View Full Version : Gove wants to be Prime Minister
Official thread of condolence for the UK. This will be our support group.
Wales-Bales
30-06-16, 08:30
Seems like the whole cabinet want to be PM :hehe:
the other bob wilson
30-06-16, 08:40
Looking at his statement
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/06/30/boris-johnson-and-theresa-may-go-head-to-head-in-conservative-le/
it may be more accurate to say he wants to stop Boris Johnson - I wonder if we'll ever find out what was being said behind closed doors in both camps in the hours after the result became clear?
He's really given Boris a bit of a kicking there.
Maybe he didn't like the sound of his piece in The Telegraph the other day
Wales-Bales
30-06-16, 09:11
Gove has possibly been tasked with preventing Boris from finishing in the top two, as the voting base then widens to include the Tory grass-root members, i.e. it's a move to help May.
Wales-Bales
30-06-16, 09:19
The Home Secretary says there should be no General Election until 2020, and no decision to invoke Article 50 before the end of the year.
The Article 50 declaration is getting further and further away!
Boris' press conference at 11.00 should be interesting
Wales-Bales
30-06-16, 09:39
And Osborne is totally sidelined, poor chap he really thought he was a shoe-in to be next PM :hehe:
Boris not to run
Who saw that coming?
Johnson not running .
He shafted the country so he could be PM, only to be stabbed in the back by gove and lady Macbeth.
Its like game of thrones
Wales-Bales
30-06-16, 11:07
Johnson not running .
He shafted the country so he could be PM, only to be stabbed in the back by gove and lady Macbeth.
Its like game of thrones
The Boss may be regretting shunting the politics threads over here :hehe:
The Boss may be regretting shunting the politics threads over here :hehe:
why? you lot can knock yourselves out all day, enjoy :hehe:
Wales-Bales
30-06-16, 11:20
why? you lot can knock yourselves out all day, enjoy :hehe:
What are you doing here? :hehe:
Actually the discourse is very civil now that the riff-raff are over at the other forum :thumbup:
Take a look at @AndrewPizzle's Tweet: https://twitter.com/AndrewPizzle/status/748471366878363649?s=09
I must admit to feeling a little robbed.
I was looking forward to Boris trying to explain the logic and reasoning behind what he wrote the other day.
the other bob wilson
30-06-16, 12:07
Just been out for a couple of hours with the car radio on and the funny thing is that I didn't hear even the remotest suggestion that Boris Johnson would not be running before he made his statement, but, once he had done, the airwaves were choc a bloc with "experts" telling us he had no other choice :hehe: - sorry, but anyone who says they saw this coming is a liar.
Anyway, I'm sticking to my original thought that the lurid allegations about him which did the rounds a few years ago were all true and he was told the stories would be released to the media if he didn't step aside - that's far more fun than the sort of stuff were hearing now.
6th May 2016
"So, is Mr Gove interested in becoming prime minister?
He is unequivocal. “No I’m not. There…I don’t want to do it and there are people who are far better equipped than me to do it.
“And there are people who have advocated Leave and people who have advocated Remain who are far better than me to do it.”
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/05/06/michael-gove-rules-out-running-for-tory-leader-and-says-his-frie/
Just been out for a couple of hours with the car radio on and the funny thing is that I didn't hear even the remotest suggestion that Boris Johnson would not be running before he made his statement, but, once he had done, the airwaves were choc a bloc with "experts" telling us he had no other choice :hehe: - sorry, but anyone who says they saw this coming is a liar.
Anyway, I'm sticking to my original thought that the lurid allegations about him which did the rounds a few years ago were all true and he was told the stories would be released to the media if he didn't step aside - that's far more fun than the sort of stuff were hearing now.
I've read a few articles that said the leave victory had put Boris in an impossible position regarding the Prime Minister job.
It basically stated whoever does the Brexit negotiating is in a no win situation. They either lose out on free trade or lose out on free movement of people. We can't have it both ways. It stated Boris would've much preferred a close defeat for the leave party.
Whilst it never came out and said he wouldn't run for the job, it did a pretty good summarising of explaining how he was in a very difficult position since the result and may have to not run for it.
I've read a few articles that said the leave victory had put Boris in an impossible position regarding the Prime Minister job.
It basically stated whoever does the Brexit negotiating is in a no win situation. They either lose out on free trade or lose out on free movement of people. We can't have it both ways. It stated Boris would've much preferred a close defeat for the leave party.
Whilst it never came out and said he wouldn't run for the job, it did a pretty good summarising of explaining how he was in a very difficult position since the result and may have to not run for it.
I also read some with the view that Cameron had resigned precisely to screw Boris in this way, knowing that Boris didn't want to lead the UK out of Europe. These articles and comments were a couple of days ago so perhaps the experts who are claiming this now really did see it coming.
I've read a few articles that said the leave victory had put Boris in an impossible position regarding the Prime Minister job.
