Sinn Fein can change course of Brexit

[CCFCC3PO]

https://www.irishtimes.com/opinion/fintan-o-toole-ireland-can-stop-a-no-deal-brexit-here-s-how-1.3972121

[RonnieBird]

No they can't.
They don't take up their seats as a matter of principle, and they never will.
In order to take up those seats they'd have to swear an oath of loyalty to the Queen and the Union and they won't.
If they did either of these things they'd face a terrible retribution from from their own paramilitary supporters.

As the journalist points out, the political and other blowback from the political wing of PIRA and INLA trying to thwart the will of the British people would be unthinkable. In Ireland it would reignite the troubles within hours and in Britain it would cause a constituonal crisis the like of which we've never seen since the days of Cromwell.

[CCFCC3PO]

No they can't.
They don't take up their seats as a matter of principle, and they never will.
In order to take up those seats they'd have to swear an oath of loyalty to the Queen and the Union and they won't.
If they did either of these things they'd face a terrible retribution from from their own paramilitary supporters.

As the journalist points out, the political and other blowback from the political wing of PIRA and INLA trying to thwart the will of the British people would be unthinkable. In Ireland it would reignite the troubles within hours and in Britain it would cause a constituonal crisis the like of which we've never seen since the days of Cromwell.

It's almost like you didn't read the whole article.

[Dorcus]

It's almost like you didn't read the whole article.

I did and it is a very well constructed and powerful argument. This could be a breakthrough move without sacrificing Sinn Fein principles. Given the impending disaster awaiting us all we need radical ideas and pretty damn quick.

[life on mars]

I did and it is a very well constructed and powerful argument. This could be a breakthrough move without sacrificing Sinn Fein principles. Given the impending disaster awaiting us all we need radical ideas and pretty damn quick.

And they have a mate in JC .

[Dorcus]

And they have a mate in JC .

Yes, you're right, a lot of their rank are Christians.

[life on mars]

Yes, you're right, a lot of their rank are Christians.

Thrown to the lion's?

[Dorcus]

Thrown to the lion's?

Sorry Daniel, I didn't quite understand your question. Who or what was thrown to the lion's what? Oh and which lion?

[RonnieBird]

Basil, the one eyed lion which used to feature in the T.V Show "Daktari", and coincidentally the same identity you used when posting on the "Cornish Herb Garden" Message Board back in the late eighties.

[Dorcus]

No that was Daiquiri Sir Jim. A cocktail named after a Welshman who was forever asking questions.

[RonnieBird]

Oh that's very good when you think about it. Just worked it out !
There's a much better joke in there but I expect it's a hate crime.

[Dorcus]

Oh that's very good when you think about it. Just worked it out !
There's a much better joke in there but I expect it's a hate crime.

I suspect that one involves the Welsh poofter and possible associations with the word cocktail no doubt. It's best we don't go there, don't you think?

[RonnieBird]

Absolutely !
You simply can't say stuff like that in our great democracy can you ?

[life on mars]

I like a Daktari on a warm summer night, and those nasty Sinn Feinier's won't effect that.

CHRISTIANS TO THE LIONS!’ I hear Nero call.

[Dorcus]

I like a Daktari on a warm summer night, and those nasty Sinn Feinier's won't effect that.

CHRISTIANS TO THE LIONS!’ I hear Nero call.

English please David

[Elwood Blues]

I did and it is a very well constructed and powerful argument. This could be a breakthrough move without sacrificing Sinn Fein principles. Given the impending disaster awaiting us all we need radical ideas and pretty damn quick.

People moan about Boris proroguing Parliament, but seem quite happy if our parliamentary democracy is messed with in other ways!

[life on mars]

People moan about Boris proroguing Parliament, but seem quite happy if our parliamentary democracy is messed with in other ways!

Yes there is some irony and bias, before Boris, we had opposition parties doing a sort of proroguing of it's own , by not agreeing any type of deal , they simply pushed the Tories to this point, by putting off or delaying the decision made in a democratic vote.

Can you imagine the uproar if a union vote to strike was dealt with in the same manner , and let's be fair some of those union ballot results are no where near the majority leave vote ,at times they are less than a third of the workforce .

Guess its called democracy when it fits .

To summarise we have an opposition party vowing never to agree any deal to take us out of Europe even though 52% voted for that action , real democracy at work at last .

Now when Boris decides to be bullish it's an outcry on injustice , bloody hypocrisy I say.

And yes I'm a remainer and no I'm not a Tory or Trump /Boris , just a
believer in the democratic right of the people however disturbing that result is .

As for Sinn Fein and its supporters and history, what can one say about those luvvies.

The day of principles are gone .

[lardy]

Yes there is some irony and bias, before Boris, we had opposition parties doing a sort of proroguing of it's own , by not agreeing any type of deal , they simply pushed the Tories to this point, by putting off or delaying the decision made in a democratic vote.

Can you imagine the uproar if a union vote to strike was dealt with in the same manner , and let's be fair some of those union ballot results are no where near the majority leave vote ,at times they are less than a third of the workforce .

Guess its called democracy when it fits .

To summarise we have an opposition party vowing never to agree any deal to take us out of Europe even though 52% voted for that action , real democracy at work at last .

Now when Boris decides to be bullish it's an outcry on injustice , bloody hypocrisy I say.

And yes I'm a remainer and no I'm not a Tory or Trump /Boris , just a
believer in the democratic right of the people however disturbing that result is .

As for Sinn Fein and its supporters and history, what can one say about those luvvies.

The day of principles are gone .

Why are you always blaming the opposition? The Tories have had a majority and then working majority throughout the whole thing. Take a look at who voted against May's deals.

I have no respect for Labour but point the finger where it should be pointed.

