View Full Version : Confirmed: Josh Murphy to Preston on a season long loan
Michael Morris
31-08-21, 22:51
As it says in the title
As it says in the title
Whilst IMHO he has been a disaster of a signing, does anyone else feel if any offer comes in for anything they will get rid?
The club hierarchy needs to explain some to us poor punters methinks.
he'll probably tear it up at Preston.
talented player but never worked out for him here.
can't help thinking that the way we play didn't help.
but for the fee and the wages he's rumoured to be on he should have been one of our main men, and he's never managed to be that.
he probably wasn't going to get a game so makes sense for someone else to pay him
Whilst IMHO he has been a disaster of a signing, does anyone else feel if any offer comes in for anything they will get rid?
The club hierarchy needs to explain some to us poor punters methinks.
no they made it known he was available on loan
life on mars
31-08-21, 22:57
Very overrated
Forest Green Bluebird
31-08-21, 22:57
he'll probably tear it up at Preston.
talented player but never worked out for him here.
can't help thinking that the way we play didn't help.
but for the fee and the wages he's rumoured to be on he should have been one of our main men, and he's never managed to be that.
he probably wasn't going to get a game so makes sense for someone else to pay him
At least he won't be able to embarrass us in our games v Preston (this season at least).
SunderlandBluebird
31-08-21, 23:02
Very overrated
This. Reading “there’s a player in there” all over Twitter and think people are forgetting the many opportunities he’s been given by three different managers and failed to take. Looked half arsed a lot of the time too.
Would barely have played this season I don’t think so getting his wages off the wage bill for a year not the worst thing in the world tbh
Forest Green Bluebird
31-08-21, 23:11
Very overrated
https://youtu.be/xvHcMv0Gxw0?t=6
https://youtu.be/QMm-H9lMGUA?t=10
https://youtu.be/_C4PYdUCVJQ?t=2
SunderlandBluebird
31-08-21, 23:14
https://youtu.be/xvHcMv0Gxw0?t=6
https://youtu.be/QMm-H9lMGUA?t=10
https://youtu.be/_C4PYdUCVJQ?t=2
I would argue the fact you had to find a third goal from his previous club speaks volumes about his three years at the club :hehe:
Forest Green Bluebird
31-08-21, 23:16
I would argue the fact you had to find a third goal from his previous club speaks volumes about his three years at the club :hehe:
:thumbup:
Was going to upload this one:
https://youtu.be/Q4IeEULH1ak?t=3
the other bob wilson
01-09-21, 05:17
Mick McCarthy could not have made it more clear that there is no place for wingers in his Cardiff City team (I believe he actually came out and said it at one of his media meetings last season). As someone who was whingeing about our under achieving wingers around this time last year, I don't believe they're any great loss and that Giles, although not as eye catching in terms of ability to go past people, is both more adaptable and has better delivery than any of those who have moved on (to be fair to Hoilett, much of his loss of effectiveness stemmed from the ageing process).
It's sad, but entirely understandable, to see Murphy leave - he was supposed to be here for four season, was quite effective in the first of them, but never had the full trust of the man who signed him (probably because Warnock expected wingers to be defenders as much as they were attackers) and, in the next two campaigns, he looked and played like someone who'd rather be somewhere else despite being given plenty of chances by Neil Harris in particular.
The odds are that Murphy has played his last game for City, we may possibly manage to get a fee for him in January, but it seems to me that he's going to become the latest, and most expensive, in a series of players who cost us millions and ended up leaving us for nothing with the difference in this case that Murphy was of an age where he had a good resale value if we decided to cash in on him.
Instead, a player who I can remember being tipped as an outsider for an England squad place when he first came here ended up being unable to get into a pretty ordinary Championship team and, let's be honest, he wasn't worth a place in our team over the past couple of years or so was he?
Grangenders
01-09-21, 05:40
A brilliant player on his day.
Unfortunately he averaged one day a season
Taunton Blue Genie
01-09-21, 05:47
A brilliant player on his day.
Unfortunately he averaged one day a season
And not always on a match day.
Bobby Dandruff
01-09-21, 05:52
And not always on a match day.
😂
UNDERHILL1927
01-09-21, 06:10
And not always on a match day.
😂😂😂
A damp squibb and such a let down after the euphoria of that home game against Real Betis.
if Preston have picked up his full wage, and the wage is something like £25k per week (as was stated on that dubious list that was circulating) then that saves us about £1 million come the end of the season.
Be interesting to see how he gets on there.
Can't think of too many more frustrating players, been what 3 years of wondering if today will be the day he really looks the player we hoped for.
Good luck to him, hope he enjoys his football there as he certainly doesn't seem to have here.
This. Reading “there’s a player in there” all over Twitter and think people are forgetting the many opportunities he’s been given by three different managers and failed to take. Looked half arsed a lot of the time too.
Would barely have played this season I don’t think so getting his wages off the wage bill for a year not the worst thing in the world tbh
Stealing a living, after all these years I’m still not sure what he can do?
Does he need a lift up there ?
Jon Parkin only seems to interview City players he has direct connection to but Josh Murphy is one I'd like to hear from as soon as possible.
High ceiling of talent, nice man off the pitch but has played 99 times for us and I'd estimate that has done well in a small handful (15? 10?) of those games.
He'll likely do well at Preston but I'd like to know his thoughts on why it didn't work out here.
WJ99mobile
01-09-21, 07:12
Had more than enough chances.
Do think he’s a good player with a poor poor attitude
The Hooded Claw
01-09-21, 07:13
He was my son’s favourite player and it now leaves us looking ever more ordinary and workmanlike.
Cornelius or Murphy as our biggest flop?
Other signings have failed badly but the club has not wasted so much money on them.
