Taking The Knee To Continue ?

By the way, they then use it to halt arguments in their steps at every stage by demanding a source or definition for everything. Very child like tactic which would prevent all human progress and invention if applied at all levels.

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Originally Posted by RonnieBird

Undergraduates are taught to list and reference their sources when constructing an essay. It’s a way of encouraging them to base their arguments and conclusions on something solid and questioning the basis of stuff which is is generally held to be so in society as a whole.

Unfortunately, they frequently take this to mean that no one can pass this stage of a “checklist “ and deal only with solid information through custom and habit.

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You know that referencing is normal in academia, don't you?

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Originally Posted by RonnieBird

No I didnt. I said exactly the opposite and emphasised that what I gave was an opinion which you are perfectly free to disagree with.

Of course you have no idea what I know and don’t know.

I get terribly tired of this thing where asking kids to provide sources when they’re new to higher education is misunderstood as something we must apply to all adult conversations and indeed all future thinking .

It’s actually just a kind of painting by numbers to get you on the ladder for your information, and it’s a pity if you get angry when someone disagrees with you really.

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Are you ****ing kidding me? YOU used the word “fact”. YOU even used the word “Marxist”. And also academics, even professors quote their sources to provide evidence of their claims. Basically to show their arguments are bullshit.

The world does not ****ing revolve around a certain group of people

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Originally Posted by SLUDGE FACTORY

I think the idiots booing are going to make themselves look like right racists . Which of course is what they are .

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Not all are not racists Sludgey, some of those that boo are against an out and out Marxist organisation! It's pathetic that multi-millionaire footballers take the knee to Marxists, when they would be among the first mutha****as up against the wall, if these dreadful people took over the country. A lot oppose BLM, as this organisation want to defund the police and our armed services and think that all white people are essentially bad

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Originally Posted by dembethewarrior

Affects me in no way whatsoever so if it was to carry on for eternity I'd have no issue with it, I'll be honest though I can't really see what it does.

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It causes conversations like this. Which is exactly its purpose. Long may it continue.

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Originally Posted by Mr Soul '68

Not all are not racists Sludgey, some of those that boo are against an out and out Marxist organisation! It's pathetic that multi-millionaire footballers take the knee to Marxists, when they would be among the first mutha****as up against the wall, if these dreadful people took over the country. A lot oppose BLM, as this organisation want to defund the police and our armed services and think that all white people are essentially bad

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Did you come to the conclusion that it's a Marxist organisation yourself?

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Originally Posted by RonnieBird

No I didnt. I said exactly the opposite and emphasised that what I gave was an opinion which you are perfectly free to disagree with.

Of course you have no idea what I know and don’t know.

I get terribly tired of this thing where asking kids to provide sources when they’re new to higher education is misunderstood as something we must apply to all adult conversations and indeed all future thinking .

It’s actually just a kind of painting by numbers to get you on the ladder for your information, and it’s a pity if you get angry when someone disagrees with you really.

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People I know but are not friends of mine are often on social media going on about booing the knee . I have known most of these people since school . They were racists then , as their parents were and they are racists now . They try and get into silly debates about it but people who know them know exactly what they are about . People on here say they don't agree with it and think its run its course and most recently I was beginning to think it was time to shelve it . But I can see it coming back stronger now . England get to their first final since 1966 and the talk is not about how well the team did but about racial abuse of black players . Its probably more relevant than ever .

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Originally Posted by RonnieBird

No I didnt. I said exactly the opposite and emphasised that what I gave was an opinion which you are perfectly free to disagree with.

Of course you have no idea what I know and don’t know.

I get terribly tired of this thing where asking kids to provide sources when they’re new to higher education is misunderstood as something we must apply to all adult conversations and indeed all future thinking .

It’s actually just a kind of painting by numbers to get you on the ladder for your information, and it’s a pity if you get angry when someone disagrees with you really.

