NHS Smokescreen Surely Not Bloody Tories

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24-01-23, 12:11
life on mars

NHS Smokescreen Surely Not Bloody Tories

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Diane Abbott MP
@HackneyAbbott
Inch by inch Wes is trying to push for a privatised/insurance based NHS all in the name of “reform”
24-01-23, 18:22
jon1959

Re: NHS Smokescreen Surely Not Bloody Tories

She’s right.
24-01-23, 19:16
Eric Cartman

Re: NHS Smokescreen Surely Not Bloody Tories

He is certainly giving me that vibe.
24-01-23, 20:09
JamesWales

Re: NHS Smokescreen Surely Not Bloody Tories

I treated myself to looking at Diane Abbott's twitter earlier but couldn't see it anything criticising Wes Streeting.

On the wider point, I am very strongly supportive of an NHS that is free at the point of use and treats everyone equally irrespective of income etc. However, I'm not really fussed on who delivers it. If private hospitals have spare capacity and the NHS pays for it then I can't say I have an issue with that. Indeed, I have benefitted from it and so has my Dad.

I'm not sure that 'delivered publically / by the state' is also one of the founding principles of the NHS is it?

Universal healthcare paid for collectively, but I'm not sure the NHS was initially envisaged to have zero relationship with the private sector was it?
24-01-23, 20:21
Eric Cartman

Re: NHS Smokescreen Surely Not Bloody Tories

Quote:

Originally Posted by JamesWales

I treated myself to looking at Diane Abbott's twitter earlier but couldn't see it anything criticising Wes Streeting.

On the wider point, I am very strongly supportive of an NHS that is free at the point of use and treats everyone equally irrespective of income etc. However, I'm not really fussed on who delivers it. If private hospitals have spare capacity and the NHS pays for it then I can't say I have an issue with that. Indeed, I have benefitted from it and so has my Dad.

I'm not sure that 'delivered publically / by the state' is also one of the founding principles of the NHS is it?

Universal healthcare paid for collectively, but I'm not sure the NHS was initially envisaged to have zero relationship with the private sector was it?

That ship has sailed a long time ago anyway so it's a bit of a red herring. Wes isn't saying much but he isn't giving any reassurance that he isn't thinking exactly what Javid tried to float a few days ago. If they start charging for GP/A+E visits it will be the beginning of the end.
24-01-23, 22:06
superfeathers

Re: NHS Smokescreen Surely Not Bloody Tories

Quote:

Originally Posted by Eric Cartman

That ship has sailed a long time ago anyway so it's a bit of a red herring. Wes isn't saying much but he isn't giving any reassurance that he isn't thinking exactly what Javid tried to float a few days ago. If they start charging for GP/A+E visits it will be the beginning of the end.

I think everyone knows it needs to be reformed, we can’t just keep increasing funding and spending badly. Trouble is any talk of reform makes people edgy.

I may be naive in thinking so but I don’t believe any party that did the above would survive
24-01-23, 22:50
JamesWales

Re: NHS Smokescreen Surely Not Bloody Tories

Quote:

Originally Posted by superfeathers

I think everyone knows it needs to be reformed, we can’t just keep increasing funding and spending badly. Trouble is any talk of reform makes people edgy.

I may be naive in thinking so but I don’t believe any party that did the above would survive

I agree. It's one of the reasons I would welcome any party who had a policy that if in govt they would welcome a commission to run the NHS that included representatives from other parties so that they all own the decision.There are many things about contemporary British poltiics I don't like but I really cannot stand how the NHS is endlessly used as a political football.

Of course, none of that will happen. Adam Price exposed some of this in the senedd today by quoting Keir Starmers comments about the English NHS and then saying to Drakeford that the same thing could be said about the NHS in Wales. And he's right.

We really need to move on from it being abused and argued over
25-01-23, 04:30
az city

Re: NHS Smokescreen Surely Not Bloody Tories

Quote:

Originally Posted by superfeathers

I think everyone knows it needs to be reformed, we can’t just keep increasing funding and spending badly. Trouble is any talk of reform makes people edgy.

I may be naive in thinking so but I don’t believe any party that did the above would survive

You do know the UK underspends on healthcare compared with reasonable comparators by a significant amount?

I don't have recent massive exposure to the NHS but I would say it certainly needs tweaking but also more funding. I have never experienced inefficiency in the NHS - unlike in the US system where profiteering is rampant.
25-01-23, 07:11
goats

Re: NHS Smokescreen Surely Not Bloody Tories

Quote:

Originally Posted by superfeathers

I think everyone knows it needs to be reformed, we can’t just keep increasing funding and spending badly. Trouble is any talk of reform makes people edgy.

I may be naive in thinking so but I don’t believe any party that did the above would survive

It’s going to be means tested soon, several doctors I know reckon it’s the only way out now
25-01-23, 08:27
superfeathers

Re: NHS Smokescreen Surely Not Bloody Tories

Quote:

Originally Posted by az city

You do know the UK underspends on healthcare compared with reasonable comparators by a significant amount?

I don't have recent massive exposure to the NHS but I would say it certainly needs tweaking but also more funding. I have never experienced inefficiency in the NHS - unlike in the US system where profiteering is rampant.

Everyone I've ever spoken to that works in the NHS says how it is inefficient and wastes money. That's not to say it needs turning on it's head but it does make sense to have a serious conversation about how it moves forwards.

Given that all being well we are on our way to a labour government I don't see it going down the route of means testing anytime soon as another poster mentioned, I think that would finish them.