight. I'd been getting that delivered for two or three months, but getting a delivery slot as Christmas gets closer is harder and harder, so I went to Tescos Aberdare for the first time in a while last week and was surprised to see how full it was - it was as busy as you'd expect it to be on a weekday during any other year with Christmas approaching. I didn't notice any control in the numbers being allowed in that day, but I've had to go to three supermarkets this week, including Tesco's Aberdare, that were all operating a traffic light system designed to stop entry if the shop was too crowded - it could be something to do with the high infection rates up here, but I'd be surprised if something similar was not being applied in most of the bigger shops in Cardiff now.

TOBW, I can confirm that Tesco in Aberdare is a bit like an overcrowded zoo. Aada

[Eric the Half a Bee]

I haven't got formal evidence to back this up, but I've read on many occasions that the R was running at around 3 in the UK in March and early April. Today I heard a presenter say on Radio 5 that figures just released show that the R in Wales was 1.27 - that surprised me as I'd neve heard it measured that precisely before and I wondered whether what she meant to say it was between 1.2. and 1.7. if she did, then 1.7 is as high as I've heard it in months, but, even if it is, it's still some way short of the figure for much of the spring wave.
Also, regarding supermarkets, I do my weekly shop in the local Lidls early on a Monday morning when there's very few people about, but I also do a Tesco's shop once a fortnight. I'd been getting that delivered for two or three months, but getting a delivery slot as Christmas gets closer is harder and harder, so I went to Tescos Aberdare for the first time in a while last week and was surprised to see how full it was - it was as busy as you'd expect it to be on a weekday during any other year with Christmas approaching. I didn't notice any control in the numbers being allowed in that day, but I've had to go to three supermarkets this week, including Tesco's Aberdare, that were all operating a traffic light system designed to stop entry if the shop was too crowded - it could be something to do with the high infection rates up here, but I'd be surprised if something similar was not being applied in most of the bigger shops in Cardiff now.

TOBW, I can confirm everything you've said about Tesco in Aberdare. There is still occasionally some rare queuing outside there as my mother-in-law, who struggles to get out of the habit of going at her usual time, will confirm as she's had to wait. I recall the first Friday in lockdown when I had to queue for 45 minutes to get in. Now, any queues last only a brief moment. Asda, down the road, is similar.

I'd be interested to find out what is the maximum number of shoppers a store can hold. I only do scan and shop. The queues for the checkouts when things get busy are pretty bad but those checkouts are never as bad. I could be wrong, but it seems that a supermarket has to be pretty crammed to cause a queue and that there is little monitoring of supermarkets any more.

[the other bob wilson]

TOBW, I can confirm everything you've said about Tesco in Aberdare. There is still occasionally some rare queuing outside there as my mother-in-law, who struggles to get out of the habit of going at her usual time, will confirm as she's had to wait. I recall the first Friday in lockdown when I had to queue for 45 minutes to get in. Now, any queues last only a brief moment. Asda, down the road, is similar.

I'd be interested to find out what is the maximum number of shoppers a store can hold. I only do scan and shop. The queues for the checkouts when things get busy are pretty bad but those checkouts are never as bad. I could be wrong, but it seems that a supermarket has to be pretty crammed to cause a queue and that there is little monitoring of supermarkets any more.

If there was some sort of control in place for my visit last week (Thursday around 3), the number allowed in must have been very high. I've always felt safe in supermarkets the size of that one over the past nine months, but I wouldn't want to be in one as crowded as last week again. When I went this week (Wednesday at about 2), I thought it was going to be more of the same when I saw how crowded the car park was, but, while there were more shoppers than when I was going there regularly in the summer, it was nowhere near as bad as last time - with a bit of luck, I'll only need to go to Tescos twice at most before Christmas and I'm thinking I may drive down to Llantrissant to the twenty four open store.

[NYCBlue]

Never mind Micheal Sheen making public announcements

I would like his wife coming round on daily visits to my house to tell me whats going on

Shes a right one

I question his judgement. Why would one leave Kate Beckinsale? He's suspect.

[xsnaggle]

What has the reply got to do with the comment? I not understand!
I usually can't go for a pint anyway, I drive almost every day, so it is no great loss to me personally.

Well it was a plaid member of the senydd that said it was rules by dictat, not me!

[A Quiet Monkfish]

I'm finding this exhausting because it seems so many people on this message board, yourself included, have such entrenched views in political terms that they can't see past them and therefore make excuses for Johnson/Drakeford (delete as applicable) instead of acknowledging their obvious failures.