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Originally Posted by Mr Soul '68

Not all are not racists Sludgey, some of those that boo are against an out and out Marxist organisation! It's pathetic that multi-millionaire footballers take the knee to Marxists, when they would be among the first mutha****as up against the wall, if these dreadful people took over the country. A lot oppose BLM, as this organisation want to defund the police and our armed services and think that all white people are essentially bad

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Don't be daft , someone who doesn't agree with the knee keeps quiet during the protest , not openly boo

Or organise counter protests like those tossers did down at Swansea, outside the stadium

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Originally Posted by Mr Soul '68

Not all are not racists Sludgey, some of those that boo are against an out and out Marxist organisation! It's pathetic that multi-millionaire footballers take the knee to Marxists, when they would be among the first mutha****as up against the wall, if these dreadful people took over the country. A lot oppose BLM, as this organisation want to defund the police and our armed services and think that all white people are essentially bad

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Course they are.

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Originally Posted by lardy

Did you come to the conclusion that it's a Marxist organisation yourself?

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There's enough information on there on the web and YouTube! Do your own homework

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Originally Posted by Mr Soul '68

There's enough information on there on the web and YouTube! Do your own homework

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YouTube :hehe:

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Originally Posted by Mr Soul '68

There's enough information on there on the web and YouTube! Do your own homework

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You're parroting it, aren't you?

If not, why do you think the footballers are supporting a Marxist organisation?

I’m hoping this political infestation of football doesn’t trickle down to club level to the extent that it has the international game.
I’m thinking that if that happens it’ll be impossible to enjoy the game and club for its own sake anymore.
It’s supposed to be a sport and an entertainment we can all share and escape the circular arguments of politics and hatred but if that’s gone it’s not for me anymore.

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Originally Posted by RonnieBird

No I didnt. I said exactly the opposite and emphasised that what I gave was an opinion which you are perfectly free to disagree with.

Of course you have no idea what I know and don’t know.

I get terribly tired of this thing where asking kids to provide sources when they’re new to higher education is misunderstood as something we must apply to all adult conversations and indeed all future thinking .

It’s actually just a kind of painting by numbers to get you on the ladder for your information, and it’s a pity if you get angry when someone disagrees with you really.

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Originally Posted by RonnieBird

I’m hoping this political infestation of football doesn’t trickle down to club level to the extent that it has the international game.
I’m thinking that if that happens it’ll be impossible to enjoy the game and club for its own sake anymore.
It’s supposed to be a sport and an entertainment we can all share and escape the circular arguments of politics and hatred but if that’s gone it’s not for me anymore.

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You can still enjoy football , just don't racially abuse people

You are clearly not a racist so carry on as you were

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Originally Posted by adz-a32

Are you ****ing kidding me? YOU used the word “fact”. YOU even used the word “Marxist”. And also academics, even professors quote their sources to provide evidence of their claims. Basically to show their arguments are bullshit.

The world does not ****ing revolve around a certain group of people

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Adz. Engaging with Internet trolls since 1996 and never learning.

Just don't respond.

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Originally Posted by adz-a32

YouTube :hehe:

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People still go to Facebook high, Google college and YouTube university 😂

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Originally Posted by dembethewarrior

Adz. Engaging with Internet trolls since 1996 and never learning.

Just don't respond.

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Noted bro :hehe: Hope you’re okay :thumbup:

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Originally Posted by adz-a32

Noted bro :hehe: Hope you’re okay :thumbup:

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Discussions are healthy.

Banging your head against your desk speaking to someone who is intentionally setting our to wind you up isn't.

Yes, all good. Same to you 👍

We have some fine, upstanding folk trying to defend the England football team from the Marxist hordes in this thread by pointing out that they, as old, white men, know more about being black in modern day Britain than the ten members of the twenty six man squad Gareth Southgate picked originally who I don't believe would have passed the "natural born Britons" test as advocated by one of those defending those who boo taking the knee.

