Songs Of Praise

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Originally Posted by Croesy Blue

Could a t-Rex even get his hands into the right position?

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The Triceratops had it sorted with the horns representing the father, son and holy spirit.

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Originally Posted by The Bloop

Cant remember who it was but someone said recently that the best thing about religion is the architecture.
I tend to agree.

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I'd say music too. Not Christian rock, but lots of orchestral music from a few centuries back was written for religion.

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Originally Posted by lardy

I'd say music too. Not Christian rock, but lots of orchestral music from a few centuries back was written for religion.

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You could add law and order and culture. Disclaimer; I'm not religious, before someone attempts to have a go at me because kids die of leukemia.

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Originally Posted by Heisenberg

I've reflected.

I still have a potentially "off the cuff" comment for you...

The example you gave was lovely, but how to you explain infants who have died of horrible diseases? Whose "will" determined those horrific events?

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Hard to answer this in a few sentences, it's a very good question. Not being flippant but it's not God's will that children ,or anyone for that matter, should die from prematurely from horrible disease. We are born into a world of suffering and pain, much of it manmade, much of it through our battles with nature and disease. You and I will suffer, have suffered, and the Bible's message is that God shares our pain in this world and offers comfort to those that seek it through him.

I had a very good friend who died as a young adult leaving a wife and baby. He was a bricklayer by trade but gave it up to become a priest. He was a joy to be with and he honestly and openly took on board the suffering of his parishioners at a very personal level. He offered love, comfort and the promise of faith in the same way that Christians believe God does.

He was a 'brittle' diabetic, hard to control and he knew he would be unlikely to live a long life. But he filled his life with purpose and love, and not once did he complain' why me'. Why didn't God save him you may ask? For what? To live a few more years with an increasing amount of suffering that is linked to his condition. We look at the physical, God at the spiritual and the answer might be wrapped up in that.

I seem to be like someone trying to explain to you how a car engine works when you will find the complete answer by looking though the manual. And you know the manual I'm talking about...from the Greek it's called 'The Book'

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Originally Posted by lisvaneblue

Hard to answer this in a few sentences, it's a very good question. Not being flippant but it's not God's will that children ,or anyone for that matter, should die from prematurely from horrible disease. We are born into a world of suffering and pain, much of it manmade, much of it through our battles with nature and disease. You and I will suffer, have suffered, and the Bible's message is that God shares our pain in this world and offers comfort to those that seek it through him.

I had a very good friend who died as a young adult leaving a wife and baby. He was a bricklayer by trade but gave it up to become a priest. He was a joy to be with and he honestly and openly took on board the suffering of his parishioners at a very personal level. He offered love, comfort and the promise of faith in the same way that Christians believe God does.

He was a 'brittle' diabetic, hard to control and he knew he would be unlikely to live a long life. But he filled his life with purpose and love, and not once did he complain' why me'. Why didn't God save him you may ask? For what? To live a few more years with an increasing amount of suffering that is linked to his condition. We look at the physical, God at the spiritual and the answer might be wrapped up in that.

I seem to be like someone trying to explain to you how a car engine works when you will find the complete answer by looking though the manual. And you know the manual I'm talking about...from the Greek it's called 'The Book'

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"Why didn't God save him, you may ask..."

Not really, as I was more interested in why your God chose to create this planet and allow millions of innocent children to suffer as a result.

I've never seen anybody explain this in a way other than "it is what it is" basically. You have done the same.

I've read The Bible by the way (well, the Old Testament anyway... The New Testament didn't have the enough theatrics to keep me entertained). I couldn't find the answers to why innocent children suffer as a consequence of simply being born... Which chapter and verse will provide that answer?

Can’t believe god can’t even zap diabetes better.

A Mars bar is literally more powerful than god.

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Originally Posted by Heisenberg

"Why didn't God save him, you may ask..."

Not really, as I was more interested in why your God chose to create this planet and allow millions of innocent children to suffer as a result.

I've never seen anybody explain this in a way other than "it is what it is" basically. You have done the same.

I've read The Bible by the way (well, the Old Testament anyway... The New Testament didn't have the enough theatrics to keep me entertained). I couldn't find the answers to why innocent children suffer as a consequence of simply being born... Which chapter and verse will provide that answer?

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As a father of a severely disabled child I'm always fascinated with religious people's answers to these types of questions. Have yet to see an answer that gives a satisfactory explanation.

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Originally Posted by Heisenberg

"Why didn't God save him, you may ask..."

Not really, as I was more interested in why your God chose to create this planet and allow millions of innocent children to suffer as a result.

I've never seen anybody explain this in a way other than "it is what it is" basically. You have done the same.

I've read The Bible by the way (well, the Old Testament anyway... The New Testament didn't have the enough theatrics to keep me entertained). I couldn't find the answers to why innocent children suffer as a consequence of simply being born... Which chapter and verse will provide that answer?

