Who would you shout for if City and Merthyr came together?Quote:
Originally Posted by J R Hartley
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Who would you shout for if City and Merthyr came together?Quote:
Originally Posted by J R Hartley
even when merthyr were doing OK there was still plenty of support for cardiff up thereQuote:
Originally Posted by J R Hartley
You may remember a company called merthyr motor auctions ?
Owner at the time was a cardiff city fan and sponsored the shirt for a couple of seasons
Its all very well howling wolf blaming cardiff city for the decline in the martyrs success but he needs to be looking closer to home to the people in merthyr who support Liverpool and man United
and how often do you go down ?Quote:
Originally Posted by Tuerto
Cardiff obviously but I do like to see my hometown club do well. I’d like to see them bite the bullet and go into the Welsh league now.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tuerto
I’m fully aware of that. The reason I started watching Cardiff in 1991 in the first place was because I met and got friendly with fellow teenagers on the terraces down Merthyr who also went to watch Cardiff.Quote:
Originally Posted by SLUDGE FACTORY
However, he does have a point. I know a lot of lads who were probably in their 20s / 30s who were regulars at Penydarren Park and just switched to Cardiff when we started getting some success.
Adam Brown of Foxy Knoxy fame and one time councillor now Steve Days pool boy in Spain was a prime example. Went everywhere with Merthyr home and away, Cardiff had a bit of success and he just jumped ship.
I think its safe to say that Mr brown and me would not agree on the subject of politicsQuote:
Originally Posted by J R Hartley
He was right about Amanda knox though
Got his own YouTube channel now. Mad as a box of frogs.Quote:
Originally Posted by SLUDGE FACTORY
he had very right wing views but when challenged on them said he couldn't be racist because of his Spanish ancestryQuote:
Originally Posted by J R Hartley
Very odd
Is the other chap living in Spain now ?
Near his mate ?
Who is he supporting now ?
just seen a few pics of a friend who is a Bedford fan, he watched the game today ( actually yesterday now ) 210 fans, one way system to the bar / Tea stand, then one way out, all looked very normal and worked at that low level amount of people
Bedford was on the Gov's area of concern list only the day before, but they still went ahead with the football :thumbup: which is great news
There's a decent DVD documentary called 'The Martyrs of 87' doing the rounds. Worth a watch even if you've no affiliation to Merthyr. Some more than amusing stories in it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tuerto
Sludge, you're paraphrasing me butt. I've more or less said all that.Quote:
Originally Posted by SLUDGE FACTORY
The truth is although the Taff valley is predominantly a City supporting area in the late 80s, early 90s Citys support was piss poor. I'll go as far to say a train from Merthyr to Cardiff I could still name most of the match day going City supporters. I'm from Aberfan, theres people who watch City now wouldn't entertain the thought during the late 80s early 90s.
Merthyrs support/crowds like City's for me are notoriously fickle. The truth is most people go and watch a winning team.
We'll agree to disagree over the FAW lad, he's a more than decent bloke.
I think it has come to that stage for them. But, wouldn't they have to start quite low down?Quote:
Originally Posted by J R Hartley
I'm not sure they'd be able to fulfil the FAW criteria to be admitted to the Cymru League or the Cymru South League.Quote:
Originally Posted by CCFCC3PO
They had to start again going through the English FA Western Leagues before getting back to the Southern League so I'd suggest going through the Welsh pyramid wouldn't be too much of an issue for them?
There's a lot of their members not wanting to look at the Welsh option. Personally, I see it as the only way they can sustain the club. The truth is they're losing players to Welsh League clubs because they can't compete with them financially.
Years ago went to watch Merthyr away to Hereford in the FA Cup.
Id say at least half of the support were City fans.
Well I don't know if we are talking about the same blokeQuote:
Originally Posted by Jordi Culé
He certainly wasn't 6 foot 5
This bloke , like his welsh nationalist bloke hated cardiff city
If your mate is 6 foot 5 and is OK with cardiff city , its clearly not the same fella
https://www.walesonline.co.uk/sport/...fixit-17298784Quote:
Originally Posted by SLUDGE FACTORY
What were Merthyr's crowds like when they were in the Conference? I thought they were around the 1,500 mark, but I could well be mistaken. I went up to watch them four or five times in those days and can remember seeing them beat Colchester in a good game.