This link (I know the Libertarians on here don't like such things, but I think it's relevant in this case) from a respected fact checking site attempts to answer the question as to whether BLM is a Marxist organisation or not and seems to me to come down on the side of saying it isn't.

https://www.politifact.com/article/2...xist-movement/

I'm sure that those trying to put the England football team right on things like this will note that the article is a year old and things have changed since then. They are right to some extent as well, more is known about BLM now, but the strange thing is that I don't recall any of them saying anything too much different back in May/June 2020 after the killing of George Floyd on the subject of race relations than they're doing now - surely, they're not just using the whole BLM controversy as a convenient means of trying to mask views they've always held are they?

If Welsh fans now boo the English national anthem or offer to shit on their side of the bridge is it deemed as a form of racism and hatred

Probably. Everyone seems determined to be offended by every childish remark or daft comment whether it has anything to do with them or not.

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Originally Posted by the other bob wilson

We have some fine, upstanding folk trying to defend the England football team from the Marxist hordes in this thread by pointing out that they, as old, white men, know more about being black in modern day Britain than the ten members of the twenty six man squad Gareth Southgate picked originally who I don't believe would have passed the "natural born Britons" test as advocated by one of those defending those who boo taking the knee.

This link (I know the Libertarians on here don't like such things, but I think it's relevant in this case) from a respected fact checking site attempts to answer the question as to whether BLM is a Marxist organisation or not and seems to me to come down on the side of saying it isn't.

https://www.politifact.com/article/2...xist-movement/

I'm sure that those trying to put the England football team right on things like this will note that the article is a year old and things have changed since then. They are right to some extent as well, more is known about BLM now, but the strange thing is that I don't recall any of them saying anything too much different back in May/June 2020 after the killing of George Floyd on the subject of race relations than they're doing now - surely, they're not just using the whole BLM controversy as a convenient means of trying to mask views they've always held are they?

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Thanks, I think the link is interesting. It seems the intellectual support for the view BLM is Marxist is drawn from conservative academics which I guess adds (fallaciously) to its appeal.

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Originally Posted by dembethewarrior

People still go to Facebook high, Google college and YouTube university ��

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That's clever and funny. I may pinch that if I may.

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Originally Posted by RonnieBird

Probably. Everyone seems determined to be offended by every childish remark or daft comment whether it has anything to do with them or not.

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Purely as a matter of interest Sir Jim, would you have the same degree of repugnance against an organisation which calls itself JLM?

Certainly if it had the same hidden agenda.

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Originally Posted by RonnieBird

Certainly if it had the same hidden agenda.

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What hidden agenda is that then? It can’t be that they’re Marxists, because people like you are always telling us about that one - it’s hardly hidden.

The problem with 'taking the knee' is that (1) it has been going on for too long, and (2) it only seems to be applied to football. Why don't all sports do it? I don't recall any rugby players doing it, and I certainly didn't see any tennis players at Wimbledon either. Nor golf, or motor racing, darts, snooker, or any other sport you can mention. Why only football? Do they think all fans are all low-life racists who need educating?
Like the public in general, the vast majority of football fans are not racist, and they are starting to resent being told that they are, every time a game kicks off. That's why people boo - not because they're racist, but because they're tired of being labelled as such.

This is worth a listen/watch

https://twitter.com/LBC/status/1414890418240729089

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Originally Posted by tforturton

The problem with 'taking the knee' is that (1) it has been going on for too long, and (2) it only seems to be applied to football. Why don't all sports do it? I don't recall any rugby players doing it, and I certainly didn't see any tennis players at Wimbledon either. Nor golf, or motor racing, darts, snooker, or any other sport you can mention. Why only football? Do they think all fans are all low-life racists who need educating?
Like the public in general, the vast majority of football fans are not racist, and they are starting to resent being told that they are, every time a game kicks off. That's why people boo - not because they're racist, but because they're tired of being labelled as such.

