View Full Version : "Giving the knee"
Maurice Swan
11-06-20, 14:59
Who else is bloody fed up with this???
I have no problem with people of different race...but you cannot change history...it is what it is.
Why bow down to a different race....white to black...black to white....whatever.
This tearing down of statues is appalling.....times were different.......you regret but you do not destroy.....
Heisenberg
11-06-20, 15:03
Who else is bloody fed up with this???
I have no problem with people of different race...but you cannot change history...it is what it is.
Why bow down to a different race....white to black...black to white....whatever.
This tearing down of statues is appalling.....times were different.......you regret but you do not destroy.....
What... the f**k?
Maurice Swan
11-06-20, 15:05
What... the f**k?
What is the point of this blasphemy??
What is the point of this blasphemy??
Which bit is the blasphemy - the knee or the statues?
In my opinion there isn't enough blasphemy about - the more the better.
Good article this morning from William Dalrymple (top historian when it comes to India and middle east) on why Clive Of India's statue outside the Foreign Office should be torn down:
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/jun/11/robert-clive-statue-whitehall-british-imperial
Heisenberg
11-06-20, 15:12
What is the point of this blasphemy??
What blasphemy?
Are you ok, Maurice? Let me know if I can help at all.
Taunton Blue Genie
11-06-20, 15:14
What is the point of this blasphemy??
The F word is not blasphemy.
A Quiet Monkfish
11-06-20, 15:14
Who else is bloody fed up with this???
I have no problem with people of different race...but you cannot change history...it is what it is.
Why bow down to a different race....white to black...black to white....whatever.
This tearing down of statues is appalling.....times were different.......you regret but you do not destroy.....
I agree. What I find odd is pulling down a hollow tin likeness of someone who lived 300 years ago makes people think they've achieved something, yet if they were really bothered about slavery they'd have been demonstrating about 7yr olds being made to work down mines for cobalt in 2020. Probably nothing about in on facebook or twitter though..
Wales-Bales
11-06-20, 15:16
Some people deserve a knee in the balls!
cyril evans awaydays
11-06-20, 15:17
What blasphemy?
Are you ok, Maurice? Let me know if I can help at all.
That piece of halibut was good enough for Jehovah you know!
Heisenberg
11-06-20, 15:17
I agree. What I find odd is pulling down a hollow tin likeness of someone who lived 300 years ago makes people think they've achieved something, yet if they were really bothered about slavery they'd have been demonstrating about 7yr olds being made to work down mines for cobalt in 2020. Probably nothing about in on facebook or twitter though..
I'm sure you'd take offence to these hypothetical protests too :hehe:
Croesy Blue
11-06-20, 15:18
I agree. What I find odd is pulling down a hollow tin likeness of someone who lived 300 years ago makes people think they've achieved something, yet if they were really bothered about slavery they'd have been demonstrating about 7yr olds being made to work down mines for cobalt in 2020. Probably nothing about in on facebook or twitter though..
Yeah why protest for something being right unless you're protesting for everything being right!!
Is it me or isn't the expression "taking" the knee? :shrug:
Which bit is the blasphemy - the knee or the statues?
In my opinion there isn't enough blasphemy about - the more the better.
Good article this morning from William Dalrymple (top historian when it comes to India and middle east) on why Clive Of India's statue outside the Foreign Office should be torn down:
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/jun/11/robert-clive-statue-whitehall-british-imperial
Shocking behaviour out in India.
A Quiet Monkfish
11-06-20, 15:20
I'm sure you'd take offence to these hypothetical protests too :hehe:
Maybe, but they'd be more relevant with regards to slavery.
Heisenberg
11-06-20, 15:22
Maybe, but they'd be more relevant with regards to slavery.
Thanks for your valuable input. May I add you to the "check with Monkfish before protesting anything" newsletter?
A Quiet Monkfish
11-06-20, 15:23
Shocking behaviour out in India.
Wow!! And just found this about goings on in Italy .http://factsanddetails.com/world/cat56/sub408/entry-6344.html
A Quiet Monkfish
11-06-20, 15:25
Thanks for your valuable input. May I add you to the "check with Monkfish before protesting anything" newsletter?
Do what you want. Another day hooked up to your laptop trying to boost your ego with sarcasm, profanity and smugness..
cyril evans awaydays
11-06-20, 15:28
Is it me or isn't the expression "taking" the knee? :shrug:
It is. Though in fairness Officer Chauvin was giving the Knee and George Floyd was taking it
Heisenberg
11-06-20, 15:28
Do what you want. Another day hooked up to your laptop trying to boost your ego with sarcasm, profanity and smugness..
Judging from your reply, you may also be interested in "Monkfish is a bitter and miserable c**t with no sense of humour" newsletter too. You already know everyone who has signed up to it.
cyril evans awaydays
11-06-20, 15:30
Who else is bloody fed up with this???
I have no problem with people of different race...but you cannot change history...it is what it is.
Why bow down to a different race....white to black...black to white....whatever.
This tearing down of statues is appalling.....times were different.......you regret but you do not destroy.....
I regret that Stalin and Lenin were leaders of the USSR but I am appalled that people tore down their statues. Something like that?
Croesy Blue
11-06-20, 15:30
Do what you want. Another day hooked up to your laptop trying to boost your ego with sarcasm, profanity and smugness..
Why are people with opinions like your always so angry?
Maurice Swan
11-06-20, 15:33
Giving ...taking...whatever...it is just ludicrous.....and wrong.
In the same vein I do not see any need to apologise etc for India....or wherever for colonialism.
History is History.
Maybe blasphemy was not the right word....perhaps using obscenities is correct...there is simply no need and reflects the user of such language.
PhyllisStant
11-06-20, 15:36
Who else is bloody fed up with this???
I have no problem with people of different race...but you cannot change history...it is what it is.
Why bow down to a different race....white to black...black to white....whatever.
This tearing down of statues is appalling.....times were different.......you regret but you do not destroy.....
The parallels between this and Jimmy Saville are incredible.
The argument for keeping the Colston statue is that "he did so much charitable work".
As did Saville but do we ignore his 'indiscretions'?
"Well if you tear down his statue you have to tear down his buildings". So are you suggesting we also close the hospital wards that Saville paid for? No but you maybe rename them as they have done is Great Ormand street.
"We can't erase history". Nobody is erasing history. Statues sole purpose is to revere and celebrate a person's greatness - maybe put it in a museum like the international slavery museum in Liverpool where its only purpose then is to teach new generations how bloody weird we were building public memorials to murderers and human traffickers.
Wow!! And just found this about goings on in Italy .http://factsanddetails.com/world/cat56/sub408/entry-6344.html
Good shout. I am now also in favour of tearing down the statue of the butcher Tiberius in.... where did you say it is Monkfish?
Maurice Swan
11-06-20, 15:38
I regret that Stalin and Lenin were leaders of the USSR but I am appalled that people tore down their statues. Something like that?
yes. History
Heisenberg
11-06-20, 15:40
yes. History
I'm just going to put up a statue of Adolf Hitler in the eyeline of your bedroom window. It's history.
Brb.
Wales-Bales
11-06-20, 15:41
I heard the Moors and Genghis Khan were a bit naughty, I wonder if anybody will be inspecting any of their past misdemeanors?
I heard the Moors and Genghis Khan were a bit naughty, I wonder if anybody will be inspecting any of their past misdemeanors?
Can we finish the Confederate clean up first?
Jefferson Davis is down and Robert E Lee is next on the list. It's history in the making! :thumbup:
dembethewarrior
11-06-20, 15:50
What is the point of this blasphemy??
What, the post he quoted?
Christ, that's some bollocks you have written.
Tuesday one of my customers was chatting and his local village " covid survival group " ( which has worked very well to be fair and helped each other out ) is trying to organise a " take a knee thursday " to replace the front line worker / nhs clap
I didnt believe him, so he showed me the FB poster
funny thing is, 80% of the village are retired and wouldnt be able to get back up, its all good though as the village doesnt have anyone that isnt white, so its a show of support :thumbup:
A Quiet Monkfish
11-06-20, 15:59
Tuesday one of my customers was chatting and his local village " covid survival group " ( which has worked very well to be fair and helped each other out ) is trying to organise a " take a knee thursday " to replace the front line worker / nhs clap
I didnt believe him, so he showed me the FB poster
funny thing is, 80% of the village are retired and wouldnt be able to get back up, its all good though as the village doesnt have anyone that isnt white, so its a show of support :thumbup:
The other day I clapped for the NHS, sang for Wales and showed the knee, all at the same time. Then again I may have been watching Joe Wicks at the time..
The other day I clapped for the NHS, sang for Wales and showed the knee, all at the same time. Then again I may have been watching Joe Wicks at the time..
:hehe::hehe: joe does like his lunges :thumbup:
The Lone Gunman
11-06-20, 16:04
This tearing down of statues is appalling.....times were different.....
Times were indeed different. As crazy as this might sound, things sometimes change. Scary, huh?
SLUDGE FACTORY
11-06-20, 16:11
Racism may almost always effect people of colour , but its repercussions affect everyone
White people who stand up to , protest about or report racism are often labelled as do gooders, liberals or in the states commie Democrats
I think the ideal place for statues of people like colston would be in a museum with a detailed notice on the bottom describing their place in history and why we should never return
Stalin and Hitler were genocidal maniacs and we know a lot about how evil they were
But we dont have statues of them or dress up like them. Apart from neo nazis and members of the royal family
SLUDGE FACTORY
11-06-20, 16:13
:hehe::hehe: joe does like his lunges :thumbup:
I hate lunges , prefer static squats against a wall
What are people’s thoughts about statues of the Roman emperors? Have to confess I enjoy seeing them despite appreciating the hard reality for most people they ruled over.
SLUDGE FACTORY
11-06-20, 16:45
What are people’s thoughts about statues of the Roman emperors? Have to confess I enjoy seeing them despite appreciating the hard reality for most people they ruled over.
Are the ancestors of the people the Roman's treated like shit still treated like shit on a daily basis ?
For example the french ?
Who else is bloody fed up with this???
I have no problem with people of different race...but you cannot change history...it is what it is.
Why bow down to a different race....white to black...black to white....whatever.
This tearing down of statues is appalling.....times were different.......you regret but you do not destroy.....
If you are fed up with 'giving the knee' then I wonder how you would react to racism if you were a PoC
Are the ancestors of the people the Roman's treated like shit still treated like shit on a daily basis ?
For example the french ?
Well, the Roman Empire extended to 5m km2 at it’s peak across Europe, Asia and Africa so probably. But I’m not aware their slavery was ever selective on the basis on race though and all conquered peoples were really fair game.
Tbh, the discussion just got me thinking if I was a bit of a hypocrite as I was more than happy to see Colston end-up in the river.
Maurice Swan
11-06-20, 17:16
If you are fed up with 'giving the knee' then I wonder how you would react to racism if you were a PoC
Quite honestly I would feel embarrassed. You think PoC (as you put it) never practised master/subordination in past history?
Quite honestly I would feel embarrased. Yoiu thinl PoC (as you put it) never practised master/subordination in past history?
Look at the modern times, the effects of colonialism on modern society. Both in Britain and in international relations. There is a lot of discrimination and racism domestically and worldwide, many developed countries are poor because the European empires took their wealth and in some cases ruined their domestic industries
SLUDGE FACTORY
11-06-20, 17:24
Quite honestly I would feel embarrassed. You think PoC (as you put it) never practised master/subordination in past history?
If you were a person of colour and you were subject to racism you would be embarrassed?
Or are you saying if you were a person of colour and these protests were going on you would be embarrassed by these protests ?
Maurice Swan
11-06-20, 17:29
yes i would....there are other ways to be heard, to get in a position of influence.
I am white...but when I see Caucasian yobs drunk in the street and fighting I feel embarrassed at the 'culture'.
dembethewarrior
11-06-20, 17:29
Quite honestly I would feel embarrassed. You think PoC (as you put it) never practised master/subordination in past history?
Ones still happening now though.
SLUDGE FACTORY
11-06-20, 17:37
yes i would....there are other ways to be heard, to get in a position of influence.
I am white...but when I see Caucasian yobs drunk in the street and fighting I feel embarrassed at the 'culture'.
Well those other ways of protesting have not been heard have they ?
cyril evans awaydays
11-06-20, 17:39
What are people’s thoughts about statues of the Roman emperors? Have to confess I enjoy seeing them despite appreciating the hard reality for most people they ruled over.
I think it's a pretty complex subject. Statues and icons erected to glorify individuals and regimes are often torn down by invaders or revolutionaries.
What we seem to have in the UK at the moment is neither of those. We have a glorification, rightly or wrongly of when Great Britain was the most powerful state on the planet. The empire that we created defined the multi-cultural state we have today and some of those honoured by statues who helped forged that empire look out of place in the Britain we live in today.
We don't seem to have managed that transition too well. Democratic attempts to deal with Colston's legacy on Bristol seem to have floundered, which must have been a trigger to his drowning at the weekend.
I think the Mayor of Bristol's response was the right one though to retrieve it and store for a future debate when emotions have cooled. I think the targeting of statues of Churchill were perverse. He may have recognised flaws but there are not many statues of Chamberlain and Lord Halifax about I guess. And it allows idiots like Yaxley Lennon to trigger his hits and mobilise the reactionaries.
All this bull about Pyramids, the Mongols etc should be just seem for what it is, Whatabboutery.inc. As should the outrage of someone living in the Dordogne who just sees modern Britain through the filter of the Daily Mail.
Taunton Blue Genie
11-06-20, 17:40
Who else is bloody fed up with this???
I have no problem with people of different race...but you cannot change history...it is what it is.
Why bow down to a different race....white to black...black to white....whatever.
This tearing down of statues is appalling.....times were different.......you regret but you do not destroy.....
Just because people amassed fortunes on the back of slavery and used some of that fortune for good works doesn't mean that their statues are sacrosanct. Using your logic, Germany should have retained all the statues of Hitler.
Just because people amassed fortunes on the back of slavery and used some of that fortune for good works doesn't mean that their statues are sacrosanct. Using your logic, Germany should have retained all the statues of Hitler.
Well actually it wasn't the Germans who destroyed them, it was us! lol:hehe:
Maurice Swan
11-06-20, 18:20
As should the outrage of someone living in the Dordogne who just sees modern Britain through the filter of the Daily Mail.
