Last nights game brings a sharp focus to where we are at

I didn't attend as I am 4000 miles away but having looked at the highlights (jeez, that's a stretch) and read various reports and comments from fans, I think the game highlights very starkly where we are at on the playing side of things.

Of course some will see this as an anti-warnock thread and how dare anyone question the saviour. But I do think that the game itself and the post match comments by Warnock outline some serious issues with the squad and also the approach the club has currently to the playing side of things.

I have no issues with being knocked out of the cup... it's not a priority and I think those fans who went knowing that are incredible and I have total respect for them... going knowing the club and fans are not making it a priority shows tremendous commitment.

Warnocks comments after the game saying that the youngsters were not up to speed while ignoring the utterly useless performances of some of the more senior players (in fact praising some of them when everyone else criticised their performances) says a lot about where we are at... I feel the senior players let the youngsters down last night... when the youngsters need the senior players to step up and lead, they put in a lacklustre performance in which the youngsters were always going to struggle to shine.

Youngsters are so neglected at the club with regards to any 'decent' pathway into the senior team I reluctantly admit that to be a youngster at city must be pretty demoralising. Also, if you are a father of a youngster at city imagine how you would feel that if by some miracle your kid makes it into the senior squad only to learn how not to keep the ball and play a brand of football that will do your lad no favours in his development. heartbreaking.

The senior players last night, whom Warnock had brought in, are pretty weak and makes our squad look pretty threadbear of quality. Why is Madine anywhere near the squad? 6 million and no goals and not even looking like he will ever score. Also, no back-up senior left or right backs available.. crazy stuff.

We got rid of Kadeem harris and essentially replaced him with Whyte - while he may have 'potential' (although he is 23) he looks so far off being a reliable squad player that it has dramatically weakened our squad with him in the squad and Kadeem out.

Warnock also made some comments about the possession that Luton had and that Fulham have ("the way they play") and how little we have - acknowledging that it is actually a tactic for us to not have the ball rather than lacking the players to keep possession (although the latter is a result of the former). While possession stats can be a vanity project for some team if you are getting beat with high possession stats, a footballing truth is that the more you have the ball the less likely you are to concede and more likely to create chances. The 2017/18 Cardiff, by hook or by crook style of football (and we acknowledge it wasn't pretty) looks so much more superior than the Cardiff 2019/20 side.

Anyway, this is just a wee rant as I can't see many positives for the rest of the season, not just from last nights game, but really 4 poor performances (even the 2 wins) in the league. I am sure we will get better but it seems that championship has improved but on the basis of the first 5 games and recruitment we certainly haven't.

It was a reserve game. Best save the panic for the poorly performing first team.

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Originally Posted by Taunton Blue Genie

It was a reserve game. Best save the panic for the poorly performing first team.

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Which there have been 4 poor performance

It’s not a panic but a reflection of our seriously lacking squad personnel and approach to youngsters

But let’s see what the next few games bring us

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Originally Posted by AfricanBluebird

I didn't attend as I am 4000 miles away but having looked at the highlights (jeez, that's a stretch) and read various reports and comments from fans, I think the game highlights very starkly where we are at on the playing side of things.

Of course some will see this as an anti-warnock thread and how dare anyone question the saviour. But I do think that the game itself and the post match comments by Warnock outline some serious issues with the squad and also the approach the club has currently to the playing side of things.

I have no issues with being knocked out of the cup... it's not a priority and I think those fans who went knowing that are incredible and I have total respect for them... going knowing the club and fans are not making it a priority shows tremendous commitment.

Warnocks comments after the game saying that the youngsters were not up to speed while ignoring the utterly useless performances of some of the more senior players (in fact praising some of them when everyone else criticised their performances) says a lot about where we are at... I feel the senior players let the youngsters down last night... when the youngsters need the senior players to step up and lead, they put in a lacklustre performance in which the youngsters were always going to struggle to shine.

Youngsters are so neglected at the club with regards to any 'decent' pathway into the senior team I reluctantly admit that to be a youngster at city must be pretty demoralising. Also, if you are a father of a youngster at city imagine how you would feel that if by some miracle your kid makes it into the senior squad only to learn how not to keep the ball and play a brand of football that will do your lad no favours in his development. heartbreaking.

The senior players last night, whom Warnock had brought in, are pretty weak and makes our squad look pretty threadbear of quality. Why is Madine anywhere near the squad? 6 million and no goals and not even looking like he will ever score. Also, no back-up senior left or right backs available.. crazy stuff.

We got rid of Kadeem harris and essentially replaced him with Whyte - while he may have 'potential' (although he is 23) he looks so far off being a reliable squad player that it has dramatically weakened our squad with him in the squad and Kadeem out.