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“Surely I was sinful at birth, / sinful from the time my mother conceived me” (Psalm 51:5). “Even from birth the wicked go astray; / from the womb they are wayward, spreading lies” (Psalm 58:3).

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Originally Posted by bobh

Didn't pray enough

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:hehe:

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Originally Posted by Heisenberg

"Why didn't God save him, you may ask..."

Not really, as I was more interested in why your God chose to create this planet and allow millions of innocent children to suffer as a result.

I've never seen anybody explain this in a way other than "it is what it is" basically. You have done the same.

I've read The Bible by the way (well, the Old Testament anyway... The New Testament didn't have the enough theatrics to keep me entertained). I couldn't find the answers to why innocent children suffer as a consequence of simply being born... Which chapter and verse will provide that answer?

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There was a programme about Sandhurst on several years ago where one training officer described that (wording changed due to i) lack of miliarty knowledge and ii) years since it was on but to give the gist of it) everyone ends up praying in the trenches.

If religion is used to provide reasonable comfort to the innocent child, as opposed to delusional hope or telling them they suffer because they hadn't said enough prayers, what is the harm? They may even become a morally stronger person, more charitable/kinder person because of it. Just means that roads are slightly busier on a Sunday morning and at other points in the week/year.

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Originally Posted by The Bloop

As a father of a severely disabled child I'm always fascinated with religious people's answers to these types of questions. Have yet to see an answer that gives a satisfactory explanation.

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Love is the answer, and I guess you supply it in bucket-loads :thumbup:

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Originally Posted by Heisenberg

"Why didn't God save him, you may ask..."

Not really, as I was more interested in why your God chose to create this planet and allow millions of innocent children to suffer as a result.

I've never seen anybody explain this in a way other than "it is what it is" basically. You have done the same.

I've read The Bible by the way (well, the Old Testament anyway... The New Testament didn't have the enough theatrics to keep me entertained). I couldn't find the answers to why innocent children suffer as a consequence of simply being born... Which chapter and verse will provide that answer?

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Why didn't you apply for the God job your always judging others from your heavenly keyboard .

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Originally Posted by Taunton Blue Genie

“Surely I was sinful at birth, / sinful from the time my mother conceived me” (Psalm 51:5). “Even from birth the wicked go astray; / from the womb they are wayward, spreading lies” (Psalm 58:3).

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I wonder what Lisvaneblue believes that means...

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Originally Posted by surge

There was a programme about Sandhurst on several years ago where one training officer described that (wording changed due to i) lack of miliarty knowledge and ii) years since it was on but to give the gist of it) everyone ends up praying in the trenches.

If religion is used to provide reasonable comfort to the innocent child, as opposed to delusional hope or telling them they suffer because they hadn't said enough prayers, what is the harm? They may even become a morally stronger person, more charitable/kinder person because of it. Just means that roads are slightly busier on a Sunday morning and at other points in the week/year.

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Sorry, you seem to have responded to the wrong post. Not sure of the relevance yours has to mine.

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Originally Posted by life on mars

Why didn't you apply for the God job your always judging others from your heavenly keyboard .

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Sounds like blasphemy to me. Go and repent.

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Originally Posted by Heisenberg

I wonder what Lisvaneblue believes that means...

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Do you reckon that plenty of people with faith believe the text that TBG posted? I don't, i know plenty of people with faith and most of them haven't a clue about what they purportedly believe . Generally, they're a bit of a contradiction, but decent people. The one thing i do envy about those with faith, is the belief that a loved one is in a 'better place' once they have died, and the fact that they believe that they'll be together again. That must bring plenty of comfort.

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Originally Posted by lisvaneblue

You are a hypocrite. The world is a bloody mess from our own making and you want to blame God. Try reading the passages below with an open mind. You might find it adds a dimension to your life

John. 1 verses 10-13

Matthew. 7 verses 10-13

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According to Christians, God is omnipresent and all powerful

If he is why doesn't he save starving children ?

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Originally Posted by Heisenberg

Sorry, you seem to have responded to the wrong post. Not sure of the relevance yours has to mine.

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I think that he's saying that when people are in the shit (Trenches) they get desperate (Praying) It doesn't have to be that extreme for me to sell out, i'd be willing to do a deal with Lucifer if i ran out of Custard Cream biscuits.

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Originally Posted by SLUDGE FACTORY

According to Christians, God is omnipresent and all powerful

If he is why doesn't he save starving children ?

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Why don't we.(.ie mankind) save starving children?

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Originally Posted by SLUDGE FACTORY

According to Christians, God is omnipresent and all powerful

If he is why doesn't he save starving children ?

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Because that's our job, apparently. God can't go around saving everyone, can he, that's a bit Disney super hero level. I don't believe in god (disclaimer again) but i do think that your notion is simplistic.