I dont see why my location should prerclude me from having opinions about the UK, even if you do not agree with them.
Maurice Swan
11-06-20, 18:23
I wonder if they will pull down statues of Nelson Mandela aka a terrorist from Parliament Square? or perhaps even those of Robert Mugabe.....oh perhaps only white people were oppressive.
Croesy Blue
11-06-20, 18:25
Where the **** are the statues of Robert Mugabe in the U.K.? :hehe:
Just because people amassed fortunes on the back of slavery and used some of that fortune for good works doesn't mean that their statues are sacrosanct. Using your logic, Germany should have retained all the statues of Hitler.
There's a mob of 'Mother in laws' eyeing up the Tommy Cooper statue in Caerphilly as we speak.
cyril evans awaydays
11-06-20, 18:29
I dont see why my location should prerclude me from having opinions about the UK, even if you do not agree with them.
I didn't say that obviates you from a view. I was talking about Whatabouttery as in What about Mandela or Robert Mugabe, wherever his statue is in the UK
Heisenberg
11-06-20, 18:35
I wonder if they will pull down statues of Nelson Mandela aka a terrorist from Parliament Square? or perhaps even those of Robert Mugabe.....oh perhaps only white people were oppressive.
I ask the witness to revert to my opening question again...
What... the f**k?
This is madness.
William Treseder
11-06-20, 19:38
Where the **** are the statues of Robert Mugabe in the U.K.? :hehe:
In Maurice Swans hallway!
In Maurice Swans hallway!
:hehe:Made me laugh.
splott parker
11-06-20, 19:42
There's a mob of 'Mother in laws' eyeing up the Tommy Cooper statue in Caerphilly as we speak.
That’s a bit fezist!!!!
Jordi Culé
11-06-20, 19:59
Tuesday one of my customers was chatting and his local village " covid survival group " ( which has worked very well to be fair and helped each other out ) is trying to organise a " take a knee thursday " to replace the front line worker / nhs clap
I didnt believe him, so he showed me the FB poster
funny thing is, 80% of the village are retired and wouldnt be able to get back up, its all good though as the village doesnt have anyone that isnt white, so its a show of support :thumbup:
Imagine the scene if one of your geriatric neighbours in a misguided attempt of solidarity decides to ‘black up’.
splott parker
11-06-20, 20:26
Get the economy back on its feet, tear ‘em all down, weigh ‘em in. Got to be a few bob to be made, just keep the ASH campaign people away from Fred:thumbup:
SLUDGE FACTORY
11-06-20, 21:11
In Maurice Swans hallway!
Feckin hell pmsl brilliant
Yeah why protest for something being right unless you're protesting for everything being right!!
WHATABOUT WHATABOUT WHATABOUT is the last refuge of people who have never had the balls to actually stand up to be counted for anything in their lives so just stand on the sidelines trying and failing to tear down people who do. It's genuinely the most pathetic behaviour I can imagine, as soon as someone does it you know everything you need to know about their character.
And by stand up to be counted I don't mean telling people your opinion on the internet or down the pub.
Sir Sidney Ruff-Diamond
12-06-20, 02:53
I’m sure I’ve seen a photo of Fred Keenor grabbing a pussy.
Just sayin’
Croesy Blue
12-06-20, 08:13
In Maurice Swans hallway!
:hehe:
Croesy Blue
12-06-20, 08:13
WHATABOUT WHATABOUT WHATABOUT is the last refuge of people who have never had the balls to actually stand up to be counted for anything in their lives so just stand on the sidelines trying and failing to tear down people who do. It's genuinely the most pathetic behaviour I can imagine, as soon as someone does it you know everything you need to know about their character.
And by stand up to be counted I don't mean telling people your opinion on the internet or down the pub.
:thumbup:
Same as people calling any good deed virtue signalling, just because they can't imagine having empathy for someone.
dembethewarrior
12-06-20, 09:16
:thumbup:
Same as people calling any good deed virtue signalling, just because they can't imagine having empathy for someone.
Well said.
I think it's a pretty complex subject. Statues and icons erected to glorify individuals and regimes are often torn down by invaders or revolutionaries.
What we seem to have in the UK at the moment is neither of those. We have a glorification, rightly or wrongly of when Great Britain was the most powerful state on the planet. The empire that we created defined the multi-cultural state we have today and some of those honoured by statues who helped forged that empire look out of place in the Britain we live in today.
We don't seem to have managed that transition too well. Democratic attempts to deal with Colston's legacy on Bristol seem to have floundered, which must have been a trigger to his drowning at the weekend.
I think the Mayor of Bristol's response was the right one though to retrieve it and store for a future debate when emotions have cooled. I think the targeting of statues of Churchill were perverse. He may have recognised flaws but there are not many statues of Chamberlain and Lord Halifax about I guess. And it allows idiots like Yaxley Lennon to trigger his hits and mobilise the reactionaries.
All this bull about Pyramids, the Mongols etc should be just seem for what it is, Whatabboutery.inc. As should the outrage of someone living in the Dordogne who just sees modern Britain through the filter of the Daily Mail.
It can get more complex. For example, some white supremacist groups glorify ancient Roman and Greece and enlist their cultures to justify their hate-based ideologies. On the basis they represent achievement and great advances in civilisation by white males. In some cases these groups have actually adopted Roman symbols, icons and acronyms into their racist messaging etc.
Some classical scholars are concerned enough by misrepresentations to actively respond to these appropriations by Alt-Right groups - see http://pages.vassar.edu/pharos/
This is getting silly now.
the BBC has pulled Fawlty towers off the TV because "It contains racial slurs".
Gofer Blue
12-06-20, 09:40
Can anyone explain what "taking the knee" is actually supposed to represent? It seems it is more than just going down on one knee as they also bow their heads and occasionally do the one-fist salute, reminiscent of the black power salute. Are participants actually bowing down and if so, to who or what?
The Lone Gunman
12-06-20, 09:43
This is getting silly now.
the BBC has pulled Fawlty towers off the TV because "It contains racial slurs".
No it hasn't.
https://news.sky.com/story/fawlty-towers-episode-pulled-from-streaming-service-due-to-racial-slurs-12005118
This is getting silly now.
the BBC has pulled Fawlty towers off the TV because "It contains racial slurs".
This episode originally had repeated use of the N word. The BBC edited it in 2013 with full approval of John Cleese.
Netfix and UKTV were airing the unedited version, its more than likely that these station will upload the edited version in the future.
Heisenberg
12-06-20, 09:48
Can anyone explain what "taking the knee" is actually supposed to represent? It seems it is more than just going down on one knee as they also bow their heads and occasionally do the one-fist salute, reminiscent of the black power salute. Are participants actually bowing downand if so, to who or what?
No.
Next...
Heisenberg
12-06-20, 10:14
It seems that a few posters do not understand what the taking of the knee represents...
It started a few years ago when a black NFL player, Colin Kaepernick, started protesting against police brutality against the black community by "taking the knee" while the American national anthem was being played. (Taking the knee is what players usually do when being given tactical instructions by the coach, so it fits with the NFL theme).
Kaepernick was slaughtered by a lot of people for it, not least the President. It started to gather a bit more momentum and other players began protesting by taking the knee during the anthem too.
Kaepernick was blacklisted by the NFL and hasn't had a team since the end of that season. The NFL have come out recently and apologised for their reaction to the protests.
That's where the origins of taking the knee comes from and why BLM uses it.
The bowing of the head that some protestors do has nothing to do with "bowing down" to anything/anyone.
If people bow their head during a minute's silence are your first thoughts "what could they be bowing down to?!"
There are some really paranoid posters on here, by the looks of it.
Thank you for attending my TED Talk on 'taking the knee'.
It seems that a few posters do not understand what the taking of the knee represents...
It started a few years ago when a black NFL player, Colin Kaepernick, started protesting against police brutality against the black community by "taking the knee" while the American national anthem was being played. (Taking the knee is what players usually do when being given tactical instructions by the coach, so it fits with the NFL theme).
Kaepernick was slaughtered by a lot of people for it, not least the President. It started to gather a bit more momentum and other players began protesting by taking the knee during the anthem too.
Kaepernick was blacklisted by the NFL and hasn't had a team since the end of that season. The NFL have come out recently and apologised for their reaction to the protests.
That's where the origins of taking the knee comes from and why BLM uses it.
The bowing of the head that some protestors do has nothing to do with "bowing down" to anything/anyone.
If people bow their head during a minute's silence are your first thoughts "what could they be bowing down to?!"
There are some really paranoid posters on here, by the looks of it.
Thank you for attending my TED Talk on 'taking the knee'.
Is the seminar fee Bill in the post?? :hehe:
Heisenberg
12-06-20, 11:27
Is the seminar fee Bill in the post?? :hehe:
In lieu of payment, donations can be made to the Cardiff City Academy Life on Mars Fund.
Gofer Blue
12-06-20, 12:33
It seems that a few posters do not understand what the taking of the knee represents...
It started a few years ago when a black NFL player, Colin Kaepernick, started protesting against police brutality against the black community by "taking the knee" while the American national anthem was being played. (Taking the knee is what players usually do when being given tactical instructions by the coach, so it fits with the NFL theme).
Kaepernick was slaughtered by a lot of people for it, not least the President. It started to gather a bit more momentum and other players began protesting by taking the knee during the anthem too.
Kaepernick was blacklisted by the NFL and hasn't had a team since the end of that season. The NFL have come out recently and apologised for their reaction to the protests.
That's where the origins of taking the knee comes from and why BLM uses it.
The bowing of the head that some protestors do has nothing to do with "bowing down" to anything/anyone.
If people bow their head during a minute's silence are your first thoughts "what could they be bowing down to?!"
There are some really paranoid posters on here, by the looks of it.
Thank you for attending my TED Talk on 'taking the knee'.
Thank you for your explanation. Just wondered, as personally I would never bow to another person. I was once castigated for attending a Queen's Award to Industry ceremony on behalf of my company because I would have to bow to the Queen. No problem - I simply shook her hand as you would with anyone else!
I assume during the one minute's silence folk are saying a prayer. That's the only time I bow my head - when I am praying.
The Lone Gunman
12-06-20, 12:33
In lieu of payment, donations can be made to the Cardiff City Academy Life on Mars Fund.
:hehe:
Taunton Blue Genie
12-06-20, 12:40
Thank you for your explanation. Just wondered, as personally I would never bow to another person. I was once castigated for attending a Queen's Award to Industry ceremony on behalf of my company because I would have to bow to the Queen. No problem - I simply shook her hand as you would with anyone else!
I assume during the one minute's silence folk are saying a prayer. That's the only time I bow my head - when I am praying.
Same here - but with the exception of meeting people from a different culture where bowing is mutual.
Thank you for your explanation. Just wondered, as personally I would never bow to another person. I was once castigated for attending a Queen's Award to Industry ceremony on behalf of my company because I would have to bow to the Queen. No problem - I simply shook her hand as you would with anyone else!
I assume during the one minute's silence folk are saying a prayer. That's the only time I bow my head - when I am praying.
What about if you're eating crisps and have dropped a bit down your jumper?
Same here - but with the exception of meeting people from a different culture where bowing is mutual.
TBG in praying SHOCKER
Thank you for your explanation. Just wondered, as personally I would never bow to another person. I was once castigated for attending a Queen's Award to Industry ceremony on behalf of my company because I would have to bow to the Queen. No problem - I simply shook her hand as you would with anyone else!
I assume during the one minute's silence folk are saying a prayer. That's the only time I bow my head - when I am praying.
People also sometimes bow their head when meditating.
Taunton Blue Genie
12-06-20, 13:12
TBG in praying SHOCKER
lardy in mistaking bowing for praying shocker.
Taunton Blue Genie
12-06-20, 13:13
People also sometimes bow their head when meditating.
Or getting out their John Thomas for a pee. Now THAT IS respect!
Or getting out their John Thomas for a pee. Now THAT IS respect!
That’s an affront to all the John Thomas’s out there :hehe:
lardy in mistaking bowing for praying shocker.
He said he only bowed when praying! Anyway just teasing old fruit etc
Taunton Blue Genie
12-06-20, 13:34
He said he only bowed when praying! Anyway just teasing old fruit etc
Teasing? Good lord! Heaven forfend! Whatever next? :-)
Taunton Blue Genie
12-06-20, 13:35
That’s an affront to all the John Thomas’s out there :hehe:
Will they be taken aback?
light up the darkness
12-06-20, 15:31
Has anyone suggested taking down Queen Victoria’s various statues as she was the reigning monarch when a lot of colonialism, related cruelty and slaughter of to indigenous people was being undertaken.
Also George IV for the Peterloo Massacre where UK citizens were slaughtered by the militia in Manchester in 1819
ccfc_is_my_life
12-06-20, 16:22
It seems that a few posters do not understand what the taking of the knee represents...
It started a few years ago when a black NFL player, Colin Kaepernick, started protesting against police brutality against the black community by "taking the knee" while the American national anthem was being played. (Taking the knee is what players usually do when being given tactical instructions by the coach, so it fits with the NFL theme).
Kaepernick was slaughtered by a lot of people for it, not least the President. It started to gather a bit more momentum and other players began protesting by taking the knee during the anthem too.
Kaepernick was blacklisted by the NFL and hasn't had a team since the end of that season. The NFL have come out recently and apologised for their reaction to the protests.
That's where the origins of taking the knee comes from and why BLM uses it.
The bowing of the head that some protestors do has nothing to do with "bowing down" to anything/anyone.
If people bow their head during a minute's silence are your first thoughts "what could they be bowing down to?!"
There are some really paranoid posters on here, by the looks of it.
Thank you for attending my TED Talk on 'taking the knee'.
Kaepernick was not blacklisted - isn't that a racist term now anyway?
Kaepernick discovered his activism after he'd been benched for a QB called Blaine Gabbert, who isn't good himself. Why was he benched? Inability to read defences, no touch or finesse on his passes, completing 58 and 59 percent of his passes his final two seasons along with a string of losses... he'd been found out.
