Expectations

We need another 2 center midfielders and possibly another striker and I would hope top two. Playoffs minim , but definitely those midfielders

Purely because we expect to do ok and this is the Championship I confidently predict we'll come 16th.

I expect a 3rd to 6th place finish and an appearance at the Championship Play-Off Final on May 25 next year. It's why I took odds of 6-4 for a top 6 spot and have booked a 4-night stay at a Londonistan hotel which encompasses that date. 90%+ of this faith is centred on our Neil's stewardship.

Where do you think the bookies will have us? 4th or 5th favourite?

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Originally Posted by Steve the Tea

Don't you just love revisionists. Why let facts get in the way of opinion? I'm not knocking you JRH, just want to state some facts.

Let's look at the facts.

Malky Mackay Spending 2012-13 in Champ
- he inherited just 9 players (3 of those were g/kprs).
- he spent under £12m in 2 seasons and got promoted
2011-12: Spent ... £2.84m
Recouped ... £1.93m
Debt ... £0.91m debt
2012-13: Spent ... £13.08m
Recouped ... £1.54m
Debt ... £11.54m

That was a net debt on transfers of £12.45m after inheriting 6 outfield players, gaining promotion in two seasons. Hardly spending badly nor excessive.

City then won the Championship by EIGHT POINTS and a goal difference of PLUS 27.

In the 2013-14 PL season Malky spent £45.82m on transfer fees recouping £3.74m during the season; a debt of £42.08m.

Sunsequently ...
- Caulker was sold for £10.75m
- Medel was sold for £8m
- Mutch was sold for £7.57m
- Brayford was sold for £2.3m

I can't see how it was badly spent if we recouped virtually what we paid for the players.

... thereby recouping £28.62m and making a spend of £13.46m on players Malky signed for the PL campaign.


This makes a net outlay of £25.91m for his two and a half seasons. Not bad when inheriting just 6 outfield players.

Much is written about the Cornelius fiasco despite being injured for 5 of his 6 months at City. The signing of Madine has been far worse considering he's been fit yet hasn't look like scoring a goal for the first team or reserves. Yes, we lost £5m on Cornelius yet no-one says a word about Mutch. Malky signed for him £1.25m yet was sold for 4 times that.

****
Fees as per: https://www.transfermarkt.com/cardif...ers/verein/603

StT.
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I think under malky we had a very high wages to turnover ratio, so we were very much gambling at the time

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Originally Posted by Rjk

Where do you think the bookies will have us? 4th or 5th favourite?

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3rd fave behind Leeds and Fulham. I recommended in a post here to take City at 6-4 the other day at Skybet as the odds were mispriced. Best available anywhere now for top 6 is 11-10.

I've read plenty of comments on here bizarrely suggesting that players who won automatic promotion 2 years ago are good enough for a promotion bid, especially if we strengthen. If only football was that simple. Every season some players do better than you expect. Every season some do worse. We have no idea what relegation will do to each individual. We were a bit of an unknown quantity 2 years ago, now our tactics and formations will be expected by opposition teams. There's also added pressure of being expected to have a good season and us being a scalp

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Originally Posted by Rjk

Where do you think the bookies will have us? 4th or 5th favourite?

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They have us joint third behind Fulham and Leeds.

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Originally Posted by Eric the Half a Bee

I've read plenty of comments on here bizarrely suggesting that players who won automatic promotion 2 years ago are good enough for a promotion bid, especially if we strengthen. If only football was that simple. Every season some players do better than you expect. Every season some do worse. We have no idea what relegation will do to each individual. We were a bit of an unknown quantity 2 years ago, now our tactics and formations will be expected by opposition teams. There's also added pressure of being expected to have a good season and us being a scalp

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I wouldn’t call it bizarre considering the bookies have us as 3rd favourites.

I agree though I think we’ll find it tougher next season and I reckon we might come up a bit short.

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Originally Posted by Baloo

I wouldn’t call it bizarre considering the bookies have us as 3rd favourites.

I agree though I think we’ll find it tougher next season and I reckon we might come up a bit short.

