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Thread: Is there anyone on here that will still defend Warnock?

  1. #26

    Re: Is there anyone on here that will still defend Warnock?

    Quote Originally Posted by Cleve van Leef View Post
    Agree totally.
    ��Agree

  2. #27

    Re: Is there anyone on here that will still defend Warnock?

    Quote Originally Posted by Allez Allez Allez View Post
    Fact is the club had no football nous in the boardroom. They went from cost cutting Slade to Trollope and crowds dwindling. Fans not happy, fans want Tan gone. Fans want Warnock. Fans get Warnock. Warnock knows there is no football nous at the club. Warnock tells Tan what is needed. Tan, after years of getting fingers burnt listens. Problem is, Warnock is a football manager from the dark ages, with 2/3 years left until he retires.

    Club gets promoted. Fans think Warnock doing a great job. He can do no wrong. Fans defend style of football, some bring up stats showing that they don't play "hoofball". Club promoted. Fans vindicated. Tan vindicated.

    Club tell fans PL will be a bonus season. Fans swallow it. Who cares that we conceded 5 again, we shouldn't even be here. Warnock escapes any form of scrutiny from fans and owners. Its a binus season. Take the money, run. Warnock building a team for next season, when we'll be going for promotion number 2. It'll be easy.

    Championship has got wiser. Teams play football, good football. Fans don't want that, Warnock's style will sort them all out. Who wants all that boring passing when you can get the ball to the striker in one big punt? It worked last time. It's not working this time. Fans, so fickle, so quick to say they never liked Warnock's style. It isn't so good when you are not winning so often. Fans now want a footballing ethos and culture at the club.

    Warnock has always avoided scrutiny. He has, if you listen to him, never actually made a mistake at all. Every loss is because of a refereeing mistake. Hard done by Warnock. His teams are hard done by too. That's where they dig in, we'll show them. And it works, at every club he has been at, it works. Until it stops working. Players suddenly start getting it in the neck from Warnock in private because, actually, it's not really the referee or the football authorities to blame. It's them. The players, The ones he spent lots of other people's money on. The ones he didn't really research that well. Then, when people start to question, hang on, is it Warnock's fault after all? He defends hisself, then sods off. Reputation always in tact. He's a survivor is Colin. His clubs, less so.
    And on top of that zero ambition at the top. Their view ..."let's continue to be plucky little Cardiff also rans and maybe strike lucky once in a blue moon without spending"

  3. #28

    Re: Is there anyone on here that will still defend Warnock?

    I'm happy for Warnock to stay until the end of the season. I don't trust the board to replace him with anyone better and think it's too risky at this point - we won't go down with Warnock.

    Plenty of mb users have got suggestions but there's none that really set the pulse racing - everyone is a gamble. Not long ago everyone was marvelling at what a setup Norwich have - think they've just lost seven on the bounce.

  4. #29

    Re: Is there anyone on here that will still defend Warnock?

    Quote Originally Posted by the other bob wilson View Post
    What's this "unprecedented success" we've had under Neil Warnock then? Granted, what he did two seasons ago was very impressive, but he's been living off that for eighteen months now - he has not done anything that is without precedent at Cardiff City except, perhaps, buy more expensive duds than any other Cardiff manager.

    Well he not only got us promoted, but had a very realistic go at keeping us there. We didn't fold up as we did the last time. He also came very close to maintaining the momentum this year and if he leaves us we will be in better shape all round than we've been before.
    In short he took us on a long march which included many fantastic moments and famous victories and made ( most) people believe in the club.
    He bought some surprising players this year and unfortunately they can't quite do the job together as a team. Mind you, he might not be finished yet.

  5. #30

    Re: Is there anyone on here that will still defend Warnock?

    Quote Originally Posted by Captain_Sensible View Post
    I'm happy for Warnock to stay until the end of the season. I don't trust the board to replace him with anyone better and think it's too risky at this point - we won't go down with Warnock.

    Plenty of mb users have got suggestions but there's none that really set the pulse racing - everyone is a gamble. Not long ago everyone was marvelling at what a setup Norwich have - think they've just lost seven on the bounce.
    What Norwich do have is a smattering of younger players who they will probably be able to cash in on if they go down. We've spent a lot more than Norwich in recent years and yet, almost without fail, the players we sign depreciate in value through a combination of their age and poor performance. We are now in a position where it appears that there are a lot of things wrong at the club - the fact that we are going to struggle to repeat the sell one or two good players a summer approach that worked pretty well for us about a decade ago once the parachute payments run out being one of them.

  6. #31

    Re: Is there anyone on here that will still defend Warnock?

    Quote Originally Posted by Captain_Sensible View Post
    I'm happy for Warnock to stay until the end of the season. I don't trust the board to replace him with anyone better and think it's too risky at this point - we won't go down with Warnock.