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Originally Posted by SLUDGE FACTORY

According to Christians, God is omnipresent and all powerful

If he is why doesn't he save starving children ?

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For a so called "loving God" he really is a game playing, sadistic fool.

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Originally Posted by UNDERHILL1927

For a so called "loving God" he really is a game playing, sadistic fool.

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Say that to his face, i dare you :hehe:

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Originally Posted by Tuerto

Do you reckon that plenty of people with faith believe the text that TBG posted? I don't, i know plenty of people with faith and most of them haven't a clue about what they purportedly believe . Generally, they're a bit of a contradiction, but decent people. The one thing i do envy about those with faith, is the belief that a loved one is in a 'better place' once they have died, and the fact that they believe that they'll be together again. That must bring plenty of comfort.

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This is what I genuinely struggle with. People can pick and choose what parts they believe from The Bible, yet it's supposedly God's words and therefore the ultimate truth.

I'm not having a go at people for choosing religion as a comfort... I'm not a complete t**t. What I am is resentful of a large percentage of religious people turning their eyes away from some of the facts that they don't wish to face because it doesn't suit their argument.

I think that's fair.

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Originally Posted by Tuerto

I think that he's saying that when people are in the shit (Trenches) they get desperate (Praying) It doesn't have to be that extreme for me to sell out, i'd be willing to do a deal with Lucifer if i ran out of Custard Cream biscuits.

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I think I've responded to this post in my previous post as well :thumbup:

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Originally Posted by Taunton Blue Genie

“Surely I was sinful at birth, / sinful from the time my mother conceived me” (Psalm 51:5). “Even from birth the wicked go astray; / from the womb they are wayward, spreading lies” (Psalm 58:3).

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David's psalms...you should read the background to them and then it may make sense.

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Originally Posted by Heisenberg

This is what I genuinely struggle with. People can pick and choose what parts they believe from The Bible, yet it's supposedly God's words and therefore the ultimate truth.

I'm not having a go at people for choosing religion as a comfort... I'm not a complete t**t. What I am is resentful of a large percentage of religious people turning their eyes away from some of the facts that they don't wish to face because it doesn't suit their argument.

I think that's fair.

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'God' breached copyright as a great many of the stories in The Bible were sourced from preceding religions.

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Originally Posted by lisvaneblue

David's psalms...you should read the background to them and then it may make sense.

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Tis all folklore. Very interesting in that respect but deities are for the birds.

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Originally Posted by Heisenberg

"Why didn't God save him, you may ask..."

Not really, as I was more interested in why your God chose to create this planet and allow millions of innocent children to suffer as a result.

I've never seen anybody explain this in a way other than "it is what it is" basically. You have done the same.

I've read The Bible by the way (well, the Old Testament anyway... The New Testament didn't have the enough theatrics to keep me entertained). I couldn't find the answers to why innocent children suffer as a consequence of simply being born... Which chapter and verse will provide that answer?

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Don't blame God for innocent children suffering, they are the worlds children and there is no reason why mankind should allow it.

The way the world is birth/life means pain, disease, sorrow and death for each of us. We are told these are the fruits of sin and we know, whether believers or not, that love, kindness, compassion, understanding, forgiveness and truth are the ways to overcome sin. And I'd add humour to that because it is uniquely human. But the greatest of these is love..

Whatever happened to truthpaste?

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Originally Posted by lisvaneblue

Don't blame God for innocent children suffering, they are the worlds children and there is no reason why mankind should allow it.

The way the world is birth/life means pain, disease, sorrow and death for each of us. We are told these are the fruits of sin and we know, whether believers or not, that love, kindness, compassion, understanding, forgiveness and truth are the ways to overcome sin. And I'd add humour to that because it is uniquely human. But the greatest of these is love..

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I don't blame him, I don't believe in him.

Once again, the answer I'm getting for 'why does God allow innocent children to suffer?' is "it is what it is" with a dose of it's not God's faults it's humanity's fault.

Please explain how it's mankind's fault for a baby dying of leukemia (for example)?

Hypothetically, how could mankind prevent it from ever happening - if we had the chance?

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Originally Posted by lisvaneblue

I don't want to come across as, to quote you...'Being a twat'. You ask a good question but an unrealistic one. We both know that there are forces for good and evil in this world. As an example most recently guards bashing the shit out of protesters in Russia. How can that be right but that's mans' doing not God's. So what do you want him to do in that situation? Kill the guards, some if not all might be good people forced into obeying orders?. Kill the protesters? Kill Putin?. ...and what would it solve anyhow. Man can sort this out if he chose to without divine intervention .

Jesus answer was to get in and mix it with those deemed to be 'bad people', he talked to them, ate with them. He believed there was good in everyone, and that we are all his ( God's) people.

I won't go on other than to ask those who will surely respond with some off the cuff comments to reflect first.