Very frustrating.
life on mars
01-09-21, 07:39
Every club has a Josh or Tomlin its about attitude and commitment, yes you can blame those who sign these players but let's be honest we all get happy clappy at the time or when they show glimpses of brilliance.
WJ99mobile
01-09-21, 07:44
Cornelius or Murphy as our biggest flop?
Other signings have failed badly but the club has not wasted so much money on them.
Very frustrating.
Tough one.
Cornelius never looked like a footballer but Murphy had more time
Still think the right manager can get a lot out of Murphy
the £1 million quid or so we might be saving in loaning him out might make the difference in being able to afford to keep Morrison or Ralls next season.
Tough one.
Cornelius never looked like a footballer but Murphy had more time
Still think the right manager can get a lot out of Murphy
we never played to Cornelius' strengths.
we saw he was 6 foot 5 so we proceeded to launch the ball at his head from 40 yards away and expected him to hold it up and bully the opposing defence.
he just isn't that sort of player, he likes to run into balls in the channels.
we made similar mistakes with Ken Zohore. just because they're big doesn't mean they're a battering ram.
the £1 million quid or so we might be saving in loaning him out might make the difference in being able to afford to keep Morrison or Ralls next season.
Also, we are probably getting a loan fee for him from Preston.
Does seem odd in a position we are so short in but I guess the writing was on the wall as he hasn't been used this season. I can only assume MM thinks one of the younger lads has more to otter.
Also, we are probably getting a loan fee for him from Preston.
Im not sure about that
The Lone Gunman
01-09-21, 08:13
Also, we are probably getting a loan fee for him from Preston.
Like that massive loan fee City got from Sheffield United for Gary Madine? You know, the one you imagined.....
As for a loan fee for Murphy, don't be so daft.
Like that massive loan fee City got from Sheffield United for Gary Madine? You know, the one you imagined.....
As for a loan fee for Murphy, don't be so daft.
it's a stretch to imagine they're picking up the full wage, let alone paying us a fee on top.
even then it's still a sensible decision imo
LeningradCowboy
01-09-21, 08:18
if Preston have picked up his full wage, and the wage is something like £25k per week (as was stated on that dubious list that was circulating) then that saves us about £1 million come the end of the season.
I very much doubt that Preston are paying anywhere near his full wages.
The Lone Gunman
01-09-21, 08:20
it's a stretch to imagine they're picking up the full wage, let alone paying us a fee on top. even then it's still a sensible decision imo
Agreed. McCarthy isn't going to give him a game, so any saving is worthwhile.
life on mars
01-09-21, 08:36
Agreed. McCarthy isn't going to give him a game, so any saving is worthwhile.
Not just MM not many managers would as he lacks commitment, just another over paid gravy train footballer .
I'm sure someone would play him if he delivered consistently.
Wish Tomlin had gone as well.
dembethewarrior
01-09-21, 08:44
This. Reading “there’s a player in there” all over Twitter and think people are forgetting the many opportunities he’s been given by three different managers and failed to take. Looked half arsed a lot of the time too.
Would barely have played this season I don’t think so getting his wages off the wage bill for a year not the worst thing in the world tbh
Agree with the move, but I don't think the 3 managers that have given him an opportunity have used him correctly. Why did Warnock spend so much on a player that doesn't track back and play defender and attacker simultaneously.. Its not his fault he was bought by a manager that can't have scouted him to know how he plays... Could have made more of his chances but it all falls back to the type of player he is (and isn't)
I very much doubt that Preston are paying anywhere near his full wages.
my Preston supporting mate reckons probably about half the wage seems about right for them.
SunderlandBluebird
01-09-21, 08:58
Agree with the move, but I don't think the 3 managers that have given him an opportunity have used him correctly. Why did Warnock spend so much on a player that doesn't track back and play defender and attacker simultaneously.. Its not his fault he was bought by a manager that can't have scouted him to know how he plays... Could have made more of his chances but it all falls back to the type of player he is (and isn't)
I agree to an extent. Murphy would no doubt do better in a team on the front foot, set up to utilise wingers regularly and where he can forget about defensive responsibilities but even in games where we did set up like that he would often fail to deliver. I just don’t think he’s very good personally. He might score 10 goals for Preston this season but I’d still think the same. Harris was nowhere near as direct as the other 2 but he still failed to make an impact.
For all the benefit of the doubt he gets about the fact 2 of the managers he played under were NW and MM, you can force your way into their team with the right attitude and doing the tough work they want you to do but he never seemed to have it in him to try for me.
I guess the fact he went out on loan so late suggests they were trying to sell him all summer but barely had any offers.
dembethewarrior
01-09-21, 08:59
I agree to an extent. Murphy would no doubt do better in a team on the front foot, set up to utilise wingers regularly and where he can forget about defensive responsibilities but even in games where we did set up like that he would often fail to deliver. I just don’t think he’s very good personally. He might score 10 goals for Preston this season but I’d still think the same. Harris was nowhere near as direct as the other 2 but he still failed to make an impact.
For all the benefit of the doubt he gets about the fact 2 of the managers he played under were NW and MM, you can force your way into their team with the right attitude and doing the tough work they want you to do but he never seemed to have it in him to try for me.
I guess the fact he went out on loan so late suggests they were trying to sell him all summer but barely had any offers.
I'm not sure I've seen us set up in the way you say for quite some time?
Agree with the move, but I don't think the 3 managers that have given him an opportunity have used him correctly. Why did Warnock spend so much on a player that doesn't track back and play defender and attacker simultaneously.. Its not his fault he was bought by a manager that can't have scouted him to know how he plays... Could have made more of his chances but it all falls back to the type of player he is (and isn't)
I'm not sure I agree about the way Warnock uses wingers.
