Target for no-one in Wales to use a gas boiler after 2030, climate change minister says

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by The Bloop

Could you post some links to this TRUE, REAL science you talk about so that we, the deluded masses, can all read about it please.
In the meantime I'm off to watch that documentary Capricorn One.

---

Here's one prediction that I'm sure I'll get right this weekend.

Ronnie won't be able to do this.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by RonnieBird

Why do you think I want to do that ?

---

It's not what you want, it's what you're doing - let's face it, it doesn't look like anyone is being won over by your "arguments" does it.

I dont know why some of you are bothering. Your arguing with someone who thinks a 23 year old who we have and has been on loan is a journeyman footballer😂😂

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Eric the Half a Bee

I'm looking forward to selling my valleys house and advertising it as having "sea views".

---

We've been able to across the Bristol Channel for years from my sister's house on the mountainside above Risca.
Maybe in a few years she'll be able to see across the Risca Bay.

If anyone wants to play 'Interactive: Climate time machine'; from NASA it's here: and seriously, this stuff is brilliant.

Just click on the graphic and will open into an interactive which allows you to slide across various measurements. I recommend the sea level one as a start. https://climate.nasa.gov/climate_res...-time-machine/

There is lots of cool (yet terrifying) stuff from NASA also linked on that page.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by lardy

This is at the heart of the matter for many conspiracy theorists*, a desire of some sort to appear intelligent by apparently knowing something most others don't.

The question they really need to ask themselves is how likely is it that I have discovered a truth just from sitting at home on my computer that billions of people, some more educated and hard working than me, haven't?

*"Climate change is made up so politicians can get rich" is a classic example of a conspiracy theory

---

Absolutely. And they somehow think that the Russians, the Chinese, the Americans and all the major countries around the world (and of very different political leanings) are able to conspire together. In a junior capacity I have attended many intergovernmental meetings and the representatives of some countries refuse to communicate between themselves. In the first meeting I ever attended I was placed in a position around the table away from the UK delegates and inbetween the government officials of two such countries merely to keep them apart.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by RonnieBird

I think you were the one being rude. Matters not. This thing about " why would they ...." shifts the onus onto the one who questions a suspicious act and it's a very old concept.

All I'm inviting you to do is look carefully into the thing yourself rather than listen to the climate changers OR me.
Make your own mind up on the facts rather than arguments and persuasion. Honestly I cant start arguing the toss with every person who's fallen for if because there are millions of them and most have a big element of "faith " in their reasoning.

This WILL be revealed in due course as bloody nonsense just like changing lead into gold, sailing off the edge of the world or 1930s racial purity "science" but that'll have to be a gradual process. It's not possible for me or anyone else without access to censoring news channels, "education " systems to convert the deluded masses one by one is it?
It's a state of mind/ pseudo religious belief and if it's wrong you can only come gradually to that by applying your own mind and testing the REAL science for yourself.

I hope you do but with respect all I can do is suggest you question what you've been told rather than get involved in a long running detailed debate with millions of mistaken people one by one.

---

I love the "do your own research" crowd.

No, I did Journalism as a degree and that was 20 odd years ago. I now do a job that's nothing to do with science in any way shape or form so I'm not going to "do my own research" (reading some websites and watching youtube videos)- I'm going to let the people who've dedicated their lives to the study of climate change continue to do the *actual* research, and if the overwhelming majority of them agree that the research shows the same thing I'm going to believe them. The arrogance to do otherwise is astounding.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by delmbox

I love the "do your own research" crowd.

No, I did Journalism as a degree and that was 20 odd years ago. I now do a job that's nothing to do with science in any way shape or form so I'm not going to "do my own research" (reading some websites and watching youtube videos)- I'm going to let the people who've dedicated their lives to the study of climate change continue to do the *actual* research, and if the overwhelming majority of them agree that the research shows the same thing I'm going to believe them. The arrogance to do otherwise is astounding.

---

I liked that he used examples of incorrect science from 100 years ago, 800 years ago and 2,000 years ago.

Alchemy, eh? They were wrong about that!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by delmbox

I love the "do your own research" crowd.