Back in April and May, I rarely saw a pensioner in a supermarket and the shops themselves had relatively strict protocols in place as regards entry, numbers inside, queuing systems, etc. Now we're at a stage whereby the virus is apparently more prevalent throughout Wales than it was earlier in the year and yet you can walk into most supermarkets whenever you like and you'll find plenty of pensioners bumbling around throughout them. So why is that? Why are things so different now despite the threat of contracting the virus apparently being more likely now? Why are the people who are most at risk of death from Covid-19 seemingly not so bothered by it any more?

I don't believe for a second that it has anything to do with their political persuasions (if they have any) or their desire for their civil liberties or their disregard for others of their lack of care for themselves. I believe most of them are not especially clever and, as well as having become fatigued by the whole situation, they have become confused by what is and isn't acceptable or advisable, or have simply stopped listening because the communications from Westminster and the Senedd have been so woolly, inconsistent, unclear and tiresome.

Drakeford is doing himself and the population of Wales no favours whatsoever by making random proclamations about the public breaking the rules without underlining what rules he believes are being broken. We seem to be at a critical stage in this pandemic - the firebreak lockdown didn't work, the NHS is apparently on the brink of being overwhelmed in some areas and Christmas is fast approaching, which we all know is guaranteed to make things worse. Nevertheless, the First Minister's messaging is seemingly more vague than ever.

For the avoidance of doubt, I voted Labour at the last election despite believing that Corbyn was an utterly hopeless leader who didn't have a prayer of being elected Prime Minister. I did so because the Labour candidate in my area is a decent person who was doing well for her constituents, and she wasn't a ****ing Tory. I'd never heard of Mark Drakeford before this pandemic, but having endured his 'leadership' throughout the last eight months or so, I've come to believe that he's also utterly hopeless. For me, his only saving grace is that he isn't Boris Johnson. However, my views on how he is handling this situation are not based on party politics at all. They're simply based on his actions and communications.

Also for the avoidance of doubt, I've been following the government's guidance throughout this pandemic to the point where I haven't been in the same building as any member of my family since mid-March, haven't been in anybody else's home during the same period and have been observing social distancing measures at all times as far as has been practically possible.

.

[Eric the Half a Bee]

Well it was a plaid member of the senydd that said it was rules by dictat, not me!

Do you find that surprising or expected?

[xsnaggle]

Do you find that surprising or expected?

the comment wasn't altogether unexpected but the direction it came from was a surprise.

[NYCBlue]

Has the government said anything about Christmas yet? We've been asked not to travel and not to mix with people outside of our household. We're still supposed to stay home as much as possible.

I've also been told privately to expect another full lockdown in January or February.

[xsnaggle]

Has the government said anything about Christmas yet? We've been asked not to travel and not to mix with people outside of our household. We're still supposed to stay home as much as possible.

I've also been told privately to expect another full lockdown in January or February.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/uk-wales-55279579

There you go. Apparently christmas relax is 23 - 27 Dec which means the new rules should start on 28th but I wouldn't be surprised if he starts them on the evening of 27th so the pubs have to close early.

Amazing turn around for the man who said there would be no more regional restrictions and that Wales would be treated as 1 place. I think when others have said something similar its been referred to as a U turn. Can't imagine why.

[life on mars]

Dear Mr Dripping : City Centred rammed today, social distancing my arse , cases rising, bloody closed pubs spreading this dreadful virus from behind its closed doors ,fix it .

Best Regards.

[Eric the Half a Bee]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/uk-wales-55279579

There you go. Apparently christmas relax is 23 - 27 Dec which means the new rules should start on 28th but I wouldn't be surprised if he starts them on the evening of 27th so the pubs have to close early.

Amazing turn around for the man who said there would be no more regional restrictions and that Wales would be treated as 1 place. I think when others have said something similar its been referred to as a U turn. Can't imagine why.

Some people have problems with u-turns. I don't, in the case of Covid. All governments are trying to find a balance between controlling the spread of the virus, trying to keep the economy ticking over etc. A u-turn just means that a previous idea, thought great at the time, is either no longer suitable or was a mistake looking back with the benefit of hindsight. There have been u-turns galore across the UK. Surely another shouldn't be a surprise?