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How do you know that this bloke Jesus said these things ?

Or did these things

There is evidence , factual evidence that if you pour petrol on a bonfire the flames get bigger

Thats a fact

What factual evidence do you have that God exists ?

Its a belief and you are entitled to it but thats all it is

I like to believe I am a very good singer and should be in a heavy rock band but I am afraid its an opinion , many people think I sing like a poisoned cat

People say oh Jesus said there is good and bad in everyone and if we repent our sins we can join him in paradise

Did Hitler repent ?

If so he's in heaven ?

Thats not right is it ?

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Originally Posted by lisvaneblue

Don't blame God for innocent children suffering, they are the worlds children and there is no reason why mankind should allow it.

The way the world is birth/life means pain, disease, sorrow and death for each of us..

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If god is omnipotent and omnipresent he could stop it though.

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Originally Posted by lisvaneblue

Why don't we.(.ie mankind) save starving children?

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Many try to

Young newly qualified doctors travel to Africa to give medical aid to starving kids

Most people in the medical profession are not religious but still do good acts

Many people who go to church don't do anything to help the poor

But wether mankind , or some of it , tries to save starving children , why doesn't God , who Christians tell us is all powerful , omnipotent and benevolent to all and loves us all .......why doesn't he step in and help save the children ?

I fully accept faith gives people comfort but there is no evidence anyone comes back from the dead or there is eternal life for those that repent

No evidence

So when a couple on songs of praise say that the pandemic has 3 times stopped them getting married which has been difficult but it was God's will then I have to say what on earth are they talking about

Religion was the opiate of the masses hundreds of years ago , now we have science to guide us

Do religious people think God invented the covid virus and now he's decided to step in and provide a vaccine ?

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Originally Posted by surge

There was a programme about Sandhurst on several years ago where one training officer described that (wording changed due to i) lack of miliarty knowledge and ii) years since it was on but to give the gist of it) everyone ends up praying in the trenches.

If religion is used to provide reasonable comfort to the innocent child, as opposed to delusional hope or telling them they suffer because they hadn't said enough prayers, what is the harm? They may even become a morally stronger person, more charitable/kinder person because of it. Just means that roads are slightly busier on a Sunday morning and at other points in the week/year.

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I’ve always found it weird that people need religion to be more moral and kind. Does it even count if you’re doing it out of fear of some mad old **** who can’t even stop diabetes zapping you.

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Originally Posted by lisvaneblue

Don't blame God for innocent children suffering, they are the worlds children and there is no reason why mankind should allow it.

The way the world is birth/life means pain, disease, sorrow and death for each of us. We are told these are the fruits of sin and we know, whether believers or not, that love, kindness, compassion, understanding, forgiveness and truth are the ways to overcome sin. And I'd add humour to that because it is uniquely human. But the greatest of these is love..

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What about people who are kind , good and try to overcome sin and defeat evil but get run over by a bus at 29 , leaving behind a mother and a baby ?

Hes done what God asked and he's dead

Either god doesn't exist or God was asleep or God decided it was time for this bloke to die, as he's all powerful , isn't he ?

If he is he's pretty mean leaving a wife to look after a child alone

The problem with Christians is they take parts of the story they like .......a young boy left under rubble from an earthquake is found by rescuers after a week ......its a miracle .....its gods work !

But some bloke rapes and stabs women ......thats nothing to do with God, thats mankind

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Originally Posted by Croesy Blue

I’ve always found it weird that people need religion to be more moral and kind. Does it even count if you’re doing it out of fear of some mad old **** who can’t even stop diabetes zapping you.

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And bear in mind that most religions consider that non-believers do not migrate to their version of the afterlife.

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Originally Posted by lardy

Whatever happened to truthpaste?

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I hope he wasn't called up.

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Originally Posted by Taunton Blue Genie

And bear in mind that most religions consider that non-believers do not migrate to their version of the afterlife.

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That’s what I don’t get why would anyone worship someone that doesn’t care how good a person you’ve been but only if you’ve kissed his arse your hole life.

If there was a god and that was his system I’d rather say **** him and take my chances in hell.

I remember when my great nan died someone at the funeral said to my mam “she won’t go to heaven mind because she didn’t go to church” imagine being that much of a ****

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Originally Posted by Croesy Blue

That’s what I don’t get why would anyone worship someone that doesn’t care how good a person you’ve been but only if you’ve kissed his arse your hole life.

If there was a god and that was his system I’d rather say **** him and take my chances in hell.

I remember when my great nan died someone at the funeral said to my mam “she won’t go to heaven mind because she didn’t go to church” imagine being that much of a ****

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It's about indoctrination, infantilisation and spread by the conduits of empires. Don't take it seriously

I mean I said god can’t even zap away diabetes lets you know how seriously I take it :hehe: