Re: Bottom line. Are we a mid table team because of the squad or the Manager?
I have sympathy for Harris in that he's trying to/ tried to change the way we play at a time when the board are not backing him like the previous manager. I imagine it's a difficult task to try and change an in built philosophy and style of football without being able to bring in the players that would help do it. I think until he's had a couple of successful transfer windows it's hard to be overly judgemental.
And whilst football is a results game, it's important not to forget that the the club is in a much more positive position that it has been for a while - young players getting first team squad exposure, massive reduction in our wage bill, some shrewd transfer business with Moore and Wilson.
Let's hope that January allows us to re-shape the squad a little more and that we start seeing the emergence of more youth. A little cup run or a shot at the play-offs would be an added bonus.
Re: Bottom line. Are we a mid table team because of the squad or the Manager?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
198bore
Unfortunately true. Finishing 5th and adding Moore, Wilson & Jodri seemed promising though.
In hindsight that run to the play was perhaps a false dawn , or we simply adjusted quicker and better to closed stadiums football than other sides, perhaps the extra subs and extra breaks within those games hid so e fault lines ? as you say technically we've added better players and sadly not progressed .
Re: Bottom line. Are we a mid table team because of the squad or the Manager?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
City123
I think Harris overacheived last season, brought in some good signings but has been limited by the mess Warnock left
I don't think Harris is a particularly good manager, but he's done better than I expected
Agreed
Re: Bottom line. Are we a mid table team because of the squad or the Manager?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Pedro de la Rosa
Would you swap Wilson for Buendia, Sarr, Mbuemo, Cantwell, Brooks etc? No.
Hoilett's legs have gone, Ralls is limited (but I agree), Bacuna is out of position and Murphy has stunk out the place for the best part of 3 seasons. Comes a time when it stops being the manager and starts to be the player.
I'd take last season's version of Lee Tomlin over Harry Wilson at this point. Wilson is capable of brilliant moments, but he goes missing far too often when we play him as a number 10.
Re: Bottom line. Are we a mid table team because of the squad or the Manager?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
LeningradCowboy
Which ones?
Accepting that there are always better players and the need to be realistic.
Comparing us to the relegated teams is one measure but maybe Brentford is fairer.
If we were trying to emulate the style of those teams and move away from long ball then I think Smithies and Morrison could hold onto their positions with both probably now doing as much as they are capable off.
I think Bennett and Nelson could be better players in the right team.
Bacuna not sure if he would be good enough in midfield.
Ralls sadly too slow but could still improve.
Pack and Vaulks no.
Hoillett past his best.
Murphy has had too many chances. Just not good enough.
Glatzel. Capable of more with better service but would he fit the style.
Moore. Has been very good but again the wrong style.
Cunningham, Bamba. We need to look forward.
Tomlin. Has too few good games and too slow.
Harris. Unsure.
Whyte. No
Ojo and Osei will become better players.
Wilson. Needs to find his best position, man up and deliver more consistently.
Re: Bottom line. Are we a mid table team because of the squad or the Manager?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
City123
I think Harris overacheived last season, brought in some good signings but has been limited by the mess Warnock left
I don't think Harris is a particularly good manager, but he's done better than I expected
Totally agree.
I think we may end this season around 12th position but we should not expect much more. Harris is very limited and any successes will probably be due to “dog fight” games.
It is clear that, like most clubs, City are simply going to throw money around.
The return of Moore, Joudi and Tomlin will definitely help but it probably will not change how we play football, which is why we are mid table
Re: Bottom line. Are we a mid table team because of the squad or the Manager?
I haven't noticed any -what I would consider permanent- drop off in Hoilett's performances. He is what he his, a decent footballer, but somewhat limited. However, he's a more than capable Championship player in my opinion.
Re: Bottom line. Are we a mid table team because of the squad or the Manager?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
NYCBlue
I haven't noticed any -what I would consider permanent- drop off in Hoilett's performances. He is what he his, a decent footballer, but somewhat limited. However, he's a more than capable Championship player in my opinion.
He was our best player by a mile in the promotion season. He's lost half a yard, at least.
Re: Bottom line. Are we a mid table team because of the squad or the Manager?
You could bring in any manager with the best of credentials but sadly that wouldn't cut it. The team have players that can only play one way by lumping the ball to Moore or Morrison. While these two are our best players by far, the rest of the side is sadly lacking and no manager, however, good could get results without a major restructuring of the squad.
The Board have a big decision to make. They either persevere with Harris and the same players or change the manager with funds to rebuild the squad. Given the fact there is no money for new players the only realistic option is to stick with Harris.
In answer to the question, we are where we are due to both the manager and squad.
Re: Bottom line. Are we a mid table team because of the squad or the Manager?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
BLUEAWAY
Ojo and Osei will become better players.