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Bookies often get this division quite wrong, so I'll stick with bizarre. I'm sure it will be a lot tougher than 2 years ago.

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Originally Posted by Eric the Half a Bee

Bookies often get this division quite wrong, so I'll stick with bizarre. I'm sure it will be a lot tougher than 2 years ago.

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I know they do. But I think there is still a basis for people to think we’ll do well that can hardly be described as strange. Anyway, I think we’re agreeing it will be tougher this time around.

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Originally Posted by Baloo

I know they do. But I think there is still a basis for people to think we’ll do well that can hardly be described as strange. Anyway, I think we’re agreeing it will be tougher this time around.

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:thumbup:

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Originally Posted by NYCBlue

They have us joint third behind Fulham and Leeds.

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Don't write off WBA

Since 2001 they have not finished outside the top six of the Championship, either automaticaly promoted, in the play offs or in the Premier League.

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Originally Posted by Michael Morris

Don't write off WBA

Since 2001 they have not finished outside the top six of the Championship, either automaticaly promoted, in the play offs or in the Premier League.

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STAT!

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Originally Posted by Michael Morris

Don't write off WBA

Since 2001 they have not finished outside the top six of the Championship, either automaticaly promoted, in the play offs or in the Premier League.

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That's who were joint third with.

Where are Fulham in the odds? I think with a striker like Mitrovic they are always going to be there or there abouts in this league.

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Originally Posted by Eric the Half a Bee

Bookies often get this division quite wrong, so I'll stick with bizarre. I'm sure it will be a lot tougher than 2 years ago.

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People always say this though, it's either the weakest division in a while, or the strongest (as it appears now). Personally, it's always a crazy division but the quality is about the same. It's going to be really tough but we've got a side we know can get promoted. That's not saying they will but with smart additions we should be in a position to challenge and I think that's the expectation.

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Originally Posted by RonnieBird

Yes it is.
In short I suggested that we must have an intent rather than some vague and general hope of scraping in.
Well you quite rightly implied that it might not quite turn out like that and I agreed with you that an intent isn't the same as a guarantee, but my point remains that we must be grimly determined to come first.

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Originally Posted by RonnieBird

My expectation therefore is that we can and must win this league outright and anything less is unacceptable.

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That reads as saying finishing in 2nd place is unacceptable, which is why I got a few cheap laughs.

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Originally Posted by Croesy Blue

Where are Fulham in the odds? I think with a striker like Mitrovic they are always going to be there or there abouts in this league.

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2nd favourites behind Leeds, who are selling a lot of key players. Something isn't right at Elland Road if you ask me! Cue massive promotion push and a 100+ points tally. Although, I did call they'd burn out last season and I think a similar story will happen this year.

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Originally Posted by Pedro de la Rosa

2nd favourites behind Leeds, who are selling a lot of key players. Something isn't right at Elland Road if you ask me! Cue massive promotion push and a 100+ points tally. Although, I did call they'd burn out last season and I think a similar story will happen this year.

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https://www.football365.com/news/lee...ely-by-default

This is a very good article on it, only bit I didn't like was

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while Cardiff City will surely not overachieve so emphatically again

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:hehe:

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while Cardiff City will surely not overachieve so emphatically again

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Lazy comment though, we didn't overachieve as much as the journalists or Warnock says. Obviously we did a bit but that summer, most people thought we'd finish in or around the top 6. I'm pretty sure in Warnock's first season, after Jan 1st we had something like 2 points less than Newcastle and would have finished 6th.

I think when you look at wage bill and transfer fees paid we definitely over achieved. That isn't the perfect way of looking at it but before the season we went up people would have been happy with playoffs.

Top 6

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Originally Posted by Croesy Blue

I think when you look at wage bill and transfer fees paid we definitely over achieved. That isn't the perfect way of looking at it but before the season we went up people would have been happy with playoffs.

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I think our wage bill was a lot, lot higher than people would like to believe. That's my point though, it isn't a massive over achievement. We went up but I think most people expected top 6. Journalists seem to think we should have finished 15th, some were even tipping us for relegation before the season started which was frankly laughable.