What a bunch of tossers

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Originally Posted by JamesWales

Credit for referencing right wing, boomers and the daily mail but you've really missed an opportunity here.

For extra points try putting 'far' or 'extreme' before the word right. Also, a missed chance not to mention brexit (or brexshit). Finally, the Daily Mail is always more hilarious when referred to as the Daily Heil.

Otherwise, as usual, an enlightening post.

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Can you not see the state of the UK right now thanks to the voting habits of your demographic? You live in utter denial and the chickens are coming home to roost right now.

I'd say the state of UK and its boomers would sit more in the Blair era and just copied ever since , voting habits are those who have incline between right and left , there is no far right or far left they have been chassed off a long time ago .

Brexit is about independence bit like SNP . Plaid .Welsh Labour who all seek separation and independence of a central body ie Westminster or EEC .

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Originally Posted by Doucas

Can you not see the state of the UK right now thanks to the voting habits of your demographic? You live in utter denial and the chickens are coming home to roost right now.

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Give me some of the things particularly upsetting you, so that we can see how these things compare with other countries to try and determine the cause of these issues and hence solve them. Not everything is caused and solved by a nations government. Inflation at the moment for example is soaring in almost every country on earth, so it's beyond the reasonable control of governments.

What issues do you want to discuss? Because the issue may be that you are misdiagnosing the problem and hence unable to solve it. Just blaming everything on the government in 2022 may be as futile as just blaming everything on god in 1022. The root causes may well lie elsewhere, at least in some cases. Or fixing problem A may make problem B worse.

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Originally Posted by JamesWales

Give me some of the things particularly upsetting you, so that we can see how these things compare with other countries to try and determine the cause of these issues and hence solve them. Not everything is caused and solved by a nations government. Inflation at the moment for example is soaring in almost every country on earth, so it's beyond the reasonable control of governments.

What issues do you want to discuss? Because the issue may be that you are misdiagnosing the problem and hence unable to solve it. Just blaming everything on the government in 2022 may be as futile as just blaming everything on god in 1022. The root causes may well lie elsewhere, at least in some cases. Or fixing problem A may make problem B worse.

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• Child poverty increasing
• Working poverty increasing
• House prices becoming unaffordable to young people
• 40 years of stagnant wages
• Huge amounts of corruption in our current government, including passing contracts to mates during covid
• Fire and rehire e.g. P & O (notice other nations didn't have staff sacked)
• Brexit and the serious negative effect that's had on businesses that import/export (this contributes to inflation whether you like it or not)
• The NHS running on fumes and increased privatisation (which no, doesn't make it more efficient)
• Appalling death rates and one of the worst performing developed nations economically when it comes to Covid
• One of the worst pensions in the developed world
• Billionaire controlled right wing media, our newspapers are owned by what? 4 people? These papers have convinced half the British population that the biggest threat to it is wokeness, immigrants and those on benefits rather than the mega wealthy.
• Spiralling wealth inequality
• Huge increases in electric and has bills (this should have been solved decades ago)

You may say well these are worldwide issues (which have been made far worse by our current government) but the basic cause is 40 years of neoliberalism across the West that has screwed the average person but somehow you get braindead morons who views the status quo and somehow thinks 'this is ok'.

I look forward to you diverting from my points or just point blank telling me they aren't issues or that I'm making them up.

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Originally Posted by life on mars

I'd say the state of UK and its boomers would sit more in the Blair era and just copied ever since , voting habits are those who have incline between right and left , there is no far right or far left they have been chassed off a long time ago .

Brexit is about independence bit like SNP . Plaid .Welsh Labour who all seek separation and independence of a central body ie Westminster or EEC .

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Blair was tory light and a neoliberal. He'd fit in with the tories post 2010 as would Keir Starmer.