Wilson. Needs to find his best position, man up and deliver more consistently.
This.
Re: Bottom line. Are we a mid table team because of the squad or the Manager?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Pedro de la Rosa
He was our best player by a mile in the promotion season. He's lost half a yard, at least.
I think he has since Warnock left. This isn't a Warnock - great, Harris - not post, but Warnock managed to get him to perform and conjour up some moments of magic, like the winner against Wolves in the PL. We haven't seen that since Harris took over. I'm not blaming Harris for this, just to reemphasise, but sometimes players work better with certain managers and don't so well with others.
Re: Bottom line. Are we a mid table team because of the squad or the Manager?
Watching the Hudson Interview it was interesting to hear him confirm just how good Warnock was at motivating players before a game. I think he said that was his strength and inferred that it made up for other weaknesses.
I do believe that the likes of Hoillett, Bamba, Morrison and some others would respond to that.
Re: Bottom line. Are we a mid table team because of the squad or the Manager?
The players have to take a lot of responsibility for the current situation. On the other hand, why are there so many 'professionals' at the club who cannot pass, move into space or develop some urgency in their approach only when they fall behind in a game?
Re: Bottom line. Are we a mid table team because of the squad or the Manager?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Eric the Half a Bee
I think he has since Warnock left. This isn't a Warnock - great, Harris - not post, but Warnock managed to get him to perform and conjour up some moments of magic, like the winner against Wolves in the PL. We haven't seen that since Harris took over. I'm not blaming Harris for this, just to reemphasise, but sometimes players work better with certain managers and don't so well with others.
Hoilett is in his 30s, he's played an awful lot of football in his career and he's peaked. It doesn't help he's played tournaments every summer! He's still our best contracted winger...
Re: Bottom line. Are we a mid table team because of the squad or the Manager?
The squad. Why should professional football players require motivation in order to accurately pass a ball, move into spaces or play with some urgency BEFORE they go a goal behind?
Re: Bottom line. Are we a mid table team because of the squad or the Manager?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
BLUEAWAY
Watching the Hudson Interview it was interesting to hear him confirm just how good Warnock was at motivating players before a game. I think he said that was his strength and inferred that it made up for other weaknesses.
I do believe that the likes of Hoillett, Bamba, Morrison and some others would respond to that.
That rings true, his coaches do all the coaching and he just motivates and/ or shouts at them. He would be unlikely to play a 'modern' style but could organise and motivate his players no doubt. Which may be why our bang average team got promoted 3 seasons ago.
Re: Bottom line. Are we a mid table team because of the squad or the Manager?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
surge
What has Murphy done to be included? Hoilett is a fine player but starting to show just how long he's been involved in high profile football.
Biggest criticism of transfers made under Harris would be starting season with just one RB. Think it's really hard to be critical of any other decision that's been made, if you're being realistic about our options. In retrospect, extending Tomlin and Nelson may be considered misses but they were each hits at the time of doing the deals. Transfer business has been one of the major strengths during Harris' time so far and without this we'd be a lot worse than being 9th best.
Like our previous manager, Neil Harris seems very keen on signing wingers, but did we really need two of them in the last transfer window? I'd have preferred us to unload a central midfielder if we could, just get a replacement for Mendez-Laing in and maybe try and get a couple of new central midfielders in. I'm saying this with a lot of hindsight (even though I did wonder if our midfield would be able to get him into the game enough), but the money spent on Harry Wilson has, to a large extent, been wasted.
Re: Bottom line. Are we a mid table team because of the squad or the Manager?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Dave Blue
The players have to take a lot of responsibility for the current situation. On the other hand, why are there so many 'professionals' at the club who cannot pass, move into space or develop some urgency in their approach only when they fall behind in a game?
Move into space... this is the key to de-hoofing. We just don’t do it so rely on lumping the ball forward.
To me that’s a Harris problem that could be improved upon quickly
Re: Bottom line. Are we a mid table team because of the squad or the Manager?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
the other bob wilson
Like our previous manager, Neil Harris seems very keen on signing wingers, but did we really need two of them in the last transfer window? I'd have preferred us to unload a central midfielder if we could, just get a replacement for Mendez-Laing in and maybe try and get a couple of new central midfielders in. I'm saying this with a lot of hindsight (even though I did wonder if our midfield would be able to get him into the game enough), but the money spent on Harry Wilson has, to a large extent, been wasted.
We have wingers who are failing offensively and poor defending . Murphy, Wilson and Whyte.
We have wingers who are failing offensively but can defend. Hoillett and Ojo
We have full backs that are making defensive mistakes and not so good going forward. Cunningham and Bacuna. Bennett maybe less mistakes and more going forward. Not sure about Bagan yet.
Better to have wing backs that are defensively good and can attack.