[olderblue]

Or it was a load of bollocks in the first place, I wouldn't trust this idiot to run a bath properly
Make it up as you go along
Just remember to be different from the people across the border
It's no wonder they've lost the people with this, no real plan, no effective communication and no worries for him once he gets the old tin tac as his index linked pension will sort him out
All hail the glorious leader

[goats]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/uk-wales-55279579

There you go. Apparently christmas relax is 23 - 27 Dec which means the new rules should start on 28th but I wouldn't be surprised if he starts them on the evening of 27th so the pubs have to close early.

Amazing turn around for the man who said there would be no more regional restrictions and that Wales would be treated as 1 place. I think when others have said something similar its been referred to as a U turn. Can't imagine why.

Pubs won’t be open for ages again I think. Just go and have a coffee with your mates, the virus doesn’t like coffee I heard

[The Lone Gunman]

Is there any scientific evidence to say that Supermarkets are a significant source in the spreading of this virus?

Dr Richard Stanton, a virology expert from Cardiff University, seems to think there is. He said today there is no mystery as to why cases have risen recently: "We know what causes rates to go up and that's people being in close contact with one another. The minute you leave a lockdown rates start to go up, because people come into contact with each other again in supermarkets, shops, etc. All of these environments lead to an increase in the amount of time people come into contact and the amount of virus in circulation."

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-55273647

[Harry Paget Flashman]

Some people have problems with u-turns. I don't, in the case of Covid. All governments are trying to find a balance between controlling the spread of the virus, trying to keep the economy ticking over etc. A u-turn just means that a previous idea, thought great at the time, is either no longer suitable or was a mistake looking back with the benefit of hindsight. There have been u-turns galore across the UK. Surely another shouldn't be a surprise?

I'm with you on this. The problem I have is the inability of politicians to say we tried something and it didn't work or we made a mistake and we are working to put it right.

Current political PR is all about not appearing weak or faultless.

[jeepster]

Dr Richard Stanton, a virology expert from Cardiff University, seems to think there is. He said today there is no mystery as to why cases have risen recently: "We know what causes rates to go up and that's people being in close contact with one another. The minute you leave a lockdown rates start to go up, because people come into contact with each other again in supermarkets, shops, etc. All of these environments lead to an increase in the amount of time people come into contact and the amount of virus in circulation."

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-55273647

It is common sense it never was the pubs.

[SLUDGE FACTORY]

Whatever his faults and despite being a Labour voter I think he has many do people seriously think drakeford has made his decisions just to be .....different .....to England?

You are joking right ?

[SLUDGE FACTORY]

It is common sense it never was the pubs.

But they were open and therefore a part of it for part of the time

[xsnaggle]

What would you do in his shoes?

What would you?

[xsnaggle]

Some people have problems with u-turns. I don't, in the case of Covid. All governments are trying to find a balance between controlling the spread of the virus, trying to keep the economy ticking over etc. A u-turn just means that a previous idea, thought great at the time, is either no longer suitable or was a mistake looking back with the benefit of hindsight. There have been u-turns galore across the UK. Surely another shouldn't be a surprise?

It's not. Like you I have had no problem with so called U turns. If the circumstances alter then you must do something different ,if that is the opposite from before then so be it.
But it isn't me who has been pointing out every "U Turn" since this shit started, is it?

[Eric the Half a Bee]

What would you?

Shame, I thought you were going to provide a list.

[Eric the Half a Bee]

It's not. Like you I have had no problem with so called U turns. If the circumstances alter then you must do something different ,if that is the opposite from before then so be it.
But it isn't me who has been pointing out every "U Turn" since this shit started, is it?

No, Westmister and the Senedd have both been doing it, quite childishly.

[xsnaggle]

But they were open and therefore a part of it for part of the time

Yes they were open but the sample that showed the spread in such places was so small that evne the people who published it siad it was too small to base a judgement on.
now the WAG is saying that they will look at the numbers to see if they have come down and how much of that decline is due to pubs not being open. How do you think they are going to decide how much is due to closing pubs and how much is due to people getting Drakeford's message and changing their habits?
The chistmas release starts on the 23rd and these restrictions are until the 20th. Anyone think for 1 minute he will allow restaurants and pubs to serve alcohol again?
The only reason he didn't tell them to close is so he doesn't have to pay furlough. If a landlord lays his bar staff off thats' his decision not Drakeford's. Very clever.

[xsnaggle]

Shame, I thought you were going to provide a list.

What made you think that? you appear to be the man in the know and agreeing with all the info, I thought you'd know better than me. I just think that Drakeford has done things for political reasons and this is not a good time to do that!
But of course that is just my opinion, and worth nothing.