Early 90s, about 600-900 I think. They were always one of the lower crowds on teletext. I have some old Rothmans somewhere so could dig it out.Quote:
Originally Posted by the other bob wilson
I'd be interested in that. Although they're local to me, I never watched too many Merthyr games in that era. Don't watch too many now mind.Quote:
Originally Posted by CCFCC3PO
On a Colchester United site, they list the lowest crowds to watch Colchester ever. It includes 710 that saw Merthyr v Colchester in December 1990. Merthyr finished 9th that season.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jordi Culé
https://www.coludata.co.uk/content.php?pg=sipg&pd=1140
Same season, they had 1,175 against Barnet - Gary Bull scored a pen for Barnet.
1989/90 they had 2,003 against Barnet, would have been one of their first home games at that level.
Just asked a regular at that time. He says they had a couple of games over 3000 but had some matches that just had about 500, at one point the average was 1500.Quote:
Originally Posted by CCFCC3PO
Fickle crowds really. City's were the same at the time.
That doesn't look like himQuote:
Originally Posted by Jordi Culé
His mate was steve , who was a hack for the echo and was a part time dj
The bloke I was speaking too said merthyr was solid martyr territory
I don't think this is him
But if this fella is so passionately pro welsh and is standing for plaid, whats he doing supporting an English football team , wolves ?
Dafydd Ellis Thomas , proud welshman , on the eve of cardiff citys fa Cup appearance and he tells the six of clock news he is man United fan
If that's plaid , feck em
Cardiff City have always had fickle supportQuote:
Originally Posted by Jordi Culé
Its the nature of the welsh sporting public
QThat Colchester match was the one I mentioned - I seem to remember the weather was pretty awful that day.Quote:
Originally Posted by CCFCC3PO
I was also at one of those matches with Barnet, think it was the earlier one which I seem to remember finished 1-1.
Both Merthyr and Aberdare had Football League sides for a while in the 20s and 30s I believe, but I don't think the gates were great for either club and they didn't survive the Great Depression.
Six Welsh clubs in the Football League in those days. On times when I’ve had the occasion to drive around those areas, Merthyr and Aberdare and surrounding valleys I’ve often wondered what young footballers from clubs such as Brentford, Leyton Orient, Millwall etc thought when they witnessed it in those far off days. Coming from the metropolis that London was, even in those days, it must have been like landing on another planet. I’d imagine they would have travelled from Paddington to Cardiff General, then changed to a train going to the valleys, or, perhaps, a charabanc or two picked them up at the General and then drove them up. Either way for a young Cockney making his first trip the landscape and sloping roofed towns must have been mind boggling.Quote:
Originally Posted by the other bob wilson
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aberdare_Athletic_F.C.Quote:
Originally Posted by splott parker
Aberdare faced re-election to the league but got voted out and replaced by Torquay. Makes sense really where would you rather go?:biggrin:
Looking at Aberdare's record in the Football League, they struggled in one of their first five seasons, but were comfortable in the other four, finishing in the top ten of the Third Division (South) twice. Their sixth season saw them finish bottom of the table though and, controversially, they were voted out in favour of Torquay -Quote:
Originally Posted by Jordi Culé
"However, in the next season, 1926–27, Aberdare Athletic finished bottom of the Third Division South and failed to gain re-election to the League, with Torquay United taking their place.[3] Aberdare's loss of their Football League place was controversial. In the first ballot, Aberdare and Southern League side Torquay, the latter having previously applied to join the League in 1923, tied with 21 each. That round of voting was marred by controversy as there was reported to be one spoilt ballot paper (for Aberdare?). Aberdare's secretary claimed that one of the scrutineers was "an interested party". Aberdare lost the second ballot with 19 votes to Torquay’s 26; fellow League side Watford, who had finished second-bottom, were comfortably re-elected with 44 votes.[4] The merged club fully renamed themselves as "Aberdare & Aberaman Athletic", and rejoined the Southern League."