Was he blacklisted when he was offered a contract by Baltimore? No. He demanded starting QB money to be a backup, pricing himself out of the league. Offered backup role at Baltimore, which was pulled when his girlfriend referred to Baltimore legend Ray Lewis as an "uncle tom"... rumours were he may go to Miami until he turned up in Florida wearing a Castro T-shirt, a clear vote winner there - not to mention is "pig cops" socks.
NFL did something unprecented in organising a private workout, something not done for any other player. That ended up as a fiasco, as Kaepernick demanded cameras for his new Nike commercial be invited, not liking the workout changing it at last minute.
He's out of NFL because he simply isn't that good and wants unrealistic money for doing so.
Kaepernick was not blacklisted - isn't that a racist term now anyway?
Kaepernick discovered his activism after he'd been benched for a QB called Blaine Gabbert, who isn't good himself. Why was he benched? Inability to read defences, no touch or finesse on his passes, completing 58 and 59 percent of his passes his final two seasons along with a string of losses... he'd been found out.
Was he blacklisted when he was offered a contract by Baltimore? No. He demanded starting QB money to be a backup, pricing himself out of the league. Offered backup role at Baltimore, which was pulled when his girlfriend referred to Baltimore legend Ray Lewis as an "uncle tom"... rumours were he may go to Miami until he turned up in Florida wearing a Castro T-shirt, a clear vote winner there - not to mention is "pig cops" socks.
NFL did something unprecented in organising a private workout, something not done for any other player. That ended up as a fiasco, as Kaepernick demanded cameras for his new Nike commercial be invited, not liking the workout changing it at last minute.
He's out of NFL because he simply isn't that good and wants unrealistic money for doing so.
it was all about Kaepernick, he is / was trying to make a name for himself as a black rights activist, him not getting a roster place just played into his story , shouldnt feel too sorry for the bloke, his nfl settlement was about $40 mill
i wonder in todays climate he would make a good pick
ccfc_is_my_life
12-06-20, 16:40
it was all about Kaepernick, he is / was trying to make a name for himself as a black rights activist, him not getting a roster place just played into his story , shouldnt feel too sorry for the bloke, his nfl settlement was about $40 mill
i wonder in todays climate he would make a good pick
I don't think he would. The flaws in his game were always there - just as soon as league adapted, he was toast.
At the moment there are numerous free agent QBs, all better than Kaepernick, especially Cam Newton - though for me Newton isn't necessarily a team first kinda guy. Surprised Patriots didn't bring him in though.
Heisenberg
12-06-20, 17:22
Kaepernick was not blacklisted - isn't that a racist term now anyway?
Kaepernick discovered his activism after he'd been benched for a QB called Blaine Gabbert, who isn't good himself. Why was he benched? Inability to read defences, no touch or finesse on his passes, completing 58 and 59 percent of his passes his final two seasons along with a string of losses... he'd been found out.
Was he blacklisted when he was offered a contract by Baltimore? No. He demanded starting QB money to be a backup, pricing himself out of the league. Offered backup role at Baltimore, which was pulled when his girlfriend referred to Baltimore legend Ray Lewis as an "uncle tom"... rumours were he may go to Miami until he turned up in Florida wearing a Castro T-shirt, a clear vote winner there - not to mention is "pig cops" socks.
NFL did something unprecented in organising a private workout, something not done for any other player. That ended up as a fiasco, as Kaepernick demanded cameras for his new Nike commercial be invited, not liking the workout changing it at last minute.
He's out of NFL because he simply isn't that good and wants unrealistic money for doing so.
I'll just leave this here and be on my merry way.
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2019-02-15/colin-kaepernick-settles-blacklisting-lawsuit-against-nfl
I'll just leave this here and be on my merry way.
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2019-02-15/colin-kaepernick-settles-blacklisting-lawsuit-against-nfl
Would you like a spoon for your birthday?
ccfc_is_my_life
12-06-20, 17:32
I'll just leave this here and be on my merry way.
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2019-02-15/colin-kaepernick-settles-blacklisting-lawsuit-against-nfl
Settling lawsuits isn't an admission of anything.
Kaepernick was offered a contract by Baltimore, pulled by his contract demands and actions of his girlfriend.
Kaepernick's QBR the last two seasons was poor, leading team to 3-16 record.
Kapernic was approached by AAF and XFL - wanted guaranteed $20m when both leagues were paying $250k per QB.
Still, it must be his protest and skin colour preventing him being in NFL not his wage demands or poor play...
ccfc_is_my_life
12-06-20, 17:33
Would you like a spoon for your birthday?
I get the impression he seems to like articles to cover his lack of knowledge of American Football.
I'll just leave this here and be on my merry way.
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2019-02-15/colin-kaepernick-settles-blacklisting-lawsuit-against-nfl
He took the money and ran, a bit of a poor show that he didnt stand up and fight for the rights he is so proud of, or will the spin be that they settled thus must be guilt, so he won
ccfc_is_my_life
12-06-20, 17:35
He took the money and ran, a bit of a poor show that he didnt stand up and fight for the rights he is so proud of, or will the spin be that they settled thus must be guilt, so he won
Heisenberg spins more than Kaepernick spins the ball...
Heisenberg
12-06-20, 17:37
Would you like a spoon for your birthday?
Yes please. It's in a few weeks so make sure it arrives on time. Ta!
Heisenberg
12-06-20, 17:38
Heisenberg spins more than Kaepernick spins the ball...
Awww. Thanks... you.
Yes please. It's in a few weeks so make sure it arrives on time. Ta!
No problem. Large economy size. Runsible!!!!!
Kaepernick was not blacklisted - isn't that a racist term now anyway?
I know you're being facetious but it's an interesting (and not coincidental) point that the word black is associated with bad things - blackmail, blackball, blacklist, black sheep, black market, black mark etc, and the word white is associated with good things - white knight, white lie, whitelist etc.
ccfc_is_my_life
12-06-20, 19:10
I know you're being facetious but it's an interesting (and not coincidental) point that the word black is associated with bad things - blackmail, blackball, blacklist, black sheep, black market, black mark etc, and the word white is associated with good things - white knight, white lie, whitelist etc.
Light, dark. Bit of a reach to automatically assume words develop due to racism.
Light, dark. Bit of a reach to automatically assume words develop due to racism.
Sure it is :thumbup:
Settling lawsuits isn't an admission of anything.
Kaepernick was offered a contract by Baltimore, pulled by his contract demands and actions of his girlfriend.
Kaepernick's QBR the last two seasons was poor, leading team to 3-16 record.
Kapernic was approached by AAF and XFL - wanted guaranteed $20m when both leagues were paying $250k per QB.
Still, it must be his protest and skin colour preventing him being in NFL not his wage demands or poor play...
Spot on, he was handed a olive branch several months ago by the league and pissed on his chips
the other bob wilson
13-06-20, 05:24
Has this thread concerning a term that the "outraged" OP couldn't even get right really reached the stage now where some people are arguing that a person's opinion on a non sporting matter becomes less relevant because someone thinks they aren't very good at their chosen sport? What a totally ludicrous argument if it has.
Hungry Blue
13-06-20, 06:43
I know you're being facetious but it's an interesting (and not coincidental) point that the word black is associated with bad things - blackmail, blackball, blacklist, black sheep, black market, black mark etc, and the word white is associated with good things - white knight, white lie, whitelist etc.
White Knight - A person with low self esteem who combats this with a unwavering need to aid others who may or may not need it. They usually have very isolated personal lives as they are very judgmental of others, surrounding themselves only with those who feed their desire to help and feel as a savior.
William Treseder
13-06-20, 06:52
I know you're being facetious but it's an interesting (and not coincidental) point that the word black is associated with bad things - blackmail, blackball, blacklist, black sheep, black market, black mark etc, and the word white is associated with good things - white knight, white lie, whitelist etc.
Hope none of these statue vigilantes read this.
They'll be storming book stores all over the UK and burning copies of the Oxford English dictionary.
Jordi Culé
13-06-20, 07:16
White Knight - A person with low self esteem who combats this with a unwavering need to aid others who may or may not need it. They usually have very isolated personal lives as they are very judgmental of others, surrounding themselves only with those who feed their desire to help and feel as a savior.
If copying and pasting something at least use a British dictionary and not an American one. We didn’t lose the American colonies to have them Yanks infect our language with their misspelled words.
It’s “saviour”.:angry:
Taunton Blue Genie
13-06-20, 07:36
I know you're being facetious but it's an interesting (and not coincidental) point that the word black is associated with bad things - blackmail, blackball, blacklist, black sheep, black market, black mark etc, and the word white is associated with good things - white knight, white lie, whitelist etc.
I understand the historic negative associations with the word 'black' but I have never been comfortable with labelling people as black - because they aren't actually black. And at what skin pigment along the scale is and isn't black? I'm more pinky brown than most so-called 'white' people.
William Treseder
13-06-20, 08:18
I understand the historic negative associations with the word 'black' but I have never been comfortable with labelling people as black - because they aren't actually black. And at what skin pigment along the scale is and isn't black? I'm more pinky brown than most so-called 'white' people.
Cmon now TBG. This whole episode is about Black and White. There are no Grey areas 😁
A Quiet Monkfish
13-06-20, 08:29
Hope none of these statue vigilantes read this.
They'll be storming book stores all over the UK and burning copies of the Oxford English dictionary.
Green with envy, green shoots of recovery, Green party, Green technology. - GLM matter too, you know.
Wales-Bales
13-06-20, 08:49
Heisenberg spins more than Kaepernick spins the ball...
All "pretend" activists do that, I bet he owns a Che Guevara T-Shirt as well :hehe:
Wales-Bales
13-06-20, 09:02
I'm more pinky brown than most so-called 'white' people.
That sounds disgusting, have you had your cloaca checked out? You may be full of shit!
If copying and pasting something at least use a British dictionary and not an American one. We didn’t lose the American colonies to have them Yanks infect our language with their misspelled words.
It’s “saviour”.:angry:
Yeah that's a very niché l definition he's found, being that Oxford, Cambridge, Websters all definite is as either:
-A person or thing that comes to someone's aid.
-A person or company making an acceptable counter-offer for a company facing a hostile takeover bid.
Still the thought of him going through all the words and frantically looking at all the world's dictionaries trying to find something that he can go aHA about, and coming up with that is funny :hehe:
Hope none of these statue vigilantes read this.
They'll be storming book stores all over the UK and burning copies of the Oxford English dictionary.
They already know about it
Hungry Blue
13-06-20, 11:11
Yeah that's a very niché l definition he's found, being that Oxford, Cambridge, Websters all definite is as either:
-A person or thing that comes to someone's aid.
-A person or company making an acceptable counter-offer for a company facing a hostile takeover bid.
Still the thought of him going through all the words and frantically looking at all the world's dictionaries trying to find something that he can go aHA about, and coming up with that is funny :hehe:
Yeah, that was exactly what happened 🙄
It was a term I saw used on twitter the other day and found the definition on urban dictionary but carry on in your own little world 👍
Yeah, that was exactly what happened
We know :thumbup:
Gofer Blue
18-06-20, 21:42
Can anyone explain what "taking the knee" is actually supposed to represent? It seems it is more than just going down on one knee as they also bow their heads and occasionally do the one-fist salute, reminiscent of the black power salute. Are participants actually bowing down and if so, to who or what?
I see Dominic Raab is in trouble today over his remarks about "taking the knee". I haven't a clue about this Games of Thrones thing but as I have already mentioned in this thread it does seem an odd gesture to me. However obviously in these highly emotionally charged times it is very non-PC to question it. In fact it may well soon become very anti-social not to take part, akin to poppy wearing. I have no problem with wearing a poppy in November but I know others do object (glorification of war etc.) and it is very noticeable that anyone who appears on TV in any connection seems to be obliged to wear one. Interestingly Raab said he would bow to the Queen - I have met the Queen and would not - I simply shook hands as I would with anyone.
SLUDGE FACTORY
18-06-20, 21:51
I see Dominic Raab is in trouble today over his remarks about "taking the knee". I haven't a clue about this Games of Thrones thing but as I have already mentioned in this thread it does seem an odd gesture to me. However obviously in these highly emotionally charged times it is very non-PC to question it. In fact it may well soon become very anti-social not to take part, akin to poppy wearing. I have no problem with wearing a poppy in November but I know others do object (glorification of war etc.) and it is very noticeable that anyone who appears on TV in any connection seems to be obliged to wear one. Interestingly Raab said he would bow to the Queen - I have met the Queen and would not - I simply shook hands as I would with anyone.
Raab is either extremely insensitive and being an arse on purpose or he is genuinely thick as shit
Boris is a racist , we know that already , I think raab is just an idiot
Raab is either extremely insensitive and being an arse on purpose or he is genuinely thick as shit
Boris is a racist , we know that already , I think raab is just an idiot
Raab isn't getting criticised because it's "not PC" - he's getting criticised because he's the foreign secretary of a major world power during a time when people have been protesting en masse worldwide about a huge issue (including in his own country) and he hasn't got a clue about the origin of one of the modes of protest, and the dismissive tone he spoke about it in was awful. I'm not sure if it's arrogance or incompetence but I suspect, with this government, it's a combination of both
And also, it's not going to become anti social not to take part, the footballers are only doing it in the first round of games, protesters are doing it, people who want to show solidarity with the BML cause have done it.
What situation do you possibly envisage finding yourself in where people are taking the knee and criticising you for not?
Who else is bloody fed up with this???
I have no problem with people of different race...but you cannot change history...it is what it is.
Why bow down to a different race....white to black...black to white....whatever.
This tearing down of statues is appalling.....times were different.......you regret but you do not destroy.....
You're fed up with people bringing attention to racial injustice? How fed up would you be having to deal with it first hand every day?
Who else is bloody fed up with this???
I have no problem with people of different race...but you cannot change history...it is what it is.
Why bow down to a different race....white to black...black to white....whatever.
This tearing down of statues is appalling.....times were different.......you regret but you do not destroy.....
Check your privilege 🙄
I have been fed up of racism and racists my whole life. I imagine the black community would be feeling worse than me. Doing the knee is not bowing down to a different race.
And ‘bow down to a different race’? It was the Brits that colonised and made the people think they were superior. And that mentality is still ongoing.
And with tearing down statues... colonialism and slavery should not be celebrated. The statues celebrated these things. And it is a biased history - doesn’t show the effects of these thing on people then and on people now.