No, I did Journalism as a degree and that was 20 odd years ago. I now do a job that's nothing to do with science in any way shape or form so I'm not going to "do my own research" (reading some websites and watching youtube videos)- I'm going to let the people who've dedicated their lives to the study of climate change continue to do the *actual* research, and if the overwhelming majority of them agree that the research shows the same thing I'm going to believe them. The arrogance to do otherwise is astounding.

---

Spot on. :thumbup:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by tforturton

Electric cars, electric heating...the whole country is going electric. But we only just got through the last winter, with a number of 'very close' incidents, where demand exceeded supply - we were literally minutes away from major power cuts. We're going to need at least a dozen new power stations, running on.... Er, what, exactly?

---

Interesting, where was this reported?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by xsnaggle

They have to make electricity far moe affordable before they can even begin to think about this. And that won't be easy!

---

My energy is 100% green and, guess what, it was the cheapest tariff on the market. Saying that, I wouldn't want to switch the boiler over to electricity because it would be very expensive to run. I guess my house will have its own energy source (solar) by the time 2030 comes around, together with a storage battery, so it may then become a viable option.

I don’t mind Ronnie asking people to do their research on this topic since I wrote my thesis on climate change and the changing energy needs of the U.K.

Conclusion - he’s wrong and it’s real. Why anyone ever engages him is beyond me.

I’d much rather a massive infrastructure project be built across the Severn getting the tidal energy but that would be billions upon billions

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by WJ99mobile

I’d much rather a massive infrastructure project be built across the Severn getting the tidal energy but that would be billions upon billions

---

I would love the barrage to be built. Yes it would cost billions but it could generate enough power for the whole of wales and then some.

The latest proposals seem really good.

I would also stick a road across it as well to make it easier to get to north Devon, or Bristol Airport.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by the other bob wilson

It's not what you want, it's what you're doing - let's face it, it doesn't look like anyone is being won over by your "arguments" does it.

---

Oh they certainly are, and there’s a whole discrete culture of senior scientists and ethical public servants who are very well aware of the realities.
In the end the truth is the truth and it will out. That’s what will ultimately matter but in the mean time people will believe what they believe whether it’s man made climate change or jackal headed monsters endangering the world from the land of the dead.

I can’t argue with irrational beliefs based on what people have been told and believed rather than understanding the way power brokers carry on behind closed doors fabricating schemes , ( because they do and that’s not a guess based on internet articles ), or understanding the plain empirical testable science as opposed to a fiddled politically motivated version they’ve been teaching kids in a state education system for many many decades.

Of course they believe what their teachers , who got it from the same place and also believe it, told them about in school. They sat and passed exams in what they were told and now they think they’re the experts . You also think they’re the experts just as people believed the “educated” classes of Ancient Egypt were the experts in Jackal headed creatures and how to supply the dead with what they needed to go on a voyage in the next world to protect and guide the living.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by LeningradCowboy

https://www.walesonline.co.uk/news/w...ilers-21344951

There is a target for gas boilers to be abandoned in Wales with no-one using one by 2030, climate change minister Julie James has said.

---

Good,

We might not achieve this but we need to have really ambitious targets.


I wonder if "energy security" is also part of the thinking, as if we don't need gas, or as much gas in the country then we aren't in danger of other countries suddenly turning off their gas pipes.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by RonnieBird

Oh they certainly are, and there’s a whole discrete culture of senior scientists and ethical public servants who are very well aware of the realities.
In the end the truth is the truth and it will out. That’s what will ultimately matter but in the mean time people will believe what they believe whether it’s man made climate change or jackal headed monsters endangering the world from the land of the dead.

I can’t argue with irrational beliefs based on what people have been told and believed rather than understanding the way power brokers carry on behind closed doors fabricating schemes , ( because they do and that’s not a guess based on internet articles ), or understanding the plain empirical testable science as opposed to a fiddled politically motivated version they’ve been teaching kids in a state education system for many many decades.

Of course they believe what their teachers , who got it from the same place and also believe it, told them about in school. They sat and passed exams in what they were told and now they think they’re the experts . You also think they’re the experts just as people believed the “educated” classes of Ancient Egypt were the experts in Jackal headed creatures and how to supply the dead with what they needed to go on a voyage in the next world to protect and guide the living.

---

**** off. You are a weapons-grade moron.

Just a reminder that Walesbales/ronniebird didn’t think Covid would be a problem either. He was wrong about that and he is wrong about climate change.