Warnock also made some comments about the possession that Luton had and that Fulham have ("the way they play") and how little we have - acknowledging that it is actually a tactic for us to not have the ball rather than lacking the players to keep possession (although the latter is a result of the former). While possession stats can be a vanity project for some team if you are getting beat with high possession stats, a footballing truth is that the more you have the ball the less likely you are to concede and more likely to create chances. The 2017/18 Cardiff, by hook or by crook style of football (and we acknowledge it wasn't pretty) looks so much more superior than the Cardiff 2019/20 side.

Anyway, this is just a wee rant as I can't see many positives for the rest of the season, not just from last nights game, but really 4 poor performances (even the 2 wins) in the league. I am sure we will get better but it seems that championship has improved but on the basis of the first 5 games and recruitment we certainly haven't.

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Good post - people who say it's ridiculous to be so critical so early in a season are missing an essential point, there is a bigger picture involved here.

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Originally Posted by AfricanBluebird

Which there have been 4 poor performance

It’s not a panic but a reflection of our seriously lacking squad personnel and approach to youngsters

But let’s see what the next few games bring us

---

The squad is highly limited and the football produced is of low quality. It will probably do us a favour to end up in the lower end of the table as long as we avoid relegation - as Tan/the club needs to take stock and take a different direction altogether.

I hate to say it, but I think it's reached the stage where I may stop going to the cup games. Over the years I've always looked forward to cup matches against clubs we don't often play. Ok, we played Luton a fortnight ago, but prior to that we hadn't played them in years.

Last season I remember leaving the ground after we'd been stuffed by Norwich on a real downer, when it became obvious that our fringe players were nowhere near good enough. The year before Burton turn up and comfortably beat us despite being bottom of the league at that point.

I agree with the OP. What we've brought in this season to "strenghthen" the squad looks to be pathetic. Day isn't up to it. Whyte, looks completley out of his depth as does Vaulks. And watching Flint trying to hit 60 yard diagonal balls last night just looked like a Ben Turner tribute act.

I think what frustrated me most was for the whole of the second haf (not that the first half was much better), there didn't seem to be any idea as to how we were trying to play. The big lad in the middle for Luton just ran the show without any of the City midfield (if we had one ), getting anywhere near him.

For the first time ever I'll be watching the FA Cup third round draw in December hoping we draw some crap side away, so I won't need to waste my time deciding whether to waste more money going to a home game that it's obvious our manager, would rather not have us play.

totally agree we need a massive overhaul from top to bottom starting off with our academy . I would effectively scrap the academy from under the 14's down . just utilise development centres until the 14 year old age group . The false hopes and costs involves to run to me are not cost effective . Not just us but the whole pro leagues in the UK

I think its evident to most our first team and reserves are light years behind in the modern day . If as stated it's Warnocks last season we really need a progressive manager who can adapt and change to the passing game . The problem with this we would probably need an entire squad of new players and to gel a good passing side from scratch may take some time . Not sure us fans ever give Managers time tho

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Originally Posted by Taunton Blue Genie

It was a reserve game. Best save the panic for the poorly performing first team.

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That's a ridiculous response to a good post. It may have been a reserve game but 8 of those starting were signed by Warnock and the way they were humbled by Luton reserves is yet another example of how poor recruitment has been.

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Originally Posted by MOZZER2

totally agree we need a massive overhaul from top to bottom starting off with our academy . I would effectively scrap the academy from under the 14's down . just utilise development centres until the 14 year old age group . The false hopes and costs involves to run to me are not cost effective . Not just us but the whole pro leagues in the UK

I think its evident to most our first team and reserves are light years behind in the modern day . If as stated it's Warnocks last season we really need a progressive manager who can adapt and change to the passing game . The problem with this we would probably need an entire squad of new players and to gel a good passing side from scratch may take some time . Not sure us fans ever give Managers time tho

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You could argue that our academy isn't producing for whatever reason but your jump to generalise that it's not working for anyone is bizarre.

The young English players coming through the academy system are head and shoulders above what Britain was producing 10 years ago.

Mason Mount, Phil Foden, Jadon Sancho, Walker Peters, Alexander Arnold, Choudary, etc are the obvious one but there are whole host of others, some of which Izzy Brown last and Ejaria last week completely dismantled our midfield singlehandedly!

of course there will be a few to make the grade but when the reject rate is something like 99.6 per cent across the board is that value for money ?

come across this interesting article which I have been hearing what's going on for the last few years now regarding academies and read the comments too . it's a mugs game

http://www.parikiaki.com/2015/08/par...e-talks-about/

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Originally Posted by MOZZER2

of course there will be a few to make the grade but when the reject rate is something like 99.6 per cent across the board is that value for money ?

come across this interesting article which I have been hearing what's going on for the last few years now regarding academies and read the comments too . it's a mugs game

http://www.parikiaki.com/2015/08/par...e-talks-about/

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What's the difference between the academy and keeping them in the development apart from the fact parents have to pay for their kids in the development?!