Again, check your privilege 🙄
Check your privilege ��
I have been fed up of racism and racists my whole life. I imagine the black community would be feeling worse than me. Doing the knee is not bowing down to a different race.
And ‘bow down to a different race’? It was the Brits that colonised and made the people think they were superior. And that mentality is still ongoing.
And with tearing down statues... colonialism and slavery should not be celebrated. The statues celebrated these things. And it is a biased history - doesn’t show the effects of these thing on people then and on people now.
Again, check your privilege ��
ADZ did you read Darren Lewis's column in the Mirror on Monday,a very powerful piece on whats it is like to be black.
So many things non blacks take for granted.
Jordi Culé
19-06-20, 06:41
At 11:58am this Sunday, can a caring compassionate fellow of this board please check on ole Maurice Swann to ensure he doesn’t self combust into a human inferno, due to apoplectic rage when he sees the City players ‘Take the knee’?
Alternatively let him burn.
I’m not bothered either way.
Gofer Blue
19-06-20, 07:34
Raab isn't getting criticised because it's "not PC" - he's getting criticised because he's the foreign secretary of a major world power during a time when people have been protesting en masse worldwide about a huge issue (including in his own country) and he hasn't got a clue about the origin of one of the modes of protest, and the dismissive tone he spoke about it in was awful. I'm not sure if it's arrogance or incompetence but I suspect, with this government, it's a combination of both
And also, it's not going to become anti social not to take part, the footballers are only doing it in the first round of games, protesters are doing it, people who want to show solidarity with the BML cause have done it.
What situation do you possibly envisage finding yourself in where people are taking the knee and criticising you for not?
I wasn't necessarily talking about myself but can you not envisage a situation where someone e.g. a footballer or a politician did not "take the knee" when everyone around him/her did so? That person would be immediately be in the spotlight with all the unwanted media attention that that would bring. If I was not isolated in rural west Wales but lived in Swansea or Cardiff I probably would have attended one of the demos but if I had, I would have undoubtedly felt under pressure to join in.
the other bob wilson
19-06-20, 07:40
I wasn't necessarily talking about myself but can you not envisage a situation where someone e.g. a footballer or a politician did not "take the knee" when everyone around him/her did so? That person would be immediately be in the spotlight with all the unwanted media attention that that would bring. If I was not isolated in rural west Wales but lived in Swansea or Cardiff I probably would have attended one of the demos but if I had, I would have undoubtedly felt under pressure to join in.
My reluctance to take the knee stems from the fact that these days I might have more than a few problems untaking it.
Gofer Blue
19-06-20, 07:49
My reluctance to take the knee stems from the fact that these days I might have more than a few problems untaking it.
Me too! :-)
Is it just me or is "taking the knee" a bit weird considering that the police guy did exactly that on george floyds neck?
Is it just me or is "taking the knee" a bit weird considering that the police guy did exactly that on george floyds neck?
Watch it, you’ll have the tinternet police knocking on your door !!!!!!
PS:——- I thought the same :shrug:
Bluebirdman Of Alcathays
19-06-20, 09:50
Settling lawsuits isn't an admission of anything.
Kaepernick was offered a contract by Baltimore, pulled by his contract demands and actions of his girlfriend.
Kaepernick's QBR the last two seasons was poor, leading team to 3-16 record.
Kapernic was approached by AAF and XFL - wanted guaranteed $20m when both leagues were paying $250k per QB.
Still, it must be his protest and skin colour preventing him being in NFL not his wage demands or poor play...
Off the top of my head, CK was rated about 26th out of 32 starting QBs so while not a world beater, he was decent enough to start for some teams. There are worse QBs who keep finding employment. The 3-16 record might have had a number of factors. He would've found work if it wasn't for the protests.
Watch it, you’ll have the tinternet police knocking on your door !!!!!!
PS:——- I thought the same :shrug:
Note to self: "you must not put a smiley on this post...you must not put a smiley on this post...... you must not put a smiley on this post.... you must no..............."
Watch it, you’ll have the tinternet police knocking on your door !!!!!!
PS:——- I thought the same :shrug:[/h
[QUOTE=xsnaggle;5088735]Note to self: "you must not put a smiley on this post...you must not put a smiley on this post...... you must not put a smiley on this post.... you must no..............."
:hehe::hehe::hehe:
ccfc_is_my_life
19-06-20, 12:01
Off the top of my head, CK was rated about 26th out of 32 starting QBs so while not a world beater, he was decent enough to start for some teams. There are worse QBs who keep finding employment. The 3-16 record might have had a number of factors. He would've found work if it wasn't for the protests.
He was decent enough to start for shit teams wanting to tank a season to draft a better QB the next.
He had zero finesse on his passes, everything was rifled in, even short dump passes to RBs. He was unable to effectively read defences, relying on his first read and then taking off with the ball.
He was replaced by Blaine ****ing Gabbert for god sake.
Contrary to claims, he wasn't cut by 49ers. He would have been, but he opted out of a $13m per year deal. Since then, despite claims, there has been interest but he's priced himself out of the market. He wants starter money when he'd be, at best, a backup. No franchise would pay that.
Let's not forget he was offered a deal by Baltimore which was pulled. Why was it pulled? Maybe because his girlfriend intimated Ray Lewis was an "uncle Tom" and stated Baltimore's owner was a "slave owner". No franchise wants to put up with that shit.
As for 49ers record, good QBs lead and inspire. Kaepernick failed to do so.
He wouldn't have found work without the protests. He'd have been cut and price himself out of the market due to his overgrown ego. Why would he want to work anyway given the money he's making through Nike as chief SJW?
I wasn't necessarily talking about myself but can you not envisage a situation where someone e.g. a footballer or a politician did not "take the knee" when everyone around him/her did so? That person would be immediately be in the spotlight with all the unwanted media attention that that would bring. If I was not isolated in rural west Wales but lived in Swansea or Cardiff I probably would have attended one of the demos but if I had, I would have undoubtedly felt under pressure to join in.
Just by attending the demos you're showing your support, if you don't want to take the knee there you don't have to and no one says a thing. Plenty of people not kneeling, their reasons are their own, and I say that as someone who did go.
In terms of your other point, it's not as if we're all expected to start taking the knee now. Like I said, footballers are doing it this round of games. If 10 of them did it and the other 1 didn't I think you're probably right there'd be questions asked. Not least by their black teammates I suspect, as to why they don't support racial equality.
ccfc_is_my_life
19-06-20, 12:16
I'd wonder why black teammates were equating not taking the knee with not supporting racial equality.
Smacks of the whole clapping for NHS crap, don't do it and you're automatically viewed as scum.
Bluebirdman Of Alcathays
19-06-20, 13:56
He wouldn't have found work without the protests. He'd have been cut and price himself out of the market due to his overgrown ego. Why would he want to work anyway given the money he's making through Nike as chief SJW?
He'd have been cut? You said he was offered a contract. Overgrown egos often go with the territory. There are reports that the Ravens and Seahawks are favourites to sign him, all despite the lay-off, so he can't be that bad.
I'd wonder why black teammates were equating not taking the knee with not supporting racial equality.
Smacks of the whole clapping for NHS crap, don't do it and you're automatically viewed as scum.
Because taking the knee for ten seconds is a symbol of supporting racial equality and if 10 of your teammates are doing it and you're refusing to there's got to be a specific reason as to why. I think it's understandable that your black teammates would wonder what that is.
The Gifaffe
19-06-20, 15:11
How long before 'Men of Harlech' is attacked for being a celebration of white colonial bully boys massacring brave black Africans?
The Lone Gunman
19-06-20, 15:18
How long before 'Men of Harlech' is attacked for being a celebration of white colonial bully boys massacring brave black Africans?
Eternity?
ccfc_is_my_life
19-06-20, 15:47
He'd have been cut? You said he was offered a contract. Overgrown egos often go with the territory. There are reports that the Ravens and Seahawks are favourites to sign him, all despite the lay-off, so he can't be that bad.
I did say that. He was given a restructured contract by 49ers, no way they were paying top dollar starting QB money for a backup. He walked away from $13m.
Ravens were looking at a deal, backing up Flacco. Pulled that after his girlfriends comments - and rightly so.
Seattle, well Carroll has always claimed interest but pulling Russell Wilson to play Kaepernick? Never. Going. To Happen.
Kaepernick could easily be on a team if he was willing to accept he'd be a backup, on backup money.
It's amazing that him taking a knee has magically made him into the best QB since Montana, Marino et al. 59% accuracy over his last two seasons isn't going to make GMs rush to hire you.
Kaepernick played his little stunt when given that unprecedented workout - never done for any other player. Moving it 30 minutes before due to start because he wanted his camera crew there to film a Nike commercial? Complaining at the last minute about the waiver when they'd known the details well in advance? he knows he's done as a starting QB so is happy to moan and take the Nike money...
If any NFL team was dumb enough to sign him on the bloated money he wants and even worse start him, the only reason would be that they are tanking for Trevor Lawrence in next draft.
ccfc_is_my_life
19-06-20, 15:48
Because taking the knee for ten seconds is a symbol of supporting racial equality and if 10 of your teammates are doing it and you're refusing to there's got to be a specific reason as to why. I think it's understandable that your black teammates would wonder what that is.
It's virtue signalling that achieves basically nothing.
Would teammates for example, think worse of Bellamy not doing it knowing the work he was doing in Sierra Leonne?
A Quiet Monkfish
19-06-20, 15:50
I'd wonder why black teammates were equating not taking the knee with not supporting racial equality.
Smacks of the whole clapping for NHS crap, don't do it and you're automatically viewed as scum.
or don't be the only house in the street without a 'rainbow' picture.
ccfc_is_my_life
19-06-20, 15:54
or don't be the only house in the street without a 'rainbow' picture.
The only use for those rainbow pictures was exposing how many people have zero clue as to the number of colours and colours in a rainbow
Bridgend Bluebird 247
19-06-20, 16:01
To be fair, its not really black people asking for it.
Mainly white middle class people to make them feel good
Taunton Blue Genie
19-06-20, 17:12
The only use for those rainbow pictures was exposing how many people have zero clue as to the number of colours and colours in a rainbow
The number of colours in a rainbow is an interesting subject:
https://www.languagesoftheworld.info/language-and-mind/all-the-colors-of-the-rainbow-and-beyond.html#:~:text=Hence%2C%20a%20Russian%20child %20has,('light%20blue').
And did you know that Japanese traffic lights are red, amber and......blue?
https://www.mentalfloss.com/article/625406/best-selling-portable-air-conditioners?utm_content=infinitescroll1
ccfc_is_my_life
19-06-20, 17:19
The first one is pseudo-babble, they missed Indigo out. ROYGBIV.
As for the second, I suddenly feel like buying an air conditioner for some strange reason.
William Treseder
19-06-20, 17:19
Because taking the knee for ten seconds is a symbol of supporting racial equality and if 10 of your teammates are doing it and you're refusing to there's got to be a specific reason as to why. I think it's understandable that your black teammates would wonder what that is.
All total bollox. Do you think for one minute any racists are gonna take notice of all this “taking the knee” nonsense?
There will always be racists. The answer in football is for all non racist fans to have the balls to stand up to them in the crowds. You cant stop people thinking as racists, but you sure as hell can stop them from spouting the shite.
Clubs need to identify these cu*ts, put their pictures up on the big screens identifying them as the scum they are and ban them for life.
Outside of football, then thats a matter for society to be brave and again challenge them at every point.
Taunton Blue Genie
19-06-20, 17:24
How long before 'Men of Harlech' is attacked for being a celebration of white colonial bully boys massacring brave black Africans?
I was rather surprised that at the Native American pow-wows I attended many years ago (including the biggest one in the States) the Star-spangled banner was played at each of them. After reading 'I Buried My Heart At Wounded Knee' I expected less respect for the anthem adopted by those who persecuted the indigenous people and, even to this day, has left a huge proportion of them in a less than wealthy state.
Jordi Culé
19-06-20, 17:29
All total bollox. Do you think for one minute any racists are gonna take notice of all this “taking the knee” nonsense?
There will always be racists. The answer in football is for all non racist fans to have the balls to stand up to them in the crowds. You cant stop people thinking as racists, but you sure as hell can stop them from spouting the shite.
Clubs need to identify these cu*ts, put their pictures up on the big screens identifying them as the scum they are and ban them for life.
Outside of football, then thats a matter for society to be brave and again challenge them at every point.
I like your train of thought here.
Although I still correctly maintain Cantona dealt with racists in the right manner back in 95.
Taunton Blue Genie
19-06-20, 17:29
The number of colours in a rainbow is an interesting subject:
https://www.languagesoftheworld.info/language-and-mind/all-the-colors-of-the-rainbow-and-beyond.html#:~:text=Hence%2C%20a%20Russian%20child %20has,('light%20blue').
And did you know that Japanese traffic lights are red, amber and......blue?
https://www.mentalfloss.com/article/625406/best-selling-portable-air-conditioners?utm_content=infinitescroll1
And if any of you are interested in the nature of the perception of colour and the linguistics used to express it (and I am probably boring you all to death, as usual) a Namibian tribe has an interesting take on such things:
https://www.gondwana-collection.com/blog/how-do-namibian-himbas-see-colour/
ccfc_is_my_life
19-06-20, 17:31
And if any of you are interested in the nature of the perception of colour and the linguistics used to express it (and I am probably boring you all to death, as usual) a Namibian tribe has an interesting take on such things:
https://www.gondwana-collection.com/blog/how-do-namibian-himbas-see-colour/
Can trump you for boring facts, once had to produce a range of screen colour setups to cover colour blindess. Did you know there are over 100 different types of colour blindness?
Been following this Fred, but reading the HEADING, I can’t get the old Grangetown End song, out of my head !!!!!
“We’re going to, jump down, turn around, kick ‘um in the bollocks”
“We’re going to jump down, turn around, kick ‘um in the head”
Etc, etc, etc
It’s just that phrase “ Giving the Knee”
Taunton Blue Genie
19-06-20, 17:33
Been following this Fred, but reading the HEADING, I can’t get the old Grangetown End song, out of my head !!!!!
“We’re going to, jump down, turn around, kick ‘um in the bollocks”
“We’re going to jump down, turn around, kick ‘um in the head”
Etc, etc, etc
It’s just that phrase “ Giving the Knee”
You forgot 'Oh, Lordy'.
