IF Drakeford says...

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Originally Posted by Hilts

Tomorrow's game should be played in front of a crowd.

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Would we come back on Saturday though if we got ‘ammered?

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Originally Posted by J R Hartley

Yes, drunk on power.

All along he has played politics to be different to England. Look at me, I’m calling the shots in Wales.

For all their faults, and there are way too many, at least the Tories give a shit about the economy and keeping the wheels of industry turning.

Here in Wales it’s head in the sand worrying about covid even though the vaccine has been rolled out and no thought for the economy, mental health, people missing appointments and operations for other issues.etc

Putting in illogical restrictions which are having little impact on infection but a big impact on the economy of Wales.

Nevermind it has a survival rate of 99.7% and probably higher the more we get vaccinated, let’s just do all we can to protect a tiny fraction of the population of having a few more years on an already long life whilst we ignore the damage it’s doing to our children’s futures. Teenagers and young adults will be the ones to pay for these decisions for many years to come, probably the rest of their lives.

England are now past the peak of Omnicrom, where was the big NHS collapse that Drakeford warned about? Even with all the data and all the reports from those further into the variant than we are saying it was mild he still won’t row back and lose face, blaming this variable, or that variable. I’m surprised the guy can cross the road by the time he takes into account the chances of being run over and the variables to consider.

Ironically, for all his posturing and showing Wales are independent of Westminster he’s probably set Welsh independence back decades.

Governed by the most corrupt, dishonest, shameless government on one side and Dictator Drakeford on the other. Oh what a time to be a Welshman living in Wales.

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I like this….have you been listening to one of my rants outside my kids school? :hehe:

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Originally Posted by J R Hartley

Ironically, for all his posturing and showing Wales are independent of Westminster he’s probably set Welsh independence back decades.

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Not sure what you're basing this on, support for Welsh Independence has surged in the last two years

https://www.npr.org/2021/05/03/99320...=1642102287294

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/u...-b1812241.html

I don't think these current restrictions would turn that on its head

Scrapped in two weeks https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-politics-59984873

all good to go for the rugby six nations

https://www.walesonline.co.uk/sport/...eford-22747787

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Originally Posted by delmbox

Not sure what you're basing this on, support for Welsh Independence has surged in the last two years

https://www.npr.org/2021/05/03/99320...=1642102287294

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/u...-b1812241.html

I don't think these current restrictions would turn that on its head

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This board's a bit out of step when it comes to support for devolution/independence etc

I assume it's because of the age profile

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Originally Posted by City123

This board's a weird anomaly in many ways when it comes to support for devolution/independence etc

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I'd love to know what sample of the population are involved in these polls. A genuine independence vote would be really interesting. Only then would we get a true picture and I suspect the turnout would be less than great.

Does this mean that there will be crowsds for the forest game?

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Originally Posted by delmbox

Not sure what you're basing this on, support for Welsh Independence has surged in the last two years

https://www.npr.org/2021/05/03/99320...=1642102287294

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/u...-b1812241.html

I don't think these current restrictions would turn that on its head

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How many people polled? And where? Is it a large sample size across the whole country? North and South?

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Originally Posted by City123

This board's a bit out of step when it comes to support for devolution/independence etc

I assume it's because of the age profile

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Who says I don’t support it?

It’s just my opinion that Drakeford and his draconian
rules and dictatorship style would not have appealed to the less informed, average Welsh voter.

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Originally Posted by The Lone Gunman

I'd love to know what sample of the population are involved in these polls. A genuine independence vote would be really interesting. Only then would we get a true picture and I suspect the turnout would be less than great.

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There's a Cardiff uni blog that regularly posted the full results with demographic breakdown etc, I don't know if they still do it

I imagine people said similar in Scotland for a while and probably the same about a referendum on leaving the EU. Would turnout be low? To get to a referendum there'd have to be a strong enough level of support for it so there'd be motivation on both sides. You can point to the devolution referendums but they were small fry, especially compared to breaking away from the UK state entirely. I imagine turnout would be quite high as we saw in Scotland & with Brexit.

Does polling mean independence is around the corner? No, that was a sharp rise which I imagine is fairly soft. However there has been consistent support for greater powers for some time, it's quite surprising how quickly anti-devolution sentiment melted away.

Edit: Here's that blog: https://blogs.cardiff.ac.uk/electionsinwales/

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Originally Posted by Armitage Shanks

Does this mean that there will be crowsds for the forest game?

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Depends how bloody minded Drakeford is. He could open up a whole weekend of sport if he says from Fri Jan 28th, or piss everyone off if he says from Monday Jan 31st.

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Originally Posted by J R Hartley

Who says I don’t support it?

It’s just my opinion that Drakeford and his draconian
rules and dictatorship style would not have appealed to the less informed, average Welsh voter.