[Eric Cartman]

Why are you always blaming the opposition? The Tories have had a majority and then working majority throughout the whole thing. Take a look at who voted against May's deals.

I have no respect for Labour but point the finger where it should be pointed.

This has been pointed out to LOM about 15 times this year. Tories had the numbers to get it though parliament, they couldn't convince their own party to vote for the deal.

[life on mars]

This has been pointed out to LOM about 15 times this year. Tories had the numbers to get it though parliament, they couldn't convince their own party to vote for the deal.

Equally Labour could have swallowed the pride and drive for an election and voted for it and stopped the Boris March ,suicide politics ,just for the sake of an election , I view Labour as gutless as the Tories ,they could have backed the deal and won the next election,they wont know .

[lardy]

Equally Labour could have swallowed the pride and drive for an election and voted for it and stopped the Boris March ,suicide politics ,just for the sake of an election , I view Labour as gutless as the Tories ,they could have backed the deal and won the next election,they wont know .

Total rubbish from the first word. It's not equal. Hence "majority".

[Eric Cartman]

Equally Labour could have swallowed the pride and drive for an election and voted for it and stopped the Boris March ,suicide politics ,just for the sake of an election , I view Labour as gutless as the Tories ,they could have backed the deal and won the next election,they wont know .

It isn't gutless to oppose something you disagree with.

[Elwood Blues]

To get back to the originsl point.

Do you think Sinn Fein giving up their seats is a good idea to delay or stop Brexit Eric?

[Eric Cartman]

To get back to the originsl point.

Do you think Sinn Fein giving up their seats is a good idea to delay or stop Brexit Eric?

Not to stop without consultation, but a delay long enough to ask the country if we still want to leave now that we know what brexit looks is the desirable in my opinion. Brexit is now leaving without a withdrawal agreement in place and without a framework for a future trading relationship in place, that is quite a departure from the promises made.

The Sinn Fein thing is a fairytale though dreamed up to fill some column inches.

[life on mars]

It isn't gutless to oppose something you disagree with.

Sitting on a fence is .
Libereals, Tories, now haveva position, time for labour to man up .

[Eric Cartman]

Sitting on a fence is .
Libereals, Tories, now haveva position, time for labour to man up .

They have a position, any deal negotiated should be put to a second ref as should no deal.

Tories don't have a position, they are still pretending to negotiate. Liberals now appear to want to revoke without actually asking anybody a direct question.

You can spin it however you like and labour have frustrated me no end over this issue but their position is clear now.

[life on mars]

They have a position, any deal negotiated should be put to a second ref as should no deal.

Tories don't have a position, they are still pretending to negotiate. Liberals now appear to want to revoke without actually asking anybody a direct question.

You can spin it however you like and labour have frustrated me no end over this issue but their position is clear now.



Would you not say the Tories have a slightly clearer leave agenda now under Boris , albeit a frightening one ?

In my humble view the only way we going to deal with Brext is via an election dominated by Brext ,where one Party is leave ie Tories , due to Brexit/DUP pressures v the remain parties , three of which I think would be SNP, Liberals and Plaid .

The question is what will Labours election position be , as Brexit will dominate and they have the heavy Brexit leave constituency issues.


Talking about spin, perhaps the current love in with the SNP with smooth chatter about consideration of another Scottish Independence vote , is shaping up like the Tory /DUP arrangement.

What goes round comes round .

As clear as mud.

[Eric Cartman]

Would you not say the Tories have a slightly clearer leave agenda now under Boris , albeit a frightening one ?

In my humble view the only way we going to deal with Brext is via an election dominated by Brext ,where one Party is leave ie Tories , due to Brexit/DUP pressures v the remain parties , three of which I think would be SNP, Liberals and Plaid .

The question is what will Labours election position be , as Brexit will dominate and they have the heavy Brexit leave constituency issues.


Talking about spin, perhaps the current love in with the SNP with smooth chatter about consideration of another Scottish Independence vote , is shaping up like the Tory /DUP arrangement.

What goes round comes round .

As clear as mud.

You call them 'remain' parties but what is their policy? Revoke or 2nd ref?

If we don't leave the EU and/or the Tories aren't in government then the appetite for a 2nd Scottish independence ref goes way down.

I don't think the Tory policy is clear beyond 'leave'. May used no deal as a theat too, it didn't work. The PM who takes us out without a withdrawal agreement will pay for it and that doesn't suit Boris because his primary aim is staying in number 10 as long as possible.

[life on mars]

You call them 'remain' parties but what is their policy? Revoke or 2nd ref?

If we don't leave the EU and/or the Tories aren't in government then the appetite for a 2nd Scottish independence ref goes way down.

I don't think the Tory policy is clear beyond 'leave'. May used no deal as a theat too, it didn't work. The PM who takes us out without a withdrawal agreement will pay for it and that doesn't suit Boris because his primary aim is staying in number 10 as long as possible.

Its a ducking mess, that is something we can agree on .

[Eric Cartman]

Its a ducking mess, that is something we can agree on .

I have actually reached the schadenfreude area where some sick part of me wants no deal for a bit of entertainment. Problem is a lot of people I know could suffer from that.

[life on mars]

I have actually reached the schadenfreude area where some sick part of me wants no deal for a bit of entertainment. Problem is a lot of people I know could suffer from that.

Strangely I'm of the same view now .

Being a remain voter ,I have become very frustrated with the whole process and have grown a dislike to the workings of the Federalist type European commission after better understanding what this was all about , wish the vote was now, after all this dirt washing has been aired.

I think I would be inclined to vote leave now ,I do wonder though how others would react or change ?? .

Incredibly the biggest deal bloker I never got to hear about ,or notices its arguments back in 2016

I now know why Corbyn and his inner circle dislike this federal organisation.