It's virtue signalling that achieves basically nothing.
Would teammates for example, think worse of Bellamy not doing it knowing the work he was doing in Sierra Leonne?
He'd do it though wouldn't he
You forgot 'Oh, Lordy'.
Grey matter is drying up :hehe:
dembethewarrior
19-06-20, 17:43
All total bollox. Do you think for one minute any racists are gonna take notice of all this “taking the knee” nonsense?
There will always be racists. The answer in football is for all non racist fans to have the balls to stand up to them in the crowds. You cant stop people thinking as racists, but you sure as hell can stop them from spouting the shite.
Clubs need to identify these cu*ts, put their pictures up on the big screens identifying them as the scum they are and ban them for life.
Outside of football, then thats a matter for society to be brave and again challenge them at every point.
Lawsuit waiting to happen
ccfc_is_my_life
19-06-20, 17:45
He'd do it though wouldn't he
It's a hypothetica example.
And no, he probably wouldn't have during his playing days, given the state of his knees might never have got back up again.
dembethewarrior
19-06-20, 17:49
Considering stopping the England egg fans singing 'swing low' as well I've read.
Wasn't aware of the songs origins.
William Treseder
19-06-20, 17:50
Lawsuit waiting to happen
So that stops it does it? Things need to change big time, and a law suit is one of those things. Thats if we as a nation are gonna get serious about this poison.
Its the sane in Scottish football with sectarianism Clubs, especially the old firm have just paid lip service to the problem for decades.
Weed the *****res out, and ban them for life. Or carry on as normal, and moan about it every time it rears its ugly head..
You forgot 'Oh, Lordy'.
Grey matter is drying up :hehe:
Bloody hell, I’m surprised you didn’t pick up on “Grangetown End” instead of what it should have been “GRANGE-END”
Norwich v Southampton doing my head in
SLUDGE FACTORY
19-06-20, 17:52
All total bollox. Do you think for one minute any racists are gonna take notice of all this “taking the knee” nonsense?
There will always be racists. The answer in football is for all non racist fans to have the balls to stand up to them in the crowds. You cant stop people thinking as racists, but you sure as hell can stop them from spouting the shite.
Clubs need to identify these cu*ts, put their pictures up on the big screens identifying them as the scum they are and ban them for life.
Outside of football, then thats a matter for society to be brave and again challenge them at every point.
It's very intimidating standing up to racists at football matches , I have shopped people doing nazi salutes in front on me on the Bob bank , it was a relief when the stewards came in and took him out , my mate said I " shouldn't have got involved " What he really meant was he was shit scared of people like that and a lot of people feel the same .
William Treseder
19-06-20, 17:59
It's very intimidating standing up to racists at football matches , I have shopped people doing nazi salutes in front on me on the Bob bank , it was a relief when the stewards came in and took him out , my mate said I " shouldn't have got involved " What he really meant was he was shit scared of people like that and a lot of people feel the same .
Then you will know how Black fans and players will feel then
Ive stood up to racists many times in all walks of life, and I'm not particularly big or hard. Ive got myself in bother over it, but it wouldn't stop me
Thats the problem. Most people wont get involved, and these tossers continually get away with it.
As I've said earlier, there will always be racists, but they need to be outed at every point.
I’ve even fallen out with mates about it..
dembethewarrior
19-06-20, 18:06
So that stops it does it? Things need to change big time, and a law suit is one of those things. Thats if we as a nation are gonna get serious about this poison.
Its the sane in Scottish football with sectarianism Clubs, especially the old firm have just paid lip service to the problem for decades.
Weed the *****res out, and ban them for life. Or carry on as normal, and moan about it every time it rears its ugly head..
I'm on about if they start the naming and shaming. Even if they are horrible little racists who deserve it, if that action was to result in them being hurt or it had an effect on their job etc people would soon start feeling sorry for themselves.
SLUDGE FACTORY
19-06-20, 18:07
Then you will know how Black fans and players will feel then
Ive stood up to racists many times in all walks of life, and I'm not particularly big or hard. Ive got myself in bother over it, but it wouldn't stop me
Thats the problem. Most people wont get involved, and these tossers continually get away with it.
As I've said earlier, there will always be racists, but they need to be outed at every point.
I’ve even fallen out with mates about it..
There was a black lady a few yards to my right as this feckwit was doing the nazi salute . There was no way as I was going to tell him to stop , I wanted him done so I told a steward who must have alerted CCTV and he was taken out at half time . He got fined and banned . If I had said something it could have ended up in a punch up .
splott parker
19-06-20, 18:29
Bloody hell, I’m surprised you didn’t pick up on “Grangetown End” instead of what it should have been “GRANGE-END”
Norwich v Southampton doing my head in
It was the Grangetown End wasn’t it?
Then you will know how Black fans and players will feel then
Ive stood up to racists many times in all walks of life, and I'm not particularly big or hard. Ive got myself in bother over it, but it wouldn't stop me
Thats the problem. Most people wont get involved, and these tossers continually get away with it.
As I've said earlier, there will always be racists, but they need to be outed at every point.
I’ve even fallen out with mates about it..
Why do black footballers always play up front?
So you can keep an eye on them!
William Treseder
20-06-20, 01:18
Why do black footballers always play up front?
So you can keep an eye on them!
Whats your point? Ate you saying that makes me a racist?If it had been a quip about a 103yr old woman who had just passed away it would be fine.
Back under your rock,
dembethewarrior
20-06-20, 01:27
Whats your point? Ate you saying that makes me a racist?If it had been a quip about a 103yr old woman who had just passed away it would be fine.
Back under your rock,
I've called out 'casual racism' in my local more than once. Needs to be done.
the other bob wilson
20-06-20, 04:55
It's a hypothetica example.
And no, he probably wouldn't have during his playing days, given the state of his knees might never have got back up again.
Talk about desperation not to say you're wrong - I made a joke of the fact that I wouldn't be able to get up again if I took the knee because I'm a not very fit, overweight, sixty four year old, but I'd do it anyway even if the getting up part from it would hardly be graceful. Bellamy was a professional footballer who got paid an awful lot of money by our club right up to the end of his career, he was also the sort of player who always gave 100 per cent in every game, he may not have been the physical specimen at the end of his career that he was at the start of it, but to seriously suggest his knees were so bad that he wouldn't have been able to pick himself up is barmy.
You do release that you are dismissing footballers as virtue signallers for taking the knee do you? Just think about that, they are free to do what they like in this country and, as far as I'm aware, every single one of them so far has done it. Are you saying that if you were a Premier League footballer, you'd not do it? What point would you be wanting to make by not doing it if, as I presume you do, you say you're not a racist?
Seems to me that footballers of all colours in this country are exercising their right of choice, what's wrong with that? I thought you libertarian types were all in favour of that.
the other bob wilson
20-06-20, 05:00
I've called out 'casual racism' in my local more than once. Needs to be done.
I did it a couple of times in pubs as well while thinking "Christ, I'm likely to get filled in here", but on both occasions, the racist backed down. The thing is though, it was only one person really on both occasions - both times he had mates with him, but on one of them at least, there were far more of us than them. I'm pretty certain I would not have been so brave at a game where I always sit with one person and it was a group of, say, five, who were shouting racist abuse.
Whats your point? Ate you saying that makes me a racist?If it had been a quip about a 103yr old woman who had just passed away it would be fine.
Back under your rock,
I'm just trying to get to the bottom of the enigma that is William.
On the one hand, a vigilante who singlehandedly stands up for black fans and footballers with no concern to his personal safety.
On the other hand, someone who spent days trying to figure out what was wrong with putting the above joke in a thread about black goalkeepers.
William Treseder
20-06-20, 06:41
I'm just trying to get to the bottom of the enigma that is William.
On the one hand, a vigilante who singlehandedly stands up for black fans and footballers with no concern to his personal safety.
On the other hand, someone who spent days trying to figure out what was wrong with putting the above joke in a thread about black goalkeepers.
There is no enigma. I, along with many others on here, have made similar attempted stabs at humour like that, only replace “blacks” for Scousers” and not a single accusation against me , or the many others, has been made.
All jokes about colour and creed are generalisations and stereotyping, otherwise they wouldn't work would they? Eg, Irish being thick, Scottish being tight, Welsh shagging sheep, Scousers career criminals, Scousers work shy etc etc,
I can, but if you cant differentiate attempted humour, and pure hatred, then its you who has a problem.
As for me being a vigilante who single handedly stands up for black fans and footballers with no concerns for my personal safety, then thats yours interpretation, not mine.
I have called out racists on many occasions, and i have got into trouble for doing it a few times, but I'm not daft, or a hero with super powers, and wouldn't approach a gang of racists for obvious reasons. .
If more people did it at games, it would help with eradicating it, at least at football stadiums.
SLUDGE FACTORY
20-06-20, 09:23
There is no enigma. I, along with many others on here, have made similar attempted stabs at humour like that, only replace “blacks” for Scousers” and not a single accusation against me , or the many others, has been made.
All jokes about colour and creed are generalisations and stereotyping, otherwise they wouldn't work would they? Eg, Irish being thick, Scottish being tight, Welsh shagging sheep, Scousers career criminals, Scousers work shy etc etc,
I can, but if you cant differentiate attempted humour, and pure hatred, then its you who has a problem.
As for me being a vigilante who single handedly stands up for black fans and footballers with no concerns for my personal safety, then thats yours interpretation, not mine.
I have called out racists on many occasions, and i have got into trouble for doing it a few times, but I'm not daft, or a hero with super powers, and wouldn't approach a gang of racists for obvious reasons. .
If more people did it at games, it would help with eradicating it, at least at football stadiums.
Have people from liverpool or the Welsh been subject to slavery , beatings , lynchings over centuries and until recently been made to travel on segregated buses , been denied the vote and are you 6 times likely to be stopped by the police if you are welsh or from liverpool than if you are say from Norfolk?
The irish have certainly over history suffered discrimination and abuse and our language in Wales was the subject of an attempt to snuff it out in the 19th century but comparing our history and jokes about the people of liverpool to jokes about black people is absurd
ccfc_is_my_life
20-06-20, 09:31
Talk about desperation not to say you're wrong - I made a joke of the fact that I wouldn't be able to get up again if I took the knee because I'm a not very fit, overweight, sixty four year old, but I'd do it anyway even if the getting up part from it would hardly be graceful. Bellamy was a professional footballer who got paid an awful lot of money by our club right up to the end of his career, he was also the sort of player who always gave 100 per cent in every game, he may not have been the physical specimen at the end of his career that he was at the start of it, but to seriously suggest his knees were so bad that he wouldn't have been able to pick himself up is barmy.
You do release that you are dismissing footballers as virtue signallers for taking the knee do you? Just think about that, they are free to do what they like in this country and, as far as I'm aware, every single one of them so far has done it. Are you saying that if you were a Premier League footballer, you'd not do it? What point would you be wanting to make by not doing it if, as I presume you do, you say you're not a racist?
Seems to me that footballers of all colours in this country are exercising their right of choice, what's wrong with that? I thought you libertarian types were all in favour of that.
To believe the comment about Bellamy not getting back up was serious shows an absolute desperation on your part to make a point out of nothing
Kneeing is an empty gesture that achieves absolutely nothing. Footballers are virtue signallers, Liverpool players will take the knee whilst conveniently ignoring Liverpool's defence of Suarez coming out with offensive racist slurs...
It's nice to see you're intimating anyone not kneeling is racist. If somebody wants to take the knee, that's up to them. If they don't that's up to them. Pretty scummy to intimate anyone not doing so must be racist...
life on mars
20-06-20, 09:31
Then you will know how Black fans and players will feel then
Ive stood up to racists many times in all walks of life, and I'm not particularly big or hard. Ive got myself in bother over it, but it wouldn't stop me
Thats the problem. Most people wont get involved, and these tossers continually get away with it.
As I've said earlier, there will always be racists, but they need to be outed at every point.
I’ve even fallen out with mates about it..
I usually find a stare in the eyes of the individuals settles it down ,however I dont see a lot of this stuff down the City and I've been around some nutters ,other than when we played Leicester in the old days , and there were songs about them being just a small town in Asia .
Its also interesting the club allows the police into the ground to monitor and eject homophobia chanting which is far more prevalent noticeably at the last home game with Brighton , nothing like that for racism , does the club and stewards think its not a big issue in Wales unlike England .
Should we now consider insults at others people , is also racist based IE English insults .
If we feel this morally positioned and caring should we now refrain for asking a certain club to look in the dustbins to eat rats ??
William Treseder
20-06-20, 09:54
Have people from liverpool or the Welsh been subject to slavery , beatings , lynchings over centuries and until recently been made to travel on segregated buses , been denied the vote and are you 6 times likely to be stopped by the police if you are welsh or from liverpool than if you are say from Norfolk?
The irish have certainly over history suffered discrimination and abuse and our language in Wales was the subject of an attempt to snuff it out in the 19th century but comparing our history and jokes about the people of liverpool to jokes about black people is absurd
In your world it is.
ccfc_is_my_life
20-06-20, 09:58
I usually find a stare in the eyes of the individuals settles it down ,however I dont see a lot of this stuff down the City and I've been around some nutters ,other than when we played Leicester in the old days , and there were songs about them being just a small town in Asia .
Its also interesting the club allows the police into the ground to monitor and eject homophobia chanting which is far more prevalent noticeably at the last home game with Brighton , nothing like that for racism , does the club and stewards think its not a big issue in Wales unlike England .
Should we now consider insults at others people , is also racist based IE English insults .
If we feel this morally positioned and caring should we now refrain for asking a certain club to look in the dustbins to eat rats ??
Once the furore over BLM dies down, the game should reflect seriously in the disproportional representation of non Black BAME - there's a lack of Asian, Jewish et al footballers in the British game.
Sadly, I doubt that cause will be championed as much as BLM.
ccfc_is_my_life
20-06-20, 09:58
Once the furore over BLM dies down, the game should reflect seriously in the disproportional representation of non Black BAME - there's a lack of Asian, Jewish et al footballers in the British game.