I don't think he asks for an excessive amount of tracking back from them, and he gives them license to take on their man time and time again. if they lose the ball it isn't a big deal unlike in some systems, and if they beat their man the team are often "in"
what playing in a Warnock team does mean is you're playing on the break a lot, are going to be isolated, when you get the ball it's going to be at head hight hurtling towards you from 40 yards away, and you'll either beat your man or lose it and then you might not see the ball for another 10 minutes.
some players do well in that role - I e. NML. others I think need to feel their way into a game and need to be constantly involved more to play well
SunderlandBluebird
01-09-21, 09:07
I'm not sure I've seen us set up in the way you say for quite some time?
There were a few games against teams below us under Harris we’d be on the front foot a lot more than we are these days but yeah not for a while now. Not that it excuses him, just look at how Giles has started in a MM team.
Pedro de la Rosa
01-09-21, 09:31
the £1 million quid or so we might be saving in loaning him out might make the difference in being able to afford to keep Morrison or Ralls next season.
It's a sensible decision, as he's not going to play but I dont think it affects Morrison or Ralls etc. I imagine they're just saving as much money as possible. I fully expect a major clear out in the summer.
Like that massive loan fee City got from Sheffield United for Gary Madine? You know, the one you imagined.....
As for a loan fee for Murphy, don't be so daft.
You haven't got a clue whether we have or haven't received a loan fee for Murphy, know-all. Sheffield United did pay a large loan fee for Madine plus a bonus when they went up. It was publicised at the time and I have relatives in Sheffield who are United fans and they confirmed it to me. Prove they didnt, Otherwise, jog on.
WJ99mobile
01-09-21, 09:48
Would have liked Murphy to be tried as a striker.
That’s got to be his last game for us
The Lone Gunman
01-09-21, 10:22
You haven't got a clue whether we have or haven't received a loan fee for Murphy, know-all. Sheffield United did pay a large loan fee for Madine plus a bonus when they went up. It was publicised at the time and I have relatives in Sheffield who are United fans and they confirmed it to me. Prove they didnt, Otherwise, jog on.
You've been asked to prove that Sheffield United paid a 'large loan fee' for Gary Madine on a number of occasions. You've never managed to do so. That's because the story is fiction.
As for Preston paying a loan fee for Murphy, that's also fiction. Anyone with a modicum of intelligence would realise that.
You've been asked to prove that Sheffield United paid a 'large loan fee' for Gary Madine on a number of occasions. You've never managed to do so. That's because the story is fiction.
As for Preston paying a loan fee for Murphy, that's also fiction. Anyone with a modicum of intelligence would realise that.
So, you cant prove that City didn't get a loan fee for Madine. You also have no idea whether City have got a loan fee for Murphy or not. And yet you state categorically that not paying a loan fee in both situations are facts. You then have the gall to accuse me of lying. Really, you have a grossly inflated opinion about yourself, your knowledge of Cardiff City and your general importance in life. I think you need help, honestly.
Although sharing the perception that he usually appears to be disinterested and uncommitted when he plays for City, I'll remind folks that he has a TWIN who plays for Newcastle.
It would be fair to say that Jacob Murphy has been in and out of the Newcastle team (in, at the mo) and loaned out a few times. But when I've seen him play, he appears to be far more committed than Josh - and is prepared to track back, being described as a winger/wingback. But, I've checked the Newcastle fan's forum and they are scathing about his defending ("on another planet" being one of the printable comments) - although fairly complimentary about his crosses and dead-ball kicks.
Interestingly, he plays on the right side, whereas Josh has been used mainly on the opposite side. He appears to be trusted now by Bruce, as he played 27 times for Newcastle last season.
Both twins were good enough to be called up for young-England teams.
Not advocating that we keep him (far from it), just wondering if it might have been an option to play him on the right.
LeningradCowboy
01-09-21, 10:34
Really, you have a grossly inflated opinion about yourself, your knowledge of Cardiff City and your general importance in life. I think you need help, honestly.
Physician, heal thyself.
Eric the Half a Bee
01-09-21, 10:34
So, you cant prove that City didn't get a loan fee for Madine. You also have no idea whether City have got a loan fee for Murphy or not. And yet you state categorically that not paying a loan fee in both situations are facts. You then have the gall to accuse me of lying. Really, you have a grossly inflated opinion about yourself, your knowledge of Cardiff City and your general importance in life. I think you need help, honestly.
Go on then. Find a link with info about Madine's loan fee. You're the one claiming it.
I could imagine you as a lawyer...."Yes, the defendant did kill the man. How do I know that? Because I do. It's up to you to prove he didn't"....
Go on then. Find a link with info about Madine's loan fee. You're the one claiming it.
I could imagine you as a lawyer...."Yes, the defendant did kill the man. How do I know that? Because I do. It's up to you to prove he didn't"....
No it isn't. I don't have to prove anything. TLG brought it up earlier in this thread and stated it was fact that no loan fee or bonus was paid. I have told you my side - let him prove the opposite (he cant by the way).
The Lone Gunman
01-09-21, 10:53
So, you cant prove that City didn't get a loan fee for Madine.
There is only one person who has ever claimed that City got a 'large loan fee' from Sheffield United for Gary Madine. That person is you. You did so in a hopeless bid to defend the transfer fee that Neil Warnock paid Bolton for Madine. You've been asked by several people on a number of occasions to provide links to any press reports which mention this supposed 'large loan fee' paid by Sheffield United, but you've been unable to do so. Instead, you're now asking me to prove Sheffield didn't pay a 'large loan fee' for Madine - something that was clearly a figment of your imagination in the first place.
I'd like to turn the tables a little if I may make so bold. I understand from relatives who live on the south coast that Cardiff City paid an enormous loan fee to Bournemouth for Brad Smith in January 2020. Prove they didn't.