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It has happened in other sports

Lewis Hamilton does it as well

A lot of the people who boo are nailed on racists and the problem of racism in society and in football in particular has never gone away

Some racists change through education but some retain their moronic views and you only have to go on football websites to see how prevalent it is

I am not talking about people having a reasonable discussion as we are here , I am talking appalling levels of racist attitudes

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Originally Posted by neilw65

This is worth a listen/watch

https://twitter.com/LBC/status/1414890418240729089

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Hes nailed it

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Originally Posted by tforturton

The problem with 'taking the knee' is that (1) it has been going on for too long, and (2) it only seems to be applied to football. Why don't all sports do it? I don't recall any rugby players doing it, and I certainly didn't see any tennis players at Wimbledon either. Nor golf, or motor racing, darts, snooker, or any other sport you can mention. Why only football? Do they think all fans are all low-life racists who need educating?
Like the public in general, the vast majority of football fans are not racist, and they are starting to resent being told that they are, every time a game kicks off. That's why people boo - not because they're racist, but because they're tired of being labelled as such.

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How long is too long? Why shouldn't it last forever? Would we say the same about public service announcements decrying drink driving? Would we say they have gone on too long for example? They have slowly burned onto the collective consciousness the shame of drink driving, just like the Taking the Knee gesture is attempting to achieve the same with regard to racism.

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Originally Posted by neilw65

This is worth a listen/watch

https://twitter.com/LBC/status/1414890418240729089

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Absolutely brilliant! There's no hiding place from those comments. Perfectly summed up.

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Originally Posted by RonnieBird

if that’s gone it’s not for me anymore.

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Great stuff. Keep it up with the kneeling lads, it's working a treat

What a load of bollocks this thread is. We don't live in a football stadium, so taking the knee means nothing outside the world of football. People need to wake up and realise disagreeing with taking the knee is not being racist, it means (or certainly can mean) that its meaning has been eroded through continuous use.

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Originally Posted by Feedback

What a load of bollocks this thread is. We don't live in a football stadium, so taking the knee means nothing outside the world of football. People need to wake up and realise disagreeing with taking the knee is not being racist, it means (or certainly can mean) that its meaning has been eroded through continuous use.

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There are valid reasons for disagreeing with an anti-racism message?

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Originally Posted by Feedback

What a load of bollocks this thread is. We don't live in a football stadium, so taking the knee means nothing outside the world of football. People need to wake up and realise disagreeing with taking the knee is not being racist, it means (or certainly can mean) that its meaning has been eroded through continuous use.

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I beg to differ , everybody I encounter knows about taking the knee , mostvagree , some dont and some get foam mouthed

Plenty of people disagreeing with the knee are nailed on racists , they know it , they hate being called racists but only because they know that we know what they think

Feck em

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Originally Posted by Feedback

What a load of bollocks this thread is. We don't live in a football stadium, so taking the knee means nothing outside the world of football. People need to wake up and realise disagreeing with taking the knee is not being racist, it means (or certainly can mean) that its meaning has been eroded through continuous use.

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Doesn’t seem much of a reason to boo it mind.

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Originally Posted by Feedback

What a load of bollocks this thread is. We don't live in a football stadium, so taking the knee means nothing outside the world of football. People need to wake up and realise disagreeing with taking the knee is not being racist, it means (or certainly can mean) that its meaning has been eroded through continuous use.

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It’s working because this peaceful protest is keeping the scourge of racism in the spotlight, it certainly hasn’t been eroded, if anything these last few days it’s gained considerable strength. The booers are using it as cover to display their true feelings I believe, we're wise to it, it’s they who need to be eroded.

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Originally Posted by SLUDGE FACTORY

I beg to differ , everybody I encounter knows about taking the knee , mostvagree , some dont and some get foam mouthed

Plenty of people disagreeing with the knee are nailed on racists , they know it , they hate being called racists but only because they know that we know what they think

Feck em

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Well said Sludge

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Originally Posted by lardy

You're parroting it, aren't you?

If not, why do you think the footballers are supporting a Marxist organisation?

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Because most of them are thicker than pigshit, to be honest with you. Great as footballers, but not the brightest as people. Yeah, I know I am generalisng here, but a lot of them aren't that bright. Also I am pretty sure not many of them would be politically motivated enough to read and understand that BLM are essentially a Marxist organisation. They are just running with the pack