Certainly looks like visits to Aberdare were not fancied by the other Football League clubs!
Here's an aerial view of the ground they used to play at;-
Attachment 4020
Read this a couple of years ago.
https://www.soccer-books.co.uk/acata...tory-9579.html
Th author has written a couple of books about Merthyr Town too. He’s a bit of the local football history buff. Nice bloke too.Quote:
Originally Posted by Hilts
http://www.historicalkits.co.uk/Aber...e_Athletic.htm
Yeh just imagine full bluebird attire on mingling with the bestQuote:
Originally Posted by splott parker
My former boss Paul Young wrote a book about the Mid Rhondda side of the early 1920s who were hoping to gain league status. They had a manager called Jim Steed who by all accounts was a top player but suffered gas damage to his lungs in the first world war. Apparently he went on to manage Charlton Athletic and one of the stands there is named after him. I've got a copy of the book somewhere, but below I've pasted the Wikepdia link to the ground and history.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mid_Rhondda_F.C.
My former boss Paul Young wrote a book about the Mid Rhondda side of the early 1920s who were hoping to gain league status. They had a manager called Jim Steed who by all accounts was a top player but suffered gas damage to his lungs in the first world war. Apparently he went on to manage Charlton Athletic and one of the stands there is named after him. I've got a copy of the book somewhere, but below I've pasted the Wikepdia link to the ground and history.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mid_Rhondda_F.C.
The Formation of Mid Rhondda F.C.
Early attempts to form a football club were placed on hold when industrial unrest spread through the Rhondda during 1910 and 1911. The coal mining area of the valleys experienced several strikes centred on the Glamorgan Colliery in Llwynypia, neighbouring Tonypandy.[4] The events game to a climax in 1911 with the Tonypandy riots, where the town centre was vandalised and looted.
In 1912, with the events of the previous years settled, an attempt was made to introduce a football team in Tonypandy.[5] The Mid Rhondda Football Club was set up, and a Board of Directors founded. All were from the Tonypandy area and were a cross section of tradesmen and workers representatives. Amongst the shareholders was D.A. Thomas, the owner of the Cambrian Combine of collieries, which had been at the heart of the strike just a year prior.[5]
The club applied to join the Southern League and was accepted even though the club had yet to select a team. With a fortnight to go before the start of the 1912–13 season the club was facing closure due to lack of funds, but good press encouraged the promoters to carry on and a week later the team had a manager and enough players for a starting XI.[5] The club's swift growth earned them the nickname The Mushrooms, though normally called The Mush.[5] Their first season in the Second Division of the Southern League saw them face the first teams of Cardiff City, Swansea Town, Croydon Common and Luton Town. Mid Rhondda made a steady if unspectacular start to their professional career, finishing 8th out of 13 teams in their first season.[6]
The promoters were happy with the club's progress in their first season, and over the next few seasons the team were often supported by crowds of over 10,000.[7] Despite some good figures these crowds were inconsistent. The home clash with Newport County in 1913 for example witnessed just 3,000 spectators, leading to financial concerns.[6] The team finished a respectful 7th in the 1913/14 season, in an expanded league of 16 clubs. The 1914/15 season saw a drop in fortunes with the team winning just 3 of their 12 games and ending 12th from 13.[6] The club suspended play during the First World War, and the club lay dormant until the first season after the war.[7]
1919–20 Season
Of all the seasons of the club's existence, 1919–20 was the most notable. With more funds available the committee of the Mid Rhondda Club made a decision to push the first team for promotion to the First Division, emulating Cardiff City.[7] They turned to a local ex-international footballer Haydn Price to manage the team.[7] He joined Mid Rhondda as secretary manager and immediately signed as captain former Aston Villa player, Joe Bache.[7] Bache brought experience to the team, but it was the signing of an untested young player from Durham, Jimmy Seed, that would be Haydn's most important signing.[7] Seed had started his career as a seventeen-year-old with Sunderland, and showed great potential in the reserves. During the war, Seed was posted to the front and was gassed in the trenches.[8] On his return to training with Sunderland, he was told that because of lung problems his career was finished.[8] Price disagreed and signed Seed.