Sadly, I doubt that cause will be championed as much as BLM.
the other bob wilson
20-06-20, 10:35
Once the furore over BLM dies down, the game should reflect seriously in the disproportional representation of non Black BAME - there's a lack of Asian, Jewish et al footballers in the British game.
Sadly, I doubt that cause will be championed as much as BLM.
How about answering the questions I asked you? Would you take the knee if you were playing in the Premier League today and, if you wouldn't, why?
Why do people get so worked up about something that they deride as a pointless gesture? Seems like snowflake behaviour to me, but it can't because we all know that description only applies to young, over sensitive, types types don't we.
https://youtu.be/0H2W1lK7P-I
banned in 3..2..1
funny as hell tho
ccfc_is_my_life
20-06-20, 11:14
How about answering the questions I asked you? Would you take the knee if you were playing in the Premier League today and, if you wouldn't, why?
Why do people get so worked up about something that they deride as a pointless gesture? Seems like snowflake behaviour to me, but it can't because we all know that description only applies to young, over sensitive, types types don't we.
How about checking your old, white privilege when demanding others answer YOUR questions?
No, I'd not take the knee. What is the goal? Recognising racism? Well, duh... we all recognise there's racism. Kneeing isn't fixing it anymore than wearing "Black Lives Matter" on the back of shirts fixes it. Focus on constructive solutions rather than knee-jerk gestures aimed at looking yourself look good.
As for your last comment, pathetic. You carry on backing empty gestures rather than constructive solutions if it makes yourself feel good.
A Quiet Monkfish
20-06-20, 11:46
How about checking your old, white privilege when demanding others answer YOUR questions?
No, I'd not take the knee. What is the goal? Recognising racism? Well, duh... we all recognise there's racism. Kneeing isn't fixing it anymore than wearing "Black Lives Matter" on the back of shirts fixes it. Focus on constructive solutions rather than knee-jerk gestures aimed at looking yourself look good.
As for your last comment, pathetic. You carry on backing empty gestures rather than constructive solutions if it makes yourself feel good.
You mentioned 'white privilege'. For me, the irony of the protests/riots was the university-educated, middle-class, London-centric white protesters, and on the other site the ill-educated, mainly working-class, non- London white men on the other site. It perfectly summed up the hypocrisy of the whole BLM business. If you're white, working class, poorly educated, there's no-one shouting for you..
the other bob wilson
20-06-20, 11:50
How about checking your old, white privilege when demanding others answer YOUR questions?
No, I'd not take the knee. What is the goal? Recognising racism? Well, duh... we all recognise there's racism. Kneeing isn't fixing it anymore than wearing "Black Lives Matter" on the back of shirts fixes it. Focus on constructive solutions rather than knee-jerk gestures aimed at looking yourself look good.
As for your last comment, pathetic. You carry on backing empty gestures rather than constructive solutions if it makes yourself feel good.
I must say Ronnie....... telling it........sorry ccfc fc is my life that you're definitely coming across as very snowflakish today.
Can I ask how me wanting you to answer a couple of questions is anything to do with my white privilege? Seems to me that you don't really understand the issue here.
As for your second paragraph, are you trying to say that you wouldn't join in with a gesture that is now supported by the NFL and, apparently, is not frowned on by the Premier League and other leagues throughout the world because you're more noble than those who are doing it?
Your "constructive solutions" appears to involve saying that you would do something in refusing to take the knee that would, for right or wrong, be seized upon by all sorts of people at the extremes of both sides of this argument for the wrong reasons - reasons that would, almost certainly, lead to a worsening of the situation.
To believe the comment about Bellamy not getting back up was serious shows an absolute desperation on your part to make a point out of nothing
Kneeing is an empty gesture that achieves absolutely nothing. Footballers are virtue signallers, Liverpool players will take the knee whilst conveniently ignoring Liverpool's defence of Suarez coming out with offensive racist slurs...
It's nice to see you're intimating anyone not kneeling is racist. If somebody wants to take the knee, that's up to them. If they don't that's up to them. Pretty scummy to intimate anyone not doing so must be racist...
You might think it's an empty gesture but if 10 year olds across the country ask their mum or dad why their footie heroes are taking a knee and that starts a conversation that wouldn't otherwise be had then it's 100% worthwhile.
And your Liverpool point is some of the most ridiculous whattaboutery I've seen in a while, so because of an incident 9 years ago involving a player that left the club 6 years ago, anything this completely different set of players says or does in regard to racism is invalid? That's such an utterly pathetic attempt to try and find something to invalidate the protest it's embarrassing.
ccfc_is_my_life
20-06-20, 11:58
I must say Ronnie....... telling it........sorry ccfc fc is my life that you're definitely coming across as very snowflakish today.
Can I ask how me wanting you to answer a couple of questions is anything to do with my white privilege? Seems to me that you don't really understand the issue here.
As for your second paragraph, are you trying to say that you wouldn't join in with a gesture that is now supported by the NFL and, apparently, is not frowned on by the Premier League and other leagues throughout the world because you're more noble than those who are doing it?
Your "constructive solutions" appears to involve saying that you would do something in refusing to take the knee that would, for right or wrong, be seized upon by all sorts of people at the extremes of both sides of this argument for the wrong reasons - reasons that would, almost certainly, lead to a worsening of the situation.
I don't have multi-accounts. Nice assumption on your part though.
Your problem is that you appear to want to project your own view into things written. I don't believe I'm more noble than anyone. I just believe in concrete measures rather than something that achieves basically nothing. Doing something for PR reasons achieves no end product in effect.
Your final paragraph is nothing more than conjecture. Clearly you're an empty vessel trying to speak loudest, so not worth responding to anymore.
ccfc_is_my_life
20-06-20, 12:05
You might think it's an empty gesture but if 10 year olds across the country ask their mum or dad why their footie heroes are taking a knee and that starts a conversation that wouldn't otherwise be had then it's 100% worthwhile.
And your Liverpool point is some of the most ridiculous whattaboutery I've seen in a while, so because of an incident 9 years ago involving a player that left the club 6 years ago, anything this completely different set of players says or does in regard to racism is invalid? That's such an utterly pathetic attempt to try and find something to invalidate the protest it's embarrassing.
Conversations are of course good but to little effect. Nobody is born racist, they learn to be racist from their environment, the biggest factor of which are direct family members. I very much doubt racist parents are going to magically be enlightened by this. If the parents aren't racist, then there's a very high chance the children have been raised to know racism is wrong.
Now would those children learn about casual racism and the issues BAME face, sure I'd agree with you. Education always good, but it would merely confirm their view racism is bad, not change a racist into a non-racist.
The Liverpool example points to the double standards within football. Suarez racist? But... he can't be... he scores goals. Leicester academy players fired for a racist video - Vardy doing similar gets a nice training course because he scores goals. Alli make racist video? 1 game ban. Asian players? Forget that...
Kneeling, putting BLM on the back of shirts isn't going to address or fix the fundamental problems football has with racism, merely conveniently ignore them for good PR.
the other bob wilson
20-06-20, 12:12
I don't have multi-accounts. Nice assumption on your part though.
Your problem is that you appear to want to project your own view into things written. I don't believe I'm more noble than anyone. I just believe in concrete measures rather than something that achieves basically nothing. Doing something for PR reasons achieves no end product in effect.
Your final paragraph is nothing more than conjecture. Clearly you're an empty vessel trying to speak loudest, so not worth responding to anymore.
Come on then, let's hear some of these "concrete measures". I assume that they must be more than the normal talking shops which achieve nothing that we have tended to see on the occasions when racism has been an urgent issue until things then returned to how they've always been.
William Treseder
20-06-20, 13:10
You mentioned 'white privilege'. For me, the irony of the protests/riots was the university-educated, middle-class, London-centric white protesters, and on the other site the ill-educated, mainly working-class, non- London white men on the other site. It perfectly summed up the hypocrisy of the whole BLM business. If you're white, working class, poorly educated, there's no-one shouting for you..
Give Sludge a shout. He’ll willingly become offended on their behalf
SLUDGE FACTORY
20-06-20, 22:34
Give Sludge a shout. He’ll willingly become offended on their behalf
Feck me theres some bollocks spouted on here
White blokes telling other white blokes that racism isnt a problem in wales despite our main centre of multi culturalism , butetown , being excluded from the rest of the city
Go to mermaid quay and it's all white people sucking on ice cream whilst half a mile away you have one of the country's most deprived communities living in tower blocks
And most people who live there are black , unlike the posters on here who tell us racism isnt a problem
Well, it wouldnt be for them , would it ?
A third of welsh school teachers report racist behaviour in the classroom
There is an excellent article written by sara robinson , a cardiff city fan who used to post on here , published in today's western mail ........its called the truth about racism in wales
In it she states that the physical wall separating butetown from the trendily called bay development kept the people of butetown segregated . The new bay are couldnt be less representative of cardiffs maritime cultural history if it tried .
There is not one statue dedicated to the people who helped build cardiff
Later on sara tells how she was walking in a city park and one of the other people in the park is black , he is stopped by the police .
On welsh Twitter a succession of white people , again fecking ironic , que up to post that racism isnt a problem in wales
Get off your knees, this is not america !
It is staggering arrogance for white welsh people to tell people from ethnic minorities living here that their experience is somehow imagined , exaggerated or invented .
How can white people who have never experienced persecution , racist taunts and jokes presume to be experts on how people who have and do experience it should feel or protest about it ?
The whitewashing of butetown extends to the workplace , our cultural life , our institutions
Black people are 8 times more likely to be stopped that white people
Racism may be less lethal , overt here but to deny it's a problem is to deny gravity , we continue to criminalise and discriminate against people of colour in 2020
We have a lot of work to do in wales before we are in any position to judge or tell protestors they have nothing to protest or that BLM is just a bunch of white middle class rich kids .....footage from the demo in cardiff shows people of all backgrounds and races were represented
An excellent article by sara , she is active on Twitter
As for the white working class none were born racist and your class does not make you a racist .
SLUDGE FACTORY
20-06-20, 22:44
You mentioned 'white privilege'. For me, the irony of the protests/riots was the university-educated, middle-class, London-centric white protesters, and on the other site the ill-educated, mainly working-class, non- London white men on the other site. It perfectly summed up the hypocrisy of the whole BLM business. If you're white, working class, poorly educated, there's no-one shouting for you..
Do you think that the people on the cardiff demo BLM were university educated white middle class people ?
I would suggest you take a look at some of the tv coverage because it clearly shows you are incorrect
Several years ago the racist and fascist english defence league came to cardiff and over 1000 people from all races and backgrounds told them in no uncertain terms that they were not welcome . I was standing next to a cardiff lad of west indian descent and a white guy from grangetown who was a bricklayer . Betty Campbell one of the first west indian headteachers in the country was there with her family , there were people from the valleys , there were people of mixed race .
Now I know that you have an issue with BLM and you are entitled to that view however much I disagree with it but please dont label the movement as a bunch of bored liberal white university types as that's nonsense .
Eric the Half a Bee
20-06-20, 23:23
You're fed up with people bringing attention to racial injustice? How fed up would you be having to deal with it first hand every day?
Quite.
I'd love to know how many messageboard posters regularly challenge supposedly innocent racist comments. I'd love to know how many actually know if such comments are racist.
Eric the Half a Bee
20-06-20, 23:24
I don't have multi-accounts. Nice assumption on your part though.
Your problem is that you appear to want to project your own view into things written. I don't believe I'm more noble than anyone. I just believe in concrete measures rather than something that achieves basically nothing. Doing something for PR reasons achieves no end product in effect.
Your final paragraph is nothing more than conjecture. Clearly you're an empty vessel trying to speak loudest, so not worth responding to anymore.
Definitely Ronnie Bird.
SLUDGE FACTORY
21-06-20, 07:14
Laura McAllister, another cardiff city fan , from bridgend , who is professor at cardiff university wales governance centre and a former captain of wales international football team has also written an article on racism , particularly in sport .
Shes on twitter , it's an excellent read
SLUDGE FACTORY
21-06-20, 07:58
Carolyn Hitt is rugby obsessed and writes for wales online and the western mail
Her rugby bias aside she is a very sharp journalist
She is also on twitter and has written several articles on the denial of racism in cardiff by the establishment who are essentially white males
Her documentary the rugby code breakers talks about butetown legends like billy Boston who went north after being ignored by wales
There were others , most of whom were black
They were accused of taking the money but in the documentary she suggests and many agree with her , that institutional racism was the core of the problem
There is even a statute of billy boston in wigan
Yet he was a tiger bay boy , a cardiffian , and no statue is here for him
Oh that was a long time ago say some
But that's been said so many times before
Cardiff has one of the oldest multi racial communities in the uk yet the denial of racism by white people in cardiff is as much a part of cardiffs history as tiger bay . Beatrice Campbell in her book Goliath wrote those words and they are very relevant .
Carolyn Hitt is rugby obsessed and writes for wales online and the western mail
Her rugby bias aside she is a very sharp journalist
She is also on twitter and has written several articles on the denial of racism in cardiff by the establishment who are essentially white males
Her documentary the rugby code breakers talks about butetown legends like billy Boston who went north after being ignored by wales
There were others , most of whom were black
They were accused of taking the money but in the documentary she suggests and many agree with her , that institutional racism was the core of the problem
There is even a statute of billy boston in wigan
Yet he was a tiger bay boy , a cardiffian , and no statue is here for him
Oh that was a long time ago say some
But that's been said so many times before
Cardiff has one of the oldest multi racial communities in the uk yet the denial of racism by white people in cardiff is as much a part of cardiffs history as tiger bay . Beatrice Campbell in her book Goliath wrote those words and they are very relevant .
There is a Weatherspoons just outside the town centre at Wigan (can’t remember the name of it), and it is absolutely plastered with photos of Billy
Forest Green Bluebird
21-06-20, 19:56
Who else is bloody fed up with this???
I have no problem with people of different race...but you cannot change history...it is what it is.
Why bow down to a different race....white to black...black to white....whatever.
This tearing down of statues is appalling.....times were different.......you regret but you do not destroy.....
Me!
I don't have a 'racist bone in my body'.
But for those who are (racist), I wonder whether all the BLM protests and is going to change their opinion.
Me!
I don't have a 'racist bone in my body'.
But for those who are (racist), I wonder whether all the BLM protests and is going to change their opinion.
no .. it won't but it might rally those that havent woken up to the situation that exsists
Me!