It basically stated whoever does the Brexit negotiating is in a no win situation. They either lose out on free trade or lose out on free movement of people. We can't have it both ways. It stated Boris would've much preferred a close defeat for the leave party.
Whilst it never came out and said he wouldn't run for the job, it did a pretty good summarising of explaining how he was in a very difficult position since the result and may have to not run for it.
Whilst the Tory Leader's and PM's job would have been a poison chalice for Boris (less so for the Remain candidates I think), I still believe he was intending to stand until mid morning today. A combination of Gove's 'betrayal' and the ridicule from Theresa May, and soundings that told him his expected 100+ Tory MP support was starting to leach away, all led to him bottling out.
The 'Anyone But Boris' campaign was lethal - in Westminster and in the press. However, if he'd got onto the ballot as one of the 2 candidates put forward by the MPs I think he would have had a very good chance of winning the Tory membership vote (even against Theresa May). Self-interested populism is more popular than ever.
Blue in the Face
30-06-16, 14:06
Anyway, I'm sticking to my original thought that the lurid allegations about him which did the rounds a few years ago were all true and he was told the stories would be released to the media if he didn't step aside - that's far more fun than the sort of stuff were hearing now.
When you say allegations, are you referring to this?
http://www.politics.co.uk/blogs/2014/11/20/channel-four-allegations-reveal-a-darker-side-to-boris-johns
Organ Morgan.
30-06-16, 14:19
I suspect Bobsy is referring to stories such as this: http://www.jpost.com/Opinion/Op-Ed-Contributors/Why-is-the-UK-media-scared-to-name-names-317108
UK media is fond of telling us that Dai Cameron has much enmity for big Boris without revealing the true reason.
I suspect Bobsy is referring to stories such as this: http://www.jpost.com/Opinion/Op-Ed-Contributors/Why-is-the-UK-media-scared-to-name-names-317108
UK media is fond of telling us that Dai Cameron has much enmity for big Boris without revealing the true reason.
So while Israeli radio listeners hear speculation about London Mayor Boris Johnson and the prime minister’s wife, Samantha Cameron, people in London are denied that pleasure. Apart from the fact that these rumours almost certainly have no basis
:hehe:
Gabalphaville
30-06-16, 15:39
It's great news for Labour. They stood no chance against BoJo. Gove is popular with the commentariat but most people in the real world think he's a ****.
Blue in the Face
30-06-16, 15:46
Has Gove made a pact with May I wonder? May will be favorite now though surely. Is Gove just angling his way to the Chancellor or foreign secretary job with this move?
Why have enemies eh?
Gabalphaville
30-06-16, 15:50
Gove's been backed by Murdoch apparently so I'm sure he'd want the top job. May is popular within the Tory party but she was pro-Remain so how would that go down with all the Brexiteers voting at the next election?
life on mars
30-06-16, 15:57
Looking at his statement
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/06/30/boris-johnson-and-theresa-may-go-head-to-head-in-conservative-le/
it may be more accurate to say he wants to stop Boris Johnson - I wonder if we'll ever find out what was being said behind closed doors in both camps in the hours after the result became clear?
Careerist all of them , Gove has had the media tap ( e mail ) on the shoulder, Boris and Farage load the bullets to create the leadership vacuum chaos , next job s the start of the new propaganda agenda , that gullible folk will listen too and believe .
the other bob wilson
01-07-16, 08:58
Whilst the Tory Leader's and PM's job would have been a poison chalice for Boris (less so for the Remain candidates I think), I still believe he was intending to stand until mid morning today. A combination of Gove's 'betrayal' and the ridicule from Theresa May, and soundings that told him his expected 100+ Tory MP support was starting to leach away, all led to him bottling out.
The 'Anyone But Boris' campaign was lethal - in Westminster and in the press. However, if he'd got onto the ballot as one of the 2 candidates put forward by the MPs I think he would have had a very good chance of winning the Tory membership vote (even against Theresa May). Self-interested populism is more popular than ever.
So true.
Organ Morgan.
01-07-16, 09:23
It's head-spinning stuff. This analysis by some film producer is excellent. https://www.buzzfeed.com/saraspary/this-guy-tried-to-sum-up-the-shitshow-that-is-british-politi?utm_term=.utVmGQJLnQ#.wkkP8QvdlQ
“So, let me get this straight… the leader of the opposition campaigned to stay but secretly wanted to leave, so his party held a non-binding vote to shame him into resigning so someone else could lead the campaign to ignore the result of the non-binding referendum which many people now think was just angry people trying to shame politicians into seeing they’d all done nothing to help them.
“Meanwhile, the man who campaigned to leave because he hoped losing would help him win the leadership of his party, accidentally won and ruined any chance of leading because the man who thought he couldn’t lose, did - but resigned before actually doing the thing the vote had been about.
“The man who’d always thought he’d lead next, campaigned so badly that everyone thought he was lying when he said the economy would crash - and he was, but it did, but he’s not resigned, but, like the man who lost and the man who won, also now can’t become leader.
“Which means the woman who quietly campaigned to stay but always said she wanted to leave is likely to become leader instead.”