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I didn't mean you in particular, just the board generally

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Originally Posted by MOZZER2

all good to go for the rugby six nations

https://www.walesonline.co.uk/sport/...eford-22747787

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Of course…never in doubt

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Originally Posted by City123

You can point to the devolution referendums but they were small fry, especially compared to breaking away from the UK state entirely.

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And there's the rub. What percentage of the Welsh population would genuinely want to break away from the UK? I believe it would be very small. Plaid Cymru's share of the vote in Wales is consistently small - just 10% in the last general election. I think that paints a truer picture than any polls. I'm sure a reasonable percentage of people would like Wales to have a greater level of autonomy, but outright independence? I don't believe there is a widespread appetite for that despite the shambles at Westminster.

I’m sure it will continue to rise if we have many more English Tory governments- who are now the UKIP party by another name. They are dragging us into a banana republic.

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Originally Posted by Dave Blue

I’m sure it will continue to rise if we have many more English Tory governments- who are now the UKIP party by another name. They are dragging us into a banana republic.

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:hehe::hehe::hehe:

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Originally Posted by J R Hartley

Yes, drunk on power.

All along he has played politics to be different to England. Look at me, I’m calling the shots in Wales.

For all their faults, and there are way too many, at least the Tories give a shit about the economy and keeping the wheels of industry turning.

Here in Wales it’s head in the sand worrying about covid even though the vaccine has been rolled out and no thought for the economy, mental health, people missing appointments and operations for other issues.etc

Putting in illogical restrictions which are having little impact on infection but a big impact on the economy of Wales.

Nevermind it has a survival rate of 99.7% and probably higher the more we get vaccinated, let’s just do all we can to protect a tiny fraction of the population of having a few more years on an already long life whilst we ignore the damage it’s doing to our children’s futures. Teenagers and young adults will be the ones to pay for these decisions for many years to come, probably the rest of their lives.

England are now past the peak of Omnicrom, where was the big NHS collapse that Drakeford warned about? Even with all the data and all the reports from those further into the variant than we are saying it was mild he still won’t row back and lose face, blaming this variable, or that variable. I’m surprised the guy can cross the road by the time he takes into account the chances of being run over and the variables to consider.

Ironically, for all his posturing and showing Wales are independent of Westminster he’s probably set Welsh independence back decades.

Governed by the most corrupt, dishonest, shameless government on one side and Dictator Drakeford on the other. Oh what a time to be a Welshman living in Wales.

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Absolutely staggering view.

And bollocks.

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Originally Posted by Eric the Half a Bee

Absolutely staggering view.

And bollocks.

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Crawl back under your rock you pillbug.

If it was left to the likes of you we would all be locked down and all out of a job.

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Originally Posted by J R Hartley

Yes, drunk on power.

All along he has played politics to be different to England. Look at me, I’m calling the shots in Wales.

For all their faults, and there are way too many, at least the Tories give a shit about the economy and keeping the wheels of industry turning.

Here in Wales it’s head in the sand worrying about covid even though the vaccine has been rolled out and no thought for the economy, mental health, people missing appointments and operations for other issues.etc

Putting in illogical restrictions which are having little impact on infection but a big impact on the economy of Wales.

Nevermind it has a survival rate of 99.7% and probably higher the more we get vaccinated, let’s just do all we can to protect a tiny fraction of the population of having a few more years on an already long life whilst we ignore the damage it’s doing to our children’s futures. Teenagers and young adults will be the ones to pay for these decisions for many years to come, probably the rest of their lives.

England are now past the peak of Omnicrom, where was the big NHS collapse that Drakeford warned about? Even with all the data and all the reports from those further into the variant than we are saying it was mild he still won’t row back and lose face, blaming this variable, or that variable. I’m surprised the guy can cross the road by the time he takes into account the chances of being run over and the variables to consider.

Ironically, for all his posturing and showing Wales are independent of Westminster he’s probably set Welsh independence back decades.

Governed by the most corrupt, dishonest, shameless government on one side and Dictator Drakeford on the other. Oh what a time to be a Welshman living in Wales.

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Spot on.
Same as the booze tax fiasco.

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Originally Posted by City123

This board's a bit out of step when it comes to support for devolution/independence etc

I assume it's because of the age profile

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Possibly, but there still hasn't been any vote in Welsh history I'm aware of that has shown a majority in favour of independence (or where Plaid have got the most votes). Given what was being said in the year prior to the vote, Plaid Cymru's performance in the election last May has to be viewed as disappointing.

For myself, I've never been closer to backing an independent Wales in my life, but still have this feeling that a vote for Plaid is a wasted one and a possible way of letting the Tories take control of the Senedd - maybe there are thousands in Wales who feel like this?

I don’t know anyone who wants an independent Wales….it’s bad enough as it is with the plaid Labour love in

just heard on the TV that Wales are lifting the restrictions in 2 weeks, I can only guess thats in time for the 6 nations ? ? ? ?

or maybe Drakeford has had a twinge of guilt ???

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Originally Posted by Wash DC Blue

Spot on.
Same as the booze tax fiasco.

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Its not even a tax! Just more profit for the likes of Tesco, Asda.etc

If the "tax" went towards programmes and support for addiction then fair enough but the extra money just stays with the seller!?!?!

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Originally Posted by blue matt

just heard on the TV that Wales are lifting the restrictions in 2 weeks, I can only guess thats in time for the 6 nations ? ? ? ?

or maybe Drakeford has had a twinge of guilt ???

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Backhander

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Originally Posted by Eric the Half a Bee

Absolutely staggering view.

And bollocks.

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I think it's a fair view to hold.

It's only a few in the Drakeford circle that will know how true it really it but arguments could be made from both sides.

He's damned if he does damned if he doesn't with some of you. Cases have halved in the last week (2300-1200 https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-wales-politics-59984873) and if he didn't lift restrictions it'd be all "DRIPFORD THE DICTATOR DRUNK ON POWER, THOSE POOR PUBS "

Being that he's saying a significant drop in cases means a drop in restrictions, which has literally been the policy for almost two years, it's 'OH YEAH, HE'S DROPPING RESTRICTIONS JUST FOR THE RUGBY WHAT A SURPRISE" even though that means that the hospitality sector you pretend to care so much about won't miss out on millions of pounds

The man's not perfect but it's ridiculous

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Originally Posted by J R Hartley

How many people polled? And where? Is it a large sample size across the whole country? North and South?

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I don't know to be honest. I also don't think that if there were a vote on independence any time soon that the Yes vote would get anywhere near it, but to say that he's set the movement back a decade is just plain wrong

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Originally Posted by J R Hartley

Crawl back under your rock you pillbug.

If it was left to the likes of you we would all be locked down and all out of a job.

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Nonsense.

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Originally Posted by the other bob wilson

Possibly, but there still hasn't been any vote in Welsh history I'm aware of that has shown a majority in favour of independence (or where Plaid have got the most votes). Given what was being said in the year prior to the vote, Plaid Cymru's performance in the election last May has to be viewed as disappointing.

For myself, I've never been closer to backing an independent Wales in my life, but still have this feeling that a vote for Plaid is a wasted one and a possible way of letting the Tories take control of the Senedd - maybe there are thousands in Wales who feel like this?

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Indeed. Most of Wales is still more interested in keeping the Tories out.

In the first few months of 2020, opinion polls suggested things were close between Labour and the Tories. One poll had the Conservatives ahead early on in the first lockdown. Then support for them plummetted.

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Originally Posted by WJ99mobile

I think it's a fair view to hold.

It's only a few in the Drakeford circle that will know how true it really it but arguments could be made from both sides.

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I disagreed with banning large crowds from sporting events. I'm generally happy with people trying to get on with their lives as long as people take enough care to avoid potentially spreading Covid as possible, particularly when rates are high.

If rates are high enough to be causing staff shortages for our essential services and there is too much strain on those, particularly the NHS, then actions have to be taken to avoid even more serious problems. Those actions should always be governed by scientific expertise.

What I don't agree with is letting the virus run rife around the population because it's just a "cold". It isn't.

It's weird. If history tells us anything, the political landscape can change dramatically from the perceived status quo. I remember when the SNP were portrayed as right nationalist nutjobs and that Labour would never lose in Scotland. If Plaid Cymru can get their sh*t together and front the party with the right leader that'll appeal to predominantly English-speaking Welsh people, then they could trounce Labour in a heartbeat.

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Originally Posted by the other bob wilson

Possibly, but there still hasn't been any vote in Welsh history I'm aware of that has shown a majority in favour of independence (or where Plaid have got the most votes). Given what was being said in the year prior to the vote, Plaid Cymru's performance in the election last May has to be viewed as disappointing.

For myself, I've never been closer to backing an independent Wales in my life, but still have this feeling that a vote for Plaid is a wasted one and a possible way of letting the Tories take control of the Senedd - maybe there are thousands in Wales who feel like this?

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Supporting more devolution/independence doesn't necessarily mean you support Plaid though

I don't buy that 33% of Wales want independence but delmbox is right, Drakeford hasn't set them back a decade. On devolution, years of polling show solid support for more powers and it's backed by most Labour voters too

The way the Senedd is set up makes it very unlikely the Tories will be in power in Wales anytime soom

I’d be more than happy to consider independence, particularly as my boy is a Welsh speaker and I’m learning, However, nobody has ever given me a compelling argument from a fiscal perspective. ( yes I know we have loads of water :hehe:)

Can anybody give a balanced view?

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economy_of_Wales

The man is a spineless prick. I fully stand behind the hatred being thrown at him for the recent disproportionate crowd ban at sports games.

Spare a thought for the others being punished by this loon aswell. Another 4 week ban on my sister and residents of her care home being able to see their families. Lots of staff tested positive, but no patients did. So public health wales backed by drakeford and Co decided that must mean that the outbreak came from within the home (would love to see the reasoning). These vermin aren't following the sensible science, lockdown has now become their default. We needed lockdowns last year, this current set are just a comfort blanket for the braindead.

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Originally Posted by the other bob wilson

Possibly, but there still hasn't been any vote in Welsh history I'm aware of that has shown a majority in favour of independence (or where Plaid have got the most votes). Given what was being said in the year prior to the vote, Plaid Cymru's performance in the election last May has to be viewed as disappointing.

For myself, I've never been closer to backing an independent Wales in my life, but still have this feeling that a vote for Plaid is a wasted one and a possible way of letting the Tories take control of the Senedd - maybe there are thousands in Wales who feel like this?

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As someone with 95% 'Welsh blood', I regret I find the welsh more parochial and self -obsessed than any of the other home nations. The local news is cringe-worthy, with all those 'experts' in their political field spouting the Senydd mantra for then. The National Newspaper of Wales is a joke, and the local rag is even worse - no serious critique, no counter-debate, dreadful schoolboy editorials. And now Labour & Plaid are in coalition [don't let them kid you otherwise], you have effectively the end of any democracy in Wales. Read the news - from across the border - you won't get it here - train/bus companies wanting to invest in factories in Wales being virtually told to get lost. Motorway schemes turned down to be replaced by 2 extra train stations in Newport. New homes in Wales increasing by up to 10% compared with England. Extra taxes, and when UK GOV. cuts income tax by 2% in April, you bet Wales will do it by 1%. The Wife nearly froze to death on a train from Carmathen back to Cardiff yesterday as the train didn't have any heating, or hot drinks. I call it a train, actually they're 40yr old converted diesil trams.
Working in the public sector I'm sure has been worthwhile and rewarding, but I'll be frank - work in the private sector and you'll possibly have a different outlook.
This isn't Party politics - I don't vote for this party or that one, I just have my views on a few things that may affect me, but we've been given 'independence' in all but name, and talentless, liberal, uninspiring Welshies are going to be in charge for a long long time

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Originally Posted by delmbox

He's damned if he does damned if he doesn't with some of you. Cases have halved in the last week (2300-1200 https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-wales-politics-59984873) and if he didn't lift restrictions it'd be all "DRIPFORD THE DICTATOR DRUNK ON POWER, THOSE POOR PUBS "

Being that he's saying a significant drop in cases means a drop in restrictions, which has literally been the policy for almost two years, it's 'OH YEAH, HE'S DROPPING RESTRICTIONS JUST FOR THE RUGBY WHAT A SURPRISE" even though that means that the hospitality sector you pretend to care so much about won't miss out on millions of pounds

The man's not perfect but it's ridiculous

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:hehe: :hehe:

It has been said all along that the evidence from other countries further ahead in the Omnicrom version that cases will fall as rapidly as they rise.

But you kid yourself that here in Wales that it’s fallen so quickly because of the illogical and meaningless restrictions Drakeford put in place.

Meanwhile the hospitality trade has lost millions as they’ve effectively been punished since December 17th. The two week period from Black Friday to New Years Day is when the sector can really cash in to see them through the quieter periods. It’s not just about the six nations.

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Originally Posted by delmbox

I don't know to be honest. I also don't think that if there were a vote on independence any time soon that the Yes vote would get anywhere near it, but to say that he's set the movement back a decade is just plain wrong

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Why is it plain wrong? It’s just an opinion same as yours.

As far as I can see the Welsh independence movement is a minority of people shouting loudest on social media.

When it went to the polls Plaid Cymru, for all their optimism that the appetite for Welsh Indepndence was massively on the increase, had a very, very disappointing result.

I actually voted Plaid Cymru myself but I think there’s a lot of blind optimism with regards independence.

I wonder is those backing Drakeford for these latest round of restrictions would so supportive if they were out of work for a month with no furlough scheme to support them? or if their business would be going down the tubes as a result of the restrictions? :sherlock:

I would highly doubt it.

This thread is so typical. Old people hate politicians that genuinely try to make things better. They prefer to give their vote to those who take backhanders from the billionaire class and continue along the path of extreme wealth inequality.

I don't think many older people realise this but basically nobody under 40 expects anything good to happen ever again thanks to the boomers.