There is only one person who has ever claimed that City got a 'large loan fee' from Sheffield United for Gary Madine. That person is you. You did so in a hopeless bid to defend the transfer fee that Neil Warnock paid Bolton for Madine. You've been asked by several people on a number of occasions to provide links to any press reports which mention this supposed 'large loan fee' paid by Sheffield United, but you've been unable to do so. Instead, you're now asking me to prove Sheffield didn't pay a 'large loan fee' for Madine - something that was clearly a figment of your imagination in the first place.
I'd like to turn the tables a little if I may make so bold. I understand from relatives who live on the south coast that Cardiff City paid an enormous loan fee to Bournemouth for Brad Smith in January 2020. Prove they didn't.
I have no idea if a loan fee was paid, enormous or otherwise, for Brad Smith and have no interest whether one was or not. You are the one who appears obsessed with Gary Madine and keep raising it. Your petty obsession with asking people to provide links to approve or disprove things is rather odd, as is your obsession with denigrating anything to do with Cardiff City. You are the one who hijacked this thread relating to Josh Murphy, merely because I pointed out to another poster that we have probably got a loan fee for him. You stick your nose into other peoples conversations constantly, trying to make yourself look clever and failing miserably every time. You are just a sad old ex Cardiff City fan who cant bear the fact that City have been successful ever since Tan took over and you got the hump. Some of your comments about him are borderline racist. You need to wind your neck in.
There is only one person who has ever claimed that City got a 'large loan fee' from Sheffield United for Gary Madine. That person is you. You did so in a hopeless bid to defend the transfer fee that Neil Warnock paid Bolton for Madine. You've been asked by several people on a number of occasions to provide links to any press reports which mention this supposed 'large loan fee' paid by Sheffield United, but you've been unable to do so. Instead, you're now asking me to prove Sheffield didn't pay a 'large loan fee' for Madine - something that was clearly a figment of your imagination in the first place.
I'd like to turn the tables a little if I may make so bold. I understand from relatives who live on the south coast that Cardiff City paid an enormous loan fee to Bournemouth for Brad Smith in January 2020. Prove they didn't.
transfermarkt seems to think we paid a loan fee of about £1m for Harry Wilson last season, which I can believe
The Lone Gunman
01-09-21, 11:11
I have no idea if a loan fee was paid, enormous or otherwise, for Brad Smith and have no interest whether one was or not. You are the one who appears obsessed with Gary Madine and keep raising it. Your petty obsession with asking people to provide links to approve or disprove things is rather odd, as is your obsession with denigrating anything to do with Cardiff City. You are the one who hijacked this thread relating to Josh Murphy, merely because I pointed out to another poster that we have probably got a loan fee for him. You stick your nose into other peoples conversations constantly, trying to make yourself look clever and failing miserably every time. You are just a sad old ex Cardiff City fan who cant bear the fact that City have been successful ever since Tan took over and you got the hump. Some of your comments about him are borderline racist. You need to wind your neck in.
Have I upset you?
Quote from an online media interview with Neil Warnock in January 2019, relating to Gary Madine’s loan move to Sheffield United - took me all of 2 minutes to find - read it and weep TLG and Mr half a bee - now who is the idiot.
”They create a lot of chances do Sheffield, and I’ve said to him: ‘go and get my old club up and get them promoted’.
”He’s felt such a heavy load on his head here, starting with missing a penalty but sometimes it’s good to wipe the slate clean.
“Financially it’s very good for us as well, everything is fully paid up and there are incentives for them going up as well.”
Come on then, what are you waiting for ? Cat got your tongue ?
The Lone Gunman
01-09-21, 11:25
Come on then, what are you waiting for ? Cat got your tongue ?
I say, old chap - I see no mention of a large loan fee. Do you have a link to this interview so I can see if I can find any mention of it? Thanks awfully.
I say, old chap - I see no mention of a large loan fee. Do you have a link to this interview so I can see if I can find any mention of it? Thanks awfully.
Hang on, so now you think that I have typed out a fake interview by Neil Warnock to make it look like we got money in for Madine ? !!. For the last two and a half years you have been trying to ridicule me for daring to suggest that anyone in their right minds would hand any money over to City for the over priced waste of space (your opinion) that was Gary Madine. Now that is is patently wrong (they paid all his wages, plus a loan fee, plus a promotion bonus which in total amounted to a ‘large amount of money’ and probably well in excess of £1m, which is what I said in the first place) and yet you still wriggle around and try to deflect any flak from yourself by pedantically playing with words and trying to be clever. As I said before - jog on and get a life.
https://www.dai-sport.com/football-cardiff-madine-sheffield-united/
The Lone Gunman
01-09-21, 11:54
Hang on…..
So no mention of a large loan fee, then?
So no mention of a large loan fee, then?
You don’t like being proved wrong, do you. Makes you look and feel particularly stupid doesn't it, after all this time lording it over this board and its members. FACT - we got over £1m from Sheffield United for Gary Madine’s loan.
The Lone Gunman
01-09-21, 12:04
You don’t like being proved wrong, do you. Makes you look and feel particularly stupid doesn't it, after all this time lording it over this board and its members. FACT - we got over £1m from Sheffield United for Gary Madine’s loan.
Really? FACT, huh? As the great man himself once said, prove it.
😉
I doubt very much whether there was a loan fee for Murphy and it is highly likely we will be picking up the majority of his wages.
the other bob wilson
01-09-21, 12:07
Here’s the article;-
https://www.walesonline.co.uk/sport/football/transfer-news/gary-madine-loan-sheffield-united-15629066
The only quotes relating to finance are from Neil Warnock.