If you ever think it’s worth engaging with him just look at the first page of the Covid thread, realise he thinks he knows everything from reading a few other forums and then once proven wrong is as disingenuous as ever. It’s a waste of time bothering with him.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by az city

**** off. You are a weapons-grade moron.

---

So many words without actually saying anything at all :hehe:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Croesy Blue

Just a reminder that Walesbales/ronniebird didn’t think Covid would be a problem either. He was wrong about that and he is wrong about climate change.

If you ever think it’s worth engaging with him just look at the first page of the Covid thread, realise he thinks he knows everything from reading a few other forums and then once proven wrong is as disingenuous as ever. It’s a waste of time bothering with him.

---

Didn’t say anything like that about Covid.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by az city

**** off. You are a weapons-grade moron.

---

Ok. That’s your opinion and it’s up to you.
I think there’s a deep reason that you get angry about anyone thinking differently though - bit scared inside that you might have been conned but can’t face it ?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by RonnieBird

Didn’t say anything like that about Covid.

---

Page one of the thread just under your wales bales name. It was moronic at the time, it looks worse with hindsight. Especially as you were parroting exactly the same smug bollocks you are in this thread.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Rjk

Good,

We might not achieve this but we need to have really ambitious targets.


I wonder if "energy security" is also part of the thinking, as if we don't need gas, or as much gas in the country then we aren't in danger of other countries suddenly turning off their gas pipes.

---

Even if the target is met, what difference will it make? Wouldn't we be better off spending the money trying to mitigate the effects of more extreme weather, rising sea levels, etc?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by LeningradCowboy

Even if the target is met, what difference will it make? Wouldn't we be better off spending the money trying to mitigate the effects of more extreme weather, rising sea levels, etc?

---

Tend to agree. Seems to be us shouldering the burden more than anyone

Maybe that’s fair, but selfishly I’d prefer to futureproof ourselves as you’ve said above

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by LeningradCowboy

Even if the target is met, what difference will it make? Wouldn't we be better off spending the money trying to mitigate the effects of more extreme weather, rising sea levels, etc?

---

Yeah. Starving people , homeless, refugees etc etc ad inf.
Thousands of more immediate and real threats to humanity and nature, which they can’t or won’t address, but they claim they’re spending your money on something which doesn’t really exist and they couldn’t fix even if it did. We won’t see the outcome of their pretend battle with the weather for 500 years so they won’t be around to explain.


See, that’s one reason for it and governments really DO that kind of stuff.

Not a mad fanciful conspiracy theory but plain common sense.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Croesy Blue

Page one of the thread just under your wales bales name. It was moronic at the time, it looks worse with hindsight. Especially as you were parroting exactly the same smug bollocks you are in this thread.

---

Great point except for the small fact that I’m not Wales Bales.
Unfortunately that’s another thing you “know” but ain’t actually so, and that tends to put your calculations out a bit.

Btw we’ve been through this a long time ago and the board management have confirmed that I’ve never posted from within 250 miles of WB, completely different I.p and everything else.

Doesn’t match your belief system though, does it - so why would a thing like that interfere with your conclusions?

Also, why not take the opportunity to tell us what the various sources of heat energy other than the sun are available to the earth, how we create the new energy for climate change rather than convert a finite and diminishing amount of basis energy into heat and explain the calculation of how much heat energy would be needed to warm the mass and volume of the planet earth and its atmosphere rather than the latter cooling and dispersing that energy ?

It’s an easy bit of math, so have a go.

Clue for you Croeso.
We could theoretically do that, but we’d have to create so many nuclear fissions ( which before you get exited involves releasing trapped atomic energy which was solar in origin) simultaneously that we’d knock the earth off its axis .

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by RonnieBird

Ok. That’s your opinion and it’s up to you.
I think there’s a deep reason that you get angry about anyone thinking differently though - bit scared inside that you might have been conned but can’t face it ?

---

I'm not angry. I pity you.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by RonnieBird

Btw we’ve been through this a long time ago and the board management have confirmed that I’ve never posted from within 250 miles of WB, completely different I.p and everything else.

Doesn’t match your belief system though, does it - so why would a thing like that interfere with your conclusions?