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Originally Posted by Doucas

• Child poverty increasing
• Working poverty increasing
• House prices becoming unaffordable to young people
• 40 years of stagnant wages
• Huge amounts of corruption in our current government, including passing contracts to mates during covid
• Fire and rehire e.g. P & O (notice other nations didn't have staff sacked)
• Brexit and the serious negative effect that's had on businesses that import/export (this contributes to inflation whether you like it or not)
• The NHS running on fumes and increased privatisation (which no, doesn't make it more efficient)
• Appalling death rates and one of the worst performing developed nations economically when it comes to Covid
• One of the worst pensions in the developed world
• Billionaire controlled right wing media, our newspapers are owned by what? 4 people? These papers have convinced half the British population that the biggest threat to it is wokeness, immigrants and those on benefits rather than the mega wealthy.
• Spiralling wealth inequality
• Huge increases in electric and has bills (this should have been solved decades ago)

You may say well these are worldwide issues (which have been made far worse by our current government) but the basic cause is 40 years of neoliberalism across the West that has screwed the average person but somehow you get braindead morons who views the status quo and somehow thinks 'this is ok'.

I look forward to you diverting from my points or just point blank telling me they aren't issues or that I'm making them up.

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I'll go through these. But aren't you massively pro-EU? The single market is probably the most neo-liberal project on earth. Literally designed to prevent government intervention and minimise control over national economies

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Originally Posted by JamesWales

I'll go through these. But aren't you massively pro-EU? The single market is probably the most neo-liberal project on earth. Literally designed to prevent government intervention and minimise control over national economies

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The EU is less neoliberal than the tories.

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Originally Posted by Doucas

The EU is less neoliberal than the tories.

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It isn't actually. But the single market is the embodiment of neoliberalism. Complete deregulation across borders. There's pros and cons to that, but I dont see how you can object to neoliberalism whilst being a big fan of the EU's single market. That's some mental gymnastics.

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Originally Posted by JamesWales

It isn't actually. But the single market is the embodiment of neoliberalism. Complete deregulation across borders. There's pros and cons to that, but I dont see how you can object to neoliberalism whilst being a big fan of the EU's single market. That's some mental gymnastics.

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Whatever you say.

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Originally Posted by Doucas

Whatever you say.

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Do you not understand what the single market is?

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Originally Posted by JamesWales

Do you not understand what the single market is?

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I never really appreciated that the embodiment of neoliberalism and complete deregulation across borders achieved so little until you highlighted its limitations. Still those stupid "experts" at the Tory established Office of Budget Responsibility maintain that its predictions of seismic trade reductions as a consequence of Brexit remain on track.

https://www.thenational.scot/news/20...rade-recovery/

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Originally Posted by cyril evans awaydays

I never really appreciated that the embodiment of neoliberalism and complete deregulation across borders achieved so little until you highlighted its limitations. Still those stupid "experts" at the Tory established Office of Budget Responsibility maintain that its predictions of seismic trade reductions as a consequence of Brexit remain on track.

https://www.thenational.scot/news/20...rade-recovery/

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There are pros and cons to it, but it's capitalism's wet dream. No doubt about that. The single market is Thatcherism on steroids. For better or worse. In terms of Brexit and global trade, I think we need much longer to assess that and not a global pandemic that has disrupted almost everything

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Originally Posted by JamesWales

There are pros and cons to it, but it's capitalism's wet dream. No doubt about that. The single market is Thatcherism on steroids. For better or worse. In terms of Brexit and global trade, I think we need much longer to assess that and not a global pandemic that has disrupted almost everything

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The bit I don't get is that if it is capitalism's wet dream why arch deregulators like Rees-Mogg are happy to see new bureaucratic barriers between this Thatcherist utopia and the UK imposed? I can see why less wealthy people fearing the impact of free movement of labour has on their utility and services but what does dear Jacob and his ilk have against the the largest market for goods, services and capital? Unless you make money from disruption and uncertainty I guess?

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Originally Posted by cyril evans awaydays

The bit I don't get is that if it is capitalism's wet dream why arch deregulators like Rees-Mogg are happy to see new bureaucratic barriers between this Thatcherist utopia and the UK imposed? I can see why less wealthy people fearing the impact of free movement of labour has on their utility and services but what does dear Jacob and his ilk have against the the largest market for goods, services and capital? Unless you make money from disruption and uncertainty I guess?

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I have no idea what goes through Moggys head. But I would suggest for him it's a mixture of old school British independence etc coupled with an alternative free market belief that we can do better on better terms globally.

Thats the conflict on it really; whilst the single market is deregulation and free markets at the same time it prevents the same with outside economies and individual members. So the UK couldn't do bilateral trade deals with other countries. Basically, as with so much in life there is evidence to suit any argument really.