No mention of loan fees, large or otherwise, in these;-
https://www.footballparadise.com/sheffield-united-sign-striker-gary-madine-on-loan-from-cardiff/
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/46786641
https://www.skysports.com/football/news/11683/11600325/gary-madine-joins-sheffield-united-on-loan-from-cardiff-city
https://www.cardiffcityfc.co.uk/news/2019/january/loan--madine-joins-sheffield-united
Seems to me that unless the loan fee we got from Sheffield United was more than £6 million, he still was a terrible buy by Warnock.
Here’s the article;-
https://www.walesonline.co.uk/sport/football/transfer-news/gary-madine-loan-sheffield-united-15629066
The only quotes relating to finance are from Neil Warnock.
No mention of loan fees, large or otherwise, in these;-
https://www.footballparadise.com/sheffield-united-sign-striker-gary-madine-on-loan-from-cardiff/
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/46786641
https://www.skysports.com/football/news/11683/11600325/gary-madine-joins-sheffield-united-on-loan-from-cardiff-city
https://www.cardiffcityfc.co.uk/news/2019/january/loan--madine-joins-sheffield-united
Seems to me that unless the loan fee we got from Sheffield United was more than £6 million, he still was a terrible buy by Warnock.
of course it was a terrible buy, it was obvious at the time. an awful signing.
comfortably the worst purchase we've ever made which is saying something
Here’s the article;-
https://www.walesonline.co.uk/sport/football/transfer-news/gary-madine-loan-sheffield-united-15629066
The only quotes relating to finance are from Neil Warnock.
No mention of loan fees, large or otherwise, in these;-
https://www.footballparadise.com/sheffield-united-sign-striker-gary-madine-on-loan-from-cardiff/
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/46786641
https://www.skysports.com/football/news/11683/11600325/gary-madine-joins-sheffield-united-on-loan-from-cardiff-city
https://www.cardiffcityfc.co.uk/news/2019/january/loan--madine-joins-sheffield-united
Seems to me that unless the loan fee we got from Sheffield United was more than £6 million, he still was a terrible buy by Warnock.
Not quite sure why you feel the need to get involved but anyway I have already provided the link, as above, where Warnock clearly states the financial situation relating to Madine’s loan move which includes incentives relating to the deal. The full figures were ‘undisclosed’ presumably because both clubs wanted to keep them quiet. My relatives in Yorkshire have indicated that the the incentive payment was around £500000 if United went up (which they did) and on top of that there were his wages, probably more than £20000 a week, which were paid in full. A loan fee was also paid but that figure has never been released. Warnock stated that the deal was financially lucrative for City. My issue with TLG is that he has always ridiculed that we got anything for Madine and will continue to do so. I have never stated that we got £6m loan fee for Madine but I do feel that his original transfer fee was good value, bearing in mind he helped us get up in 2018 and at the time we were in desperate need of a striker and £6m was the going rate in the January window.
I doubt very much whether there was a loan fee for Murphy and it is highly likely we will be picking up the majority of his wages.
50%.
dembethewarrior
01-09-21, 12:32
Not quite sure why you feel the need to get involved but anyway I have already provided the link, as above, where Warnock clearly states the financial situation relating to Madine’s loan move which includes incentives relating to the deal. The full figures were ‘undisclosed’ presumably because both clubs wanted to keep them quiet. My relatives in Yorkshire have indicated that the the incentive payment was around £500000 if United went up (which they did) and on top of that there were his wages, probably more than £20000 a week, which were paid in full. A loan fee was also paid but that figure has never been released. Warnock stated that the deal was financially lucrative for City. My issue with TLG is that he has always ridiculed that we got anything for Madine and will continue to do so. I have never stated that we got £6m loan fee for Madine but I do feel that his original transfer fee was good value, bearing in mind he helped us get up in 2018 and at the time we were in desperate need of a striker and £6m was the going rate in the January window.
Probably feels the need to get involved because over the years since and the multiple times it's come up you've never actually proven it and often slope off hoping it falls off the page... Until it pops back up again and you still can't prove it.
the other bob wilson
01-09-21, 12:41
Not quite sure why you feel the need to get involved but anyway I have already provided the link, as above, where Warnock clearly states the financial situation relating to Madine’s loan move which includes incentives relating to the deal. The full figures were ‘undisclosed’ presumably because both clubs wanted to keep them quiet. My relatives in Yorkshire have indicated that the the incentive payment was around £500000 if United went up (which they did) and on top of that there were his wages, probably more than £20000 a week, which were paid in full. A loan fee was also paid but that figure has never been released. Warnock stated that the deal was financially lucrative for City. My issue with TLG is that he has always ridiculed that we got anything for Madine and will continue to do so. I have never stated that we got £6m loan fee for Madine but I do feel that his original transfer fee was good value, bearing in mind he helped us get up in 2018 and at the time we were in desperate need of a striker and £6m was the going rate in the January window.
As the man who spent all of that money on someone who turned out to be a dud st City, Warnock would try to make the terms Madine went to Sheffield United under sound as attractive as possible wouldn’t he.
Your last sentence rather says it all about the way you come at things. If some other Championship side had paid £6 million for a striker who never scored a goal in the twenty six appearances (and that’s only league matches) he made for them and missed a penalty in a top of the table game with the eventual Champions, you wouldn’t be saying “ah, but he got an assist at Sheffield United” about him, you’d be laying into the player and the team daft enough to pay all that money for him.
The only way Gary Madine’s signing represented “good value” is if you truly believe we wouldn’t have gone up if we hadn’t signed him - apart from that one, valuable, assist at Bramell Lane, Madine contributed nothing towards our promotion.
The Lone Gunman
01-09-21, 12:44
My issue with TLG is that he has always ridiculed that we got anything for Madine and will continue to do so.