I don't have a 'racist bone in my body'.
But for those who are (racist), I wonder whether all the BLM protests and is going to change their opinion.
What is it you're fed up with mate?
People begruding of the fact that other people, whether they be of color or not, even mention that racism is a problem. Read a ****ing book, look in the mirror, realise how ****ing ignorant you are, apologise, and then get back to us with something constrauctive. PLEASE.
People begruding of the fact that other people, whether they be of color or not, even mention that racism is a problem. Read a ****ing book, look in the mirror, realise how ****ing ignorant you are, apologise, and then get back to us with something constrauctive. PLEASE.
Some people really can't appreciate that not everyone has a similar experience in life or sees things through a different lens.
A good example is to think of job interviews. Two people are the leading candidates, both as strong as each other and both give great interviews. One is white, and one is black. The interview team are white. They are more likely to side with the white candidate (much more likely) NOT because they are racist, but because humans are tribal and are drawn towards others similar to them. They will find ways, subconsciously, to justify it.
This is very common and one of the solutions is quotas, which seems to upset many people because they don't understand the reason. An argument you hear against it is 'the job should go to the best person' but anyone who's ever done recruitment will know that there's normally not one miles ahead stand out person.
With a mainly white recruiting team, a white person will normally win the 50-50 calls. So a black person has to be much better than the white person to get the job. That doesn't seem fair, does it?
(all this is interchangable by the way. It could be a white person in China or Botswana who struggles. These kind of barriers exist all over the place, it's human nature)
I always see people on here saying racism is not really a problem any more, because black kids don't get called all sorts of names at school, or black families don't get 'GO HOME' graffitied on their house. But it definitely still exists and it's quite sad that so many don't want to listen about what it's really like to be in a minority.
William Treseder
22-06-20, 21:25
Some people really can't appreciate that not everyone has a similar experience in life or sees things through a different lens.
A good example is to think of job interviews. Two people are the leading candidates, both as strong as each other and both give great interviews. One is white, and one is black. The interview team are white. They are more likely to side with the white candidate (much more likely) NOT because they are racist, but because humans are tribal and are drawn towards others similar to them. They will find ways, subconsciously, to justify it.
This is very common and one of the solutions is quotas, which seems to upset many people because they don't understand the reason. An argument you hear against it is 'the job should go to the best person' but anyone who's ever done recruitment will know that there's normally not one miles ahead stand out person.
With a mainly white recruiting team, a white person will normally win the 50-50 calls. So a black person has to be much better than the white person to get the job. That doesn't seem fair, does it?
(all this is interchangable by the way. It could be a white person in China or Botswana who struggles. These kind of barriers exist all over the place, it's human nature)
I always see people on here saying racism is not really a problem any more, because black kids don't get called all sorts of names at school, or black families don't get 'GO HOME' graffitied on their house. But it definitely still exists and it's quite sad that so many don't want to listen about what it's really like to be in a minority.
Credit where its due Lardy. Thats a great post.
The Lone Gunman
22-06-20, 22:13
Here's an interesting story from my neck of the woods:
https://www.walesonline.co.uk/news/wales-news/black-lives-matter-shirts-defaced-18451342?utm_source=facebook.com&utm_medium=social&utm_campaign=wales_main&fbclid=IwAR3bt-ulczfqcO9rl2I9jTGz6KdvJD60p-pPdILyPd1SH5ZO_1RKF4vCnHs
I travel past this artwork most days. Never been vandalised in ten years until the last week. Now it's been vandalised three times within a few days. But there's no racism here, right?
Eric the Half a Bee
22-06-20, 22:19
Here's an interesting story from my neck of the woods:
https://www.walesonline.co.uk/news/wales-news/black-lives-matter-shirts-defaced-18451342?utm_source=facebook.com&utm_medium=social&utm_campaign=wales_main&fbclid=IwAR3bt-ulczfqcO9rl2I9jTGz6KdvJD60p-pPdILyPd1SH5ZO_1RKF4vCnHs
I travel past this artwork most days. Never been vandalised in ten years until the last week. Now it's been vandalised three times within a few days. But there's no racism here, right?
I reckon the longer BLM goes on, the more it is pissing some people off. Another 3 months and I reckon we'll be back to the same sort of situation we had with the National Front. Just shows the braindead never learn.
Here's an interesting story from my neck of the woods:
https://www.walesonline.co.uk/news/wales-news/black-lives-matter-shirts-defaced-18451342?utm_source=facebook.com&utm_medium=social&utm_campaign=wales_main&fbclid=IwAR3bt-ulczfqcO9rl2I9jTGz6KdvJD60p-pPdILyPd1SH5ZO_1RKF4vCnHs
I travel past this artwork most days. Never been vandalised in ten years until the last week. Now it's been vandalised three times within a few days. But there's no racism here, right?
Depressing set of comments under the story too.
SLUDGE FACTORY
22-06-20, 22:42
Here's an interesting story from my neck of the woods:
https://www.walesonline.co.uk/news/wales-news/black-lives-matter-shirts-defaced-18451342?utm_source=facebook.com&utm_medium=social&utm_campaign=wales_main&fbclid=IwAR3bt-ulczfqcO9rl2I9jTGz6KdvJD60p-pPdILyPd1SH5ZO_1RKF4vCnHs
I travel past this artwork most days. Never been vandalised in ten years until the last week. Now it's been vandalised three times within a few days. But there's no racism here, right?
They were just having a laugh
It was just a joke
No racism in cardiff
Nothing to see
Move along
SLUDGE FACTORY
22-06-20, 22:45
Depressing set of comments under the story too.
Where are the comments ?
Where are the comments ?
I think you have to log in to Wales Online. Apart from refreshing the log in every few months it now happens automatically for me whenever I go onto one of their pages. There are 10 comments at the moment and all of them seem to be supporting the vandalism and rubbishing BLM.
SLUDGE FACTORY
22-06-20, 22:55
I think you have to log in to Wales Online. Apart from refreshing the log in every few months it now happens automatically for me whenever I go onto one of their pages. There are 10 comments at the moment and all of them seem to be supporting the vandalism and rubbishing BLM.
No racism in cardiff
Credit where its due Lardy. Thats a great post.
Thank you :thumbup:
William Treseder
23-06-20, 04:15
Change the record ffs. It could be the same person that is responsible each time.
A city the size of Cardiff is bound to have racists, but you go on and on as though its crawling with them.
SLUDGE FACTORY
23-06-20, 10:40
Change the record ffs. It could be the same person that is responsible each time.
A city the size of Cardiff is bound to have racists, but you go on and on as though its crawling with them.
Of course it is
One racist bloke in cardiff goes round defacing black lives matters t shirts and covering them in dog shit
One racist bloke leaves pigs heads outside mosques
It's one bloke who has systematically defaced the jewish section of western cemetery
I can only think that your suggestion it's one bloke is a joke
You are having a laugh right ?
You are in complete denial
Feck me theres some bollocks spouted on here
White blokes telling other white blokes that racism isnt a problem in wales despite our main centre of multi culturalism , butetown , being excluded from the rest of the city
Go to mermaid quay and it's all white people sucking on ice cream whilst half a mile away you have one of the country's most deprived communities living in tower blocks
And most people who live there are black , unlike the posters on here who tell us racism isnt a problem
Well, it wouldnt be for them , would it ?
A third of welsh school teachers report racist behaviour in the classroom
There is an excellent article written by sara robinson , a cardiff city fan who used to post on here , published in today's western mail ........its called the truth about racism in wales
In it she states that the physical wall separating butetown from the trendily called bay development kept the people of butetown segregated . The new bay are couldnt be less representative of cardiffs maritime cultural history if it tried .
There is not one statue dedicated to the people who helped build cardiff
Later on sara tells how she was walking in a city park and one of the other people in the park is black , he is stopped by the police .
On welsh Twitter a succession of white people , again fecking ironic , que up to post that racism isnt a problem in wales
Get off your knees, this is not america !
It is staggering arrogance for white welsh people to tell people from ethnic minorities living here that their experience is somehow imagined , exaggerated or invented .
How can white people who have never experienced persecution , racist taunts and jokes presume to be experts on how people who have and do experience it should feel or protest about it ?
The whitewashing of butetown extends to the workplace , our cultural life , our institutions
Black people are 8 times more likely to be stopped that white people
Racism may be less lethal , overt here but to deny it's a problem is to deny gravity , we continue to criminalise and discriminate against people of colour in 2020
We have a lot of work to do in wales before we are in any position to judge or tell protestors they have nothing to protest or that BLM is just a bunch of white middle class rich kids .....footage from the demo in cardiff shows people of all backgrounds and races were represented
An excellent article by sara , she is active on Twitter
As for the white working class none were born racist and your class does not make you a racist .
Is this a white flight problem from the other side of the dyke ?, historically the Welsh are known for their high moral standing .
Taunton Blue Genie
23-06-20, 12:49
Is this a white flight problem from the other side of the dyke ?, historically the Welsh are known for their high moral standing .
It's not like you to be jingoistic :hehe:
It's not like you to be jingoistic :hehe:
http://blog.policy.manchester.ac.uk/featured/2014/06/wales-must-confront-uncomfortable-truths-about-racism/
Just reading about the 'moral worth' of the Welsh.
Taunton Blue Genie
23-06-20, 13:41
http://blog.policy.manchester.ac.uk/featured/2014/06/wales-must-confront-uncomfortable-truths-about-racism/
Just reading about the 'moral worth' of the Welsh.
Self-praise is no praise at all, they say - and that article refers to the 'belief' and 'sense' of its own population.
Still, keep up the Welsh supremacist propaganda.
Self-praise is no praise at all, they say - and that article refers to the 'belief' and 'sense' of its own population.
Still, keep up the Welsh supremacist propaganda.
The Welsh do set themselves high standards interestingly I have just read segments on the net of totally different books by different authors talking of the Welsh high moral standards compared to others whilst talking about immigration into America, Australia and Argentina.
Probably something to do with Welsh religion and the chapels at the time, not to mention the influence of Eisteddfods, seen one line talking about the Welsh unmixed have the highest moral standards in the World and another line about the Welsh having the least crime in the World and another about the Welsh being the most literate in the World due to Sunday schools.
Now is this alleged racism malarkey in Cardiff imported from England ? as it was seen by some as an English problem and not a Welsh problem as noted by the above article linked too by me and copied by you.
William Treseder
23-06-20, 16:14
Of course it is
One racist bloke in cardiff goes round defacing black lives matters t shirts and covering them in dog shit
One racist bloke leaves pigs heads outside mosques
It's one bloke who has systematically defaced the jewish section of western cemetery
I can only think that your suggestion it's one bloke is a joke
You are having a laugh right ?
You are in complete denial
Are you on magic mushrooms you goon?
I meant the same person defacing the t shirts, not one person covering the whole of the city 😂
SLUDGE FACTORY
23-06-20, 16:58
Are you on magic mushrooms you goon?
I meant the same person defacing the t shirts, not one person covering the whole of the city 😂
Let's be honest , given your continual denial of racism in cardiff , at cardiff games etc , I didnt need to be under the influence of mushrooms to make that conclusion
You are off again in the burnley all lives matter thread , same old yeah but no but yeah
William Treseder
23-06-20, 17:06
Let's be honest , given your continual denial of racism in cardiff , at cardiff games etc , I didnt need to be under the influence of mushrooms to make that conclusion
You are off again in the burnley all lives matter thread , same old yeah but no but yeah
You do realise that I'm entitled to some opinions on here yeah? Just because they may differ from yours, it doesn’t mean I'm in denial of anything.
You seem to be an expert on every town and City in the UK.
Moodybluebird
23-06-20, 17:18
Here's an interesting story from my neck of the woods:
https://www.walesonline.co.uk/news/wales-news/black-lives-matter-shirts-defaced-18451342?utm_source=facebook.com&utm_medium=social&utm_campaign=wales_main&fbclid=IwAR3bt-ulczfqcO9rl2I9jTGz6KdvJD60p-pPdILyPd1SH5ZO_1RKF4vCnHs
I travel past this artwork most days. Never been vandalised in ten years until the last week. Now it's been vandalised three times within a few days. But there's no racism here, right?
I think it's inevitable that an issue that polarises opinion like BLM will result in a backlash from those that take umbrage in what they see as an attack on our culture by activists from the 'other side'. Feelings are already inflamed and the situation is likely to become much worse over the coming months.
SLUDGE FACTORY
23-06-20, 17:21
You do realise that I'm entitled to some opinions on here yeah? Just because they may differ from yours, it doesn’t mean I'm in denial of anything.
You seem to be an expert on every town and City in the UK.
You are entitled to say whatever you want
But if everything you say seems to be against BLM , pro all lives matter, despite people telling you why all lives matters is a right wing phrase of dubious origin , if you deny that cardiff city has a racist element , and always has , that cardiff has a history of denying racism , and always has then one tends to draw a line in the sand .
I am a fairly well educated bloke on social history in the uk , no expert , but I know a lot about urban geography and immigration
For example most of Bristols west indian community came from Jamaica, most of cardiffs came from st kitts and the smaller islands because when I was at college I did a thesis on it.
I know that leeds and manchester have large jewish communities whilst cardiff , bristol etc do not , as i used to live in leeds
I know that the east side of oxford is a very run down , cosmopolitan part of the city as I used to live there
I know that despite the urban myth bradford has many races and cultures , not just Pakistani Muslim , as i used to live there
It's a mix of education and living in different places
SLUDGE FACTORY
23-06-20, 17:23
I think it's inevitable that an issue that polarises opinion like BLM will result in a backlash from those that take umbrage in what they see as an attack on our culture by activists from the 'other side'. Feelings are already inflamed and the situation is likely to become much worse over the coming months.
I know what you are saying but my view is that most of those who talk about an attack on our culture are swivel eyed racists
You are entitled to say whatever you want
But if everything you say seems to be against BLM , pro all lives matter, despite people telling you why all lives matters is a right wing phrase of dubious origin , if you deny that cardiff city has a racist element , and always has , that cardiff has a history of denying racism , and always has then one tends to draw a line in the sand .