Also, why not take the opportunity to tell us what the various sources of heat energy other than the sun are available to the earth, how we create the new energy for climate change rather than convert a finite and diminishing amount of basis energy into heat and explain the calculation of how much heat energy would be needed to warm the mass and volume of the planet earth and its atmosphere rather than the latter cooling and dispersing that energy ?

It’s an easy bit of math, so have a go.

---

I think this one's from the DC Comics circa 1938 when Krypton was destroyed by a Supernova. If you've got an original it'll be worth a fortune.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by RonnieBird

Clue for you Croeso.
We could theoretically do that, but we’d have to create so many nuclear fissions ( which before you get exited involves releasing trapped atomic energy which was solar in origin) simultaneously that we’d knock the earth off its axis .

---

This one could be when Superman spins the world backwards in order to go back in time. It's embarrassing at ComicCons to hear fans try and defend the science of this one as it's widely regarded as being one of the worst Superman film storylines. Interestingly though, the head of DC Comics apparently sanctioned it at the time. I think he was nobbled.

Some very learned and scientific arguments there !

And there was me thinking you’d just repeated what someone n TV told you.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by RonnieBird

Btw we’ve been through this a long time ago and the board management have confirmed that I’ve never posted from within 250 miles of WB, completely different I.p and everything else.

Doesn’t match your belief system though, does it - so why would a thing like that interfere with your conclusions?

Also, why not take the opportunity to tell us what the various sources of heat energy other than the sun are available to the earth, how we create the new energy for climate change rather than convert a finite and diminishing amount of basis energy into heat and explain the calculation of how much heat energy would be needed to warm the mass and volume of the planet earth and its atmosphere rather than the latter cooling and dispersing that energy ?

It’s an easy bit of math, so have a go.

---

You right wing libertarian type "free thinkers" crack me up at times. A true free thinker would be able to consider all of the sides and nuances of an argument before deciding on which side of it to take because they wouldn't be bound by things such as political dogma like most of us mere mortals are. A true free thinker would have the capacity to get me to say "well, I wasn't expecting that from them" quite often and, quite likely, would have the power to get me to reconsider my own opinions at times.

Contrast that with the "free thinkers" we have on here like yourself. Until this thread, I was able to see your name put to a post on a non footballing subject which impacts on our "culture war" driven society and know exactly what was coming. It's not just you, there are a few on here who fall into the same, narrowly defined category - all of those millions and millions of possibilities around for a true free thinker to consider and yet the CCMB free thinkers always think the same thing with their right wing tick lists :hehe:

I said until this thread earlier, because, I confess, you have surprised me this time around, but only because of the complete and utter feebleness of your "argument". The "I would explain it to you, but you're too thick to understand" line is the sort of thing I would have expected from my nephew and nieces about fifteen years ago when they were pre teens - as someone else who can be guilty of typing twelve words when two will do, I think I have grown pretty good at spotting BS which takes up a lot of space, but doesn't actually say anything when I see it, but, then again, given the number of others who have you figured out in this thread, I didn't need to be particularly good to recognise it this time.

One last thing, if you really are old enough to have seen Ronnie Bird play for us, I can only assume that you were taught by the only teacher in the UK who specialised in mathematic at that time - why use the twee Americanism "math" otherwise?

“I can’t teach you anything,I can just ask you to think” -Socrates ( not the footballer , just another one if these stupid teenage types like your nephews I expect).
More people in the world say Mathematic as opposed to what you say I’m afraid, but I’m sure you know what it means and maybe you should consider that some people might develop their knowledge of that subject beyond a brief acquaintance with it in their first school. Actually, I’m old enough that some of the teachers in my Grammar School insisted that the word “shown” was spelled “shewn”,and would smack you on the head for using the word “nice” to mean anything except “exact”, but I’ve probably moved on a bit since then.

I spoke very differently then too and thought London was a long way. I’d not yet spoken with three US Presidents and two British P.Ms, obtained a doctorate from Oxford or lots of other stuff which wasn’t centred in Tonypandy. Thus I’m a different person now in many ways and I’m terribly sorry if you don’t like that.

Hey, I’ve read your football blog, so it’s odd to hear you accusing me of verbosity or ineffective use of language,but again that’s okay.