Not quite. I have always ridiculed your claim that City got a ‘large loan fee’ for Gary Madine that you have previously suggested was well in excess of £1 million.
I note you are now stating the loan fee figure (should one exist) has never been released, which differs somewhat from your previous claims
Fair play to dml here.
He seems to have knowledge of a loan fee for Madine that the press (or anybody else) couldn't get hold of, knows that 50% of Josh Murphy's wages are being paid by Preston and his relatives know exactly how much the bonus was that Sheffield United paid.
Hats off to the lad. He's got his finger on the pulse.
Llandaff Blue
01-09-21, 12:56
Fair play to dml here.
He seems to have knowledge of a loan fee for Madine that the press (or anybody else) couldn't get hold of, knows that 50% of Josh Murphy's wages are being paid by Preston and his relatives know exactly how much the bonus was that Sheffield United paid.
Hats off to the lad. He's got his finger on the pulse.
:hehe:
PhyllisStant
01-09-21, 12:57
I'm quite happy to see him loaned out as his patchy form could easily be at least emulated by one of the youngsters Harris, Colwill even Taz Mayembe.
It's so satisfying seeing youngsters progressing and getting game time. I also don't think there's a magic formulae to some of the clubs known to be a hot bed of producing youngsters - I think circumstance and finances forced them to play them - and that's the only way they are going to improve - getting first team football with better more experienced pros.
life on mars
01-09-21, 13:14
I'm quite happy to see him loaned out as his patchy form could easily be at least emulated by one of the youngsters Harris, Colwill even Taz Mayembe.
It's so satisfying seeing youngsters progressing and getting game time. I also don't think there's a magic formulae to some of the clubs known to be a hot bed of producing youngsters - I think circumstance and finances forced them to play them - and that's the only way they are going to improve - getting first team football with better more experienced pros.
Absolutely , and if this means a year or two as just a top 10 side whilst they progress surely that is the best route for us in these challenging times .
WJ99mobile
01-09-21, 13:33
of course it was a terrible buy, it was obvious at the time. an awful signing.
comfortably the worst purchase we've ever made which is saying something
Semantics I know but!
I don't think he was a terrible buy - I think it was a terrible deal
I think on paper it was a good signing if it was circa £0.5-1m. I think he showed some glimpses of what he could do at times and did suit us at that time
There's a difference. The terrible buys are ones that;
a) were never going to play
b) never fitted into a style
There are a handful of bad buys but hell of a lot more of bad deals
As the man who spent all of that money on someone who turned out to be a dud st City, Warnock would try to make the terms Madine went to Sheffield United under sound as attractive as possible wouldn’t he.
Your last sentence rather says it all about the way you come at things. If some other Championship side had paid £6 million for a striker who never scored a goal in the twenty six appearances (and that’s only league matches) he made for them and missed a penalty in a top of the table game with the eventual Champions, you wouldn’t be saying “ah, but he got an assist at Sheffield United” about him, you’d be laying into the player and the team daft enough to pay all that money for him.
The only way Gary Madine’s signing represented “good value” is if you truly believe we wouldn’t have gone up if we hadn’t signed him - apart from that one, valuable, assist at Bramell Lane, Madine contributed nothing towards our promotion.
By getting promotion to the Premier League, our turnover went up from £34m to £122m. The total paid out by Warnock in transfers to get there, including Madine, was about £10.5m. If that isn't good value for money, I don't know what is. Madine played in 13 games in the promotion run in and therefore contributed fully including ‘that’ assist. To just state that is all he did is plain nonsense. The penalty he ‘missed’ against Wolves was actually saved by the keeper (Hoilett missed his but no one ever mentions that). We still went up anyway. At the time we signed Madine, we had no fit strikers and Bolton didn't want to sell, so we had to pay an inflated fee, which is standard for the January window. Sam Vokes went from Burnley to Stoke for £9m in the same window for gods sake. Accusing Warnock of lying about the loan terms is silly as well.
WJ99mobile
01-09-21, 13:46
By getting promotion to the Premier League, our turnover went up from £34m to £122m. The total paid out by Warnock in transfers to get there, including Madine, was about £10.5m. If that isn't good value for money, I don't know what is. Madine played in 13 games in the promotion run in and therefore contributed fully including ‘that’ assist. To just state that is all he did is plain nonsense. The penalty he ‘missed’ against Wolves was actually saved by the keeper (Hoilett missed his but no one ever mentions that). We still went up anyway. At the time we signed Madine, we had no fit strikers and Bolton didn't want to sell, so we had to pay an inflated fee, which is standard for the January window. Sam Vokes went from Burnley to Stoke for £9m in the same window for gods sake. Accusing Warnock of lying about the loan terms is silly as well.
Tend to agree with inflated fees
Fair play to dml here.
He seems to have knowledge of a loan fee for Madine that the press (or anybody else) couldn't get hold of, knows that 50% of Josh Murphy's wages are being paid by Preston and his relatives know exactly how much the bonus was that Sheffield United paid.
Hats off to the lad. He's got his finger on the pulse.
Preston paying 50% of Murphy's wages has been released elsewhere and discussed. The link confirming money changed hands for Madine’s loan has already been released. My relatives are season ticket holders at Sheffield United and their manager confirmed the incentivised promotion bonus that Warnock referred to. Wind your neck in.
Not quite. I have always ridiculed your claim that City got a ‘large loan fee’ for Gary Madine that you have previously suggested was well in excess of £1 million.
I note you are now stating the loan fee figure (should one exist) has never been released, which differs somewhat from your previous claims
So you are now finally admitting that Sheffield United paid fees and full wages to City for Madine’s loan. Thats progress anyway, having previously stated on numerous occasions that we didn't get anything. How much do you think they paid in promotion incentive then - £50, £100 ? You asked for a link and I gave you one. Now you are floundering around trying to save face.