Got it? OK. Let’s continue.
“Which means she holds the same view as the leader of the opposition but for opposite reasons, but her party’s view of this view is the opposite of the opposition’s.
“And the opposition aren’t yet opposing anything because the leader isn’t listening to his party, who aren’t listening to the country, who aren’t listening to experts or possibly paying that much attention at all.
“However, none of their opponents actually want to be the one to do the thing that the vote was about, so there’s not yet anything actually on the table to oppose anyway.
“And if no one ever does do the thing that most people asked them to do, it will be undemocratic and if any one ever does do it, it will be awful.
“Clear?”
the other bob wilson
01-07-16, 09:25
I've read a few articles that said the leave victory had put Boris in an impossible position regarding the Prime Minister job.
It basically stated whoever does the Brexit negotiating is in a no win situation. They either lose out on free trade or lose out on free movement of people. We can't have it both ways. It stated Boris would've much preferred a close defeat for the leave party.
Whilst it never came out and said he wouldn't run for the job, it did a pretty good summarising of explaining how he was in a very difficult position since the result and may have to not run for it.
I saw those stories, but I'm talking about people who were saying fifteen minutes before he spoke that Boris Johnson was going to announce that he wasn't going to stand - as I mentioned, I was in my car at time, so can't say for sure if it was the same on telly, but there was no inkling whatsoever as to what was going to happen on 5 Live.
I agree that it would appear that the next Prime Minister will be handed something of a poisoned chalice because it's impossible to see how anyone could negotiate a package which would satisfy all those who voted to leave. However, that begs the question why would any of the five candidates stand for the job - if Boris was going to be in an impossible position, then, surely, that applies to them as well?
What seems very odd to me is that Michael Gove would put himself into the equation while, at the same time, doing something that will make significant portions of the country in general and legions of Tory MPs and party members in particular think he is a complete and utter bastard.
the other bob wilson
01-07-16, 09:32
It's head-spinning stuff. This analysis by some film producer is excellent. https://www.buzzfeed.com/saraspary/this-guy-tried-to-sum-up-the-shitshow-that-is-british-politi?utm_term=.utVmGQJLnQ#.wkkP8QvdlQ
“So, let me get this straight… the leader of the opposition campaigned to stay but secretly wanted to leave, so his party held a non-binding vote to shame him into resigning so someone else could lead the campaign to ignore the result of the non-binding referendum which many people now think was just angry people trying to shame politicians into seeing they’d all done nothing to help them.
“Meanwhile, the man who campaigned to leave because he hoped losing would help him win the leadership of his party, accidentally won and ruined any chance of leading because the man who thought he couldn’t lose, did - but resigned before actually doing the thing the vote had been about.
“The man who’d always thought he’d lead next, campaigned so badly that everyone thought he was lying when he said the economy would crash - and he was, but it did, but he’s not resigned, but, like the man who lost and the man who won, also now can’t become leader.
“Which means the woman who quietly campaigned to stay but always said she wanted to leave is likely to become leader instead.”
Got it? OK. Let’s continue.
“Which means she holds the same view as the leader of the opposition but for opposite reasons, but her party’s view of this view is the opposite of the opposition’s.
“And the opposition aren’t yet opposing anything because the leader isn’t listening to his party, who aren’t listening to the country, who aren’t listening to experts or possibly paying that much attention at all.
“However, none of their opponents actually want to be the one to do the thing that the vote was about, so there’s not yet anything actually on the table to oppose anyway.
“And if no one ever does do the thing that most people asked them to do, it will be undemocratic and if any one ever does do it, it will be awful.
“Clear?”
:hehe:
I see a couple of people commenting on the story have also made the Yes Minister connection that was in my head while I was reading it.
the other bob wilson
01-07-16, 11:56
Gove wont make it past the first round and certainly wont win it. Just heard Ken Clark saying that every MP he has spoken to is very angry with Gove - who has behaved as if it were a student union election - rather than for someone who wants to PM.
Theresa May or Liam Fox, although there is alot of talk about the other woman (whose name I forget)
Andrea Leadsom was one of only two politicians on the leave side who quite impressed me during the campaign (that's one more than on the remain side mind) - unbelievably, the other one was some bloke from UKIP whose name I've forgotten.
I can't see Leadsom making it into the final two because that would, almost certainly, mean two women contesting the leadership, but I'd agree that Gove is by no means a certainty to be in the last round of voting.
Gove just said he'd tried almost everything not to be leader of the conservative party.
Clearly not trying as hard as me.
Gove just said he'd tried almost everything not to be leader of the conservative party.
Clearly not trying as hard as me.
Good point. I've been trying really hard not to be leader of the Tory Party as well. So far it's working. Maybe we can give Gove some tips?
Do we want someone who mistrusts experts as PM?
Wales-Bales
01-07-16, 15:52
Do we want someone who mistrusts experts as PM?
Do you trust me to answer this question?
I wont vote for a man who has no chin.
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