You've obviously had a bad experience and that's fair enough. It is very taxing on parents but the alternative these days is kids sitting in front of a screen eating sweets and chocolate!

If people realised the chances are slim and took it that way it wouldn't be such and issue.

It gives the kids fitness, social skills, independence, life skill in dealing with a little pressure etc so it's not only about being a footballer.

There is more of a chance now that there was 10 years ago at most clubs (not ours) as the kids are better technically than their foreign counterparts at the moment but I do understand your frustrations as well as if people think it's all great then they are sorely mistaken.

Ultimately if the kid is enjoying it then there's no issue but if he hates it and it's just about the parent then its different.

I'm reserving judgment until we play some of the better teams in the league - we tend to 'up' our game when we play them. There's also the issue of so many new players who have to gel - the team against Luton in the league game being an obvious example.

But I share the concerns over our spend; the summer purchases; the lack of depth in the squad and non-scoring strikers.

The main worry though is what will happen when Warnock goes, leaving behind a team built entirely in his image.

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Originally Posted by Cyclops

I'm reserving judgment until we play some of the better teams in the league - we tend to 'up' our game when we play them. There's also the issue of so many new players who have to gel - the team against Luton in the league game being an obvious example.

But I share the concerns over our spend; the summer purchases; the lack of depth in the squad and non-scoring strikers.

The main worry though is what will happen when Warnock goes, leaving behind a team built entirely in his image.

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I thought that your 'we' was Pompey, old fruit :-)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by AfricanBluebird

I didn't attend as I am 4000 miles away but having looked at the highlights (jeez, that's a stretch) and read various reports and comments from fans, I think the game highlights very starkly where we are at on the playing side of things.

Of course some will see this as an anti-warnock thread and how dare anyone question the saviour. But I do think that the game itself and the post match comments by Warnock outline some serious issues with the squad and also the approach the club has currently to the playing side of things.

I have no issues with being knocked out of the cup... it's not a priority and I think those fans who went knowing that are incredible and I have total respect for them... going knowing the club and fans are not making it a priority shows tremendous commitment.

Warnocks comments after the game saying that the youngsters were not up to speed while ignoring the utterly useless performances of some of the more senior players (in fact praising some of them when everyone else criticised their performances) says a lot about where we are at... I feel the senior players let the youngsters down last night... when the youngsters need the senior players to step up and lead, they put in a lacklustre performance in which the youngsters were always going to struggle to shine.

Youngsters are so neglected at the club with regards to any 'decent' pathway into the senior team I reluctantly admit that to be a youngster at city must be pretty demoralising. Also, if you are a father of a youngster at city imagine how you would feel that if by some miracle your kid makes it into the senior squad only to learn how not to keep the ball and play a brand of football that will do your lad no favours in his development. heartbreaking.

The senior players last night, whom Warnock had brought in, are pretty weak and makes our squad look pretty threadbear of quality. Why is Madine anywhere near the squad? 6 million and no goals and not even looking like he will ever score. Also, no back-up senior left or right backs available.. crazy stuff.

We got rid of Kadeem harris and essentially replaced him with Whyte - while he may have 'potential' (although he is 23) he looks so far off being a reliable squad player that it has dramatically weakened our squad with him in the squad and Kadeem out.

Warnock also made some comments about the possession that Luton had and that Fulham have ("the way they play") and how little we have - acknowledging that it is actually a tactic for us to not have the ball rather than lacking the players to keep possession (although the latter is a result of the former). While possession stats can be a vanity project for some team if you are getting beat with high possession stats, a footballing truth is that the more you have the ball the less likely you are to concede and more likely to create chances. The 2017/18 Cardiff, by hook or by crook style of football (and we acknowledge it wasn't pretty) looks so much more superior than the Cardiff 2019/20 side.

Anyway, this is just a wee rant as I can't see many positives for the rest of the season, not just from last nights game, but really 4 poor performances (even the 2 wins) in the league. I am sure we will get better but it seems that championship has improved but on the basis of the first 5 games and recruitment we certainly haven't.

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Well said, that man.

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Originally Posted by thehumblegringo

That's a ridiculous response to a good post. It may have been a reserve game but 8 of those starting were signed by Warnock and the way they were humbled by Luton reserves is yet another example of how poor recruitment has been.

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It was an appalling result and the squad is very poor, that's true. However, the result will be far less significant than results in the league whatever way you look at it.

If we somehow beat Fulham, and we often do, no one will even remember last nights game in a few weeks.

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Originally Posted by Taunton Blue Genie

It was a reserve game. Best save the panic for the poorly performing first team.

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True, but their reserves beat our reserves. A club that has spent the last decade between the conference and division '4'. We've been in the Prem league 2 seasons and mostly top half of Championship the rest...