:hehe:
Reacting like that just makes you as big a bully on this board as TLG and blue lewj.
Reacting like that just makes you as big a bully on this board as TLG and blue lewj.
Bullies?
Are you not the one who called me a Jack and invited anybody that question the club to support somebody else?
The Lone Gunman
01-09-21, 14:15
So you are now finally admitting that Sheffield United paid fees and full wages to City for Madine’s loan. Thats progress anyway, having previously stated on numerous occasions that we didn't get anything. How much do you think they paid in promotion incentive then - £50, £100 ? You asked for a link and I gave you one. Now you are floundering around trying to save face.
Did Sheffield Utd pay some or most of Madine’s wages? Of course they did. That’s how loans normally work. Did they pay all of his wages? I don’t know, but I’d say it’s entirely possible.
Did Sheffield Utd pay Cardiff City a promotion ‘bonus’ of some description? That’s possible. What sort of sum would have been involved if they did? Like you, I have no idea.
Did Sheffield Utd pay Cardiff City a ‘large loan fee’ for Madine in excess of £1 million, as you have previously claimed? Not a chance.
Do you have relatives who are Sheffield Utd season ticket holders and who are acquainted with Chris Wilder, who gave them financial details of the Madine loan deal, which they in turn passed on to you? Don’t be so ridiculous.
Did Sheffield Utd pay some or most of Madine’s wages? Of course they did. That’s how loans normally work. Did they pay all of his wages? I don’t know, but I’d say it’s entirely possible.
Did Sheffield Utd pay Cardiff City a promotion ‘bonus’ of some description? That’s possible. What sort of sum would have been involved if they did? Like you, I have no idea.
Did Sheffield Utd pay Cardiff City a ‘large loan fee’ for Madine in excess of £1 million, as you have previously claimed? Not a chance.
Do you have relatives who are Sheffield Utd season ticket holders and who are acquainted with Chris Wilder, who gave them financial details of the Madine loan deal, which they in turn passed on to you? Don’t be so ridiculous.
it's all a moot point, even if they had paid us 2 million it was still a terrible signing
the other bob wilson
01-09-21, 14:53
By getting promotion to the Premier League, our turnover went up from £34m to £122m. The total paid out by Warnock in transfers to get there, including Madine, was about £10.5m. If that isn't good value for money, I don't know what is. Madine played in 13 games in the promotion run in and therefore contributed fully including ‘that’ assist. To just state that is all he did is plain nonsense. The penalty he ‘missed’ against Wolves was actually saved by the keeper (Hoilett missed his but no one ever mentions that). We still went up anyway. At the time we signed Madine, we had no fit strikers and Bolton didn't want to sell, so we had to pay an inflated fee, which is standard for the January window. Sam Vokes went from Burnley to Stoke for £9m in the same window for gods sake. Accusing Warnock of lying about the loan terms is silly as well.
You do make me chuckle at times. Where did I accuse Warnock of lying? What I wanted to get over is that having paid a fortune for a dud, he was bound to put the most favourable spin he could on the loan deal, that’s not saying he lied.
Even as I typed Madine missed his penalty, I knew you’d be back with your he didn’t miss it, the goalkeeper saved it line - he and Hoilett didn’t score from those penalties, therefore they missed them, Madine doesn’t get a quarter of a goal because his weak effort would’ve gone in if there wasn’t a goalkeeper there.
Getting all agitated about me saying Madine did nothing except that one assist doesn’t disguise your failure to address my point about whether we would have gone up if we hadn’t signed Madine - of course we would and we didn’t need him to get all of that extra money.
By the way, Zohore came back from his injury on Boxing Day 2017 in the 4-2 home defeat by Fulham - Pilkington was also around that January, so it’s not true to say we had no fit forwards when we signed Madine.
Llandaff Blue
01-09-21, 15:19
Reacting like that just makes you as big a bully on this board as TLG and blue lewj.
:hehe:
WJ99mobile
01-09-21, 15:21
Would be lovely if a thread could be discussed without bickering between the usual culprits
The Hooded Claw
01-09-21, 15:23
My relatives in Yorkshire have indicated that the the incentive payment was around £500000 if United went up (which they did) and on top of that there were his wages...
“My relatives”… 🤣🤣
Citizen's Nephew
01-09-21, 15:34
You do make me chuckle at times. Where did I accuse Warnock of lying? What I wanted to get over is that having paid a fortune for a dud, he was bound to put the most favourable spin he could on the loan deal, that’s not saying he lied.
Even as I typed Madine missed his penalty, I knew you’d be back with your he didn’t miss it, the goalkeeper saved it line - he and Hoilett didn’t score from those penalties, therefore they missed them, Madine doesn’t get a quarter of a goal because his weak effort would’ve gone in if there wasn’t a goalkeeper there.
Getting all agitated about me saying Madine did nothing except that one assist doesn’t disguise your failure to address my point about whether we would have gone up if we hadn’t signed Madine - of course we would and we didn’t need him to get all of that extra money.
By the way, Zohore came back from his injury on Boxing Day 2017 in the 4-2 home defeat by Fulham - Pilkington was also around that January, so it’s not true to say we had no fit forwards when we signed Madine.
Again, I can’t be sure, but I seem to remember Warnock saying something along the lines that signing Madine had kicked Zohore up the *rse that is to say, Warnock implied it was a brilliant strategy of his to get Kenneth fired up.
Also, don’t assume he would have scored even if there hadn’t been a goalkeeper! 😉
Did Sheffield Utd pay some or most of Madine’s wages? Of course they did. That’s how loans normally work. Did they pay all of his wages? I don’t know, but I’d say it’s entirely possible.