    Plenty of mb users have got suggestions but there's none that really set the pulse racing - everyone is a gamble. Not long ago everyone was marvelling at what a setup Norwich have - think they've just lost seven on the bounce.
    Well done 'captain' a very 'sensible ' reply the world is full of experts and managers ,many haven't actually managed anything, let alone footballers ego's.

    I think the players have let themselves down , no one told them to :
    Give away the second ball.
    Defend like amateurs.

    Not run into spaces or different angles to create chances.

    Yes he should have gone after Utd, it was the coub who decided not too, in part probaly after Sala .

    He has an ageing team and we are just seeing the season out, and I think that was the plan all along.

    Lets jyst say thanks Neil , see us to May , and just make the changes at the season end .

  7. #32

    Re: Is there anyone on here that will still defend Warnock?

    Quote Originally Posted by RonnieBird View Post
    Well he not only got us promoted, but had a very realistic go at keeping us there. We didn't fold up as we did the last time. He also came very close to maintaining the momentum this year and if he leaves us we will be in better shape all round than we've been before.
    In short he took us on a long march which included many fantastic moments and famous victories and made ( most) people believe in the club.
    He bought some surprising players this year and unfortunately they can't quite do the job together as a team. Mind you, he might not be finished yet.
    Can you expand on the “in better shape all round” comment?
    - Is our first team in better shape? Not really.
    - is our academy producing more first team players? Erm...nope.
    - do we have a clear plan for the future? Not on your nelly!
    - did we have an unexpected and unlikely promotion followed by a relegation and are now practically back in the same place as when Warnock arrived? Yip!
    - Has our manager spent more money than any of his predecessors? Yes, Siree!

  8. #33

    Re: Is there anyone on here that will still defend Warnock?

    Quote Originally Posted by RonnieBird View Post
    I'd defend him because he's arguably been the best manager we've ever had. I'm very grateful for what he's done for this club.
    Sadly the whole thing seems to have run its course now and it doesn't look to me as if the spark can be recaptured at this stage.
    It's a pity that the unprecedented success couldn't have been developed or at least preserved, and now we've got to start again .
    That'll take a long time I'm afraid
    If he is, 'the best manager we've ever had,' then we wouldn't be in virtually the same condition as when he took over, playing poor football and still going backwards.

    StT.
    <><

  9. #34

    Re: Is there anyone on here that will still defend Warnock?

    Quote Originally Posted by Captain_Sensible View Post
    I'm happy for Warnock to stay until the end of the season. I don't trust the board to replace him with anyone better and think it's too risky at this point - we won't go down with Warnock.

    Plenty of mb users have got suggestions but there's none that really set the pulse racing - everyone is a gamble. Not long ago everyone was marvelling at what a setup Norwich have - think they've just lost seven on the bounce.
    Every managerial appointment is a gamble.
    The club need to work out what decision may offer the more reduced gamble.
    Jepson, Bamba and others mentioned on here offer very little experience at a decent level and more importantly, will never attract players to this club that possess the qualities we need.
    Bellamy is the only choice for me. Of course a gamble but has played at the highest level under top managers, now has coaching experience and would end Warnockball. He could probably sign players that would otherwise not consider Cardiff City

  10. #35

    Re: Is there anyone on here that will still defend Warnock?

    Quote Originally Posted by life on mars View Post
    Well done 'captain' a very 'sensible ' reply the world is full of experts and managers ,many haven't actually managed anything, let alone footballers ego's.

    I think the players have let themselves down , no one told them to :
    Give away the second ball.
    Defend like amateurs.

    Not run into spaces or different angles to create chances.

    Yes he should have gone after Utd, it was the coub who decided not too, in part probaly after Sala .

    He has an ageing team and we are just seeing the season out, and I think that was the plan all along.

    Lets jyst say thanks Neil , see us to May , and just make the changes at the season end .
    Bring someone in at the end of February. They need time evaluating the current squad before the summer

  11. #36

    Re: Is there anyone on here that will still defend Warnock?

    Me,
    Team
    We are currently playing shit. Correct. However i dont feel we are a million miles away from being a decent team. Theres been a fair amount of change.over last 12 months.
    If we can get a bit tighter at the back and a bit more clinical genuinelly feel we will be in and around.
    It looks unlikely can get much worse, if the players can improve then

    Tactics
    I got no issue with how we play football. Theres more than one way to get the ball.in the net. We create plenty of chances without having to keep the ball for long periods. Everyone wants to win games and play beautiful football but only 3 teams go and 21 fail.
    Those who want him gone becauae of tactics i'm sure you werent asking him.to be sacked when we were 2nd.

    Transfers
    This is the most frustrating part of Warnock.
    For me when we were so inferior compared to other clubs in pl it wasnt about bolstering numbers it was adding quality. Any money spent should have gone into players playing.