I am a fairly well educated bloke on social history in the uk , no expert , but I know a lot about urban geography and immigration
For example most of Bristols west indian community came from Jamaica, most of cardiffs came from st kitts and the smaller islands because when I was at college I did a thesis on it.
I know that leeds and manchester have large jewish communities whilst cardiff , bristol etc do not , as i used to live in leeds
I know that the east side of oxford is a very run down , cosmopolitan part of the city as I used to live there
I know that despite the urban myth bradford has many races and cultures , not just Pakistani Muslim , as i used to live there
It's a mix of education and living in different places
How did you doing a thesis on communities dictate where people from different Caribbean islands went to live? :shrug::getscoat:
SLUDGE FACTORY
23-06-20, 18:07
I think it's inevitable that an issue that polarises opinion like BLM will result in a backlash from those that take umbrage in what they see as an attack on our culture by activists from the 'other side'. Feelings are already inflamed and the situation is likely to become much worse over the coming months.
How did you doing a thesis on communities dictate where people from different Caribbean islands went to live? :shrug::getscoat:
My bad
My papers were about the history of immigration into bristol and cardiff , they didnt come from st kits to cardiff because I told them to
Taunton Blue Genie
23-06-20, 18:15
The Welsh do set themselves high standards interestingly I have just read segments on the net of totally different books by different authors talking of the Welsh high moral standards compared to others whilst talking about immigration into America, Australia and Argentina.
Probably something to do with Welsh religion and the chapels at the time, not to mention the influence of Eisteddfods, seen one line talking about the Welsh unmixed have the highest moral standards in the World and another line about the Welsh having the least crime in the World and another about the Welsh being the most literate in the World due to Sunday schools.
Now is this alleged racism malarkey in Cardiff imported from England ? as it was seen by some as an English problem and not a Welsh problem as noted by the above article linked too by me and copied by you.
Your usual Welsh supremacy card followed by your 'English being at fault for everything' schtick. So very predictable and so prejudiced.
Your usual Welsh supremacy card followed by your 'English being at fault for everything' schtick. So very predictable and so prejudiced.
Im not taking a position I'm asking a question.
You are entitled to say whatever you want
But if everything you say seems to be against BLM , pro all lives matter, despite people telling you why all lives matters is a right wing phrase of dubious origin , if you deny that cardiff city has a racist element , and always has , that cardiff has a history of denying racism , and always has then one tends to draw a line in the sand .
I am a fairly well educated bloke on social history in the uk , no expert , but I know a lot about urban geography and immigration
For example most of Bristols west indian community came from Jamaica, most of cardiffs came from st kitts and the smaller islands because when I was at college I did a thesis on it.
I know that leeds and manchester have large jewish communities whilst cardiff , bristol etc do not , as i used to live in leeds
I know that the east side of oxford is a very run down , cosmopolitan part of the city as I used to live there
I know that despite the urban myth bradford has many races and cultures , not just Pakistani Muslim , as i used to live there
It's a mix of education and living in different places
If you are fairly well educated on social history and urban geography and immigration what is your take on the Anglo Saxon races overrunning Britannia ?, are we better or worse off ? or is it impossible to tell ?
Some say the laws of Hywel Dda were so advanced it took English law about a 1000 years to catch up.
Feck me theres some bollocks spouted on here
White blokes telling other white blokes that racism isnt a problem in wales despite our main centre of multi culturalism , butetown , being excluded from the rest of the city
Go to mermaid quay and it's all white people sucking on ice cream whilst half a mile away you have one of the country's most deprived communities living in tower blocks
And most people who live there are black , unlike the posters on here who tell us racism isnt a problem
Well, it wouldnt be for them , would it ?
A third of welsh school teachers report racist behaviour in the classroom
There is an excellent article written by sara robinson , a cardiff city fan who used to post on here , published in today's western mail ........its called the truth about racism in wales
In it she states that the physical wall separating butetown from the trendily called bay development kept the people of butetown segregated . The new bay are couldnt be less representative of cardiffs maritime cultural history if it tried .
There is not one statue dedicated to the people who helped build cardiff
Later on sara tells how she was walking in a city park and one of the other people in the park is black , he is stopped by the police .
On welsh Twitter a succession of white people , again fecking ironic , que up to post that racism isnt a problem in wales
Get off your knees, this is not america !
It is staggering arrogance for white welsh people to tell people from ethnic minorities living here that their experience is somehow imagined , exaggerated or invented .
How can white people who have never experienced persecution , racist taunts and jokes presume to be experts on how people who have and do experience it should feel or protest about it ?
The whitewashing of butetown extends to the workplace , our cultural life , our institutions
Black people are 8 times more likely to be stopped that white people
Racism may be less lethal , overt here but to deny it's a problem is to deny gravity , we continue to criminalise and discriminate against people of colour in 2020
We have a lot of work to do in wales before we are in any position to judge or tell protestors they have nothing to protest or that BLM is just a bunch of white middle class rich kids .....footage from the demo in cardiff shows people of all backgrounds and races were represented
An excellent article by sara , she is active on Twitter
As for the white working class none were born racist and your class does not make you a racist .
But you speak of the wall as if it was deliberately built to hide the black community from everyone, and of course you know very well that that is not true and never had been. The wall was built to keep people off the permanent way so the coal wagons could get to the docks and as part of the boundary wall of the bute west dock. and the Lady recounting the black man stopped by police in a park. I've never seen police in Cardiff randomly stop anyone, whether black yellow white [pink or green. They stop people when there is a need. But even then I've not seen it and certainly not against any particular group of people.
you talk about people spouting bollox, but you are just as guilty of it as anyone else when it suits your argument.
Taunton Blue Genie
23-06-20, 20:21
Im not taking a position I'm asking a question.
It's a stupid question and fits in with your incessant anti-English prejudice.
It's a stupid question and fits in with your incessant anti-English prejudice.
No prejudice, if the cap fits.
Taunton Blue Genie
23-06-20, 20:58
No prejudice, if the cap fits.
:hehe:
SLUDGE FACTORY
23-06-20, 23:07
But you speak of the wall as if it was deliberately built to hide the black community from everyone, and of course you know very well that that is not true and never had been. The wall was built to keep people off the permanent way so the coal wagons could get to the docks and as part of the boundary wall of the bute west dock. and the Lady recounting the black man stopped by police in a park. I've never seen police in Cardiff randomly stop anyone, whether black yellow white [pink or green. They stop people when there is a need. But even then I've not seen it and certainly not against any particular group of people.
you talk about people spouting bollox, but you are just as guilty of it as anyone else when it suits your argument.
If you dont think black people are stopped in cardiff randomly then you must be a public relations officer for the force
Why would sara robinson , who you can contact on twitter , a fellow cardiff city fan make up a story about going for a walk in a park and seeing a black bloke get stopped by the police ?
If you think shes lying show your cards and tell her
But you speak of the wall as if it was deliberately built to hide the black community from everyone, and of course you know very well that that is not true and never had been. The wall was built to keep people off the permanent way so the coal wagons could get to the docks and as part of the boundary wall of the bute west dock. and the Lady recounting the black man stopped by police in a park. I've never seen police in Cardiff randomly stop anyone, whether black yellow white [pink or green. They stop people when there is a need. But even then I've not seen it and certainly not against any particular group of people.
you talk about people spouting bollox, but you are just as guilty of it as anyone else when it suits your argument.
https://www.stop-watch.org/your-area/area/south-wales
If you dont think black people are stopped in cardiff randomly then you must be a public relations officer for the force
Why would sara robinson , who you can contact on twitter , a fellow cardiff city fan make up a story about going for a walk in a park and seeing a black bloke get stopped by the police ?
If you think shes lying show your cards and tell her
Being “devils advocate” here, but sometimes all is not what it seems !!
About 5 years ago, there were a team of gypsy’s (yes, definitely) targeting houses in Rhiwbina and Llanishen. They had a WHITE VAN.
Now I live in Llanishen and at the time, I drove a WHITE VAN.
THREE times in one day I was stopped by different police officers whilst driving around Rhiwbina, as they were checking EVERY WHITE VAN.
Now maybe, just maybe, a crime had been committed in the area in question, where the black man was walking.
If the description of the offender was “a black man”, would not this justify questioning him.
It depends on what when on before.
Same as car accidents, someone caused it, and drives off, “no one sees what happened before”
SLUDGE FACTORY
24-06-20, 09:08
https://www.stop-watch.org/your-area/area/south-wales
Thank you very much
SLUDGE FACTORY
24-06-20, 09:12
But you speak of the wall as if it was deliberately built to hide the black community from everyone, and of course you know very well that that is not true and never had been. The wall was built to keep people off the permanent way so the coal wagons could get to the docks and as part of the boundary wall of the bute west dock. and the Lady recounting the black man stopped by police in a park. I've never seen police in Cardiff randomly stop anyone, whether black yellow white [pink or green. They stop people when there is a need. But even then I've not seen it and certainly not against any particular group of people.
you talk about people spouting bollox, but you are just as guilty of it as anyone else when it suits your argument.
I refer you to the link provided by veg1960
Black people are 6 times more likely to be stopped in south wales than white people
That's staggering
Now either this woman who saw the police randomly stop a black guy in cardiff is lying or your view , based only on the evidence of your own eyes which are those of a white person are correct
The evidence suggests you are wrong
Thank you very much
I can't work out from that table if a black person is 7.4 times more likely to be stopped and searched than a white person, or if 7.4 black people are stopped for every white person.
Pretty illuminating either way
Taunton Blue Genie
24-06-20, 09:22
If you are fairly well educated on social history and urban geography and immigration what is your take on the Anglo Saxon races overrunning Britannia ?, are we better or worse off ? or is it impossible to tell ?
Some say the laws of Hywel Dda were so advanced it took English law about a 1000 years to catch up.
No tribe or people are truly indigenous to these islands. The Celts, the Normans, the Jutes, the Frisians, the Danes, the Saxons and the Angles are merely people who moved around Europe in different waves and none of them was a pure race in the first place. And let's not forget that many armies picked up recruits from everywhere they passed through and that mercenaries joined them in order to share the spoils. Each invasion meant that their influence and DNA made their mark and we are a very mongrel race. All this racial purity you spout is sheer nonsense.
SLUDGE FACTORY
24-06-20, 09:53
I can't work out from that table if a black person is 7.4 times more likely to be stopped and searched than a white person, or if 7.4 black people are stopped for every white person.
Pretty illuminating either way
I think it's for every 1 white person stopped 7 black people are stopped
Considering that 5 percent of cardiffs population is black , that's worrying
No tribe or people are truly indigenous to these islands. The Celts, the Normans, the Jutes, the Frisians, the Danes, the Saxons and the Angles are merely people who moved around Europe in different waves and none of them was a pure race in the first place. And let's not forget that many armies picked up recruits from everywhere they passed through and that mercenaries joined them in order to share the spoils. Each invasion meant that their influence and DNA made their mark and we are a very mongrel race. All this racial purity you spout is sheer nonsense.
Oldest surviving indigenous people here, Britannia belongs to the Welsh, Offa's Dyke proved to be a bigger barrier to Germanic dna than the North sea did.
If you dont think black people are stopped in cardiff randomly then you must be a public relations officer for the force
Why would sara robinson , who you can contact on twitter , a fellow cardiff city fan make up a story about going for a walk in a park and seeing a black bloke get stopped by the police ?
If you think shes lying show your cards and tell her
I didn't say she was lying, I said I have never seen it in Cardiff. Never!!!!!! you're ultra defensive there aren't you sludge?
Feck me theres some bollocks spouted on here
White blokes telling other white blokes that racism isnt a problem in wales despite our main centre of multi culturalism , butetown , being excluded from the rest of the city
Go to mermaid quay and it's all white people sucking on ice cream whilst half a mile away you have one of the country's most deprived communities living in tower blocks
And most people who live there are black , unlike the posters on here who tell us racism isnt a problem
Well, it wouldnt be for them , would it ?
A third of welsh school teachers report racist behaviour in the classroom
There is an excellent article written by sara robinson , a cardiff city fan who used to post on here , published in today's western mail ........its called the truth about racism in wales
In it she states that the physical wall separating butetown from the trendily called bay development kept the people of butetown segregated . The new bay are couldnt be less representative of cardiffs maritime cultural history if it tried .
There is not one statue dedicated to the people who helped build cardiff
Later on sara tells how she was walking in a city park and one of the other people in the park is black , he is stopped by the police .
On welsh Twitter a succession of white people , again fecking ironic , que up to post that racism isnt a problem in wales
Get off your knees, this is not america !
It is staggering arrogance for white welsh people to tell people from ethnic minorities living here that their experience is somehow imagined , exaggerated or invented .
How can white people who have never experienced persecution , racist taunts and jokes presume to be experts on how people who have and do experience it should feel or protest about it ?
The whitewashing of butetown extends to the workplace , our cultural life , our institutions
Black people are 8 times more likely to be stopped that white people
Racism may be less lethal , overt here but to deny it's a problem is to deny gravity , we continue to criminalise and discriminate against people of colour in 2020
We have a lot of work to do in wales before we are in any position to judge or tell protestors they have nothing to protest or that BLM is just a bunch of white middle class rich kids .....footage from the demo in cardiff shows people of all backgrounds and races were represented
An excellent article by sara , she is active on Twitter
As for the white working class none were born racist and your class does not make you a racist .
What nationality is this Sara person ?, what is her angle, how long has she been in Cardiff ?, is this the first time she has written about this topic since all the fuss ?
What's the crime stats for black people for crimes committed ?, is it out of sink for being stopped ?, Was the person that Sara seen stopped a criminal ?
You are taking a risk putting your faith in a Western Mail journalist, they are a Labour unionist paper (unionist as in GSTQ newspaper) and need to be treated accordingly.
splott parker
24-06-20, 19:52
What nationality is this Sara person ?, what is her angle, how long has she been in Cardiff ?, is this the first time she has written about this topic since all the fuss ?
What's the crime stats for black people for crimes committed ?, is it out of sink for being stopped ?, Was the person that Sara seen stopped a criminal ?
You are taking a risk putting your faith in a Western Mail journalist, they are a Labour unionist paper (unionist as in GSTQ newspaper) and need to be treated accordingly.
‘Out of sink’ has got escaped goats worried.
‘Out of sink’ has got escaped goats worried.
:hehe:
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