Did Sheffield Utd pay Cardiff City a promotion ‘bonus’ of some description? That’s possible. What sort of sum would have been involved if they did? Like you, I have no idea.
Did Sheffield Utd pay Cardiff City a ‘large loan fee’ for Madine in excess of £1 million, as you have previously claimed? Not a chance.
Do you have relatives who are Sheffield Utd season ticket holders and who are acquainted with Chris Wilder, who gave them financial details of the Madine loan deal, which they in turn passed on to you? Don’t be so ridiculous.
So, in your book, any fee paid to a club as part of a loan deal for a player, is not a loan fee if it is paid at the end of the loan as part of an incentivised loan agreement. Do you know how ridiculous that sounds. All that I have ever said is that City received in excess of £1m for loaning Madine to Sheffield United in 2019 and you have been denying that happened ever since. Next, you don't think it is possible that any fan of Cardiff City can possibly have relatives or friends who support other clubs. You are deluded. My wife was born in Yorkshire and we have relatives and friends there who that we visit regularly. Please show me where I said anyone knew Chris Wilder or that he personally gave them details of the loan deal- you are making that up, as usual. It is possible for bona fide fans of clubs to get information about their club without knocking on the managers door and having a cup of tea with him. After all, you have been claiming inside information about City for years without actually being a fan or going to games. Have you been making it up all this time ?
You do make me chuckle at times. Where did I accuse Warnock of lying? What I wanted to get over is that having paid a fortune for a dud, he was bound to put the most favourable spin he could on the loan deal, that’s not saying he lied.
Even as I typed Madine missed his penalty, I knew you’d be back with your he didn’t miss it, the goalkeeper saved it line - he and Hoilett didn’t score from those penalties, therefore they missed them, Madine doesn’t get a quarter of a goal because his weak effort would’ve gone in if there wasn’t a goalkeeper there.
Getting all agitated about me saying Madine did nothing except that one assist doesn’t disguise your failure to address my point about whether we would have gone up if we hadn’t signed Madine - of course we would and we didn’t need him to get all of that extra money.
By the way, Zohore came back from his injury on Boxing Day 2017 in the 4-2 home defeat by Fulham - Pilkington was also around that January, so it’s not true to say we had no fit forwards when we signed Madine.
Madine wasn’t here in 2017.
Edit - yes he was I misread your post.
dembethewarrior
01-09-21, 18:06
I'm quite happy to see him loaned out as his patchy form could easily be at least emulated by one of the youngsters Harris, Colwill even Taz Mayembe.
It's so satisfying seeing youngsters progressing and getting game time. I also don't think there's a magic formulae to some of the clubs known to be a hot bed of producing youngsters - I think circumstance and finances forced them to play them - and that's the only way they are going to improve - getting first team football with better more experienced pros.
What's happened with Taz?
You don’t like being proved wrong, do you. Makes you look and feel particularly stupid doesn't it, after all this time lording it over this board and its members. FACT - we got over £1m from Sheffield United for Gary Madine’s loan.
That’s ok then, what a steal he was eh??
BlueArmy 86
01-09-21, 19:26
Would be lovely if a thread could be discussed without bickering between the usual culprits
THIS!!
The Lone Gunman
01-09-21, 19:46
So, in your book, any fee paid to a club as part of a loan deal for a player, is not a loan fee if it is paid at the end of the loan as part of an incentivised loan agreement. Do you know how ridiculous that sounds. All that I have ever said is that City received in excess of £1m for loaning Madine to Sheffield United in 2019 and you have been denying that happened ever since.
Seems your memory is fading, old boy. What you actually said (on 14/10/2019 at 12:29) was: "We received a reported seven figure loan fee for Madine from Sheffield United last season plus a seven figure bonus for him when Sheffield Utd got promotion. Our net outlay on him is therefore considerably reduced and not bad value considering we got promotion with him in the squad and he contributed a number of assists, including to the equaliser at Sheffield United, without which we would not have gone up automatically."
Indeed, in this very thread (at 10:38), you said: "Sheffield United did pay a large loan fee for Madine plus a bonus when they went up."
You've never managed to produce any evidence whatsoever that your claims are accurate. Meanwhile, you've desperately tried to move the goalposts several times today by claiming the "reported seven figure loan fee" was in fact an undisclosed sum that has never been released, and then by suggesting the £1 million-plus 'large loan fee' you conjured up out of thin air in October 2019 actually comprised of Madine's wages, a loan fee and a promotion bonus.
Credit where it's due, you're entertaining in a weird sort of a way. However, I must confess I've yet to determine whether dml1954 is actually a spoof account or not. I strongly suspect it is and you're just having a laugh. After all, nobody could say the things you do on a regular basis and be serious, could they?
anyway, what about that loan eh? that was a turn up for the books
Eric the Half a Bee
01-09-21, 21:15
anyway, what about that loan eh? that was a turn up for the books
Yes, I was amazed Sheffield United wanted him.:getscoat:
anyway, what about that loan eh? that was a turn up for the books
Josh Murphy, you say? Decent move for him, and not just that, my relatives who live in Preston have told me that if Preston get promotion, then the club are in for 11 million, could work out to be a brilliant bit of business from Warnock.
Eric the Half a Bee
01-09-21, 21:25
Josh Murphy, you say? Decent move for him, and not just that, my relatives who live in Preston have told me that if Preston get promotion, then the club are in for 11 million, could work out to be a brilliant bit of business from Warnock.
Plus the huge loan fee and 7 figure promotion bonus!
Plus the huge loan fee and 7 figure promotion bonus!
I also have more family in Blackpool. The Wintle deal would blow your mind.
Eric the Half a Bee
01-09-21, 21:32
I also have more family in Blackpool. The Wintle deal would blow your mind.
:hehe:
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