...as soon as I got off the train, I was cheered like as if I was a heavyweight champion of the world, rather than a reject who had been told his footballing days were over.[8]
– Jimmy Seed describing his reception at Tonypandy after joining Mid Rhondda
Seed played "non-stop football" from the time he joined Mid Rhondda, and his lungs appeared to recover. By the end of his first season Seed was signed by Tottenham Hotspur for £1,000, and enjoyed a long career with both Spurs and Sheffield Wednesday as well as making five appearances for England. Another notable player on Mid Rhondda's books at this time was future Wales international, Dai Collier.
A highlight of the season was when Mid Rhondda played local rivals Ton Pentre in a preliminary round of the FA cup. 20,000 spectators watched the game, filling the ground with many more covering the mountainside overlooking the pitch.[8] More success was to come when the team won the Southern League Division Two, amassing 37 points over 20 games, losing none and drawing only three games.[9] They then took the Welsh League title, beating Cardiff City into second place, losing just five of the thirty games. They completed the season with a third trophy, beating Barry F.C. 1–0 at Merthyr to take the South Wales Cup.[10]
The strength of the club at the time is best gauged by the challenge matches the team undertook against Football League clubs.[10] Due to the large following the club possessed, they were able to offer incentives to league clubs to travel to Tonypandy. These were teams that normally played Bristol on the Saturday, then brought their first teams to the Rhondda for a Monday night encounter.[10] Crowds in excess of 15,000 and the substantial win bonus that was offered elevated these games above friendlies. These encounters included wins over Nottingham Forest (3–1), Derby County (2–0) and Portsmouth (1–0) in 1919 and a draw against Tottenham Hotspur and a narrow loss to Aston Villa (1–2) in 1920.[10]
Club demise
The club and supporters expected continued success for the 1920–21 season in the First Division of the Southern League. A new stand was built, and other ground improvements were added, including a press box and a gymnasium.[11] Then ready for the new season, the Southern League was invited to form a Third Division of the Football League. The current First Division of the Southern League became the new Third Division, and no promotions were accepted. Mid Rhondda remained in the Second Division.[11]
From this, the team disintegrated. Price left for Grimsby Town and took five players with him, while the remaining players of the previous season found different clubs.[11] This was followed by a national coal strike in 1921 which crippled the South Wales valleys, and the Club was suspended by the Football Association of Wales for non-payment of debts.[11] The club reformed in 1922, mainly thanks to voluntary donations from local miners, but now known as Mid Rhondda United. The club rejoined the Southern League for the 1924–25 season and applied for Football League membership in 1925. However the economic depression of the 1920s worsened, and there was real poverty in the Rhondda and there was little money for entertainment.[11] The club continued until March 1928 when, with debts of £1,400, Mid Rhondda was forced to close when the banks called in its overdraft.[11]
In the 1920's there were a host of south Wales clubs applying to join the football league, including Llanelli, Pontypridd, Barry.Quote:
Originally Posted by Hot Shot Hamish.
Thanks Hamish, a fascinating read - Mid Rhondda were a serious football team and I'm ashamed to say I'd never heard of them until this morning.
Jimmy Seed is/was a substantial figure in football;-
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jimmy_Seed
There is so much football history in South Wales that has been forgotten. I recently went down a rabbit hole with it and just came out with more questions. Looking at Southern League tables from before the Great War is quite interesting, I never knew Caerphilly had a club.
Llanelli tried pretty much for 30 years to get elected but couldn’t get the votes - http://www.nonleaguematters.co.uk/fo...ostatt_id=3506
Jock Stein played for Llanelli.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bruce Parry
Thanks for posting that very interesting link - I started from the top and have not got too far down it yet, but have already come across things like Walsall Swifts being booted out one season and then elected back into the Football League a year later and then Bradford City being accepted without ever having played a game while other clubs went through the usual election procedure.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bruce Parry
Just clicked on the wiki link.Quote:
Originally Posted by Hot Shot Hamish.
What a great nickname ‘The Mush’ and ‘Mushrooms’. I’m hoping the team kit was a sort of inspired psychedelic effort.
Interesting stuff.