No, I’m not going to try and have a technical or philosophical debate with SOME people here ( not you ), who don’t know the difference between a simile and a banjo and think the Magna Carta is a kind of ice cream bar but I’ve tried to tempt them into thinking about stuff a bit. Can’t do more I’m afraid.


You obviously don’t like any of this stuff or the fact that not everyone is quite like you. Not my fault I’m sorry and I honestly think that’s your prejudice not mine. Bottom line is that this is why it’s naive of me to attempt certain conversations here and that’s entirely my fault because I should have learned to accept that years ago.

Trouble is you see that if no one had ever drawn me into the wonderful possibilities of this huge world then I’d definitely still be in the same limited and localised mindset, and so I’ll risk upsetting people as long as there are those who’ll use the lifeline.

The word 'nice' has had the meaning of pleasant for the last 250 years and it originally meant ignorant in the 13th century. It meant precise for a period in the 16th century so maybe your Grammar School teacher was rather out of touch.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by RonnieBird

“I can’t teach you anything,I can just ask you to think” -Socrates ( not the footballer , just another one if these stupid teenage types like your nephews I expect).
More people in the world say Mathematic as opposed to what you say I’m afraid, but I’m sure you know what it means and maybe you should consider that some people might develop their knowledge of that subject beyond a brief acquaintance with it in their first school. Actually, I’m old enough that some of the teachers in my Grammar School insisted that the word “shown” was spelled “shewn”,and would smack you on the head for using the word “nice” to mean anything except “exact”, but I’ve probably moved on a bit since then.

I spoke very differently then too and thought London was a long way. I’d not yet spoken with three US Presidents and two British P.Ms, obtained a doctorate from Oxford or lots of other stuff which wasn’t centred in Tonypandy. Thus I’m a different person now in many ways and I’m terribly sorry if you don’t like that.

Hey, I’ve read your football blog, so it’s odd to hear you accusing me of verbosity or ineffective use of language,but again that’s okay.

No, I’m not going to try and have a technical or philosophical debate with SOME people here ( not you ), who don’t know the difference between a simile and a banjo and think the Magna Carta is a kind of ice cream bar but I’ve tried to tempt them into thinking about stuff a bit. Can’t do more I’m afraid.


You obviously don’t like any of this stuff or the fact that not everyone is quite like you. Not my fault I’m sorry and I honestly think that’s your prejudice not mine. Bottom line is that this is why it’s naive of me to attempt certain conversations here and that’s entirely my fault because I should have learned to accept that years ago.

Trouble is you see that if no one had ever drawn me into the wonderful possibilities of this huge world then I’d definitely still be in the same limited and localised mindset, and so I’ll risk upsetting people as long as there are those who’ll use the lifeline.

---

Again, although your superiority complex shines through, it’s just plenty of words, with
nothing said. If you’ve really met all of those Presidents and Prime Ministers, you’d have hoped they’d passed more on to you than a right wing check list, so you can all say exactly the same things.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Taunton Blue Genie

The word 'nice' has had the meaning of pleasant for the last 250 years and it originally meant ignorant in the 13th century. It meant precise for a period in the 16th century so maybe your Grammar School teacher was rather out of touch.

---

No doubt he was Taunton. That was somewhat the point.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by goats

Nevermind that, we all need to get out in our gardens and dig, dig trenches 3 metres deep and as long as possible to put pipes in to source the heat we all need. So forget the bar you built, the new patio or decking, up it comes, get digging. You just need a small room then to house the components needed to sort that heat to run your your house….and about 10/20 grand. It’s no problem Shirley?
Come on, get digging we’ve got 8 yrs….to save mankind

---

New build housing site up Tonyrefail has no gas, heat comes from holes dug underground and they have electric car charging ports on every drive.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by WJ99mobile

An arbitrary date with no appreciation of the complexities of the changes, time to reskill etc

Definitely can see 2030 new homes being fitted with no gas boilers but retrospective changes are pie in the sky

---

There's one up Tonyrefail already

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Croesy Blue

I don’t mind Ronnie asking people to do their research on this topic since I wrote my thesis on climate change and the changing energy needs of the U.K.

Conclusion - he’s wrong and it’s real. Why anyone ever engages him is beyond me.

---

Its quite funny and sad at the same time watching people get embroiled in these online wars.