    Its a lot of money spent and theres still no stand out players.

    What i would say is the signings going into Pl looked sensible young players who if did well would be good investments however if fell short knew could do a job in championship. It hasnt worked out that way.

    Premier League

    Ive got no issue with how we went down. We failed yes but it was so much closer than everyone thought. In the end i think we were unfortunate to get relegated as thibk we were better overall than 1 or 2. 1 or 2 goals wpukd have made the difference.

    Future
    Is it being short sighted sticking with Warnock? Yes whoever takes over is unlikely to want to play similar system. However, i still believe we can do something this year. I maybe wrong but i think we have a better chance of doing something with him than without him.

  12. #37

    Re: Is there anyone on here that will still defend Warnock?

    I will defend him



    He saved us from relegation certainties .......remember that win against Bristol city ?

    He galvanised the fans after a good few years of morbidity

    He got us promoted to the big time

    He's made mistakes like any other manager

    But we are mid table , not six points adrift for gods sake

    This season mid table is what its going to be , that's not the end of the world .......but relegation would be and that's a very strong possibility if we replaced Warnock now ........knee jerk reactions like that have ruined many clubs

    We are not a big club like Sunderland , Pompey etc who have the supporter base to eventually drag themselves back

    We should stick with Warnock who is exactly the right man for a scrap in the middle of the table and then when he retires at the end of the season we should thank him for what he's done for Cardiff city and then look for a fresh face to move us forward

    In my view , replacing him now could backfire on us big time

  13. #38

    Re: Is there anyone on here that will still defend Warnock?

    Quote Originally Posted by SLUDGE FACTORY View Post
    We are not a big club like Sunderland , Pompey etc who have the supporter base to eventually drag themselves back
    Is that the Sunderland who have lost a third of their support since relegation from the Premier League, or Portsmouth, who can barely fit 20,000 into Fratton Park, who saw attendances drop to 12k in League 1?

  14. #39

    Re: Is there anyone on here that will still defend Warnock?

    Quote Originally Posted by Eric the Half a Bee View Post
    Is that the Sunderland who have lost a third of their support since relegation from the Premier League, or Portsmouth, who can barely fit 20,000 into Fratton Park, who saw attendances drop to 12k in League 1?
    Sunderland crowds have been around 28k all season, which is pretty impressive considering their fall down the divisions and 2nd year at league one. They have a much bigger fan base than us, we could only get 24k for a derby game in the championship.

  15. #40

    Re: Is there anyone on here that will still defend Warnock?

    Quote Originally Posted by Eric the Half a Bee View Post
    Is that the Sunderland who have lost a third of their support since relegation from the Premier League, or Portsmouth, who can barely fit 20,000 into Fratton Park, who saw attendances drop to 12k in League 1?
    Sunderland are getting 25000 plus in league one and Pompey's support has held up around the 18000 mark since their fall from grace , sides like this and the likes of Sheffield Wednesday , derby , etc have a solid core support

    We don't

    Under Slade , Jones and Trollope fans would desert us in droves when results went against us

    Its always been the case and one of the reasons why getting rid of Warnock could jettison this club into freefall and possible relegation

    If people want a new manager in my view we should ensure we don't go down , by sticking with Warnock ......and make a change at the end of the season

  16. #41

    Re: Is there anyone on here that will still defend Warnock?

    Quote Originally Posted by Stavross1927 View Post
    Sunderland crowds have been around 28k all season, which is pretty impressive considering their fall down the divisions and 2nd year at league one. They have a much bigger fan base than us, we could only get 24k for a derby game in the championship.
    They were getting 43k at one point in the Premier League. In the Championship their crowds dropped by 33% after relegation. Ours has currently dropped by 27% though we're getting almost 3,000 more than our promotion season.

    The Bristol City home games have never been our biggest attendances of the season, so that figure doesn't surprise me, though it is bigger than our home average this season. Expect bigger crowds against Leeds and Swansea.

  17. #42

    Re: Is there anyone on here that will still defend Warnock?

    i respect what he has done for us hands down... but history is yesterday and we have to look forward..

    i was in the camp of him not starting this season at all and got laughed on here and fb, thats cool, and no i dont know who should be a suitable replacement im not in the business of football managerial recruitment but all i know is its not working is it

  18. #43

    Re: Is there anyone on here that will still defend Warnock?

    Quote Originally Posted by SLUDGE FACTORY View Post
    Pompey's support has held up around the 18000 mark since their fall from grace
    No it hasn't.

    2009/10 Premier League 18249
    2010/11 Championship 15571
    2011/12 Championship 15076
    2012/13 League 1 12232
    2013/14 League 2 15461
    2014/15 League 2 15242
    2015/16 League 2 16391
    2016/17 League 2 16823
    2017/18 League 1 17917
    2018/19 League 1 18223
    2019/20 League 1 17893

    Theirs dropped a third in 3 seasons going from Premier League to League 1. What is interesting is that their Supporters' Trust eventually bought the club at the end of that 2012/13 season and the fans came back. They clearly had a number of stay aways prior to that, though.

  19. #44

    Re: Is there anyone on here that will still defend Warnock?

    If the 2 that hit the bar had gone in we, would be saying 2,wins since the, Jacks.
    That's the fine line in football..

  20. #45

    Re: Is there anyone on here that will still defend Warnock?

    Sludge - your justification for sticking with Warnock looks to me to hinge on him keeping us up, which given how much has been spent and the club’s own pre-season stance amounts to a huge failure.
    Why should we trust Warnock with another transfer window*, then expect the new manager to start with a full season ahead, when they could come in now, assess the squad and make sensible changes in the January window*?

    *Assuming no transfer ban.

  21. #46

    Re: Is there anyone on here that will still defend Warnock?

    Quote Originally Posted by SLUDGE FACTORY View Post
    I will defend him



    He saved us from relegation certainties .......remember that win against Bristol city ?

    He galvanised the fans after a good few years of morbidity

    He got us promoted to the big time

    He's made mistakes like any other manager

    But we are mid table , not six points adrift for gods sake

    This season mid table is what its going to be , that's not the end of the world .......but relegation would be and that's a very strong possibility if we replaced Warnock now ........knee jerk reactions like that have ruined many clubs

    We are not a big club like Sunderland , Pompey etc who have the supporter base to eventually drag themselves back

    We should stick with Warnock who is exactly the right man for a scrap in the middle of the table and then when he retires at the end of the season we should thank him for what he's done for Cardiff city and then look for a fresh face to move us forward

    In my view , replacing him now could backfire on us big time
    Well said Sludge completely agree, what a fickle lot of fans we have

  22. #47

    Re: Is there anyone on here that will still defend Warnock?

    Think everyone appreciates the fact he brought the fans and the club closer together. Think we all appreciate the year in the PL as well.

    He bought championship players when we went up with the idea that we have a better squad when/if we came back down.

    He came down and in his own words said we were going to “have a good go at it”.

    It’s not gonna happen, it’s not what he has done thats the issue is it, it’s what he promised to do and is failing at.

    He’s back where he started, fans bickering, shit football and struggling in the league.

    So tell me, what has he done to deserve to stay? He’s failing. Don’t let one season in the PL cloud your judgement.

    His players don’t want to play for him.

  23. #48

    Re: Is there anyone on here that will still defend Warnock?

    Quote Originally Posted by Tuerto View Post
    The biggest disappointment for me isn't the fact that we're struggling and playing shite football, it's the fact that the club and manager hasn't used the experience and money of the premier league as a way of bringing in players with the potential to improve and develop into players that will show that they have ability. There has been zero planning, it seems Warnock has done what he wants.
    Absolutely Spot On.

  24. #49

    Re: Is there anyone on here that will still defend Warnock?

    As a few have said we are back where we started in many ways.

    Yes, he took us up but he has also been terrible in the transfer market and many of those signings were made and then weren't picked.
    See Vaulks as the latest example of this. It is as if he doesn't look at a player and what they can do and buys them and then sees their flaws.

    For me it has run it's course. If he stays it gives less time to the new man and will take that much longer to get the squad in any fit state again.

    I, like many others though, am worried what the board with it's lack of football knowledge will bring in.
    We have had Malky, Ole Gunnar Solskjaer, the Scott Young/Gabbidon double act, Slade and Warnock.
    The list is very hit and miss and with almost all of those there always seemed to be a breakdown between the board and manager. Malky especially. If I can give Warnock the most credit for anything it is the way he has managed Tan and the board.

  25. #50

    Re: Is there anyone on here that will still defend Warnock?

    Quote Originally Posted by SLUDGE FACTORY View Post
    He saved us from relegation certainties.....
    Nonsense.

    When Warnock arrived, City were a side drained of confidence who were playing poorly, but they weren't relegation certainties by any stretch of the imagination. Indeed, when he took over Cardiff were two points behind Derby and Villa, who were 18th and 19th in the table. They ended the season five points behind Derby, who finished 9th, and level on points with Villa, who finished 13th.

    Warnock undoubtedly did well to galvanise an under-performing side, but what he effectively did in 2016/17 was turn a team that should have been mid-table into a team that was mid-table. It was good work but it was no miracle. He inherited a squad that included the likes of Morrison, Manga, Peltier, Bennett, Gunnarsson, Ralls, Zohore, Harris, Whittingham and Pilkington. Relegation certainties they were not.

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